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shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1189
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 11:01 am: | 
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Late Saturday night we were in the international arrivals baggage claim at Newark Airport. A baggage handler walked up to my five-year-old son and touched his face. He ran his palm down my son's face, from his forehead to his chin, then stroked him on the cheek. I screamed at him, "Get your hands off his face! Don't touch a child you don't know! That's disgusting!"
Yesterday in the post office an elderly woman on line in front of us said, "Oh, he's so cute," and started reaching toward my son's face. When I interfered to block her, she shooed my hand away to try to reach him! I blocked her again, and again she attempted to bypass me to touch his face!
What is with these people? Why do strangers feel they have to right to touch a child? I am so infuriated! |
Meandtheboys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 3115
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 11:29 am: |
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Not sure what your objection to strangers touching your child is, but you're certainly entitled to it. I would be upset if someone kept trying to touch my child if I objected. But I generally don't.
I understand why they want to touch the child. Children are generally irresistible. They're merely showing affection. Doesn't bother me, so I guess I can't help you. |
gj1
Citizen
Username: Gj1
Post Number: 313
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 11:31 am: |
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It may be annoying and overstepping boundaries, but disgusting? IMO, acting like a crazy person in response is probably more damaging to the child. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 6821
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 11:36 am: |
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The airport face-stroking scenario sounds a lot more creepy than the old lady.
There is something appealing about kids. I am always tempted to wiggle a baby's foot or hand when I see one in a restaurant, etc. But, I don't because I figure that it is presumptuous for a stranger to touch someone's child.
If an older child (4-6ish) runs across my path, I have been know to put a hand on their shoulder or head in order to avoid a collision. |
Michael Turner
Citizen
Username: Resident_lune
Post Number: 11
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 11:39 am: |
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That child is going to grow up thinking if someone so much as pokes him he's going to get molested. :-/
In all seriousness, just try and calm down. There's better ways to ask someone to stop touching your kid without hollaring at them or otherwise acting like an offensive linesman blocking someone.
Let me ask you ... would you have responded differently if this stranger was another mother or father and they had a child of similar age with them as they doted over how cute your child is? I'm inclined to believe you wouldn't act the same if that was the case. |
themp
Supporter
Username: Themp
Post Number: 2618
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:04 pm: |
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I would take a chill pill if I were you. |
Virtual It Girl
Citizen
Username: Shh
Post Number: 4099
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:15 pm: |
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Why touch a kid's face? That is kind of disgusting. And a baggage handler? Ick, how many germs do you think are on his hands?
I *might* not have screamed, but I definitely would have pulled my child away and said to her "if you don't want someone to touch you, you should say something" or to the toucher "she doesn't like to be touched." When my youngest was a baby I was always telling kids not to touch her, or instead of don't touch I'd tell them "touch her feet, she likes when kids touch her toes, but she'll cry if you touch her anyplace else."
It's beyond me why a baggage handler would touch your child's face. |
Scrotis Lo Knows
Citizen
Username: Scrotisloknows
Post Number: 905
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:25 pm: |
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shoshanna-
I understand your concerns, especially the baggage handler-how creepy. The PO woman you may have overreacted a bit. One question, did the BH know you were mom?
My wife is the same way, very protective. Your perception definitely changes when your child is involved.
I have a habit of running into old men in supermarkets who have to tell me 10 times how cute my 2 year old son is. After the 2nd time I am like dude.....
-SLK |
argon_smythe
Citizen
Username: Argon_smythe
Post Number: 770
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:39 pm: |
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I would not call such behavior disgusting, I would call it presumptuous.
It would be nice if people treated children like people. Sure, they're small and immature. But come on - would you walk up to an adult and tell them how attractive they are as you run your hand across their face? Why then would it be OK to do so to a child?
That said, screaming at anyone usually doesn't accomplish much.
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Wendyn
Supporter
Username: Wendyn
Post Number: 2758
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:45 pm: |
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There may be some overreaction, but think about how you would feel if a stranger reached over and stroked your face. Ewwwww.
