| Author | Message | ||
     joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 851 Registered: 1-2006 |
Water fountains for Coloreds only, in 2006, where else but?? from jihadwatch.org, at its dhimmiwatch thread Pakistan: Christian Beaten For Drinking Water From Public Facility What's an unclean kaffir doing drinking from the Muslims-Only water fountain? Muhammad Crow Alert: "Christian Stone Mason Beaten For Drinking Water From Public Facility," from the ASSIST News Service, with thanks to LAH: LAHORE, PAKISTAN (ANS) -- A Christian stone mason received critical injuries, including dislocation of his shoulder after he was seen drinking water from a public facility, by a Muslim man on June 6 (Tuesday) just outside the eastern city of Lahore, the Pakistan Christian Post (PCP) has reported. Nasir Ashraf, the Christian mason was working at the construction site of a school. The trouble for him began while he was returning to the site. Confronting him with anger the Muslim man asked him as to why he drank water from the public facility by using a glass that was placed at the water tank. “Why did you drink water from this glass since you are a Christian?” the PCP quoted the Muslim man as asking Nasir. “The man accused the mason of polluting the glass and proceeded to destroy it. The Muslim man then summoned a crowd by shouting, “This Christian polluted our glass,” and encouraged them to beat him up”, the PCP report said. “The crowd began beating Nasir, eventually pushing him off a ledge. The fall dislocated his shoulder, broke his collarbone in two places and knocked him unconscious,” it said. | ||
| Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 1339 Registered: 4-2006 |
Dave- I think you are wrong to make that type of outrageous and over-the-top equation. That was a an act of state terror against German Jews who were natives and citizens of that very country. There is no right to a visa to enter the United States, it is a priviledge accorded. Some commentators have raised the very issue of restricting entry into the US from muslim countries as a means of ensuring our domestic safety. I believe I posted an article by Cathy Seipp on that very subject. If someone near and dear to you dies as a result of the admission of someone who commits a terrorist act because we must be "liberal", how would you feel? It is a valid, non-prejudicial thing to discuss. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave  Post Number: 10352 Registered: 4-1997  |
Clearly you are right. As long as we can blame all Muslims for the acts of a few, that's what America is all about. | ||
| Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 1341 Registered: 4-2006 |
And have all muslims condemned the acts of a few? If not Dave, you need to go back to the drawing board. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10353 Registered: 4-1997 |
Clearly you are right. If there is even one Muslim who is holding out his criticism, all Muslims need to pay. These are critical times. We need to spread hate faster than the terrorists do. Then we will win, god be praised. | ||
| Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 1342 Registered: 4-2006 |
Avoidance is not the answer. | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 15230 Registered: 1-2003  |
On the one hand, we have 3ringale calling for something equivalent to the Japanese internment camps of WW-II. On the other hand, we have Joel citing persecution against Christians in Pakistan. I happen to agree with you, Joel, that such persecution is an atrocity. However, I think your mind is made up about the validity of a religion embraced by at least a third of the world's population. And you sideskirted my question in a not-so-clever way. Are you trying to say that Western bigotry is somehow better than Muslim bigotry? I deplore whatever culture might have led to Mr. Haq's actions. However, there is a culture, and there are individuals. Back to another question you never answered: if a Muslim applied to work for you, what would your response be? Try not to cloak your answer in sarcasm this time. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10355 Registered: 4-1997 |
Avoidance is the answer if war is the question. | ||
| Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 1343 Registered: 4-2006 |
Tom Reingold- It is up to muslims not only to advance the faith, but advance their acceptance and willingness to fully participate in american society, as other groups have done in the history of this country. | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 852 Registered: 1-2006 |
