Architect Redux

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Author Message   greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 1731 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 2:33 pm:        We are starting to contemplate a new kitchen . We have a 1927 house, with a one story addition with a flat roof that was added around the late 50's (?). The Spouse wants to break out thru the original supporting back wall to incorporate part of the addition into the new kitchen. I'm figuring, while we're at it, let's add a master bathroom, which would go on the flat roof of the addition. I know that we will have to do all kinds of support work for both the expansion and the bathroom. Here's the question: we have a good design & plan on getting a well-recommended, experienced contractor. Do we need to hire an architect to deal with the support issues? Or can a good contractor build correctly? I've had different opinions in a small sample of 2. I want to hear what the gurus & been-there-done-that MOLers think.   peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 255 Registered: 8-2002 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 2:51 pm:        maybe check with the town, too -- sounds like there's some engineering work involved -- which likely a contractor is not licensed for... good luck with the addition! pete   JGTierney Citizen Username: Jtg7448 Post Number: 40 Registered: 6-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 3:09 pm:        greenetree - granted, i'm biased, as i am an architect. in my experience a lot of contractors don't want to touch structural issues. not because they don't know what to do, they just don't want the liability. though of course, we bring so much more to the table than just a license. a good architect will not run your budget up (as so many seeem to fear), but will insure you get the quality job you deserve. it's a matter of knowing where to spend the money and where to save it. ok - i'm done with my self-serving plug. good luck!   Brett Citizen Username: Bmalibashksa Post Number: 247 Registered: 7-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 3:22 pm:        greenetree - I'd go with the architect. It's like having an accountant do your taxes, you'll end up saving more then you spend for the service.   greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 1732 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:04 pm:        I appreciate the feedback. Here's where I'm confused: if contractors do not have to be licensed, then how do you know that your contractor can follow a blueprint drawn up by the architect? I would think that knowing how to correctly carry out the structural work is just as important as knowing how to design the structural changes! I hadn't necessarily planned on hiring a GC to oversee the work; I have several trusted and favorite contractors (plumber, electrician & even possibly builder - although I will get several opinions). I'm more of a pit bull than anyone I know, so I'd rather deal directly with all the specialists. Everyone I know who hired a GC has a horror story to tell. Does the architect generally serve as GC????   peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 256 Registered: 8-2002 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:08 pm:        hmm...maybe that's what the town building dept is for? and a little pit bull in the owner! ;-) Pete   peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 257 Registered: 8-2002 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:21 pm:        btw -- my previous house was "new" -- bought it based on plans. we had one of the better builders (by reputation at least) -- but still -- on every visit to the site there was something that had been done wrong. sometimes the builder's office hadn't communicated the specs right to the guys on the job. sometimes the guys on the job got it wrong. the worst -- came home from a week long business trip early evening. drove by the site -- they had built the foundation while i was gone. i'm wearing a suit and wingtips -- and as i'm looking closely -- the chimney chase is on the wrong side! Got right into the mud walking around that night -- and the whole thing seemed off. Came back in the am -- measured -- yep -- something's wrong. in short -- they built the WRONG foundation!. 2 days later they bulldozed the thing down and started over! they *hated* me after that! so now that I think about it -- that "pit bull" thing may be most important! Pete   Brett Citizen Username: Bmalibashksa Post Number: 250 Registered: 7-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:25 pm:        Green – In my experience with a large renovation in Asbury park. The architect did not serve as a GC, he only consulted with the GC a few times. The GC ran the show and had foreseen all of the problems that I would not have thought of (i.e. porta pottys). The GC had the time to inspect the work and have things corrected before I looked at them, this helped because I would have been constantly upset at the workers. When there were problems the GC came up with reasonable solutions. We had intended on installing a faucet outside near the deck but when construction was complete the piping had not been run. Although he would have gotten the pluming installed this would have taken a few weeks to complete. He compensated us by upgrading the molding an adding a few extras here and there, we were happy with it. I thought I could manage the job of GC but I was wrong, maybe it was the size of the project.   