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Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 379
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 17, 2006 - 10:51 pm: | 
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Glock: You can be poor and live in a lousy neighborhood and not choose to join a gang, do drugs, become disenfranchised and kill. Millions of young blacks do it every day and by the way not just blacks. Many youths are faced with living in less then desireable circumstances.
Plus I really think you are disrespecting the older generation who fought for alot of things that your generation now expects. Blacks killing blacks did not start when slavery ended. And the generations before you fought very hard to be able to form communities, start churches and make sure their kids got an education. However limited that might have been back then. Just because a black man/woman is poor does not mean he/she cannot respect him/herself and be proud of every little achievement he/she makes.
bklyntonj: I agree once again it is an internal issue. An internal issue that needs support when it is addressed. What is needed is a leader that wants the message heard not the face on the TV. Why is nobody going back ... don't know but I can tell you that some do. Have met Queen Latifa a couple of times in bars in Newark. Her whole family and friends with her from when she went to school there. Believe she still lives around here. I have met the sister and the father. I guess once it gets better for some the survival instinct kicks in as with any other human being. I got out, I got a family, I don't want to go back. But hey I am just guessing here. By the way bklyntonj I am not black and would you care to share where you speak and in what venue? |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1598
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 17, 2006 - 11:10 pm: |
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I guess it's time to ask: Glock, what is your solution? Do you have one in mind?
Skip the platitudes about how 'white America needs to change'... I'd LOVE to hear some details. |
mem
Citizen
Username: Mem
Post Number: 6168
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 9:26 am: |
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Case,
You seriously expect a response? Those posts are racist and hate mongering. Some of them are so stupid and useless I laugh out loud.
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Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1671
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 9:28 am: |
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And Phoenix: Thank you for the list of organizations. I actually called the "Beyond Expectation" number in Chicago to see if they would allow an additional chapter to be opened. HOWEVER you actually proved my point. I asked where the black parents ralleys are? All the organizations you listed are school or youth driven.
Bajou,
Some of these “troubled youths” are from one parent home or guardians who have custody. There are some who’s parents are NOT the greatest role models. One kid I knew back in my hometown was 13 when he was gunned down. He tried to rob a store with a toy gun and the owner shot him and he lost his life. He was from a one parent home whose Mom was later arrested for drug dealing. I was 15 at the time and after this incident happened, I and another friend of mine got a petition together and went house-to-house to advocate for a youth center to keep these young kids off the streets. One Minister heard of our petition and opened up his center for the kids to hang-out.
Sure we can make a choice. I came from a 2 parent home and my parents enrolled us in all kinds of activities to keep us busy. These days, you have Grandma & Grandpa caring for some of these troubled teens because their own parents are NOT around. Grandma & Grandpa already raised one set, they have to raise another at an older age. It’s not easy.
“Bajou and any other black person on this thread, if black love is so strong, why aren't more blacks who make it out, never go back?”
bklyntonj,
That's not totally true. My sister made it, my brother made it, and came back. My sister decided to stay after graduating from one of the best teaching colleges. She decided to teach at what was once, one of the worst Middle Schools in Boston. She later went on to work with an “At Risk” program trying to keep troubled youths in school. A few years ago, the NBA “Stay in School” program awarded her with a plaque at an NBA game for her work. Unfortunately, her program was dismantled due to government funding. The program is moot, and I’m afraid these “troubled teens” are going to fall through the cracks. They’ve cut funding in some of the after school programs and educational programs. Last year was one of the worst for murders of young people in Boston.
Instead of the USA spending a GREAT amount of money supporting this illegal war, we have to take care of home first and use the money in OUR educational system. youth programs et al to keep these kids OFF the streets and give them hope. We need mentors to encourage these kids that there ARE other choices in life than the streets.
My brother works at a recreational facility in Boston associated with a college that provides also a haven for low income students to join the computer program, and other various recreational activities. He decided to come back and I DO go back to my old neighborhood.
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crabby
Citizen
Username: Crabbyappleton
Post Number: 618
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 9:36 am: |
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Often the old neighborhood rejects the ones who fled and "made it" (because if you "made it" you are obviously a white man in black clothing).
