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Shanabana
Citizen
Username: Shanabana
Post Number: 769
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, July 15, 2006 - 11:09 pm: | 
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I heard it from a friend. I'm steaming mad, because my kids are zoned for South Mountain (great school, BTW).
Hey, we pay the same darned taxes as clinton parents do!!! Why should I have to pay child care out of pocket when other residents don't?!? Maybe the district would like to reimburse all of us half-day parents for the childcare we have to pay to compensate for their cheapness?
FULL DAY KINDERGARTEN FOR ALL TWO TOWN RESIDENTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Thanks for tolerating my over-zealous use of punctuation.)
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John James Leuchs Jr
Citizen
Username: Clairvoyant
Post Number: 107
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 12:19 am: |
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Ask Dinky or Mrs. Nelson but I believe it is connected with the ESL program. Clinton is host to many students who have special needs. Often they are mainstreamed for subjects into the regular classroom. That should be a consideration as to where to implement a full day kindergarten program. Test scores should also be considered. Where is the greatest need? Full day kindergarten is not considered in a childcare-babysitting mode but rather as it relates to instructional opportunities for the population that has the greatest needs. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15053
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 12:58 am: |
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I have faith that eventually, the district will figure out how to provide full day to everyone. You won't be a beneficiary of that, but it's still good to look forward to.
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Soparents
Supporter
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 2119
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 6:39 am: |
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Shana, I feel the same way you do, and I imagine most K parents do too!
I don't know all the facts about it, but I gather it started last year. A friend of mine had her daugher go to Clinton and got a call saying that they were running one class of all day K and did a lottery and her daughters name came up did she want a place? She said yes, and then I heard from 2 other friends also with kiddies going to Clinton and they got in too (One other friends son did not get offered a place). I think remembering her saying that this was going to be mix of standard stream and ESL students.
Now, I don't know the facts of what got this off the ground, but the story I heard was that a woman had been lobbying for years to get this tried. I don't know why it is only Clinton, or if it will go to other schools, but yes, I will say the green eyed dragon came out and I really wished that my daughter going into South Mountain Annex would have been given the same chance.
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John James Leuchs Jr
Citizen
Username: Clairvoyant
Post Number: 109
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 9:42 am: |
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Shanabana, why don't you ask Dave or Jamie to move this thread to the Education posts? There you would get more definitive answers. As SOParents stated it is just one class, not for the whole school. I believe that it is funded by a grant and it is because they have the ESL students in their school. |
Megan
Citizen
Username: Megan
Post Number: 123
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 10:25 am: |
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It did start last year, and I believe it was actually funded through a grant. Seth Boyden will also have one full-day kindergarten class this year. Both schools are Title I schools. I believe that's the reason the programs have started at these schools. As a parent with an SB kindergartner, I'm jealous of the families who got the full-day program, but I know this is a first step toward full-day for the entire district, so I'm trying to look at it as a positive. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5653
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 1:42 pm: |
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I went through the school system ***many*** years ago. Back when we still had neighborhood schools -including Fielding, First Street and Montrose. Back when there was no 'annex.' I don't remember there being full day kindergarten back then either... |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15067
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 1:52 pm: |
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That sounds a lot like those "when I went to school I walked two miles in the snow uphill both ways in bare feet" stories. Full day kindergarten is an idea whose time has come, and it can't come too soon. We do have to wait, though, and the phase-in going on now isn't perfect, but at least it's progress. Let's try to have Megan's attitude towards it.
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Shanabana
Citizen
Username: Shanabana
Post Number: 773
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 2:29 pm: |
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I had full-day kindergarten 36 years ago. Seems like kids these days are being gyped (hope no Roma are reading this): less kindergarten, taught to the tests, etc.
I guess I was misinformed, or I misunderstood. I thought the whole school had it, I mean, all entering kindergarteners. I didn't realize it was a lottery and part ESL.
The only reason I didn't put this in the Education section is because (1) it was a rant, and (2) no one goes there anymore...
Ah well. Dream on. Dream on. |
Cynicalgirl
Citizen
Username: Cynicalgirl
Post Number: 2954
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 2:37 pm: |
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In my old district, in another state, full day kindergarten started the same way: special needs schools/classes, under one sort of grant or another. Don't know that most of us need to be envious of the needs (economic and otherwise) that give rise to this attention. My kid went to Clinton in later elementary, and one way and another, there seem to be a lot of special needs packed into that school. I'd guess full day K will help with some of that.
I'm sure the thoroughness with which full day programs get rolled out is a function of money like so many things. My kid went to a full day private kindergarten, with wrap around care and I'm guessing a lot of working parents do the same, almost by default. Even if the program isn't billed as 6 hrs of kindgergarten, my experience was that pretty much is in terms of types of work and play, concepts, etc. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5656
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 4:51 pm: |
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Tom
what the heck is that supposed to mean? I grew up in South Orange / Maplewood and parents have been trying to get full day kindergarten since I went through the school system, many years ago. Some districts are starting to provide it -for a fee. Same as they are charging a fee for students to participate in sports and clubs. It stinks, I know, but sadly, with the budget cuts, I can't see our district getting full time kindergarten anytime soon. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15077
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 4:52 pm: |
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Oh, sorry I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying half day was good enough for you so it's good enough for today's kids. Again, sorry about that.
