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Oregon gal
Citizen
Username: Oregon_gal
Post Number: 35
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:07 pm: | 
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Ever since we started looking into living in this lovely part of New Jersey, I have heard it referred to as the "suburbs" by both residents and realtors. Now I know this could be just a semantics issue, but I'm a homeowner now so I take it personally 
When I think suburbs I think strip malls anchored by (choose one of the following) TGI Fridays, The Olive Garden or Applebees. I think ginourmous SUV's that MUST be driven to the store, the school, the park, the everything. I think cookie-cutter houses in "planned communities." I think of detachment, isolation and of people who don't particularly want to know their neighbors. I'm the first to admit, this is my problem, my stereotype, my judgmental assessment.
However, I for one will NOT refer to Maplewood/South Orange (or Millburn, or Montclair, or.....) as a suburb. In my mind, suburbs do not have the rich history, lovely homes, established neighborhoods, one of kind downtowns, access to mass transit, green spaces and you get my drift.
So I open this thread to nominations of a new title should anyone wish to chime in. Something I can use to describe my town to people who have never been here.
Have at it. |
Nohero
Supporter
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 5571
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:16 pm: |
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We're in a suburb. If you want to get all historical, our communities grew as a result of the rail lines, which connected these "suburban" areas to the "urban" areas. The earliest "commuters" were folks who came here in the early years of the twentieth century.
So, we're in a suburb. But, we just do it right.
We can't help it if those other places give "suburb" a bad name.
Maybe those other places should come up with a new name for themselves, instead.
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Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1293
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:20 pm: |
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Suburb. It's what we are. The ones you describe are specific to areas that don't have a history. We considered relocating in California and I saw the suburbs you are describing. They sucked.
Everyone was so psyched about the new construction. Having grown up in a "real suburb" (Montclair) I found the West Coast version totally lacking. We stayed right here in New Jersey because it is actually what suburbs are supposed to be.
Oregon_Girl, you are in the real suburbs now. Forget your previous associations, they have nothing to do with us. Perhaps we should re-name the crappy West Coast communities something besides "suburbs."
J.B. |
Oregon gal
Citizen
Username: Oregon_gal
Post Number: 36
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:21 pm: |
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I like that idea as well! I could think of all sorts of colorful adjectives to describe some of the suburbs I've had the displeasure of driving through.
Weren't many of these towns (I always look at the signs) established in the 1700's? |
Oregon gal
Citizen
Username: Oregon_gal
Post Number: 37
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:23 pm: |
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I think you've both hit the nail on the head. The people I have to describe the town to are all from the West Coast, so if I say "suburb" you know what they're thinking. |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1294
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 4, 2006 - 11:23 pm: |
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Nohero,
Cross posted. Great minds.
J.B. |
combustion
Citizen
Username: Spontaneous
Post Number: 183
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:09 am: |
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I'm curious, I know of urban areas, suburban, and rural. We certainly aren't urban (city), and we aren't rural(farmland/country). So if you don't like the label "suburb," what would you choose to call this area? |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1645
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:16 am: |
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The Brookings Institute actually did a very interesting report on this last year...they separated out a set of communities that they refer to as the "First Suburbs" and looked at the distinctive strengths and issues that they currently face relative to both cities and newer suburbs. Obviously much of Essex County fit their definition.
The summary report was available for free download and is great reading if you are seriously interested in this stuff. (I don't have the URL offhand) |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1301
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:19 am: |
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Oregon Gal,
Let them stay ignorant. Don't you know New Jersey is one of the best kept secrets? Tell them you live in a suburb in New Jersey. You and they will both smirk, but for different reasons.
J.B.
Join us. There's no use fighting. |
Calliope
Citizen
Username: Calliope
Post Number: 543
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 2:20 am: |
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When the gentleman took the trains to the City and their wives walked to the shady downtown to the market, and their children romped in playgrounds until their daddies stepped off the platform at 6:10,the communities of the suburbs were born. So, Oregon gal , you are in the ORIGINAL suburbs. Established communities in Essex, Union and Bergen counties are similar (go to Cranford or Ridgewood) I have heard these boroughs, villages,and Townships referred to as "Bedroom communities", but that doesn't convey the rich life to be had here.
JB is right---shhhhh---it is our little secret---so , maybe we are the "secret suburbs."
Calli |
sac
Supporter
Username: Sac
Post Number: 3599
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 8:15 am: |
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I have heard us described as an "urban suburb", FWIW.
I just agree with those who say that we have got it (mostly) right. |
Cynicalgirl
Citizen
Username: Cynicalgirl
Post Number: 2922
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 8:35 am: |
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When moving here, and doing one of those online things that helps you find your right neighborhood, M/SO was described as urban suburb as sac says. I think it's pretty apt. It has a town center and identity, which a lot of the artificial housing developments don't have outside of this area. For what it's worth, Livingston feels more like the suburbs as I know them elsewhere. Our old town was more like that, than this.
I would guess that prior to the mid town direct and when Newark still throve as a city, Maplewood was more of a suburb to Newark than to New York. |
Carla
Citizen
Username: Elbowroom
Post Number: 98
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 9:41 am: |
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I think of the K Hovnanian/Toll Brothers style housing developments as housing developments and not suburbs. I could never live in one of those cookie cutter communities.
Tell your friends from Cali that you don't live in a development - you live in a town.
I like the term urban suburb. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12026
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 10:13 am: |
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Terms I have often heard are "inner ring" and "first tier" applied to MW/SO and similar communities in Westchester and on Long Island. |
Oregon gal
Citizen
Username: Oregon_gal
Post Number: 41
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 10:14 am: |
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I like urban suburb too.