How about African countries with black leaders who are suppressing their own black population? What do we all think of that? Must be whitey's fault. |
mem
Citizen
Username: Mem
Post Number: 6169
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:02 am: |
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Phenix,
Great post. |
bklyntonj
Citizen
Username: Bklyntonj
Post Number: 717
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:06 am: |
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Hi Bajou, sorry about my assumption. I believe its your husband you said who's black, correct? Me, I hit the streets. My venue is the corner, the barber shop, the local playgrounds, my nieces and nephews and their friends. All black youth I come in contact with. I've spoken at my church and youth detention homes. Also, my children and their friends spend more time with me than my children do with any of their friends' fathers.
Case & crabby, your posts are exactly what my father was telling me (not wanting to go back and be a victim of black-on-black crime, African leaders suppressing their population). That's what makes the problem we're discussing here an internal issue. Whites can't make blacks play nice in the sandbox.
Phenixrising, long time no hear. My comment was and I quote, "why aren't more blacks who make it out, never go back?" I did not say any, I did not say none, I said more. You know good and well the majority don't want anything to do with the "hood" if/when we get out.
Case, you're right. That's why the majority do not go back. Not to mention the crimes that may be committed upon them when they come back. That's why most rappers, athletes and celebrities leave the ghetto when they obtain financial wealth.
mem, (c'mon Boo) you say Glock's comments are racists and hate mongering but are they true? Uh, yeah. |
crabby
Citizen
Username: Crabbyappleton
Post Number: 621
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:20 am: |
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okay, then. It's a black problem. So stop blaming whitey. |
bklyntonj
Citizen
Username: Bklyntonj
Post Number: 718
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:22 am: |
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crabby, they have an ointment for that. |
bettyd
Citizen
Username: Badjtdso
Post Number: 252
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:41 am: |
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Glock: "White people brought blacks to this country." What about those Africans comlicit in that ugly period who sold out their fellow blacks to the evil whites of European descent? What do you think of them? What do you think of the countries in Africa and their leaders where slavery still exists? |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1600
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:46 am: |
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Don't confuse Glock - I'm curious to see if he answers my question. |
Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1673
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 10:57 am: |
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You know good and well the majority don't want anything to do with the "hood" if/when we get out.
Again, I think your stretching it when you say “the majority.” At least around my circle of friends who “made it” went back. They may not have residence there, but they DO go back.
There are other examples of folks who made it. Look at Jim Brown, Magic Johnson, and Keyshawn Johnson, who’ve gone back into the “community” and built businesses.
Rapper Jay-Z… who still goes back to the Marcy Houses in Bed-Stuy and who is a part owner of the Nets that will build an arena in Brookyn.
And how about these three extraordinary African-American men…
“ who grew up on the impoverished streets of Newark, New Jersey. Sampson Davis, George Jenkins, and Rameck Hunt navigated the urban terrain, facing temptations of the street, jail time, and difficulties with poverty-stricken (and in some cases, drug-addicted) parents, they made a pact to become doctors and to stick together through the challenges they would face as they worked toward that goal.They not only made good on their pact – two are physicians and one is a dentist – they are now also committed to sharing their success stories to motivate kids from the inner-city to stay out of gangs, to stay away from drugs, and to take the high road out of poverty and adversity through education.”
They went back. And I give ALL praise for making a difference and not forgetting where they came from.
There are countless others who are not as famous, who’ve gone back and made a difference. I will add my sister to that list!
@ mem… Thanks!
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bklyntonj
Citizen
Username: Bklyntonj
Post Number: 719
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 11:00 am: |
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bettyd, I don't know of any African leaders who came here to check on their fellow Africans after they were sold to whites in Africa. I doubt very seriously if they knew what was in store for them. No one can say they know African leaders knew what was going to become the history we know today. But the whites of European descent did know. No excuses.
Let me ask a question, if your child sees you do something wrong in front of their friends, do you think they should apologize for their parents' behavior? |
bklyntonj
Citizen
Username: Bklyntonj
Post Number: 720
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 11:11 am: |
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Phenix, I mentioned the "three doctors" in an earlier post. It takes the people like your sister and others to go back and spread the message on what it takes to be successful, not just go back. If you back to go visit, or just get a haircut or frequent shops you've grown accustomed to, that's not making a difference. If anything, that can be viewed as rubbing your success in someone's face. I'm talking about talking to people about making a difference, helping out in the community, etc.