Tom: From today's New York Sun, and a glint of sunlight as well: August 6, 2006 A voice of sanity Youssef Ibrahim, New York Sun: The interminable Arab-Israel conflict has come to an important moment. Israel’s quest for secure borders has so much in common with the existential needs of its neighbors that as Lebanon stands at the crossroads, so does the Arab world. Many in the vast, silent Arab majority have become convinced over the past decade that they will never build a future for themselves or their children as long as turbaned hoodlums — such as Hezbollah’s Hassan Nasrallah, uniformed pseudo-revolutionaries like Libya’s dictator, Muammar Gadhafi, and their ilk — continue to embark on armed struggles in the name of God or hallucinatory visions of Arab nationalism. For those who read, watch, and listen to Arabic press and broadcast outlets, as well as coffee-table chatter, the subtext of conversations among Arabs today is this: We are done with chasing windmills, we need to use oil money to build, and we want to look forward, not backward. To be sure, the tired jihadist slogan “No voice shall be louder than that of the battle” still fills the air, but it is, for the most part, just white noise. I haven’t heard such sentiments since the debacle of June 1967, when Egypt’s Gamal Abdel Nasser packed Syria, Jordan, the Palestinian Arabs, and much of the Arab world off to a devastating defeat by Israel in the Six-Day War. After that tragedy, which became known as “the Catastrophe,” Nasser’s battle cry of Arab nationalism simply collapsed. Unfortunately, this void was quickly filled by Wahhabi-powered Islamic jihadism from the dark heart of the Arabian Desert — the kingdom of Saudi Arabia and its sinister priesthood mafia. Ideologically and financially, this jihadism was propped up by profoundly reactionary concepts, as was Iran’s more revolutionary version, which came about after that country’s religious revolution of 1979. Both versions were supported by insecure regimes. By definition, both Wahhabi and Iranian religious demagoguery — and their tributaries Al Qaeda, Hamas, the Muslim Brotherhood, and the entire McDonald’s-like franchise of jihadist fantasies, including the Iranian-sponsored Hezbollah — are nihilist, seeking to substitute the existing order in complicated societies with the comfort of medieval ignorance. None of the branches of this movement possesses a social project or anything close to it. Today’s Arabs understand that this won’t do in 2006. Now that the jihadists have brought their fight to Lebanon, it is by no means sure that they will exit intact or triumphant. What is evident is that silent majorities among the Saudis, Egyptians, Jordanians, and much of the vast world of Sunni Islam are rooting openly or quietly for the demise of Hezbollah, as well as an end to jihadism. No Arab armies are rushing to assist Sheik Nasrallah in Lebanon. Images of the sectarian butchery that these jihadist forces have unleashed in Iraq are more than sobering, as is the mayhem that Islamic jihadists brought to Gaza and onto the whole Palestinian Arab landscape long before the current war in Lebanon. In this sense, Lebanon has emerged as their latest front. It is precisely in Lebanon where it seems a difference could be made — by drawing a line in the sand that bars any further jihadist initiatives. Right now, Israel is doing the work. But once the shooting stops, the dust settles, and everyone surveys the damage, Israel hopes that the silent Arab majority will place the blame where it truly belongs: upon the terrorists in their midst. Poor Lebanon. Such is its fate that a battle that should have destroyed Syria, Hezbollah, and the ultimate villain of this drama, Iran, is being fought instead in Lebanese valleys and towns. Still, Lebanon possesses the best of the Arab world — a highly educated population, a spirit of free enterprise, and a multilingual, multiethnic, and multicultural society that stands on the cusp on modernity, globalization, and sophistication. It will make a comeback, if for no other reason that, at this point, far too many Arabs understand that enough is enough. A prominent writer for the Arab daily Asharq al-Awsat, Hoda Al Husseini, put it well yesterday when she argued that, in the end, Sheik Nasrallah and those like him — including Hamas and the other jihadis who launch wars on the enemy only to destroy their own nations, people, and welfare — will be looked upon by fellow Arabs as people who “hate Israel far more than they love their own people.” With each passing day of the Lebanon war, this is sinking in. | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 15234 Registered: 1-2003 |
Joel, you sure can cite bad stuff. So? Do you ignore my questions because you think they are immaterial, or because you'd rather avoid them? I think if you answered them, they would question your beliefs. But give it a try. It might not hurt. I agree that the world is full of people to fear. Yes, indeed. Now that you've found the darkness, are you going to look for the light? | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 853 Registered: 1-2006 |
