| Author |
Message |
    
zoe
Citizen
Username: Zoe
Post Number: 281
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 10:30 am: |     |
I do understand that many gay and lesbian children face difficulties resulting from their sexual preferences, but is this separate school a reasonable solution? Isn’t this just another example of separate, but equal?
What might be good for those children, could very easily be construed as special treatment and result in things like tax dollars being spent on supporting a school for conservative children, who also frequently are victims of harassment in schools. What about schools designed to support public prayer or a particular religious view?
You cannot have it both ways! What is next? Perhaps it isn’t long before we see a High School solely earmarked for those are un-hip? Kids are cruel, they make fun of nerds and those who dress differently, does that demand or qualify for a separate school?
|
Dave Ross
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4930
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 10:46 am: | |
I still haven't made up my mind about this, but two things stand out: 1) it's not unconstitutional, whereas having a religion-based public school would be, and 2) how would gay conservative students benefit less from the school? |
Brett
Citizen
Username: Bmalibashksa
Post Number: 15
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 10:51 am: | |
What happens if this turns out to be one of the best schools in the city? Will parents pretend their child is gay to get in? |
zoe
Citizen
Username: Zoe
Post Number: 283
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 10:59 am: | |
Not Gay conservatives, which may in fact be increasing in numbers, but conservative students. They are frequently made to feel threatened. Purely the numbers show a clear majority of Teachers, especially those in the union, are overwhelmingly registered Democrats.
Conservative students are not only mostly outnumbered, but frequently made fun of. So are those who dress differently, or wear religious symbols or clothing. |
zoe
Citizen
Username: Zoe
Post Number: 284
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 11:09 am: | |
Brett, of course they will. This is America. |
Nohero
Citizen
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 1866
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 2:22 pm: | |
I went to a nerds-only high school. We rocked.
Seriously, Zoe, this school is for students who have had trouble in other schools. The concept (which people are free to disagree with) is that the student's sexuality makes that student a target of anti-social, if not violent, behavior, to a greater extent than clothing, religion, or even race. These students are seen as being at risk of dropping out (or worse) because of the problems caused by other students.
To use one of the categories you mentioned, as an example, I'm not aware of Republican kids committing suicide because the liberal kids can't accept them. I agree, in an ideal world there should not have to be a separate school. But, we know we are not in that ideal world, because the NY Post has concluded that they can sell a lot of papers with a headline screaming "GAY HIGH SCHOOL". |
face
Citizen
Username: Face
Post Number: 81
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 3:39 pm: | |
Seriously Nohero, any kid feeling outcast and tormented, regardless of true sexuality, will seek out ways to attend such an alternative school. How can their entrance be prohibited? What are they going to do, request proof of their sexuality?
With only 100 students, Harvey Milk sounds like it'll have a nice ratio of students to teachers, so who wouldn't want to go to school there, or offer to teach? Sounds like the chance to receive a better education, (even if falsely choosing to face any stigma generated by admiting to a untruthful sexual preference). Any parent currently dissatisfied with their son or daughter's NYC High School will give consideration to this alternative. |
sportsnut
Citizen
Username: Sportsnut
Post Number: 482
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 4:28 pm: | |
Nohero I guess it depends on your definition of "rocked."
I don't see how this helps in any great way. In fact I think it teaches kids that the only way for them to be accepted is to be with those who are just like them. I don't see that as an answer. |
johnh91011
Citizen
Username: Johnh91011
Post Number: 31
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 30, 2003 - 5:46 pm: | |
One concern I have about a seperate well advertised school for gays/lesbians etc is that it becomes a wholesale target for some ranting and raving lunatic like those that bomb abortion clinics and kill doctors performing abortions. I think that a safe place for gay/lesbian teens is very essential since so many are depressed and too many commit suicide due to harrasment, social outcasting etc. Is the right answer a place with a Neon sign "GAY HIGH SCHOOL' the right venue? |
jet
Citizen
Username: Jet
Post Number: 229
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2003 - 2:14 pm: | |
How do you know your gay in the 8th grade ? Do your parents make that decision for you ? |
Brett
Citizen
Username: Bmalibashksa
Post Number: 16
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2003 - 2:32 pm: | |
jet : I'm glad you asked that I was trying to figure it out myself.
I know a transgender that said she knew that something was wrong when she was growing up but I question a parents reaction when 13 year old says "Dad I'm supposed to be a girl, can I go to that high school".
And as far as being gay or lesbian I gota think you're just starting to figure that stuff out and you might want to "experiment" a little.