As far as Jay-Z, Magic Johnson and others, that's all well and good what they're doing but they're not the majority. As a matter of fact, Cornell West spoke at my alma mater and he told the students there, "we need more leaders to be frank with our youth. Look, you're not going to be another 50 cent or Jordan or LeBron or Jay-Z. Once they realize this, then we can work on them focusing more on realistic goals". |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 944
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 11:54 am: |
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""White people brought blacks to this country." What about those Africans comlicit in that ugly period who sold out their fellow blacks to the evil whites of European descent? What do you think of them? What do you think of the countries in Africa and their leaders where slavery still exists?"
Slavery was part of African culture before Europeans came. It was on a very small scale, and the slaves were generally only prisoners of war who were treated very well and had the opportunity to marry into freedom or have children who would be free. As for black leaders who sold their African brothers into slavery. That is the fault of a few misguided leaders who were decieved by the Europeans, and many of them...were sold into slavery themselves when the Eurpeans had had their fill.
"How about African countries with black leaders who are suppressing their own black population? What do we all think of that? Must be whitey's fault."
It is. Africa was fine till the European imperialist swine got there.
"Don't confuse Glock - I'm curious to see if he answers my question." I'm not an idiot, thank you very much.
A solution? Stop calling it a black problem. And don't tel me that I call it a white problem, because I don't. It's an American problem. |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1603
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 12:27 pm: |
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OK... well, so your solution is as follows:
A solution? Stop calling it a black problem. And don't tel me that I call it a white problem, because I don't. It's an American problem.
Sounds good to me - if we stop calling it a black problem and start calling it an American problem, what exactly does that solve? I mean, I'm glad that we got the labelling squared away but WHERE IS YOUR SOLUTION?
Incidentally, regarding your comment that you "don't call it a white problem":
White people created this country. White people brought blacks to the country. White people did nothing but mistreat and disenfranchise blacks in this country throughout most of this country's history.
You figure it out.
Perhaps I 'figured it out' incorrectly - this post seems to imply (rather strongly!) that you ARE in fact laying the blame at the feet of the white man.
Incidentally, I say 'white man' but you know, there could be women involved too. Behind every successful white devil is a good woman, right?
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Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 383
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 1:29 pm: |
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Dear Glock- you wrote:
Slavery was part of African culture before Europeans came. It was on a very small scale, and the slaves were generally only prisoners of war who were treated very well and had the opportunity to marry into freedom or have children who would be free.
May I educate you a little (even though I am white). Go read..
But slavery lives on, in all its ancient horror, though politicians, artists, and the media have little to say about it. In the West African nation of Mauritania, between eighty and ninety thousand human beings are owned outright by other people, according to the American Anti- Slavery Group, Human Rights Watch/Africa, and the U.S. State Department. Most are black tribesmen owned by the dark-skinned Berbers known as the Moors. Across the continent, in the war-ravaged Sudan, chattel slaves number in the tens of thousands, according to Christian Solidarity International. Most are the children of black Christian and animist villagers, taken in raids by their traditional Arab enemies, now formed into militia by the Muslim government in Khartoum in its war to subdue the south.
"Nothing has changed in the way of life of these Arab groups for the past hundred years," said a report written in 1995 by the Comboni Fathers, Catholic missionaries in the Sudan. "Their only progress has consisted in the provision of large amounts of modern weapons and up-to- date transportation. The time of long lines of enchained slaves marching north is over. Now truckloads of children are seen moving in the same traditional direction."
These modern slaves often serve as maids or cooks, or as farm laborers or cattle herders. Many were taken too young to remember their homes or families. Some who have tried to escape have been branded, or have had their Achilles tendons cut; some have been castrated. Many, both male and female, are regularly raped.
These facts are well known to Western governments and to the United Nations, and reports on slavery appear in the Western media from time to time. Yet they have failed to ignite the popular indignation that fired the abolitionist and anti-apartheid movements.
"There are two key elements to the story of slavery in the twentieth century," says Charles Jacobs, Research Director of the American Anti- Slavery Group. "One is that it exists at all. The other is what I call the scandal of silence-the fact that people don't want to even acknowledge that it exists."
Cultural relativity is at least partly behind this reticence. The quarrels in Mauritania and the Sudan are obscure. They do not occur against the backdrop of economic modernization, as in South Africa, nor do they mirror the black-white tensions of the apartheid battle, which struck Americans so close to home.
http://www.iabolish.org/activist_ctr/abolitionists/abdel-nasser-ould-yessa.html
Get involved if you want to make a differences cause that's the only way it's gonna change. Are you involved in any movement?
