| Author | Message | ||
     Innisowen Citizen Username: Innisowen Post Number: 1395 Registered: 3-2004 |
Oh, Scrotey, You've been BAAAAAAAAAD today! You've been getting angry, bro. But I've had a good day. A good run this morning, and with weather in the low '50s, a good bike ride this afternoon. I'm afraid I have more snow in the freezer compartment of my fridge than anywhere on our property or anywhere nearby. I'm not worried: there are two months of winter left, so I'll get my snow and plenty of it. I'll just have to be patient, and that's not my style. Let me see now... where can you and I cross swords. Hmmmmm..... | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 449 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hey Innis- I am so not much mad as I am annoyed. Tulip just gets to me and I vented. Besides, my ipod is on the fritz so that doesn't help!  I am glad you got some exercise in...didn't have time...be back later | ||
| anon Supporter Username: Anon Post Number: 2513 Registered: 6-2002 |
I am glad you got some exercise in...didn't have time. Try a round of golf. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 453 Registered: 10-2005 |
They should create a game like rugby golf-now that would be a sport...if you partner takes too long to tee off you can tackle him or crack him the head with a driver! And you would nenver have to worry aboutrunning out of beer! OMG...gota go my son is throwing dry dogfood all over the kitchen!!! | ||
| Meandtheboys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 2716 Registered: 12-2004  |
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| Meandtheboys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 2717 Registered: 12-2004 |
Scrotis, you're needed on the "hotdog for lunch" thread--just to stir things up a bit! | ||
| Elgato Citizen Username: Elgato Post Number: 5 Registered: 2-2004 |
Back to global warming....Here's a pessimistic article from Fortune magazine. Maybe we'll all wake up when it starts affecting our bank balances. http://money.cnn.com/2006/01/17/news/economy/climate_fortune/index.htm | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 764 Registered: 10-2004  |
heres a tidbit from todays news - warmest year in a century The article also states we are at the warmest point in 10,000 years. Te strategy that this administration is using is exactly what the cigarette companies did in the 50s and 60s. | ||
| sportsnut Citizen Username: Sportsnut Post Number: 2281 Registered: 10-2001  |
I thought this discussion was about "global" warming, not "U.S." warming. Tell the folks over in Russia that its the warmest winter on record: http://www.cnn.com/2006/WEATHER/01/19/russia.cold.ap/ So which is it? Is the mild winter we're having a sign of global warming and the cold spell in Russia just a blip or vice versa? Can't have it both ways. In the interest of full disclosure I'm with Rastro on this issue. | ||
| Smarty Jones Citizen Username: Birdstone Post Number: 223 Registered: 10-2005 |
Funny, we were at one of our coldest points not 80 years ago, and everyone was running around crying about the next human caused ice age. When you say warmest year, do you mean warmest year on the earths crust, the oceans, or the Troposphere? Or are you talking about the Mesosphere or the stratosphere? Even the Thermosphere (where the space shuttle orbits) is considered part of the earths atmosphere....The article mentions weather stations recordings and surface temparature, so I have to assume they are talking about the Troposphere. Do we know how many weather stations are taking these readings in the troposphere? They never seem to report that data. When YOU say the warmest year ever, I have to presume you mean Maplewood NJ.....if not, please be more specific about what this warmest point is. And don't respond "All of them", because that isn't true. Most people who live in fear of Global warming actually have no idea what they are talking about, and what the science behind it is actually studying. I have yet to see anything different from this thread. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 493 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hoops- That doesn't prove it is caused by billions homo sapiens inhabiting the earth....give the climate more credit, why don't you...it is more powerful then you, I and the rest of us.... | ||
| tulip Citizen Username: Braveheart Post Number: 3092 Registered: 3-2004 |
The weather in Moscow is another sign of global warming...vast and radical anomolies in weather. Read up. Don't trust your gut on this one. Bother to see what scientists who study this are saying. This isn't an article of faith. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 497 Registered: 10-2005 |
Tulip- The question is not wether GW exists (it obviously does). The question is how much of an impact are us humans having on the climate. -SLK | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3979 Registered: 12-2001  |
Global warming could very well result in a significant cooling of parts of Earth,in particular, those parts of Earth warmed by the Gulf Stream. Given this fact, the skeptics will never run out of anecdotes and anomalies to disprove global warming. | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 765 Registered: 10-2004 |
Scrotis - sure... and air polution has not human cause either. Please get out of the dark ages. This is not a political issue, it is a scientific issue. All the science points to global warming being increased due to emissions. To save a buck you would ruin the planet for future generations. Keep to your cigarrette company arguments and phony science. I respect the EPA commisioners who stood up to tell the truth. | ||
| Meandtheboys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 2754 Registered: 12-2004 |
Scrotis, I find it endlessly amazing how no one actually seems to be listening to what you are actually saying, don't you?!? | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 502 Registered: 10-2005 |
MEandtheboys-yes it is a plague on this board. Hoops-Fine, you are right, we are doomed! Start packing Women, children and minorities first! I bet you didn't hear the report that US emissions have steadily declined via other measures without having to join the Kyoto gig? Did you hear the emission levels of the forerunning countries Kyoto? I am starting to bet you are a high school student, Hoops... | ||
| Meandtheboys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 2755 Registered: 12-2004 |
And yet you keep trying. Not sure what that makes you!  | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5657 Registered: 12-2001  |
Or that 2005 was the warmest year since they started keeping records.