Use the force Luke. Learn from the past, Luke, errr, Tom. This is the light, because it illuminates the truth. August 07, 2006 Lebanese Shi'ite leader: Hizballah fighting "new battle of Khaybar" In "Shiite cleric hails Hezbollah militants," AP blandly notes that "at Khaibar, the name of an oasis in what is now Saudi Arabia, Islam's prophet Muhammad won a battle against Jews in the year 629." That's not precisely what the earliest Islamic records show. As I explain in my forthcoming book, The Truth About Muhammad (coming October 9 from Regnery), Muhammad was not responding to any provocation when he led a Muslim force against the Khaybar oasis, which was inhabited by Jews – many of whom he had previously exiled from Medina. One of the Muslims later remembered: “When the apostle raided a people he waited until the morning. If he heard a call to prayer he held back; if he did not hear it he attacked. We came to Khaybar by night, and the apostle passed the night there; and when morning came he did not hear the call to prayer, so he rode and we rode with him….We met the workers of Khaybar coming out in the morning with their spades and baskets. When they saw the apostle and the army they cried, ‘Muhammad with his force,’ and turned tail and fled. The apostle said, ‘Allah Akbar! Khaybar is destroyed. When we arrive in a people’s square it is a bad morning for those who have been warned.’” The Muslim advance was inexorable. “The apostle,” according to Muhammad's earliest biographer, Ibn Ishaq, “seized the property piece by piece and conquered the forts one by one as he came to them.” Ibn Sa‘d reports that the battle was fierce: the “polytheists…killed a large number of [Muhammad’s] Companions and he also put to death a very large number of them….He killed ninety-three men of the Jews…” Muhammad and his men offered the fajr prayer, the Islamic dawn prayer, before it was light, and then entered Khaybar itself. The Muslims immediately set out to locate the inhabitants’ wealth. A Jewish leader of Khaybar, Kinana bin al-Rabi, was brought before Muhammad; Kinana was supposed to have been entrusted with the treasure of the Banu Nadir. Kinana denied knowing where this treasure was, but Muhammad pressed him: “Do you know that if we find you have it I shall kill you?” Kinana said yes, that he did know that. Some of the treasure was found. To find the rest, Muhammad gave orders concerning Kinana: “Torture him until you extract what he has.” One of the Muslims built a fire on Kinana’s chest, but Kinana would not give up his secret. When he was at the point of death, one of the Muslims beheaded him. Kinana's wife was taken as a war prize; Muhammad claimed her for himself and hastily arranged a wedding ceremony that night. He halted the Muslims' caravan out of Khaybar later that night in order to consummate the marriage. Muhammad agreed to let the people of Khaybar to go into exile, allowing them to keep as much of their property as they could carry. The Prophet of Islam, however, commanded them to leave behind all their gold and silver. He had intended to expel all of them, but some, who were farmers, begged him to allow them to let them stay if they gave him half their yield annually. Muhammad agreed: “I will allow you to continue here, so long as we would desire.” He warned them: “If we wish to expel you we will expel you.” They no longer had any rights that did not depend upon the good will and sufferance of Muhammad and the Muslims. And indeed, when the Muslims discovered some treasure that some of the Khaybar Jews had hidden, he ordered the women of the tribe enslaved and seized the perpetrators’ land. A hadith notes that “the Prophet had their warriors killed, their offspring and woman taken as captives.” During the caliphate of Umar (634-644), the Jews who remained at Khaybar were banished to Syria, and the rest of their land seized. This is the numinous Islamic chain of events that Fadlallah is invoking. BEIRUT, Lebanon - Lebanon's top Shiite Muslim cleric hailed Hezbollah militants Thursday as "the soldiers of the Arab and Islamic nation" on their way to triumph over the U.S. and Israel. Grand Ayatollah Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah saluted the fighters in a video aired on Hezbollah's Al-Manar television. "You are moving ... to reach a new victory for the nation and to defeat the American and Zionist political pride and all the enemies of freedom in the region and the world," Fadlallah said. "You are the soldiers of the Arab and Islamic nation and your struggle will bring victory to Arabs, Muslims and the oppressed," he said. Fadlallah, whose house and office in south Beirut were flattened by Israeli airstrikes last month, urged the guerrillas to continue fighting the "new battle of Khaibar." At Khaibar, the name of an oasis in what is now Saudi Arabia, Islam's prophet Muhammad won a battle against Jews in the year 629.... | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 15235 Registered: 1-2003 |
OK, Joel. You have your mind made up. What's the use in talking? One day, people from various backgrounds will know how to proceed, to build tolerance and prosperity together, and you won't hear it, because you're too busy promulgating the hatred that you claim to hate when it comes from Muslims. Yes, you can cite the bad stuff, and it's true, and it's bad, and it's bad, and it's true, but I think I see a bigger picture. And I guess you're too smug to acknowledge that I even asked you some useful questions. Well, you sure showed me, didn't you? | ||