And to correct you once again. Europe was not the first to purchase slaves from African Rulers..it was Arabian Nations.
http://wwwa.britannica.com/eb/article-54846
Earliest in Eqypt:
http://www.egyptsites.co.uk/upper/aswan/museum.html
and mainly from Nubia:
http://www.crystalinks.com/nubia.html
So your statement that whites and europeans are at fault for all of the trouble in black society in America or Africa is just plainly ignorant. Open your mind a little Glock, I know you got a good one.
Brooklyntoj: Almost got married. Geography, maily distance worked against us. |
Lydia
Supporter
Username: Lydial
Post Number: 1857
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 1:30 pm: |
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Quote:A solution? Stop calling it a black problem. And don't tel me that I call it a white problem, because I don't. It's an American problem.
YES!
I read a great book last year - "Growing Up Fast" - about 6 white girls growing up in economically depressed Pittsfield, Ma - about 45 minutes from the college town I grew up in and a world apart from my teenage life.
All 6 girls grew up in middle-class blue-collar homes - when the GE plant closed and their parent's lives veered out of control, they quickly got pregnant, lived in dangerous neighborhoods, dropped out of school and most had more babies, digging them deeper into poverty and limited life choices.
I don't think it's as simple as race - poverty and absent parents, or generations of a combination of both result in "lost" children, who then perpetuate the cycle.
Everyone needs to feel valued. People who are neglected, abused or ignored, gravitate towards any group or person that can tell them they are worthwhile.
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C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 2624
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 1:52 pm: |
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Here's another book that is a great read on these issues: Fist, Stick, Knife, Gun. It details the changes in our urban culture, particularly for kids, that have elevated ordinary pecking-order fist-fights into full fledged murders. And how hard it is for even the "A" students to avoid getting caught up in it on some level. It also talks about what adults and kids can do and must do to change the culture. It's written by an insider (who we may have speak at the Unitarian Church in Summit next year. I'll let you all know if we're successful.) The book is available at the Maplewood Library. |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 945
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 2:00 pm: |
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"Past hundred years" bajou.
I was talking pre-slavery. |
Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 387
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 2:20 pm: |
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Dear Glock:
"Past hundred years" bajou.
I was talking pre-slavery.
And I was trying to tell you that pre-slavery would be somewhere around 2000 years ago because that is how long africans have been enslaved by other cultures. However africans enslaving africans has been around much longer:
INTRODUCTION
Slavery has existed in various forms throughout most of recorded history, and Africa has not been an exception. From ancient Egypt to the European invasions to even as late as the 20th century, Africa has had a particularly long and harrowing history of slavery. Although the transatlantic slave trade is prominent in the history books, slavery existed and sometimes flourished in Africa long before. In fact, slavery was practiced all over Africa: in many areas there were large-scale slave societies, while in others there were slave-owning societies
Africa was fine till the European imperialist swine got there:
I guess that statement could be true if you were Zulu however I doubt a Bantu would agree with you.
You want to know how long this problem has been around.. pre-white, pre-black..namely pre-historic...
http://www.shef.ac.uk/archaeology/publications/books/warfare-prehist.html
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Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1606
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 2:31 pm: |
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Glock,
No further comment on 'blaming the white man'?
Just checking. |
K_soze
Citizen
Username: K_soze
Post Number: 238
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 2:32 pm: |
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•••• it, blame the caveman |
Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 389
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 3:10 pm: |
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Blame Man...(not women, just men).
I think we should all go out for an interracial beer...what do you say..
. |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 947
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 3:48 pm: |
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I do other things besides post on MOL, Case. |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1608
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 5:12 pm: |
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Good response - besides, you can't win... this is all a white plot against you. We're all part of the conspiracy. In fact, who the hell let this kid graduate high school? That is NOT part of the plan!
Actually, I doubt that you really said this:
White people created this country. White people brought blacks to the country. White people did nothing but mistreat and disenfranchise blacks in this country throughout most of this country's history.
You figure it out.
I bet Dave edited your post to make you SEEM like somone who spouts this kind of nonsense and then can't back it up.
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Lydia
Supporter
Username: Lydial
Post Number: 1860
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 5:43 pm: |
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There's plenty of slavery going on right now in Africa.
