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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14633
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:13 pm: | 
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June 8, 2006
Op-Ed Columnist
Other People's Blood
By BOB HERBERT
For the smug, comfortable, well-off Americans, it doesn't seem to matter how long the war in Iraq goes on — as long as the agony is endured by others. If the network coverage gets too grim, viewers can always switch to the E! channel (one hand on the remote, the other burrowing into a bag of chips) to follow the hilarious antics of Paris, Britney, Brangelina et al.
The war is depressing and denial is the antidote. Why should ordinary citizens (good people, religious people, patriots) consider their role in — and responsibility for — the thunderous, unending carnage? Enough with this introspection. Let's go to the ballpark, get drunk and boo Barry Bonds.
The nation is in deep denial about Iraq. For years the president and his supporting cast of arrogant, bullying characters have tried to put the best face on this war. They had no idea what they were doing when they ordered the invasion of Iraq, and they still don't. Many of the troops who were assured that the Iraqis would welcome them with open arms are now dead. And there's still no plan.
Paul Wolfowitz, who fashioned the phony intellectual underpinnings of this catastrophe, told us that Iraqi oil revenues would cover the cost of reconstruction. He was as wrong about that as the president was about the weapons of mass destruction. (And as wrong as Dick Cheney was last June when he said the insurgency was in its last throes.)
Here are the facts: The war so recklessly launched by the amateurs in the Bush White House has already taken scores of thousands of lives, and will ultimately cost the United States $1 trillion to $2 trillion.
No one has been held accountable for this. While Mr. Bush's approval ratings are low, the public has been largely indifferent to the profound suffering in Iraq. This is primarily for two reasons: Because most Americans have no immediate personal stake in the war, and because the administration and the news media keep the worst of the suffering at a safe distance from the U.S. population.
The killing of American troops is usually kissed off with a paragraph or two in the major papers, and a sentence or two, at best, on national newscasts. (Imagine if someone in your office, sitting at a desk across from you, were suddenly blown to bits, splattering you with his or her blood. You wouldn't get over it for the rest of your life. This is what happens daily in Iraq.)
The many thousands of Iraqis who are killed — including babies and children who are shot to death, blown up, or incinerated — remain completely unknown to the American public. So not only is there very little empathy for the suffering of Iraqis, there is virtually no sense among ordinary Americans of a shared responsibility for that suffering.
Despite the frequently expressed fantasies expressed by President Bush and some of the leading politicians of both parties, the idea of a U.S. victory in Iraq is an illusion. The nightmarish violence is rising, not receding. Iraq is not being pacified. A suicide bomber blew himself up in a bustling market in Basra over the weekend, killing 27 and wounding scores. On Sunday, 20 people were stopped and pulled from their vehicles on a highway near Baquba and shot to death.
John Burns, writing in yesterday's New York Times, told us: "The death toll in one of the most grisly recent attacks, in the village of Hadid, near the Diyala provincial capital of Baquba, rose to 17 on Tuesday when the police delivered nine severed heads to the Baquba morgue in the fruit boxes in which they were found in the village."
Eight other heads had previously been found.
Instead of beginning to pull our troops out of Iraq, we are sending more in. The permanent Iraqi government, which was supposed to be the answer to everybody's prayers, is a study in haplessness. Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, Al Qaeda's man in Iraq, remains at large. (As does Osama bin Laden, somewhere in Pakistan.)
As was the case with Vietnam, the war in Iraq is a fool's errand. There is no clear mission for American troops in Iraq. No one can really say what the dead have died for. And yet the dying continues.
When it all finally comes to an end (according to President Bush, on somebody else's watch) we'll look around at the hideous costs in human treasure and cold hard cash and ask ourselves: What in the world were we thinking?
Copyright 2006 The New York Times Company
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Hoops
Citizen
Username: Hoops
Post Number: 1441
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:37 pm: |
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Quote:When it all finally comes to an end (according to President Bush, on somebody else's watch) we'll look around at the hideous costs in human treasure and cold hard cash and ask ourselves: What in the world were we thinking?