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Purplebug
Citizen
Username: Purplebug
Post Number: 71
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 12:45 pm: |
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I have been known to back away from children. Not all of them are cute. |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1190
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:01 pm: |
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My feeling about it is along the lines of what Argon and Wendyn said. And what VIG said. He didn't just pat him on the head -- he ran his open palm from the forehead to the chin. His palm was bigger than my son's entire head. It is such an invasion. And imagine how helpless my child feels. I did use it as a teachable moment, explaining to my son that it is not okay that the guy did it and that it is okay for him to tell the toucher that he does not want to be touched. The reason I shouted was that I wanted the baggage handler to know that his behavior is completely out of line. Like Wendyn said, how would you like it if the baggage handler ran his palm down your face and stroked your cheek? Wouldn't you shout out to him to stop it? |
Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 55
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:17 pm: |
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It is a sad sad world when a human cannot look at a child smile and touch his face without being accused of something. By the way..why is a baggage handler more gross then a grandma at the postoffice? How do you know she didn't just put raw chicken in the oven and picked her nose and then didn't wash her hands?
Bajou |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2466
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:25 pm: |
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As a large adult guy, if some guy tried to run his hand along my face from my forehead to my chin, he wouldn't make it past my eyes without ofvfering to buy me dinner.
As a child, I'd think it was weird. but then, I think a child thinks all adults are weird.
back on topic, I think what the guy did was weird, but not worth yelling about. Maybe just tell the guy not to touch your kid. I assume you were standing next to your son, and that it as obvious he was with you? Did he say anything? |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2467
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:26 pm: |
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Bajou, because men who want to touch young boys are child molesters, while grandmas want to bake them cookies. A grandma would never go out without washing her hands. |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1191
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:42 pm: |
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By the way, I did not accuse him of anything other than handling and stroking my child's face. That in and of itself is not appropriate. It does not make it a "sad" world. It was also inappropriate for the elderly woman in the post office. If someone thinks my child is cute and wants to start a conversation with him, I have no problem with that. |
Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 58
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:46 pm: |
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Dear Rasto:
What messed up world do you live in? Why is a man not allowed to feel like anybody else about a child. Dads love their kids, uncles and grandpa's love kids. My ex boyfriend loved my kids..A person smiling and touching a young childs face in front of their mother is not the posterboy of child molestation. Most molesters are not strangers either...they are family members.
You stated:
As a large adult guy, if some guy tried to run his hand along my face from my forehead to my chin, he wouldn't make it past my eyes without offering to buy me dinner.
Would you feel the same if it would be some woman running her hands along you face from your forehead to you chin? Is it dinner either way..?
Bajou
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Meandtheboys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 3122
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 1:52 pm: |
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Bajou, I'm pretty sure Rastro was being sarcastic? |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2471
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 2:01 pm: |
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Bajou, I was being sarcastic about men being molesters and gandmas wanting to bake them cookiees. Everyone know grandmas are the real threat, and middle aged men are looking to provide assorted baked goods... 
As for a woman running her hand across my face, I'd think it was pretty weird, too (even as a large adult guy). but depending on what she looked like, I might buy her dinner (Don't tell my wife!)
But then I'd probably get a rash from the bad karma that would come my way. |
shestheone
Citizen
Username: Shestheone
Post Number: 239
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 2:08 pm: |
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When I read the initial post, I didn't think of molesters or grandmas. I simply wondered why any adult would think it is ok to invade the personal space boundaries of any stranger -- child or adult. |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1192
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 2:55 pm: |
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shestheone: Bingo! |
Charles De Mar
Citizen
Username: Charles_demar
Post Number: 227
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 3:08 pm: |
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Maybe they had something on their face (food, drink remnants, booger) & they were wiping it off. |
mem
Citizen
Username: Mem
Post Number: 5836
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 3:36 pm: |
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Rastro - Doi you think my rash is bad karma?
What did I do now?
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redY67
Citizen
Username: Redy67
Post Number: 4993
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 3:50 pm: |
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It is amazing the difference in cultures. A friend of mine lived in Brazil for six years. She said when she would fly from the US to Brazil it was amazing the differences.
When she was in the aiport in Brazil, they helped carry her children, when she got here, she asked one of the Airport personel to hold her son for a moment while she opened the stroller. The aiport attendant refused, and was appalled at the question. |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1193
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 4:35 pm: |
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Helping someone who asks for help - even offering help -- is not the same as uninvitedly wiping your hand across a stranger's face. |
Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 62
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 5:43 pm: |
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I have just been told that Rastro is not so bad after all! |
redY67
Citizen
Username: Redy67
Post Number: 4994
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 6:17 pm: |
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no shoshannah absolutely it is not, that would freak me out too if a stranger touched my child like that. I just think it is very interesting how different cultures can be.