AP | ||
| Haight-Strawbury Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 6685 Registered: 10-2001  |
so care to explain 99-04..Global warming took some time off?  libs. | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3980 Registered: 12-2001 |
A wonderful argument this is. Since scientists don't have access to the detailed information they need to accurately model global warming and cooling cycles from the PreCambrian Era to the present, we can't conclusively distinguish between human impacts on global temperatures and other factors. And since it will be hard to get people to sacrifice without proof, I guess we will just wait and see what will happen. However, for the pecularliarly naive members of the species who don't believe that our activities can influence the global environment...well, I am at a loss for words. | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 769 Registered: 10-2004 |
Slick - I suspect you are an ... No, I wont be pulled into your little mind games. The wealth of data points to global warming as a threat to human beings and this planet. If you want to choose to look the other way and place your trust in corporate interests then so be it. I did not mention Kyoto nor any other potential remedy for global warming slick so where you make these leaps into political argument fails me. Reducing our emissions can only help in reducing this phenomenon. Scientists worldwide are in agreement on the need for reduced emisssions. I dont see where this is even a debate. Unless you have tremendous stock in oil companies and coal burning power plants, car companies or major industrial polluters I dont see how you can be against reducing emissions. In the short run there may be some financial hardships for companies that have to comply but in the long run we all benefit. Actually come to think of it when I read your posts Slick I think that you are just pushing buttons for the heck of it. I bet you havent even once showed us what you really think. I seriously doubt that AI is a conservative Straw. And I seriously doubt that all conservatives think global warming is untrue. | ||
| tulip Citizen Username: Braveheart Post Number: 3109 Registered: 3-2004 |
Haight: Actually, 2005 was the hottest summer on human record, followed by 1998, 2003, 1999, and 2004. NBC announced it this morning. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 506 Registered: 10-2005 |
Uh, oh 2005 was hot? everyone jump ship! Board your windows! Hide your kids! Shoot your dog! Stock up on toilet paper and batteries! How simple can the math be? The earth is 4.5 billion years old-the farthest core samples go back 400k years. So that leaves us, oh lets say 4 billion years of unmeasured climates. When science can differentiate between natural climate changes vs. human affected climate change then give me a ring.... Again: The question is not wether GW exists (it obviously does). The question is how much of an impact are us humans having on the climate. Did I stutter....? -SLK | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3981 Registered: 12-2001 |
Scrotis, The beauty of your argument is that by the time "science can differentiate between natural climate changes vs. human affected climate change " it will be too late if, in fact, we find out that human activity is the major factor. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 510 Registered: 10-2005 |
Tjohn- Fine, GW exist and it is all my fault, should I invest in some additional homeowners/life insurance and a pair of waders? -SLK | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3983 Registered: 12-2001 |
That's certainly one option. Supposing you believed that global warming was caused by human activity. What would you supporting doing? I supposed we could always take the long view and conclude that America will be less screwed by global warming than most other countries and not worry about it. | ||
| malone Citizen Username: Malone Post Number: 300 Registered: 5-2001 |
every one of you who believes in global warming should just shut your computer off to conserve the energy and heat. Turn your lights off ande sit around in the dark. Stop driving your SUV in favor of a more fuel efficient car. Or stop driving altogether. Have solar panels placed on your roof. Etc....Etc......Etc..... Oh wait! That's right! You want someone else to make a sacrifice. | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3984 Registered: 12-2001 |
Energy conservation is certainly a component of reducing CO2 emissions. But that will happen for economic reasons. Specifically, assertions to the contrary notwithstanding, oil reserves are being used up and remaining oil reserves are increasingly expense to recover. But there are plenty of other ways of taking CO2 out of the atmosphere. One way is to bury large amounts of plant material as happened during the major coal formation periods in the geological good old days. Coal formation has removed at least a trillion tons of carbon from the atmosphere. | ||
| Elgato Citizen Username: Elgato Post Number: 6 Registered: 2-2004 |
