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MeAndTheBoys
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Username: Meandtheboys

Post Number: 4263
Registered: 12-2004


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 5:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So, what do we think?


Jury Finds Yates Not Guilty in Drownings
By ANGELA K. BROWN, Associated Press Writer
1 hour ago

HOUSTON - In a dramatic turnaround from her first murder trial, Andrea Yates was found not guilty by reason of insanity Wednesday in the drowning of her children in the bathtub.

The 42-year-old woman will be committed to a state mental hospital and held until she is no longer deemed a threat. If she had been convicted of murder, she would have been sentenced to life in prison.

Yates stared wide-eyed as the verdict was read, then bowed her head and wept quietly. Her relatives also shed tears, and the children's father, Rusty Yates, muttered, "Wow!" as he, too, cried.

Four years ago, another jury convicted Yates of murder, rejecting claims that she was so psychotic she thought she was saving her the souls of her five children by killing them. An appeals court overturned the convictions because of erroneous testimony from a prosecution witness.

Yates' chief attorney, George Parnham, called the verdict this time a "watershed event in the treatment of mental illness."

Wendell Odom, another of Yates' attorneys, suggested that attitudes have changed since the first trial: "Five years ago there were a lot of people who could not get past the anger of what happened."

Yates' 2002 conviction triggered debate over whether Texas' legal standard for mental illness was too rigid, whether the courts treated postpartum depression seriously enough, and whether a mother who kills could ever find sympathy and understanding in a tough-on-crime state like Texas.

Yates drowned 6-month-old Mary, 2-year-old Luke, 3-year-old Paul, 5-year-old John and 7-year-old Noah in their Houston-area home in June 2001. Her attorneys said she suffered from severe postpartum psychosis and, in a delusional state, believed that Satan was inside her and that killing the youngsters would save them from hell.

"The jury looked past what happened and looked at why it happened," Rusty Yates, who divorced his wife last year, said outside the courthouse. "Yes, she was psychotic. That's the whole truth."

Prosecutors had maintained that Yates failed to meet the state's definition of insanity: that she was so severely mentally ill that she did not know her actions were wrong.

"I'm very disappointed," prosecutor Kaylynn Williford said. "For five years, we've tried to seek justice for these children."

Yates will be sent to Vernon State Mental Hospital, a prison-like maximum-security facility encircled by a 17-foot fence and guard towers. Experts say it can take decades before psychiatrists decide that a patient is healthy enough to be released, and even then a judge can reject those findings.

The jury, split evenly between men and women, deliberated for about 13 hours over three days. The jurors had not been told that Yates would be committed to a mental institution if found not guilty.

Yates did not testify. Her lawyers presented much of the same evidence as in the first trial, including half a dozen psychiatrists who testified that Yates was insane.

During a videotaped 2001 jail interview, Yates told a psychiatrist that her children had not been progressing normally because she was a bad mother, and that she killed them because "in their innocence, they would go to heaven."

The jury was told about Yates' two hospitalizations after two suicide attempts in 1999, and about her stays in a mental hospital a few months before the drownings.

But prosecution witness Dr. Michael Welner, a forensic psychiatrist, testified that Yates killed the youngsters because she felt overwhelmed and inadequate as a mother, not to save their souls. He said that it was not until a day after the killings that she talked about Satan and saving her children from hell.

Welner also said Yates showed that she knew her actions were wrong by waiting until her husband left for work to kill them, covering the bodies with a sheet and calling 911 soon after the crime.

Yates' 2002 conviction was overturned after Dr. Park Dietz, a forensic psychiatrist, told the jury that before the drownings, NBC ran a "Law & Order" episode about a woman who was acquitted by reason of insanity after drowning her children. It was later learned that no such episode existed.

Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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The Soulful Mr T
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Username: Howardt

Post Number: 2275
Registered: 11-2004


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 6:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)




...ellipsis
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Claflin Kennerly
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Username: 2cents

Post Number: 34
Registered: 3-2006
Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Me and the Boys, I am personally outraged!!! If she is that insane I think she should be locked away forever! Who's to say when she will lose control again? And if the husband knew she was sick, why is he not held responsible for leaving the children with her?
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daylaborer
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Username: Upondaroof


Post Number: 834
Registered: 4-2003


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It all boils down to the judicial / penal system. 10 years should mean 10 years. Life should be for as long as you live and if you're f@#kin' nuts, ya ain't gonna get better. (In a perfect world!)
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Scully
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Post Number: 824
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Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm with Claflin Kennerly to the word.
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Glock 17
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Username: Glock17

Post Number: 1589
Registered: 7-2005


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If she's insane...she needs help. If she's not insane...she needs to be locked away.
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Southerner
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Username: Southerner

