| Author |
Message |
    
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 141
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 1:43 pm: | 
|
It is interesting that few want to discuss this topic. I have no quarrel with legal immigration and even understand that our current immigration rules are too restrictive. I do not oppose changing our current immigration rules to more reflect reality. However, I do think we need to have immigration rules and to keep track of who is coming into our country and if they are not behaving as potential good citizen's there should be rules about the right to stay being denied. Yes our nation is a land of immigrants and these were the "rules" our ancestors abided by. So again I welcome legal immigration.
BUT I do have a problem with "illegal" immigrants expecting to have the rights of US citizens. Can I "illegally" emmigrate to Mexico (or any where else) and demand my children be schooled, my health care paid for, and if necessary, welfare benefits be provided to my family by the Mexican (or any other) government? Don't think so. Actually I am under the impression that I can't even buy property in Mexico unless I am a Mexican citizen. So why do these illegal immigrants think they should have these "rights" merely by crossing our border without permission? Guess it is not PC to voice these thoughts but I think the majority of Americans red and blue staters look at the issue along the same lines. |
Mr. Big Poppa
Citizen
Username: Big_poppa
Post Number: 621
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 1:58 pm: |
|
To answer your property question...."Yes and No" http://www.mexonline.com/propmex.htm
Would these demanded rights be ok if their wages were taxed? They would essentially be paying for their services, albeit probably not in the same amounts as their American counterparts. |
FlyingSpaghettiMonst
Citizen
Username: Noodlyappendage
Post Number: 88
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 1:59 pm: |
|
Nob, Check the National Anthem thread in Soapbox (tho it really shold be here!) |
notehead
Supporter
Username: Notehead
Post Number: 3228
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 2:20 pm: |
|
I think that whatever we decide to do, we ought to have both the conviction and resources to strongly enforce the rules we decide on. Find a fair way to deal with the immigrants that are already here; revamp the rules by which people can become citizens, perhaps making it much simpler and easier; but then put more effort into preventing people from entering or staying illegally. The rule of law is the bedrock of society. If the law is unfair, then change it, but then enforce it. |
TomR
Citizen
Username: Tomr
Post Number: 1076
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 2:55 pm: |
|
Nob,
Are illegal immigrants really entitled to receive welfare benefits?
notehead,
In revamping the rules, would you advocate the immigrants be required to read, write and/or speak english in order to become citizens?
TomR |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 142
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 5:15 pm: |
|
Mr Big Poppa: Illegals are by definition "underground" and therefore not officially traceable -- how would you ever know if they were paying their taxes.And certainly few "illegals" make enough money to pay enough taxes to pay for their costs to American society -- remember their big benefit is that they are cheap laborers. If one doesn't need to be a legal immigrant or a citizen to qualify for benefits, what's the point of being a citizen? In that case I'd like to be illegal and duck my taxes as well.
TomR: OK, to my knowledge, I don't know if the courts have said illegal immigrants are "entitled" to welfare benefits although some are receiving these benefits with false papers (and food stamps etc.).........but our courts have said their children are entitled to school K-12 and medical care. And now they also want to expand their education right to cover college costs -- something legal citizens are not entitled to. Why should they just be entitled to walk into your country and get benefits? Again what's the point of being a lawabiding citizen? BUT again can you or I go to any other country in the world illegally, take up illegal residence and qualify for schooling and medical care for yourself and your dependents. I know Britain changed its law so that children born in the UK to noncitizens no longer automatically qualify for citizenship...........because they got tired of footing the bill.
Again, I am ok with having noncitizens having better controlled access to legal immigration but I absolutely oppose giving anything to "illegals" just because they managed to cross the border and they want us to give them a better life. Tom, guess you don't mind their sense of "entitlement"?
|
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 143
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 5:17 pm: |
|
And yes I do think they should read and write and speak English. |
GOP Man
Citizen
Username: Headsup
Post Number: 360
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 5:21 pm: |
|
We should conscript them into the military. |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 144
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 5:45 pm: |
|
Actually, I think the military already employs many noncitizens-- don't know if you can be employed by the military if you are illegal but so many illegals have false papers for getting jobs that probably there are illegals in our military.. I do think if an they serve in the armed forces they should have every right to speedy citizenship! That's definitely earning the right to citizenship and doing a job that many Americans don't want to do. |
3ringale
Citizen
Username: Threeringale
Post Number: 178
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 7:47 pm: |
|
This is one of those inane emails that floats around the internet, but it makes a few good points, garbled syntax and all:
Try This In Mexico
If you are ready for the adventure of a lifetime,
TRY THIS:
Enter Mexico illegally. Never mind immigration quotas, visas, international
law, or any of that nonsense.
Once there, demand that the local government provide free medical care for
you and your entire family.