rpwoodard Citizen Username: Rpwoodard Post Number: 10 Registered: 7-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:36 pm:        Greenetree, We are in the middle of a kitchen renovation. We tore down 2 walls. We are so happy that we spent the money on a good architect. 1. The plans are very detailed. The GC and his sub-contractors follow the detailed blueprints for specs & instructions. Everyone working on any aspect of this job knows what materials to use, exact measurements & placement, etc. There are no ambiguities. 2. The architect determined the size and placement of a steel beam that was required for support. If we had left these calculations up to the GC, I think that we would continually wonder if the roof was going to cave in from lack of support. 3. The architect recommended several very capable GCs and helped us through the bidding and selection process. This was much more valuable than I realized. I did lots of research and still, the architect asked several questions of the GCs that I hadn't even considered asking them--it definitely helped us to narrow down our choices of GCs. Use the architect--based on the scope of your project, I think it will be well worth it. Take LOTS of time selecting an architect. We used Hoffman Architects in Summit. Our GC is fantastic--Atlas Construction.   JGTierney Citizen Username: Jtg7448 Post Number: 41 Registered: 6-2003 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:39 pm:        Sure, you can be your own GC. Architects work in various ways - for instance, you have 3 parties - you (The Client), the Architect, and the GC. In this case The Client is also the GC. You are hiring your own Sub-Contractors (plumber, electrician, etc.) It simply means you run the schedule, the money, etc. This is typically a service the GC provides. Design-build is when the architect wears the GC hat. Again this is my opinion, but I wholeheartedly agree with Brett in that architects are like accountants. I use that line often. Each of your subs is interested in his/her part-no one but the architect looks out for the whole. You, as the the end user, should be very interested in the whole. I've run into this in my own house - each sub shows up selling you his/her wares. Each wants to sell you the 'best' product at the 'best' price. How do you know where to spend the money and where to save it? Architects will actually help you establish and stay within budget. Architects also receive professional discounts on appliances that are passed on to the clients. In a typical situation the architect is the owner's representative. The arch looks out for your interests. Why do architects and contractors make fun of each other - contractor's say architects spend $$$, architects accuse GC's of providing the lowest common denominator. Contractor's are not trained to calculate design loads. They know through experience how to build. You can definitely trust them to read the plans and build correctly. They are not licensed to determine the design weight of your new bathtub and the support it will require. And they definitely don't want the liability. You can hire an architect simply for the drawings. Take them to town yourself for permitting and be your own GC. Or you can keep the architect on for what is called 'construction administration' and let him/her work with the subs. It's up to you! Take a look at this link for more info: http://www.aia.org/consumer/overview.asp   greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 1733 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 5:05 pm:        I think you've all sold me on the architect. I still may be my own GC. The contractors I am hoping to bring in are people I trust implicitly. I know I want to use my own electrician and plumber. Can anyone recommend a builder, contractor to do the "heavy lifting" who is open to working with my guys?   Michael K. Mc Kell Citizen Username: Greenerose Post Number: 30 Registered: 9-2003 Posted on Wednesday, October 1, 2003 - 6:56 am:        FYI: Great Architect.... Speak to Tom Fitz or Mike Miller and tel them Mike from Greene-Rose sent you. Thomas P. Fitzgerald 908-876-4848   Redsox Citizen Username: Redsox Post Number: 331 Registered: 6-2002 Posted on Monday, October 6, 2003 - 5:01 pm:        as a contractor- architects, by the most part, are scum. the nubies(under 35 yrs old) are totally fem. architects today are the interior designers of old. architects take credit for everything and responsibility for nothing. engineers figure out load designs- architects require contractors to verify and provide shop drawings and engineering calculations. it's plans & specs, no it's design build, no it's means & methods, no you're the professional you should have known, no the intent was always ..... no- your detail is wrong and you have to pay me you *sshole.