An older woman, going to touch my child wouldn't freak me out. |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2478
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 6:47 pm: |
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Bajou, haven't you seen me in all the Jetsons resuns? How could I be so bad? 
Actually, I'm just on a run these past couple of days. I feel like I've spent 20 of the past 30 hours online. I don't usually feel the need to respond to each and every post on each and every thread. |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2479
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 7:08 pm: |
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Mem, I think your rash is follicle mites. They read the latest recipe, and they figured they'd eat you before you eat them. |
Greeneyes
Citizen
Username: Greeneyes
Post Number: 752
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 7:14 pm: |
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Shoshannah,
I have the same problem. My 14 month old son has the cutest chubby cheeks. Total strangers think it's ok to just come up, pinch his face, squeeze his face, kiss his face. It does freak me out. A counter person at Panera came up to him and shoved a piece of bread in his mouth. It's maddening. I know people don't mean any harm, but the kid wasn't even eating solids yet and this woman thought because he was big, he needed a snack!
Now, I'm on the defensive. I put my face-pincher radar on. I can spot them now and I move my body accordingly. I brought my son a hoodie that is two sizes too big, so the hoodie part hides his face. I carry some wet ones, so I can wipe his face and hands if I miss one of those baby touchers. |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2481
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 7:19 pm: |
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For the record, I don't want anyone to think I believe it's ok for complete strangers to touch other people. I've joked about it here, but really, I don't think it's appropriate for anyone to touch a child they don't know, particularly babies that cannot say "leave me alone." I always bristle when my wife even touches babies' feet if she doesn't know the parents. You want to say how cute someone's child is? Great. But there is no reason for touching the kid. |
Meandtheboys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 3125
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 7:30 pm: |
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Funny how different we all can be. I know that all of my kids, at one time or another, have been touched by a stranger and it's never bothered me. Perhaps if their intentions were anything other than appreciation of the beauty and innocence of children, I would get a bad vibe and be upset. But for the most part, it all seems perfectly innocent. In fact, I take it as a supreme compliment that even other people find my children hard to resist. And I see it as one of the great things about being a child: people are so attracted to you and so uninhibited by the usual societal crap that they have no qualms about touching you to show how much they appreciate you. But then that's just me, I guess.
Not to mention, I'm pretty sure I'm going to be one of those old ladies at the grocery store who just can't resist touching the little cutie pies.  |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1195
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 7:45 pm: |
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Meand: How do your kids feel when strangers touch them?
One of the dozens of reasons I think it is inappropriate is because the touching is for the benefit and enjoyment of the toucher, not the touchee. |
Meandtheboys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 3126
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 8:05 pm: |
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My kids have never indicated in any way, shape or form that it bothers them. But then, my kids are very friendly and outgoing. And maybe they're comfortable with it because I've always been comfortable with it.
Certainly, if there were ever any indication that they didn't like it on any level, I wouldn't allow it to happen. And I believe my older two know enough to object if they have a problem. And I'm sure they wouldn't hesitate to do so. Although it's really the babies that get more attention. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 12692
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006 - 9:45 pm: |
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Not to say you don't have a right to feel that way, shoshannah. You just reminded me of something.
We spent last week in Florida. We visited South Beach, that chic singles area of Miami Beach. There's a "parade" of pedestrians along Ocean Blvd, where all the restaurants and hotels are. There was a ~14 month old baby sitting right near the parade, and he looked at all the passers by and held his hand out, and we paraders all touched his hand as we passed by. It was uplifting. Clearly, his parents were pleased. Otherwise, I probably would not have offered my hand.
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fiche
Citizen
Username: Fiche
Post Number: 80
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 8:15 am: |
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I am often tempted to touch the beautiful, precious children that I see when I am out and about. I resist because I know most parents feel the way Shoshannah does. In fact, I felt that way when my children were young. Oh, but they are sooooo cute. |
Shawna
Citizen
Username: Lucies_mom
Post Number: 107
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 10:06 am: |
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When I first read this I thought: This is totally a cultural issue. A guy I know was Treasurer of Asia for a non-profit organization which deals directly with kids. Everytime he got on a plane, he had to think about what was expected. Thailand- never touch anyone's head. Philippines -friendly pat on the head for kids.... etc. The western world cutlures seem less defined in this respect.