SLK, you have a point about the waders - many a true word spoken in jest! Last year there was major flooding in the UK and northern Europe and the only people that seemed to be moving around the streets in those areas were those in waders! As the climate becomes more and more erratic, the best advice might be to check out a few disaster-preparedness websites and go from there! We are going to have to be prepared for all extreme weather eventualities. I see the weather channel has a new 'what if' series at 9.30 pm on Sundays to help get us ready. As tjohn said, America will probably be less screwed, but only for a while until the erratic weather starts to seriously affect crops and food supplies. Tulip mentioned the weather in Moscow but it's not just Russia that's catching a chill, it's all over Asia; Japan, China...It's dropped to around freezing in India which is unheard of and most people don't own coats, blankets or have heating. People are dying from the cold. Check this out "Extreme weather in Asia: the Big Freeze" http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/011106EB.shtml Those countries are going to have to adapt as much as we are to weather conditions they are unprepared for. Malone, I'm sure many of us do turn out the lights when we are not using a room, use energy efficient bulbs, avoid buying SUVs etc., in the hope that we will conserve dwindling natural resources as much as possible so that future generations won't be limited to candles and bikes (let's hope the planned cycling paths are finished by the time they're needed). | ||
| Smarty Jones Citizen Username: Birdstone Post Number: 226 Registered: 10-2005 |
SCIENCE? You must be kidding. The evidence supporting a Warming Trend, and the evidence used to support Human Caused Warming Trends is Circumstantial. Circumstantial evidence has NO part of the scientific method, and is not valid as the sole evidence presented to convict in court. Further, there are multiple breakdowns of logic when using circumstantial evidence (see Aristotle and Socrates writings on the matter). For some reason, we are supposed to make one exception for the use of Circumstantial evidence, and that is Global Warming. Further, the liberal views on this matter would like us to make a worldwide global allocation of Trillions of $$'s of resources, based upon this Circumstantial evidence. Finally, we are supposed to set aside several hundred years of proper use of the scientific method, and accept this NEW approach as Gospel, and absolute science. Anybody who accepts this is doing themselves, their governments, and their scientific community a huge disservice by being willing to accept Circumstantial evidence as a basis for building massive policy, taxation and law. This is why Al Gore sounds like such an idiot when he is shouting on the podium about this stuff, and it's why logical people don't accept these arguments. By the way, the pro-Global Warming posters don't sound like idiots (like Al Gore), you just sound like stepfords who haven't done any research or independent thought on the topic. | ||
| Meandtheboys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 2777 Registered: 12-2004 |
Amen. | ||
| tom Citizen Username: Tom Post Number: 4268 Registered: 5-2001 |
circumstantial this  | ||
| tom Citizen Username: Tom Post Number: 4269 Registered: 5-2001 |
and this  | ||
| tom Citizen Username: Tom Post Number: 4270 Registered: 5-2001 |
and this  | ||
| Smarty Jones Citizen Username: Birdstone Post Number: 227 Registered: 10-2005 |
There's a definition for believing in something based soley upon circumstantial evidence....it's called FAITH. On the Right, I'm being asked to be Faithful that a Supreme Being is espousing the way we should live our lives. On the Left, I'm being asked to be Faithful that their beliefs in Global Warming are true (if not RIGHTOUS), and if I don't get in line....We'll be sorry. I'm tired of everybody demanding my Faith. My Global Warming friends all happen to be Atheists...I sometimes wonder if they are replacing the need to believe in something Greater than self, with this Passion/Fear around global warming. | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3985 Registered: 12-2001 |
V. well said Smarty. You have demonstrated why mankind is incapable of responding to longer term trends. Since we don't have detailed global information for the last billion years or so, we can't model global climate change with confidence. Detractors of human-caused climate change will always be able to poke fun at those who are concerned about human-induced global warming. Me, I look forward to global warming. When my house is beachfront, the value of it will increase exponentially. | ||
| Smarty Jones Citizen Username: Birdstone Post Number: 228 Registered: 10-2005 |
Tom, nobody questions the data points you are posting (despite huge innacuries/differences between data collection 100 years ago vs. today) Why don't you look up the definition of Circumstantial Evidence before you jump the gun on graphs, and charts. I could post a chart showing Death Rates in Africa coming down dramatically over the same time period, and claim "Increased use of Petroleum Saves Millions of Lives". We all know this to be an unlikely statement. However, I'm supposed to suspend my disbelief of such statements when it comes to Global Warming. Tjohn, your statement is downright false. Mankind has responded gloriously to many long term trends, particularly ones that are both real, and caused by humans. The list is fairly lengthy, but better off in a thread of it's own. As for feeling bad about not caring about Faith Based Initiatives (like Global Warming), unfortunately, I just don't. | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3986 Registered: 12-2001 |
"There's a definition for believing in something based soley upon circumstantial evidence....it's called FAITH. " Well, that's not really true. Rational beings have the ability to assess the amount of circumstantial evidence to determine if it is cause for alarm. One weather anomaly is not a cause for alarm. Multiple weather anomalies combined with melting permafrost just might be worth taking seriously. | ||
| tjohn Supporter Username: Tjohn Post Number: 3987 Registered: 12-2001 |
"Tjohn, your statement is downright false. Mankind has responded gloriously to many long term trends, particularly ones that are both real, and caused by humans." As the list is lengthy, can you provide just a couple of instances of a proactive response to a long-term trend? |