And in the USA there's plenty of denigration of light-skinned blacks and dark-skinned blacks, or nonsense about "nappy" hair or permed hair. Or "All-American" blonds vs. natural.
Whites and blacks spend a lot of money changing their hair - white women bleach/perm it to a curly yellow-white and black women perm their hair to a straight style.
Millions, probably billions of dollars are spent/wasted on hair and nail care, and 90% by women.
If all that effort went into freeing slaves and empowering young people we could really make a difference.
Change always begins at home, so take the money you waste on personal care and put it to good use - or at least match it. |
ffof
Citizen
Username: Ffof
Post Number: 4727
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 18, 2006 - 6:07 pm: |
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oh ly-dial. and what? give up Liftin's special facial products? |
combustion
Citizen
Username: Spontaneous
Post Number: 42
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 12:50 am: |
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Due to some computer glitches I'm just a little late to this discussion, and boy am I pissed.
LW and Phenixrising, you two made some nasty comments about K_soze. He wasn't trying to take any "irrelevant cheap shots" or being "sarcastic." Sorry if people are sick of street crime. It doesn't matter WHAT race the perpetrators are. Violent crimes endanger us all. We are ALL at danger of being innocent victims of this scourge. I can't blame him at all for not having any sympathy whatsoever for the little punk who basically saved taxpayers time and money by having himself taken out. By the way, that's MY description of the situation, NOT his, so don't go attacking him again for something he didn't even say.
LW said "I love it when white people tell us their opinions on our leaders." What if I made that same statement but replaced the word "white" with "black" or "African American." I'd be labeled a racist. But it's okay for your to say stuff like that? News flash, that makes you racist AND a hypocrite.
Glock, I don't even know where to start with your uneducated over-opinionated sweeping across the board racist comments. Lets see, "push most of them into ghettos and make sure they are ignorant of themselves and the world around them. Make sure turf wars are there." Are you kidding me? What is this, a Nazi Ghetto with barbed wire and armed guards to keep people in? And are you saying white people are responsible for turf wars? That's good news!!!! If white people are responsible for it then that means we can stop all this nonsense!!! I never thought it would be that easy to make the streets safe! Thanks for the heads-up Glock! (Hey Phenix, THAT was sarcasm!)
By the way Glock, your little comment about "white people did nothing but mistreat and disenfranchise blacks in this country throughout most of this country's history." After the civil war many white Northerner abolitionists moved down south in an attempt to help with the struggle for racial equality. These people tried to FIX things, to help newly freed slaves become educated, start new lives. In today's history books they are lumped together with "carpetbaggers," now a derogative term. And what of the idealistic "Freedom Riders?" Sure, the groups were interracial, but I'm sure there must have been at least one or two white people on board those buses. (Guess what Phenix, MORE SARCASM!!!!) These people were threatened, beaten, fire bombed, and yet they kept going. White people were also involved in the movement to help blacks obtain the right to vote. I'm NOT saying they were the only force working here, but they didn't sit back and turn a blind eye either. There were plenty of white people throughout history who have risked bodily injury or even death to help black people in their struggle for equality. It would have been easier and safer for these people to have not gotten involved, yet they choose to. I'm glad to see their sacrifices were appreciated.
Glock, you will always be a hater who blames other's for every misfortune in your life, real or perceived. No matter what happens in your future you will see discrimination everywhere because you WANT to see it. People like you make me sick. |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 950
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 1:29 am: |
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Who said anything about misfortune in my life? |
combustion
Citizen
Username: Spontaneous
Post Number: 43
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 2:18 am: |
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I can't believe I'm actually here taking the time to respond to you. Hello!!! It was hypothetical!!! I've known people like you before. I avoid people like you because you will always find someone to blame for anything and everything that happens to you. I used to have a friend who was on the highway doing 35 miles over the limit. He was pulled over and ticketed. Of course it had nothing to do with the fact that he was speeding, he was pulled over because he was black and driving a nice car. Just ask him. I also remember a number of years ago my mother's friend did an illegal U-turn on South Orange Avenue right in front of a police officer. She was ticketed. This was obviously because she had a black passenger in the car with her. I'm sick of people who blame everything on race. Try a little accountability for your own actions, you might find you get a little further in life.