| Southerner Citizen Username: Southerner Post Number: 1401 Registered: 2-2004 |
I like seeing Reingold get spunky. | ||
| 3ringale Citizen Username: Threeringale Post Number: 335 Registered: 1-2006 |
Tom Reingold, I would hardly compare my modest proposal om Muslim immigration to "something equivalent to the Japanese internment camps of WW-II". By the way, did you know that the ACLU and California Gov. Earl Warren favored internment, but J. Edgar Hoover opposed it? But I digress. I think it is fair to say that most people who post here line up along the usual Dem and Repub lines with a few exceptions. There is a fair amount of hypocrisy and double standards on both sides. Some decry our invasion of Iraq and locking up some hapless goat herders at Gitmo and charging them with "terrorism". But I have little doubt that the same people would not mind invading Darfur and sending Mel Gibson to Gitmo and chaging him with "hate speech". At least I am consistent. Khomeini said that Islam is politics or it is nothing. What is Islamic politics? Is it what the leader of CAIR says it is, if there are any unindicted CAIR leaders left? To quote myself: What we should not do is invade or attack Muslim countries or give economic or military assistance to other countries that do so. What part of that do you disagree with? Do you want to "Be About Peace" or not? America cannot solve the problems of the world. We should not be the world's policeman, welfare caseworker or polyglot flophouse. Not to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think that joel dranove and Factvsfiction are close to agreeing with me about the nature of Islam. I think we would disagree on how to address the problem, but I respect them for seeing the world as it is, and not viewing it through rose-colored, multi-cultural glasses. Cheers | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 15236 Registered: 1-2003 |
3ringale, I don't always agree with you, but I do agree that you don't follow party lines, and I enjoy your fresh thinking. It's nice to have you here. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10359 Registered: 4-1997 |
Are we going to ask all immigrants what their religion is? Should we let atheists in? What happens if they convert? Should we find all Muslims here now and make them wear arm bands? "Yes, we know we understand America was settled by people seeking religious freedom, but we decided out of fear and ignorance to change all of that." Maybe 3ringale should simply return to wherever he or she immigrated from and be done with it if America seems too free and open for his comfort? Talk about letting the terrorists win... | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1810 Registered: 10-2004  |
Dave - bingo. | ||
| 3ringale Citizen Username: Threeringale Post Number: 336 Registered: 1-2006 |
Dave, I see Islam as more akin to a political ideology with a religious component. I think it was originally used as a vehicle for Arab imperialism with a dollop of Arab polytheism thrown in. Whatever it may be now, it is foreign to America. America's politico-legal system is a combination of Canon law, Germanic folk law and English common law. Islam has virtually no formative significance for us. This is documented in detail by Harold J. Berman in his magisterial Law and Revolution: The Formation of the Western Legal Tradition. It had an impact on me, but don't hold Prof. Berman accountable for my shortcomings. You should read it if you get a chance:http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0674517768/sr=1-3/qid=1155046921/ref=pd_bbs_3/1 04-4205850-6039919?ie=UTF8&s=books Islam also played no part in our folk-ways or language,(except for a handful of words). So, the very hypothetical prospect of a ban on Muslim immigration and the return of the Muslims already here to Dar Al Islam would not seem very significant, culturally. I can't say what the economic or military tab would be, but I daresay it would be less than $300 billion and 20,000 dead and maimed American soldiers. My father came here from Ireland and my mother was born and raised in Irvington. If I go back to where I came from, it would only be to....Orange, NJ! Cheers PS I edited my profile and it is now sex specific, but I am going to let everyone keep guessing about my hair color and favorite TV show. | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5700 Registered: 10-1999  |
Nativists in the U.S. once argued that the religious beliefs of Irish Catholic immigrants were antithetical to American democracy. People seriously argued that immigration from Ireland should be limited. These same arguments keep getting repeated, just with a different religious group, or nationality, or race. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10363 Registered: 4-1997 |
