| Author | Message | ||
     Brokeback Straw Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 6954 Registered: 10-2001  |
according to Reuters. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 10957 Registered: 5-2001 |
Here is the link to the Reuters site: http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2006-03-16T1 53121Z_01_L16126894_RTRUKOC_0_US-IRAQ-USA-OFFENSIVE.xml&archived=False Part of me says, after seeing reviews of the new book CobraII, we should have done this before and part of me sees this as desperation on the part of the Administration. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1494 Registered: 5-2001 |
The last throes of an occupying power. | ||
| Twokitties Citizen Username: Twokitties Post Number: 401 Registered: 8-2004 |
Gosh, I thought major combat operations were over. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1761 Registered: 7-2004  |
Does this mean we get to see Bush playing dress up again? | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5193 Registered: 10-1999  |
 | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5964 Registered: 12-2001  |
And now, mysteriously, the story is "not available" Ok who leaked top secret combat ops? | ||
| ajc Citizen Username: Ajc Post Number: 4868 Registered: 9-2001  |
...no mention of or concern for our troops, just wise guys taking shots at our President, what a bunch of jerks! | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1762 Registered: 7-2004 |
...no mention or concern for our troops, either there ajc, just a wise guy taking shots at other posters, you know the rest! | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 929 Registered: 10-2004  |
ajc - thats true. I hope our troops are safe. And I also hope that the number of innocent lives lost is low. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1763 Registered: 7-2004 |
Hoops: Of course we all hope our troops are safe and Bush keeps his bloodlust for innocent lives lost at a minimum. We're the side that AGAINST the war and want to bring everyone home safely asafp. Hey, at least he kept it one size, font and color. | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5194 Registered: 10-1999 |
Ajc: Why would you accuse people here, of not being concerned about the troops? I should hope that we all are concerned. We can disagree about policy without making those accusations. And if you are going to call us “jerks”, I wish you would say it with your trademark ALL CAPS, or boldface, or italics, or even ALL THREE. Otherwise, we might think that you don’t really mean it.  | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1497 Registered: 5-2001 |
ajc Does every comment about the war require that? For what it's worth, Iraqi civilians are in a hell of a lot more danger than the troops conducting this offensive. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5965 Registered: 12-2001 |
seriously, ajc, don't equate a dissatisfaction with the reasons/administration/lack of on the ground equipment and support, as lack of concern for the troops. They are not mutually exclusive. Not speaking for everyone, but I pray they are ok, on a daily basis. Since my brother is in the service every thing that happens has a somewhat personal, albeit somewhat distant, effect on me. My brother lives in Indonesia, a hotbed of radicalism, and there has already been a bombing at the facility where he works. | ||
| Grrrrrrrrrrr Citizen Username: Oldsctls67 Post Number: 400 Registered: 11-2002  |
This is too funny! | ||
| tom Citizen Username: Tom Post Number: 4543 Registered: 5-2001 |
It's an all-too common rhetorical trick, where the people who want to get the troops out of danger are somehow labelled as being against them; and the people who want to keep them over there where they're bombed and shot up daily are somehow working in their best interests. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5970 Registered: 12-2001 |
The link works again. Not a whole lot of information. | ||
| ajc Citizen Username: Ajc Post Number: 4871 Registered: 9-2001 |
Of course "we" all hope our troops are safe... Sure you all do... so show it, talk about it, let them know it, and get off their bosses back!!! Don't any of you get the message? We're in a war, our troops are there in harms way, they're there because they believe in what they're doing, and they will be there until you guys get your act together and elect a President that shares your philosophy… that’s no matter how much you bitch about it. I believe, as our troops believe, that America is in Iraq for honorable reasons. If you think bashing their Commander and Chief is showing how you respect them and support them, then yes, you all are a bunch of jerks! | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 931 Registered: 10-2004 |
ajc - you are exactly what you accuse us of. Most troops do not believe that the war is honorable. Most troops want to come home. Most troops would rather be stationed state side then living in miserable conditions fighting an enemy they cant see and trying to police a country that does not want us there. The president is wrong and those of us opposed to the war are bringing that to light every day. Hopefully we can bring enough pressure to bear so that the troops can come home where they belong. And the troops are not there because they share a philosophy. They are there because they are ordered to go. Brave men and women all. | ||
| Brokeback Straw Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 6955 Registered: 10-2001 |
this thread should be called "Art and the Anti-Americans." | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1764 Registered: 7-2004 |
Art has no respect. And deserves none. | ||
| Brokeback Straw Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 6956 Registered: 10-2001 |
I guess you never met the man because it's doubtful you'd say such a thing to his face. (and live to talk about it) He's a tough dude. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1501 Registered: 5-2001 |
obey | ||
| tom Citizen Username: Tom Post Number: 4545 Registered: 5-2001 |
conform The troops are not there because they believe in what they are doing. They are there because they were sent there and are following their orders. There is no cause-and-effect relationship where troops believe or disbelieve in their mission and therefore that mission changes. And straw, re your "anti-american" remark: bite me. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1766 Registered: 7-2004 |