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Bajou
Citizen
Username: Bajou
Post Number: 1096
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 4:59 pm: |
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Hey Tom: I did have to walk two miles in the snow however not both times uphill LOL and not with bare feet. We used to carry our skies up in the morning so we could sky home after school.
Be nice to JTA ...she is a great girl! |
Rivka Nelson
Citizen
Username: Rivka_nelson
Post Number: 36
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 6:54 pm: |
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Two years ago there was a full day kindergarten program just for ESL students at Clinton School. The students attended a regular half day program in the morning and then continued their day in an ESL classroom in the afternoon. It was very successful. This year, after a new parent, Amy Paternick (sp?) lobbied Gov. Cody's office, the district was given a grant (seed money) to fund one full day Kindergarten class. It was decided to put it at Clinton School because of the ESL component. The full day kindergarten class has some ESL students in it and the remaining students are made up of students drawn from a lottery. The remaining ESL students attend a half day kindergarten program and then have a half day ESL program in the afternoon.
The program is being kept up this year, I'm not sure if we have a grant or the district is funding the program. In addition they are adding one full day kindergarten to Seth Boyden. It is probably correct that part of the consideration as to where to start the full day programs has to do with the fact that both schools are Title I schools. (Title I is based on a certain percentage of free and reduced lunch students attend the school).
I have heard from members of the BOE that the intention is to roll out full day kindergarten programs to all the schools in the district. Hopefully that will happen in the near future. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5664
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 16, 2006 - 11:01 pm: |
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Not at all Tom. I think it's very unfair only the 'Abbott Districts' get full-time K. Thus being one of the reasons my sister didn't want to move back to South Orange. She ended up sending the twins private school, where they've been ever since.
Back when I was in grade school the schools were K-6, 7-9 and 10-12. We went home for lunch in grade school. Even back then there were a good number of children with both parents working. Until my mother started to work we always had a couple of friends eating at our house.
It got to the point my parents paid one of the college kid down the street to watch us for the time we came home for lunch. There were six of us -from 2nd grade up to 6th; and I'm sure it was a major pain for her. By the time my two youngest sisters got to 5th and 6th grade, the 5th grade moved over to the middle school so our parents no longer had to worry about lunch.
I think a full day Kindergarten would be a big draw to the towns. Does anyone know what other towns around us offer full day Kindergarten? I know Millburn-Short Hills does.
I sure hope we don't go the way some other towns have gone - charging a fee for students to play sports and join clubs. |
Camnol
Citizen
Username: Camnol
Post Number: 417
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 7:56 am: |
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It's also a space issue. If you have 3 a.m & 3 p.m. K classes, you need 3 class rooms. For full-day for the same group, you would need 6 classrooms. My old district couldn't offer it because they didn't have the classroom space. |
Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1589
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 9:46 am: |
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JTA, in answer to your question about other towns offering full-day K, Livingston does (I live in Livingston). It's from 8:05 to 2:25 every day. Not sure what other towns...I think Montclair does. |
Smoochie
Citizen
Username: Smoochie
Post Number: 112
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:00 am: |
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West Orange has full day kindergarten. One of the major reasons we live here |
CLK
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 2333
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 12:41 pm: |
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I hate to point this out, but the school budgets are already stressed to breaking point and nobody seems to want to take on the tax burden that is required just to fund what we already have.
I, too, am a proponent of full-day kindergarden. Or at least, of increasing the number of spots available in kindergarden ASP so that a lottery is no longer required, and all who need it can get it.
But there is the cost. While I have no idea how much full-day K (or universal ASP) would cost, I am sure the cost is not trivial.
While I'm not happy about my current rate of tax, I still feel lucky to live in MW and would probably fork out more. With some grumbling of course, but I'd do it for the good of the schools.
What about the rest of you? Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is? I agree that full-day K would be a positive in terms of bringing people into our town. But I've also heard the argument that higher tax keeps people away. So what would the net result of full-day K be? I really have no idea myself, just raising this as an issue. For me, it's about doing what is right for our kids and families, but there is this pragmatic thing, too.
I'm hoping that this question provokes your thinking, rather than your ire. I'm not 100% sure what I think, myself. |
ceceliac
Citizen
Username: Ceceliac
Post Number: 101
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 2:56 pm: |
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I agree CLK. And the other important point is that as long as S1701 exists, it doesn't even matter if we'd agree to have our taxes raised to provide more funding for school-related programs. There's not much we can do within the cap they've placed on school spending state-wide. The cuts we've been experiencing, which have not been pretty, are all S1701 related. We need to begin focusing more of our attention on the state budget cap. Until we do, all the things we'd love to have--or all the things we hate having taken away--are completely out of our control. |
Mummite
Citizen
Username: Mummite
Post Number: 285
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:39 pm: |
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I hate to admit that I agree on taxes.
My family will probably end up paying for private Kindergarten and then sending our children to state sachools for First grade. A tax increase to cover the Full day K would be less than the whole year preschool/montessori fees. Other towns providing full day K must be lacking in something else.... I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. MW neighbors are the best. |
argon_smythe
Citizen
Username: Argon_smythe
Post Number: 860
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 18, 2006 - 2:38 pm: |
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You can complain about this or you can consider it a step in the right direction that, if successful, may be expanded to benefit you.
If you complain enough that the district discontinues the program and we're back to half days all around.
It's your choice.
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