A number of years ago my mother's house was searched in the middle of the night because a carjacking suspect ran through the house (our dogs chased him out). At the time it was very stressful and we were all very upset by this event. The police questioned everyone who was home at the time and even woke up my ten year old sister. They wanted to know why the suspect had chosen our particular house. In hindsight I realize it looked very suspicious to the officers involved. The police were only doing their job and it was just our dumb luck for that jerk to have chosen our house (combined with my parents stupidity in not locking our door!). Yes, the search was stressful. Yes, everyone involved felt intimidated by having the house swarmed with officers. But looking back I see they were just doing their job. Of course had this happened to my former friend mentioned above he would have been labeled it harassment and it would obviously have been the police trying to persecute a black family. I truly believe that you will see what you want to see in any given situation. I know I could type all night and I will never be able to make you think different. That said I think I've already wasted more than enough of my time on you. |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 951
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 2:40 am: |
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That has absolutely no relation to what was being discussed before. I don't blame other people for my problems. Never have, never will. You are doing what many posters do, and turn this into a discussion of me. It's not. You don't know me. You don't see me going about my business every day. Therefore you can't possibly be able to know what I do and/or don't do. |
The Notorious S.L.K.
Citizen
Username: Scrotisloknows
Post Number: 1428
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 6:24 am: |
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combustion-
I am not defending him but Glock reminds me of the young Malcom X in his early years speaking more from his heart than his head. Hopefully he'll mature in both body and mind like Malcom did.
But yet again, Glock does have a misfortunate life in living Maplewood and all so who knows?
Yes that was sarcasm. I seem to have that art down pretty good.
-SLK
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Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1614
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 8:22 am: |
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Glock,
You realize that your posts are still visible, right? Sometimes people forget that this is different than a verbal discussion - here, when you say "I never said that" we can all just scroll up!
We don't know you, that's true, so we have to go by your posts here. Let's start when I asked you what YOUR solution was... since you were obviously not blaming whites for everything (that was sarcasm too, by the way!)
OK... well, so your solution is as follows:
A solution? Stop calling it a black problem. And don't tel me that I call it a white problem, because I don't. It's an American problem.
Sounds good to me - if we stop calling it a black problem and start calling it an American problem, what exactly does that solve? I mean, I'm glad that we got the labelling squared away but WHERE IS YOUR SOLUTION?
Incidentally, regarding your comment that you "don't call it a white problem":
White people created this country. White people brought blacks to the country. White people did nothing but mistreat and disenfranchise blacks in this country throughout most of this country's history.
You figure it out.
Perhaps I 'figured it out' incorrectly - this post seems to imply (rather strongly!) that you ARE in fact laying the blame at the feet of the white man.
Incidentally, I say 'white man' but you know, there could be women involved too. Behind every successful white devil is a good woman, right?
Awwww... there's that old white man again, causing problems. However, I notice that I haven't seen your solution yet, Glock. You claim that you don't spend your time in mindless rants against white people (past postings notwithstanding, apparently)... but again - what's your solution?
And incidentally - if you want to avoid the whole issue that's fine... you screwed up, you got called on it, and we can move on. But don't waffle around telling people how you never blame other people for your problems - that "white man" post of yours was so whiny you sounded like a 14 year old girl from Long Island for a minute.
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Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1615
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 8:26 am: |
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Incidentally... if SLK and Combustion are both white guys (as I am), then does this thread count towards our required 15 hours a month of "keeping the black man down"?
I'd hate to fall behind on my quota.
Seriously though, I'm assuming that Glock is going to avoid answering the last post... I suppose I would too if I were in his position.
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Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1678
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 8:45 am: |
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LW and Phenixrising, you two made some nasty comments about K_soze.
What nasty comments did I make other than "the sacarsm" comment? The sarcasm statement made in reference to Chris & K_zoe reply in this exchange.
Chris
Where are Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson in all this?
K_soze
They'll only speak up if they're killed by non-black people.
Always bringing in Al & Jessie like they represent ALL Black folks.
I don’t disagree with K_soze about choices in life, however, some of the recent shootings of the teens in Newark were also INNOCENT ones. I don't believe in LUMPING all these recent killing of teens to thugs. Sure there were some who "chose the life" and they've suffered the consequences for their actions.