Demand bilingual nurses and doctors.
Demand free bilingual local government forms, bulletins, etc.
Procreate abundantly.Deflect any criticism of this allegedly irresponsible
reproductive behavior with, "It is a cultural USA thing. You would not
understand, pal."
Keep your American identity strong. Fly Old Glory from your rooftop, or
proudly display it in your front window or on your car bumper.
Speak only English at home and in public and insist that your children do
likewise.
Demand classes on American culture in the Mexican school system.
Demand a local Mexican driver license. This will afford other legal rights
and will go far to legitimize your unauthorized, illegal presence in Mexico.
Drive around with no liability insurance and ignore local traffic laws.
Insist that local Mexican law enforcement teach English to all its officers.
Good luck! You'll be demanding for the rest of time or soon dead.
Because it will never happen. It will not happen in Mexico or any other
country in the world except right here in the United States, Land of the
naive and stupid, idiotic politically correct politicians, like Geo W Bush!!
Cheers
PS to Nob, This article is not exactly about illegal aliens serving in the military, but I found it to be an interesting, if unsettling read:
http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gangs01.html |
Factvsfiction
Citizen
Username: Factvsfiction
Post Number: 244
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 7:51 pm: |
|
Just deport everyone. I could use a vacation. |
TomR
Citizen
Username: Tomr
Post Number: 1080
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 8:11 pm: |
|
Nob,
You can guess anything you wish. But do so at your own peril.
You suggested that nondocumented immigrants are entitled to welfare benefits in our country. This was news to me, so I inquired as to your certainty on the matter.
To your credit, you readily admitted that you're unaware of any such entitlement.
But now you intimate that there is some legitimate movement to provide a college education to the children of nondocumented immigrants, a benefit not provided to legal citizens.
Where do you get this stuff? Some guy got on a soapbox an said "I want ..."; and your knickers are in a twist?
Try this. Ask taxpayers whether they want to pay taxes. You'll get an overwhelming response that they don't. Do you think the wing-nuts are going to bring about the demise of tax revenue to fund our government because most taxpayers don't want to pay taxes?
Your hyperbole is a bit over the top.
Lastly, and although I didn't ask you about english language literacy requirements for immigrants, what do we do with the citizens we have who can't read, write and/or speak english?
TomR
|
Mr. Big Poppa
Citizen
Username: Big_poppa
Post Number: 622
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 8:39 pm: |
|
Actually, I think the military already employs many noncitizens-- don't know if you can be employed by the military if you are illegal but so many illegals have false papers for getting jobs that probably there are illegals in our military..
Nob,
I think you contradicted yourself about whether illegals pay taxes. If they falsify their papers to obtain jobs, their taxes are most probably witheld.
I know of a few illegals that own small businesses, so they obviously pay larger amounts of taxes. |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 145
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 7:27 am: |
|
Mr. Big Poppa, Tom R
Yes some illegals ( a samll number) pay taxes and contribute to social security and can't ever get it back -- some have probbaly managed to start small businesses -- hardly enough to pay the way of the many. And that is not the point -- the point is they started out, and remain here, illegally -- bad catch 22 for those few who are succeeding -- guess you guys don't have a problem with that ILLEGALNESS -- interesting! Just trying to figure out why you think anybody else needs to follow any of society's rules?
I'd be happy to have guest workers come here and pay their own way for American services -- just don't understand why anyone thinks they are entitled to a free ride and you haven't explained why you think it is ok for those who are here illegally to get a free ride. I don't mind supporting the social contract with fellow citizen's and paying my fair share of taxes by the way. |
Mr. Big Poppa
Citizen
Username: Big_poppa
Post Number: 630
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 8:48 am: |
|
Nob,
Admit it, you have absolutely no support for your comments. You mention that only a small number of illegals pay their taxes, yet in your previous post you indicated that "so many illegals have false papers" which would indicate their taxes are being witheld.
It's ok to express an opinion, but don't pass if off as fact. |
Southerner
Citizen
Username: Southerner
Post Number: 977
Registered: 2-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 9:47 am: |
|
How long until we are forced to see another professional soccer league be formed? |
Mr. Big Poppa
Citizen
Username: Big_poppa
Post Number: 633
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 10:03 am: |
|
More NASCAR!!!!!
Southerner, is that you?
 |
cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 5586
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 11:15 am: |
|
Illegal immigration is corporate welfare. |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 3009
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 12:31 pm: |
|
Not just corporate welfare. Consumer welfare as well. |
Aok
Citizen
Username: Aok
Post Number: 236
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 9:16 pm: |
|
So I guess you are not among the Mplwd/SO residents who have concerns about "nonresident" students using your schools? |
Closed: New threads not accepted on this page