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greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 1844
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 10:50 am: |     |
Well- we're doing it. Gutting the kitchen - down to the bare walls & moving a bathroom. Here's the question to those of you who've done this sort of thing: how much overage did you find on your original estimates?
My research shows the following:
1. The better you plan up front & the better the design, the less costly the nasty surprises.
2. There are two types of cost overruns:
a) "While we're at its"; and
b) "Oh shit. That support beam is rotten".
Any thoughts or advice? Someone else told me that they had the initial plans approved by Maplewood Bldg. but had to make changes once the work was done even tho it was "exactly as planned".
Looking forward to hearing it all....
Thanks! |
Sylad
Citizen
Username: Sylad
Post Number: 68
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 11:29 am: | |
We gutted our kitchen last spring, it included removal of walls. The contractor came out a few weeks before and poked a small hole in the ceiling to make sure that his assuptions regarding the structure/support were accurate, they were. We did not go over buget at all, during the process we added additional work that was not in the original scope, but the original cost did not increase. Based on hearing horror stories, I think it comes down to who you hire. The company we used did/managed the entire job and did it very fast, they came every day and were in and out in 4 weeks. PL me if you want their contact info, I have posted it in the past. |
GoBlue
Citizen
Username: Turner407
Post Number: 6
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 12:36 pm: | |
Sylad,
Can you post your contractor's information please? Also, did you hire an architect, use a design center or none of the above for the design phase? Thanks. |
Jackie Day
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 205
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 1:10 pm: | |
Having done (believe it or not) three major kitchen renovations (looong story) and one big master bathroom from A to Z, I can honestly say we're quite guilty of the "while we're at it" syndrome. It ranges from appliances to everything else. But if you set it out early on that you're willing to give a little in some places to get a little more in others, you might be able to avoid it. We always spent more on appliances and less on floors...we just had a yen for stainless steel Bosch, etc, but didn't mind if our floor was a simple ceramic tile from Jasco.
Good luck and have fun - I think it's a blast. |
JGTierney
Citizen
Username: Jtg7448
Post Number: 90
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 3:51 pm: | |
Greenetree,
We are architect/homeowners living with a gutted kitchen and bath.
We have been our own best friends and worst enemies at the same time.
Yes, we save ourselves some money (due to trade discounts, etc.) but then we change the scope - A LOT. You see, our design services come free of charge!
I recommend hiring a professional - they will save you time, aggravation, and even money. But of course I'm biased.
As far as the "oh shit!" stuff - we've had our share of that...
1 - once we removed the plaster from the kitchen ceiling we had a nice view of the rotted setting bed for the main bathroom upstairs. yuck!
many, many years of water damage. hmmmm - how do you close the celing up knowing that water is coming your way, sooner rather than later.
2 - some poor prior home rennovation work. the framing for a structural wall was toyed with at some point - and not well done. we are left to remediate it.
3 - we had early hopes of refinishing the oak floors only to discover they had no life left in them and needed to be completely replaced.
a good professional will provide you with a 'contingency' - a percentage of the job for all
of the unforeseen issues. if in the end, there are none - then it is money in the bank - or more to spend!
spend your money where it matters to you...that may be in everything, or in certain aspects of the job. it is a personal choice.
good luck - stay sane |
Sylad
Citizen
Username: Sylad
Post Number: 69
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 4:01 pm: | |
We used Custom Craft,973.839.4286 ask for Tom, he is the owner. Tom did our design. They do bathrooms and kitchens, they do not do additions so if your projectincludes an addition you need someone else, but they would do the kitchen/bath after the new structure of the addition was built. You probably won't need an architect unless your doing a big expansion. If moving walls you may need a structural engineer, but they can do all of that. They did my house and my neighbor, we are both very happy. I would hire them again. Let me know if you want to know more. |
Lizziecat
Citizen
Username: Lizziecat
Post Number: 108
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 2, 2003 - 11:53 pm: | |
Years ago, when we were working on replacing an ugly, leaky 1950's bathroom, we started to remove the old tile floor, and, with the first blow of the hammer, the entire bathroom floor collapsed and crashed into the dining room below. Oh shit! Whoever had "renovated" in the fifties had cut out the supporting beams and poured a concrete floor without replacing the supports. Fortunately, no one was hurt, and we managed to clean up and rebuild the entire bathroom floor. It added a lot of time and expense to our job, but the end result is a really classy bathroom--with a properly constructed floor.
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greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 1846
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 3, 2003 - 9:41 am: | |
Lizzie- that frightens me! JG, you are correct- we are working with a designer, but I also wanted input from "real" homeowners. Sylad- thanks for the recommendation; we do have a contractor whom we've worked with before & we trust. I'm hoping that our trust extends to a huge job like this!
The biggest potential for nasty surprises is under our extension. The current den, bathroom and pantry sit on a one story extension, over a crawl space, that was probably added in the fifties. I fully expect that the plumbing is leaking, but since we are moving the bathroom & changing the heating system in those rooms, I anticipate that the estimate from the plumber for the new heating system & piping will include those things up front. I love and trust my plumber (he's also a great guy and my neighbor) so I am confident that he'll foresee as much as possible.
I hope I'm not getting too optimistic; seems like most posts have been positive. I'm trying to expect the worst, hope for the best and stay married!!! 
Thanks, all! If you think of any other advice, keep posting! |
roconn
Citizen
Username: Roconn
Post Number: 11
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 3, 2003 - 9:55 am: | |
Greentree,
I did this last year (02) (before the tree crushed the second floor) .... I didn't have to move walls, but did have some plumbing and whatnot to deal with. Mostly I did the prep mechanical myself (adding cirucuts/outlets/shut off valves/drains).
I set my original budget at 15K and came in just a couple of hundred bucks over that including appliances I handn't originally considered replacing. I had admittedly spent 2 years considering options and because of the installation 'caveat' below, had more 'limited' choices in what I could/couldn't pick. I ended up though with exactly the kitchen I wanted, for the money I wanted to spend.
The caveat to that number is that I didn't have to pay the installer, he is a friend, so my out of pocket for the actual installation was I think about a thousand dollars.
I used the HomeDepot in Union/Vauxhall for the design and cabinet purchase. Went with an American Woodmark kitchen in natural maple with SSV (solid surface veneer) counters with integral sinks. (drop me a line you can come see) ...
The places where I had the biggest problems in my 75+ house were with the end installation. None of the corners are actually square and well, the ceiling and floor aren't really level either, if your doing a complete 'gut' of your kitchen those aren't going to be as major issues as they were for me.
As to the over crawl space issue (I have that too, although mine is original) you get to make sure that what was OK in the past gets updated to OK now and also sounds like you're going to have the heat made better too.
I have a 'list' of contractors and other repair persons on all the issues involved with my rebuild and I am happy to say the quality of the work was great and he did it in what some have said was an unreasonably short period of time. (Tree crash Sept 11, back in completed house 12/5)
Hope this helps
ROC |
JGTierney
Citizen
Username: Jtg7448
Post Number: 91
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 3, 2003 - 10:02 am: | |
You're right about the marriage thing!
The process has its stressful moments.
So far (3 months) I've only cried once(and yes, i am the wife end of the team!)
Keep in mind how wonderful it will look and how
much you will love it in the end! |
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