Once upon a time, (at least when I was growing-up) fists were used settled fights. Now its guns & knives. Just recently as of this week a student dued to graduate from High School next month was gunned down because of an argument the day before. No drugs or illegal activity, just a damn argument. Folks have been shot down just because they "looked" at someone a certain way. A honor roll student and star running back from Newark was gunned down walking from his girlfriend’s home.
Another young girl dued to graduate next month and looking forward to her prom…was gunned down in a robbery attempt by other teens.
If you “thoroughly” read my post, I also mentioned, “teens don’t even feel safe going to school, without the dodging of bullets or gang bangers in their face.” These are teens who just want to get an education graduate and better themselves. They do exist ya know? |
Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1679
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 8:57 am: |
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Guess we SHOULD rename this thread "SARCASM" because that's what this is becoming.
SLK,
I think you touch on a good point about Glock.
I am not defending him but Glock reminds me of the young Malcom X in his early years speaking more from his heart than his head. Hopefully he'll mature in both body and mind like Malcom did.
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crabby
Citizen
Username: Crabbyappleton
Post Number: 625
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 9:06 am: |
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"dued to graduate " This was written twice. Are you talking about "dudes" or do you mean "due"? It's confusing.
Also, I'd like to know why when you were younger "fists were used settled fights".
Why is fighting acceptable at all? I find fighting despicable and so do my children and that is what we teach them. When we talk about incidents at our own high school, they'll relay info about "fights" in the cafeteria or in the hallways or after school. Whether it's girls or boys, it is always black vs black. Is it a black culture thing to encourage fighting? And I'm being serious in my question. |
Hoops
Citizen
Username: Hoops
Post Number: 1376
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 9:30 am: |
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crabby,
You are asking interesting questions that may be better in a new thread, but I will answer for my own family and my own perceptions -
Instigating a fight for reasons other then self defense is not acceptable. In no way is fighting a behavior that is encouraged in my house. However the rule in my family is if you are assaulted, hit, attacked, by anyone you are to defend yourself. If someone hits me, I hit them back. That is the way it goes in my family and if one of my kids is suspended for a week from school because he defended himself then so be it. The lesson is that you can not give in to a bully and there has to be a price paid if someone decides to pick on one of us. Going to an authority figure in these cases is not going to correct the behavior.
We wont start fights but we will defend ourselves. |
The Notorious S.L.K.
Citizen
Username: Scrotisloknows
Post Number: 1432
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 9:37 am: |
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phenixrising-
[Don't drop dead Glock/LW], but I read the "AutoBiography of Malcom X and watched Spike Lee's movice X numerous times. I actually respect Malcom X, especially when he saw the err of his ways. Too bad he could never act on them.
If Glock and LW doesn't want us "white peeps" opinion, then so be it. But until noticeable chunk of white male teenagers begin dropping out of school, hang out on corners slinging dope and carrying a piece wearing gang colors and flashing silly gang signs while three of their "hos" are pregnant, maybe they will realize we might know a thing or two.
Remember in X when Malcom's mentor scolded him for dreassing like a pimp as looking like a clown and making his black race look like fools? That is my favorite part and I say the same thing to myself alot.
Just ask yourself, what would Malcom say about those I describe in the second paragraph if he were alive today?
-SLK |
K_soze
Citizen
Username: K_soze
Post Number: 251
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:22 am: |
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Phenixrising - I didn't mean to lump them all together, like I said, if an innocent child dies it is a sad tragedy. I pray to god that I never have to see one of my children die before I do. We just can't escape the fact that there's children on the streets doing things that even for an adult would (or should) be unimaginable. Maybe my comment on Sharpton and Jackson was a bit harsh but black people are being wronged, robbed & killed by other blacks everyday, you don't really see Sharpton out there trying to take back the community but let a white cop shoot a black kid and it's a field day (probably more so for Sharpton).
Hoops - I agree with you 100% on fighting back. My kids better not be out there trying to start ••••, but I'd be damned if they're gonna take •••• from anyone, I'm not saying crack a guy in the head as soon as he makes a "yo mamma so" joke...there's always a less confrontational way out of things and I'll try to teach them that but when you turn the other cheek to walk away and he's following you pushing or hitting, then it's on. Some of my friends think this is wrong, they teach their kids to always, no matter what turn the other way...even if it means getting beat up, I think this is setting them (kids) up to live a life where they're always gonna get taken atvantage of. (in one way or another)
Enough with the thread drift already |
Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1681
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:24 am: |
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SLK,
I read and saw the movie Malcolm X. I actually went down to the set where Spike was filming in Brooklyn. He really did a good job on the movie and kept pretty close ties to the book. One of the things Malcolm advocated “economic self-reliance, and identity politics. My parents always say, “”Work hard, you CAN accomplish whatever you put your efforts too.” Don’t let anyone get in your way of success (economic self-reliance) .”