Plus what happens if you find out your not G/L/T do you leave your friends and change schools? |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1506
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2003 - 2:40 pm: | |
Actually lots of us know or strongly suspect our true sexual orientation by that age. But some of us take many years (with perhaps detours into alcoholism and other escapes) to come to terms with it. Jet, I'm assuming you are heterosexual. Were you turned on by members of the opposite sex at the tender age of 14? Quite likely from my observations of adolescents. I'm not aware of any pregnant teens using artificial insemination, are you?
I think a lot of high schoolers who think they may be gay try to hide it, at least until they get out of their parents' homes. I certainly did. But there are some kids who simply can't hide it or who take a principled stand to be who they really are. And these are the kids who are so vulnerable to the beatings, harassment, etc. I was suspected of being a lesbian in high school, despite the occasional "cover" date with a guy. And I got taunted. On some basic level some classmates knew what I was struggling with. I felt threatened. I even tried going steady with a guy for 6 months. Of course it was destined to fail. My uncle claims he knew he was gay when he was 6 years old. He tried to drown this knowledge in beer. He's still half in the closet, at least around family and despite my being out and accepted by the same branch of the family for decades now.
It may be hard for some straight folks to imagine the terrifying pressure to conform, even in this day and age. But look at what Mr. Bush is doing in this very week. Trying his damnedest to prevent gay people from marrying. Nice big bone he's throwing to his conservative constituency, huh? Interesting timing/diversion from other political events. When even major Christian groups are openly struggling with this issue. He says he "respects" gays. He might as well spit on us for all his respect.
Sorry, rant over.
Cathy
aka Bacata/Nakaille |
bella
Citizen
Username: Bella
Post Number: 325
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2003 - 5:23 pm: | |
Jet - I had my first crush on a boy when I was in 3rd grade; my parents didn't have to tell me that I was straight. But I guess in your world it isn't the same for homosexual children. Didn't you know what sex you were attracted to by 8th grade? |
Pierce Butler
Citizen
Username: Pierce_butler
Post Number: 30
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Friday, August 1, 2003 - 12:25 pm: | |
bella, would you believe kindergarten? As Woody Allen's character in Annie Hall said: "I didn't have a latency period." |
frodo
Citizen
Username: Frodo
Post Number: 22
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Friday, August 1, 2003 - 1:22 pm: | |
Jet---that's a really good question. I never knew I was gay when I was younger. I didn't know what gay meant, but I knew that I liked other boys more than I should and I knew that it was wrong. I grew up ashamed of who I was. I had no friends because I was afraid of being different. It wasn't until the fourth grade that I heard the word gay. That was when my grade school class decided that the shy quiet kid who kept to himself and read during recess was gay. My last name is Mogavero and from 4th to 8th grade, my "friends" called me Mogay. They tormented me everyday by playing cruel tricks on me and calling me names and my teachers allowed it. They knew what the kids were calling me and they ignored it. I went to Catholic school and most of my teachers were nuns.
Then came Xavier, an all male military school in Manhattan. Once again, I kept to myself and had no friends, but by this time I managed to learn how to get by. I learned how to become invisible and I don't mean like the invisible man. I learned how to exist and not be noticed. Then I started wondering, why bother existing? What was the point of living when no one would notice that I was gone.
I came out in College, but at that point it didn't make anything better. I hadn't gotten so used to being invisible that I didn't know how to make friends and I was very lonely. That's when I tried suicide. Two times I tried it and both times somebody was watching out for me.
I have been in therapy for 9 years trying to learn to stop hiding and open up to people. It has been a long and difficult thing to do, but I know I am strong enough to do it.
I wish that there was a gay high school when I was growing up. Maybe it would have helped. Maybe it wouldn't have. Maybe the answer is for people to realize that we have no agenda except to live our lives peacefully among heterosexuals. I know that homosexuals are not perfect, but I don't know of any perfect heterosexuals either. Until that time, I think that any small step that is taken is worth it and that hopefully someday schools like this will not be necessary. Gay and straight live together in perfect harmony.
Well, I think I have said enough. See you all soon.
Vinny Mogavero |
Brett
Citizen
Username: Bmalibashksa
Post Number: 18
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Friday, August 1, 2003 - 1:37 pm: | |
Frodo: By your account you would have been invisible to the kids at a gay high school wouldn’t you? Are you under the impression that there should be a Junior high and possibly elementary school?
Also weren’t the Nerds, fat kids, poor kids, “slow” kids, and weird kids treated badly? I must admit that I was quite a ass these groups, I was the problem not them. Why not make a school for those of us who couldn’t handle anyone that was “Different”? |
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