"get off their bosses back" That actually might be one of the most un-American, mindless sentiments I have read on this board. For shame. | ||
| Ond Citizen Username: Ond Post Number: 83 Registered: 3-2004 |
consume | ||
| bettyd Citizen Username: Badjtdso Post Number: 136 Registered: 12-2005 |
ajc: Don't you dare question the motivation or patriotism of those who oppose the war, or say we're not for the troops. That's the oldest, lowest trick in the book. I come from a long time DEMOCRATIC family. You know those commie loving, hate the troops, unpatriotic types: my grandfather on my mother's side was gassed while in the US Army in 1918 (at 18 years of age) at Mountfacon in France. He lost a lung and had to be sent to Arizona for a year to convalesce. They thought he wouldn't last three months but lived till his late seventies; My grandfather on my father's side was a US Army doctor/thoracic surgeon in WWI. He saw a lot of thoracic and other injuries and taught for years thoracic surgery in the US Army after the war. My father fought in the Pacific in WWII, working his way through the Pacific Islands with the famed 32nd Division-Buna, Atapei, Kwajalein, the Phillipines with MaCarthur, then the occupatiion of Japan. (Oh, by the way at a reunion of the remaining men in or around March/April of 03, everyone of them, TO A MAN, was against the war in Iraq). An uncle in WWII also. An older Vietnam Vet brother. All of the foregoing eventually protested the Vietnam War. I can no longer tolerate people saying you don't support the troops if you oppose this idiotic, unnecessary war. Their "boss" put them there unnecessarily without thinking of the consequences and not preparing for the insurgency. The worst possible thing a Commander in Chief can ever do-put our bravest in harm's way when not absolutley necessary. I've been for the troops since day one-they should never have been sent to Iraq to be killed or injured. That too can be considered patriotic. ajc: tell us who we're fighting in Iraq by the way. Also, they've raised the enlistment age. If you're a vet re-up, if not, enlist and go stand a post and really support the troops. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5972 Registered: 12-2001 |
Straw..he is a gentle giant. But on this point I disagree. It is not mutually exclusive to support the troops and question their reason for being where they are. In fact, I would suggest, it is important to question it. It keeps us honest. And, as we have seen, honesty in the white house is hard to come by, be it the democrats or republicans who live there. As I said in another thread, there is way too much grey for me to come down so solidly on one side or the other. Lets lay off the 'if its not my way its the highway' junk. I don't think that tom or even RL for that matter is any more or less Patriotic than you or art. Just have different ways of expressing that patriotism. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1767 Registered: 7-2004 |
Thanks, Duncan. I'm actually quite patriotic, which is why I'm so disturbed by what's happening to our country. | ||
| dougw Citizen Username: Dougw Post Number: 754 Registered: 3-2005 |
Robert why are you a patriot? | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1768 Registered: 7-2004 |
Doug: How many more terrorists do you think were created today? | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12996 Registered: 1-2003  |
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000103&sid=ahSba_UBmikI&refer=us RL, please don't take that bait. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5973 Registered: 12-2001 |
bettyd...while I understand your vigor on this topic by saying this...
you undermine your point. when you say that ajc should be over there fighting with those he supports it is much the same as saying "if you question the president you are not patriotic". It doesn't fly. Thanks to your family and their sacrifices (and those of many many others) we can have this debate. So thanks! And RL, I know you are, and that is why I get frustrated when you throw up some reactionary posts. | ||
| dougw Citizen Username: Dougw Post Number: 755 Registered: 3-2005 |
Tom how is that bait? Why is saying something good about America bait? | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12997 Registered: 1-2003 |
dougw, I'm sorry. I assumed you meant "why" when you probably meant "how". I should have given you the benefit of the doubt. And if that's not clear enough, then never mind, and please accept my apology. | ||
| dougw Citizen Username: Dougw Post Number: 756 Registered: 3-2005 |
Here - I am a patriot because I love freedom, democracy and oppourtunity. I think America is the best place in the world to find these. Robert - why are you a patriot? | ||
| bettyd Citizen Username: Badjtdso Post Number: 137 Registered: 12-2005 |
Duncan: You're right. But I have had to endure three years of people calling me a "jerk" and accusing me, and others in my family, of not supporting the troops and somehow being unpatriotic. I'm sure others on this board have gotten the same treatment. I'm very proud of my family's military history, but regretted posting that a moment after I hit the button. It just came spilling out due to the frustration. I shouldn't take it so personally. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 10962 Registered: 5-2001 |
This weeks Newsweek calculates the odds of a solider being wounded in Iraq at 3.8%, not bad for a football bet, but higher than Vietnam and Korea where the odds were under 2%. The profession of arms is a dangerous one, but maybe the Administration policies of not providing enough troops to do the job isn't really "supporting the troops" either. | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12999 Registered: 1-2003 |
3.8% per how long? That stat is incomplete. Survival rate is up, thanks to medical technology. That leaves more maimed and injured people. I can't claim this is worse, but it does introduce some new problems at a new scale. And it means that would-be death statistics turn into statistics of injuries, which is one reason the number is higher now. Maybe I should have been a statistician. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 10964 Registered: 5-2001 |
Tom, my interpretation of the table was they took injuries (which may included deaths as well, I will check) divided by the number of soliders who served or are serving in Iraq. I will go over the article in more detail. This was my throne reading this morning. |