US = Melting pot = pot o' confusion.
However, "wiping a hand down a child's face" does sound disgusting. But..maybe could still be cultural..
I don't have kids, but I think if I were you I'd just tell my kids not to let strangers touch them. Don't make it too serious. Just mention it and see what happens. At five he should be able to duck and weave his way out of it quite well. Then when the stranger looks perturbed that she can't get her grubby hands on your kid, you can just shrug, turn away and snicker to yourself. 
Tom- I think your situation with the child holding his hand out is totally differnt. The child was initiating the contact. That seems to be more acceptible than a passive child getting germed on.
I sometimes feel annoyed when strangers pet my dog. If you want to pet my dog and you don't already know us, please ask first.
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redY67
Citizen
Username: Redy67
Post Number: 5001
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 10:14 am: |
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Shawna--that is good to know, I am very guilty of that!  |
breal
Citizen
Username: Breal
Post Number: 744
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 12:45 pm: |
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I know to respect other people's bubbles, but my kids, esp. when they were early elementary age, used to want to pat every small baby's head. Of course they did. The babies were so beautiful.
But I wouldn't let them. If the parent was stopping to talk to us, I would sometimes tell my kids they could ask permission from the parent to tickle the baby's toes. It was always granted. This thrilled my kids, but didn't get germ-y hands near the baby's face.
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 12699
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 1:57 pm: |
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Oh certainly the situation I was in last week is totally different. Didn't mean to imply otherwise.
But my story and the terms "germed on" and "bubble" lead me to decide it's not really about germs, it's about personal space and boundaries, isn't it?
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shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 1196
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 2:13 pm: |
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And it is not a mutual act. It is merely for the delight of the toucher. |
Mplwdladee
Citizen
Username: Mplwdladee
Post Number: 143
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 2:19 pm: |
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these days its weird. I had a woman come up to my daughter kneel down and kiss her on the cheek. I was stunned and didnt know what to do. when she said can I have a kiss I said "no we dont kiss strangers" then she went in for the gold. My husband thought I knew this woman I was confused and really upset. I felt somehow I wasnt being a protective mother. It still upsets me. I would never do this to a stranger's child I might say she's cute or adorable but never kiss a child of a family I dont know. |
Cindy Bellow
Citizen
Username: Sob
Post Number: 3
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 9:03 pm: |
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there's a difference between carrying a child in an airport and stroking someone's (child or adult) face. I wouldn't like it one bit if someone tried to do that to my child. the intention behind it, even if innocent, is inappropriate and dysfunctional. |
mwoodwalk
Citizen
Username: Mwoodwalk
Post Number: 522
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, March 2, 2006 - 10:55 pm: |
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Right on meand. We and our boys are the same way and we wouldn't have it anyother way. Life is too short.
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CFA
Citizen
Username: Cfa
Post Number: 1586
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 5:37 am: |
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MeAnd...I applaud the way you're raising your children. They will grow up to be well rounded and personable. |
Meandtheboys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 3141
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 7:06 am: |
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Gee thanks, guys. I thought I was the only insane person who welcomed friendly strangers' admiration and appreciation of my children!
I think some day my 2-year-old will be mayor (I know--God forbid). Everywhere we go he says an enthusiastic hello to everyone he sees. He walks in to Bagel Chateau like the reigning prince, waving his little hand like a beauty queen and saying hello, hello, hello.
I'm actually very pleased they are all so outgoing, being that I was painfully shy as a child (and sometimes still as an adult).
They have their shy moments as well, when they maybe don't want to say hello, or give Aunt Marge a hello kiss, and I allow them that feeling as well. I tell Aunt Marge they will probably be up for a kiss later, and let them take whatever time they need to relax and feel comfortable. |
Lou
Citizen
Username: Flf
Post Number: 76
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:54 am: |
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I agree with Shawna and Red - many times this might be a cultural difference. In Europe, for example, I never saw a parent react this way when someone touches their child to show affection.
In fact, I can completely see my mom, in one of her visits to the US, to look at a child and think how cute she is and touch her feet, hand or face, while having the best of intentions and thinking that she is giving a great compliment to the parents!
I'm not a parent and I don't know how I would react if a not pleasant looking man would want to touch my child, but I don't think I would have a problem with an older lady in the post office showing some affection by touching my child's face.
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