Well most of us will ask that. Staw, SLK, cjc, ajc, dougw, and Guy (where are you these days anyway) will be declaring success. |
cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 5699
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:45 pm: |
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I'm right here. And when there is success I will celebrate it keeping in mind the tremendous sacrifice this country made to advance the cause of freedom.
The line that we don't care how long the war is taking is Coulter-esque. |
drewdix
Citizen
Username: Drewdix
Post Number: 1193
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:51 pm: |
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!!!!!!!!!
C onservative
J ingoist
C heerleader |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14638
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:54 pm: |
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The line that we don't care how long the war is taking is Coulter-esque.
How are you feeling the pinch? What sacrifices have you had to make to keep this war going?
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GOP Man
Citizen
Username: Headsup
Post Number: 393
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 4:59 pm: |
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personally, I feel it every day living here among the smug libs in Maplewood. it takes real courage to continue to support our president, our brave troops, and the war effort against the snide remarks and dirty looks I get from my fellow Maplewoodians. but I'll keep fighting the brave fight here, along with my fellow conservatives, because we know that the spread of freedom is worth the price. |
Guy
Supporter
Username: Vandalay
Post Number: 1724
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 7:35 pm: |
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Hoops, thanks for noticing. Just been laying low. I'll be back. |
cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 5700
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 7:44 pm: |
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Tom (and RL, and others who have tried this line before) -- if you 're putting in place the stereotypical argument of "if you haven't served, you haven't sacrificed" I have said repeatedly I have sacrificed on levels for this effort short of putting on a uniform at my age. My family has seen two members deployed and successfully returned, thank God, so I'm well aware loved ones die. My trifling taxes (in comparison to lives lost and not at all about their size) are going to this. And yes -- the deficits and debt some rail about foisted upon our childen isn't something I take at all lightly either, though I think the eventual success in Iraq will be more significant and cheaper than the return the War on Poverty turned out to be). They'll be alive to begin to pay it and that's the big thing I'm working for here. I'm not doing it to score political points.
If that wasn't quite the argument you meant to convey, I apologize for assuming the worst.
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14640
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 9:26 pm: |
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No, that's quite good, actually. I am dismayed that many wouldn't consider sending their family yet think we should be in this war. I'm also dismayed that those who favor the war are not calling for tax increases. Do I take it you share these dismays with me?
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joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 568
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 9:41 pm: |
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How big, in dollar amount is the current federal budget?
You can round off to the nearest trillion dollars.
jd |
GOP Man
Citizen
Username: Headsup
Post Number: 394
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 9:43 pm: |
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absolutely tom. that is indeed quite good. it's very hard to pay taxes and not take the deficit lightly. I'm also doing that, and spending a lot of time on messages boards supporting the troops, and I've got magnets on all my cars. with people like us behind the war effort, we'll definitely prevail. |
cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 5702
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 10:59 pm: |
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Well, we still have that tax for the Spanish American war going right? And the income tax was to pay for the war as I recall. Only the rich would pay initially?
You're not going to agree with my stance that taxes should be set at the level -- regardless of income levels or social engineering -- which optimizes growth and in the process revenue going into the Treasury while leaving as much as possible in the hands of people who earned it. Spending is about choices. Deficits aren't necessarily a problem when related to GDP for me, and some things to incur deficits over is a fight for national security (another area you won't agree with me on with regards to Iraq I'll bet).
Sending my loved ones to war? I didn't send them. It's a volunteer force. I wouldn't dissuade them and actually feel quite honored and fortunate and proud my loved ones went. That is largely because I think it's worth it, of course. |
GOP Man
Citizen
Username: Headsup
Post Number: 395
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 6:42 am: |
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absolutely. you're right on in saying that the key thing is that our children will be alive to pay that debt. because they would have been in mortal danger if we had not gone to war in Iraq. if Saddam had had WMD, he might have given them to evildoers who could have perhaps used them on Americans. our children should thank us for this war. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14641
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 7:17 am: |
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cjc, your argument is respectable and consistent. You may be surprised that I say that.
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cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 5703
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 12:50 pm: |
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Not really, Tom. Though I usually end up disagreeing with you, you're one of the more honest and responsible posters here. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14646
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 6:06 pm: |
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Thank you. It's nice to see some people around here trying, isn't it?
Group hug!
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