Arab imperialism? I recall Palestinians being displaced because England and France sliced it that way following WW2. I see the US invading Iraq on false premises. I saw what happened with the Shah of Iran. With Iran-Contra. With our proxy war with the USSR in Afghanistan. All bouts of western, not Arab, imprerialism. (I'm defining USSR as a western power in this context) With your arguments about cleansing the US of Muslims, maybe we should ban Chinese, Indians, Japanese and Koreans because their "folk-ways" and language haven't entered our mainstream. | ||
| 3ringale Citizen Username: Threeringale Post Number: 337 Registered: 1-2006 |
Nohero, There is an old joke about an Irish nativist. I don't remember the whole setup, but the punchline went something like: Amerikay for Americans. Dave, I was referring to Arab imperialism ca. the 7th to 12th centuries. I'm not offering any defense of 20th century imperialism, Western or otherwise. As far as banning Chinese, Indian, Japanese, or Koreans from America goes, I am in favor of closing the borders and imposing a moratorium on immigration for at least 5 years, until we can figure out what the heck is going on. I would include the Irish in that group. However, if any Chinese, Indians, Japanese, Koreans or Irish start flying airplanes into tall buildings, I would probably want to make the moratorium permanent. Cheers | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12342 Registered: 5-2001 |
Nohero, three words for you, "I know nothing".  I think that anyone whose ancestors arrived here after around 1860 should be rounded up and returned to their country of origin. All of this is based on your perception. I am OK, but those who came here after me aren't.  | ||
| Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 1347 Registered: 4-2006 |
Nohero- And had the Irish immigrants previously been shooting cannons or discharging muskets into any buildings here in the US to kill the followers of Martin Luther? Congrats to you, for you win my new " kumbayiah, let's all get along (despite reality) multicultural understanding off-base analogy" award for most inane MOL post. BTW dude, they can't seem to find 11 Egyptian students that were supposed to be attending school here on student visas. Perhaps you should be calling Homeland Security to request they show extreme sensitivity to their different cultural perceptions and desire to skip school to explore alternative opportunities. Perhaps bomb-making classes? More job opportunities in the Middle East for that certainly. | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5703 Registered: 10-1999 |
Really? Most inane? Wow, that's quite an encomium. I thought the reference was quite a propos. Someone argued for exclusion of Muslims, on the grounds that Islam "is foreign to America". The argument seemed familiar, and I was just pointing out that similar arguments had been made before, with regard to _____________ (fill in the blank with your favorite scapegoat ethnic group, or race, or nationality, or religious persuasion). But, on the plus side, this thread has been informative, with regard to the prejudices of some of the posters. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12348 Registered: 5-2001 |
FactvFiction, I know you are a real expert on all this stuff. Heck, you told me this yourself. However, I suggest you google "Draft Riots Civil War. | ||
| 3ringale Citizen Username: Threeringale Post Number: 338 Registered: 1-2006 |
Nohero, Can you offer your take on Khomeini's statement that "Islam is politics or it is nothing"? What do Islamic politics look like? Is there a good Islamic politics and a bad Islamic politics? Do we need Islamic politics in the US? Aren't our politics screwed up enough already? Has anyone ever defined Irishness as political? Are pluralism, tolerance multi-culturalism and diversity celebration universal principles found in every society, or are they limited to certain times and places? I'm just wondering. Cheers | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 15241 Registered: 1-2003 |
Which Khomeini said that? Never mind; it doesn't matter. The ones we knew and know were and are political figures. Why don't you ask Joe Random in a mosque. The fact is that every entity becomes political. Power struggles emerge everywhere. There are political battles at every workplace and in every household. It is meaningless to say Islam is political, because so is everything else. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10377 Registered: 4-1997 |
Look at the beginnings of Christianity: Sadducees and Pharisees. Politics. Look at the Vatican. Politics. Look at the Crusades. Politics. Look at the beginnings of the Anglican Church. Politics. Luther's Proclamations. Council of Trent. Bush's Campaign in evangelical churches. etc. etc. | ||
| 3ringale Citizen Username: Threeringale Post Number: 339 Registered: 1-2006 |