And I like the idea of keeping it a secret - maybe we should develop the Maplewood/SO secret hand shake...
Susan 1014, I might just go look up the First Suburb report you referenced, it sounds really interesting.
Thanks all for the thoughts! |
musicme
Citizen
Username: Musicme
Post Number: 1713
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 10:21 am: |
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submallan ... them
suburban...us |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1304
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:11 am: |
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Yeah, maybe the difference is we have a real "urb," to be "sub" to.
I mean, "a suburb of Sacramento?" Oh, I just gagged a little.
J.B. |
themp
Supporter
Username: Themp
Post Number: 3069
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:12 am: |
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This reminds me of a conversation I had with someone years ago. She had made a casserole, but she insisted it wasn't a casserole, because casseroles were for "suburban people." So I pointed out that she herself was from the suburbs. She told me I was wrong, and she was from a "rural area," which was quite a stretch, given the street she grew up on with its neat rows of post-War houses. Maybe there were a few farms in her county, but it was the 'burbs.
It was annoying. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12028
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:13 am: |
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And the new term for places such as Somerset County is "exurban". ........... |
HOMMELL
Citizen
Username: Hommell
Post Number: 263
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:14 am: |
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http://www.brookings.edu/metro/pubs/20060215_FirstSuburbs.pdf |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14876
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:26 am: |
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How about calling it a suburb with sidewalks, where kids walk to school and to each other's homes. That might evoke the proper picture. Oh, and mention all the mature trees we have and pay dearly to keep.
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Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1305
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:08 pm: |
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That reminds me, Tom, how's that tree the town planted in front of your house in the middle of winter?
J.B. |
JGT
Citizen
Username: Jtg7448
Post Number: 217
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:14 pm: |
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I describe the town as a prime example of one of the original transit oriented suburbs...the kind of town that has retained a sense of 'place'.
There is a town center, it is walkable, and planned parks are scattered about.
For me, it is what a suburbs were meant to be...not the strip mall placeless towns so many people have become accustomed to living in.
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14882
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 12:25 pm: |
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It took a while for it to sprout leaves, but it looks like it will do just fine now.
Here, I just took this picture:
Thanks for asking, Jersey_Boy! Ichh, my house is dirty!
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cmontyburns
Citizen
Username: Cmontyburns
Post Number: 1893
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 1:01 pm: |
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Note to self: TP Reingold's tree in 6-10 years.
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14887
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 1:04 pm: |
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Why is my picture sideways here? It is right-side up on my computer.
Sometimes Macs are annoying. Too smart for their own good.
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Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1307
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 1:16 pm: |
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Well, I'm happy to see my concerns about winter planting have not come true.
ANYHOO, I think I was saying, "We're a suburb of NYC, not Sacramento." Damn, I gagged again.
J.B. |
Oregon gal
Citizen
Username: Oregon_gal
Post Number: 45
Registered: 6-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 10:20 pm: |
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Sorry to keep making you throw up in your mouth. I hate that. |
tabby
Citizen
Username: Tabby
Post Number: 341
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 5, 2006 - 11:13 pm: |
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The term that I associate with the newer areas is "subdivision". For me this connotes all the negatives that Oregon Girl mentioned. |
Michael K. McKell
Citizen
Username: Mckellconst
Post Number: 19
Registered: 5-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 8:55 am: |
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When I moved from Jersey City in 1977 to South Orange I considered it the country. After 18 years their I moved to Long Valley and now see S.O. more of a city.
I guess it all depends upon where you come from. |
cmontyburns
Citizen
Username: Cmontyburns
Post Number: 1895
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 9:28 am: |
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If you live in South Orange and work in South Orange, you can refer to it as town, village, city, hamlet, whatever you like.
But if you get on a train every day and ride into Manhattan, you live in the suburbs.
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MeAndTheBoys
Citizen
Username: Meandtheboys
Post Number: 4172
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 10:11 am: |
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The suburbs Oregan Gal refers to are the modern bastardization of the term "suburb." But, yes, we are in the suburbs. Although I also prefer "urban suburb." |
darrenso
Citizen
Username: Darrenso
Post Number: 25
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 11:50 am: |
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Someone who posts on Wikipedia seems to have an idea of another name for our type of community.
Click here and look at the picture.
See anyone you know? |
LilLB
Citizen
Username: Lillb
Post Number: 1951
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 12:07 pm: |
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I don't know any of them, but what's up with the one guy who's not wearing a jacket (the same guy reading a newspaper)? Everyone's wearing hats and coats and this guys acting like it's a nice spring day...... |
Scully
Citizen
Username: Scully
Post Number: 716
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 3:04 pm: |
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I've heard us called the 'older suburbs'. As opposed to new developments, I suppose. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12054
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 3:34 pm: |
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What city are we a suburb of? Newark? New York? Both?
Suppor your answer with a discussion including the relationship to the historic commuting patterns in Maplewood starting in the 1920s. |
Kibbegirl
Citizen
Username: Kibbegirl
Post Number: 624
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 5:34 pm: |
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South Orange feels like a suburb to me. Green grass, great parks, small, quaint streets, and gaslights for goodness sakes! Maybe because we're so close to NYC, we don't consider ourselves the 'burbs, but S.O. and M'plwood are indeed. Thank goodness we don't have the pollution of TGI Fridays and the like. Those would only take away from the charm of our local establishments. |
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