His last pilgrimage to Mecca, his trip proved to be life-altering. Malcolm met many devout Muslims of a number of different races, men whose faith and whose practice of Islam he couldn't help but respect. He believed that racial barriers could potentially be overcome, and that Islam was the one religion that conceivably could erase all racial problems.”
"Human rights are something you were born with. Human rights are your God-given rights. Human rights are the rights that are recognized by all nations of this earth."
"In the past, yes, I have made sweeping indictments of all white people. I will never be guilty of that again — as I know now that some white people are truly sincere, that some truly are capable of being brotherly toward a black man. The true Islam has shown me that a blanket indictment of all white people is as wrong as when whites make blanket indictments against blacks."
Malcolm X.
This is what Malcolm believed before he was assassinated. And for his beliefs and disagreements with Elijah M. it cost him his life. |
Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1682
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:31 am: |
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K_soze
We must have posted at the same time! Your previous post (on your life) was touching. I guess all these shooting as of late are so upsetting. Several of these teens are the same age as my own teen. Kinda gets you a bit emotional…ya know.
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Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 1683
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:42 am: |
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crabby,
I dislike physical fighting. Personally, as a kid I try to AVOID them. But like Hoops indicated, if someone begins pummeling you, you have to defend yourself. When I was growing-up, fights were settled with fists flying (the boys) & hair pulling (the girls) with the occassional slaps et al. Sometimes that is how kids settled their issues.
And fighting IS NOT a Black issue. Physical fighting occurs with ALL races.
When I was 11 my parents moved to a neighborhood that happened to be predominately Jewish. In my sixth grade class there were several physical fights with a couple tough kids in class. I was the lone AA, with 2 Irish, one German and the rest Jewish. The one tough Irish kid use to get into physical altercations with the tough Jewish kid. Always some kind of boxing match after school.
If you want an example of today, last year they arrested some girls (who happen to be white) for fighting. The arrests came after someone decided to video tape the incident broadcast this on the web. They didn’t realize that it would make the national news.
Today, kids and grown-ups seem to settle fights violently with guns & knives. Even if they use fists, if one kid is defeated the same defeated kid comes back with a gun and shoots. It's sickening, but its reality nowadays.
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crabby
Citizen
Username: Crabbyappleton
Post Number: 628
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:43 am: |
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I teach turn the other cheek. Why stoop to the low standards of the bully?
But at least my question is answered. There seems to be something in the black culture that says it's okay to fight. So don't come cryin' about "racist" security guards at CHS when a fight breaks out in the cafeteria or when extra police need to be on hand at the MLK fashion show or what not. Thank you in advance. |
bettyd
Citizen
Username: Badjtdso
Post Number: 254
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:45 am: |
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Appropriate self defense is fine and is the law in NJ. If someone assaults you you can defend yourself. However, it must be limited by the situation. If someone assaults you and, for instance, you knock the person down and they are disabled and semi-conscious or unconscious, you can't continue to beat them. You should then remove yourself from the situation. But I think nowadays what used to be a shoving match or a minor fist fight turns into a more deadly situation with guns, knives, etc. and due to the gang mentality.
What I also find disturbing about youth violence today is its prevalence among young girls. |
Hoops
Citizen
Username: Hoops
Post Number: 1381
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 11:59 am: |
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crabby - sorry to shoot down your allusions but I am not black, what I teach my kids is common sense. My kids are not aggressive, they are very secure in their demeanors and are definitely not ones to be picked on.
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Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 392
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Friday, May 19, 2006 - 1:27 pm: |
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oh finally:
Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Kumbaya my Lord, kumbaya
Oh Lord, kumbaya
You know what's kind of sad. We all want the same thing...we all want our kids to be safe, our streets to be livable, our schools to be good...
Yet we waste time and energy debating back and forth about it instead of doing productive things (I include myself in this). I will be of on vacation next week and will do some thinking on what I can contribute to help this situation. I will definately have a few talks with my teenage kids to get their perspective.
Peace out. |
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