OK, OK, I surrender. Islam is a religion of peace (President Bush says so, so it must be true). All religions are peaceful, except maybe for Christianity. The more Muslims who immigrate to America, the more peaceful things will be. Maybe we should dedicate all the Diversity Visas to Islamic countries to make up for lost time? http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/types/types_1318.html I'll try to find something else to be a gadfly about. Now I know how Winston Smith must have felt. Cheers | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 861 Registered: 1-2006 |
This site has the names and pictures of well over one hundred Israeli children and babies murdered in the name of Islam, since 2000. Some pictures are not for the squeemish. But, I am still peaceful, and about peace. These dead are at peace, before their time, for no reason other than their country of origin. http://daledamos.blogspot.com/2006/08/123-israeli-children-killed-by.html | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 862 Registered: 1-2006 |
Oops, "entity" of origin. jd | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10382 Registered: 4-1997 |
One third of civilian deaths in Lebanon over the past week are children under 13. That's over 200 in 4 weeks. | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 864 Registered: 1-2006 |
So? Your point is? These kids were deliberately targetted by individuals with bombs on their person. No mistakes possible. They chose these kids as targets. jd | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10386 Registered: 4-1997 |
Here are Israeli right wingers celebrating the 60th anniversary of their terrorist bombing of a British hotel last month. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2277717,00.html In other words, for every horrible act committed against Israelis by Muslim extremists, I can match it with an equally horrible act by Israel. The point is it will go on until both sides sit down, stop overreacting, and work things out on a rational level. If we had any president except death-monger Bush, this would be happening already. | ||
| cjc Citizen Username: Cjc Post Number: 5785 Registered: 8-2003 |
Oslo Accords worked well. | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 865 Registered: 1-2006 |
Dave: I don't think so. Think about this when you buy a slice of pizza: Remembering the Sbarro Atrocity Today is the fifth anniversary of the horrific massacre of innocent civilians by a Palestinian suicide bomber, at the Sbarro pizzeria in Jerusalem. Here’s the web site dedicated to one of the victims: A loving tribute to Malka Chana Roth 1985-2001. UPDATE at 8/9/06 8:32:33 am: And let’s also remember how the Palestinians celebrated this atrocity—by building a display commemorating it at An Najah University in Nablus: Unfortunately, I don't know how to link the links, so you can go to littlegreenfootballs.com to get to the pictures about what can happen when you are eating pizza in Israel during peacetime in 2001. | ||
| J. Crohn Supporter Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 2669 Registered: 3-2003 |
From Dave's link: The plaque presents as fact the Irgun’s claim that people died because the British ignored warning calls. “For reasons known only to the British, the hotel was not evacuated,” it states. It bloody well does. And Mr. McDonald and Dr. Jenkins are free to deny the truth as much as they please, but their denials don't change the reality: A warning message was delivered to the telephone operator of the King David Hotel before the attack and also delivered to the French consulate and the Palestine Post newspaper. According to Irgun sources, the message read "I am speaking on behalf of the Hebrew underground. We have placed an explosive device in the hotel. Evacuate it at once - you have been warned." Irgun representatives have always claimed that the warning was given well in advance so that adequate time was available to evacuate the hotel. Menachem Begin writes (p. 221, The Revolt, <1951> ed.) that the telephone message was delivered 25 - 27 minutes before the explosion. The British authorities denied for many years that there had been a warning at all, but the leaking of the internal police report on the bombing during the 1970s proved that a warning had indeed been received. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing "The point is it will go on until both sides sit down, stop overreacting, and work things out on a rational level. If we had any president except death-monger Bush, this would be happening already." Good lord. You have finally out-tulipped Tulip. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12357 Registered: 5-2001 |
Clever those Mossad agents, very clever. I don't know if the paper work was slipped into the file by an Israeli agent or not. However, and I think we are seeing this with the leaflets being dropped in Lebanon, warnings are rarely effective. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 10389 Registered: 4-1997 |
A phone call absolves you from putting bombs in a crowded building? |