Post Number: 1352
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Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't think she did anything wrong. I'm pro-choice. I'll admit she waited a little longer than usual to decide to terminate her pregnancy but who can blame her. That's a tough decision.
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red
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Username: Redy67

Post Number: 6591
Registered: 2-2003


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

southerner, so not funny.
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Cynicalgirl
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Username: Cynicalgirl

Post Number: 3012
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Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I actually do think she's crazy/psychotic. But, I think her ex was complicitous by continuing to have children with her, and leave them home in her care, despite her untreated mental illness. As I recall, there was a religious angle to this. I wish to heck (1) she would chose to be sterilized to insure that she never goes off her meds and has more kids in or outside of prison, and (2) he because he has no judgement at all.
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Glock 17
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Post Number: 1590
Registered: 7-2005


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 7:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think dave should have that post removed.
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mwsilva
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Username: Mwsilva

Post Number: 510
Registered: 5-2002
Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 9:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The lady is sick.

Let her get help.
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MeAndTheBoys
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Username: Meandtheboys

Post Number: 4264
Registered: 12-2004


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 9:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm sure we know how Tom Cruise feels about her!

FWIW, I'm with Greenetree.
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Bettina
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Username: Bettina

Post Number: 162
Registered: 8-2004
Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 9:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow, what's it going to take for people to believe that mental illness is REAL! Our bodies are imperfect, and that does happen to include our brains! Why are our brains any different from any other organ in our body which as we know can at any time go terribly wrong?
And as for holding Mr. Yates complicitious, are you kidding? I have a funny feeling there is little punishment on this earth that could be worse for him than having all of his children drowned in a bathtub. I have to say, that is one of the most heartless positions I've ever heard.
Yikes.
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red
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Username: Redy67

Post Number: 6600
Registered: 2-2003


Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 10:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bettina--a case as horrific as this makes it hard to wrap your brain around it. A mother drowning her five angels. I think people do understand mental illness, but this is over the top. There was too much calculation from the mother, too much thought. That for me does her in.
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Alleygater
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Post Number: 2358
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Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 11:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think I blame the church partly for this one. Satan? Evil? That's stupid church stupidity. I wonder how her priest feels. Chalk up another great sin done with the help of religion. Yeah she's crazy. How else could she have believed that kind of dumb crud?
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Sandi and Paul
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Username: Momsandi

Post Number: 98
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Posted on Wednesday, July 26, 2006 - 11:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This was a very unusual verdict for Texas which doesn't usually acknowledge an insanity defense. It has been stated that she will be in mental institution for the rest of her life, in all likelihood. If they ever did let her out there would be a strong public outcry.
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MeAndTheBoys
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Post Number: 4272
Registered: 12-2004


Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 9:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well said Bettina. As someone who has suffered from varying extremes (luckily, mostly mild) of clinical depression most of my life, I can tell you firsthand how hard it is for most people to understand you can't just "get over it," or "buck it up," or "don't think about it," or any of the other things people like to say to folks who, in the extreme, may not even be able to drag themselves out of bed, or get themselves out of the house, or stop crying, or any of the other myriad symtoms!
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Chris Prenovost
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Username: Chris_prenovost

Post Number: 1034
Registered: 7-2003
Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 12:55 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am sorry.

But I think she should be executed.

She murdered her children. All five of them.

She chased them through the house.

Shoved them in the bathtub. Held them underwater for the several minutes it took for their lungs to flood. Waited until the last breath of life was extinguished.

And repeated that five times.

I do not know if she was mentally ill, and I do not care. Some crimes are just so horrendous that they brook no excuse. What's next, Hitler saying, 'I was mentally ill, I didn't know it was wrong to exterminate six million Jews'?
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Cynicalgirl
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Post Number: 3016
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 1:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My point, Bettina, was that during the reporting at the time, despite her obvious illness, etc. Mr. Yates (and she, to be fair) held fast to personal and religious beliefs about regarding her role, childbearing, etc. He knew she was going through some desperate times, but did little to lighten the load either by getting her medical attention, avoiding additional pregnancies or similar. His church also advocated homeschooling, which she did on top of everything else, while clearly depressed as all get out. That's why I say he's complicitous, though perhaps that's the wrong word. I think he bears some responsibility for what happened, moral at least. Much as a parent who allows abuse or neglect to be carried out by the other parent.

I agree that she was mentally ill, really, really do. I don't think she should be released, and I do think she belongs in a mental hospital. What provokes me is that her husband knew it, and while he indicates difficulty in getting her medical help, he had no problem insisting on her carrying out her wife/mother role in the way his church dictated. And I believe he's getting married again, etc.
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eliz
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 1:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm with Bettina on this. I think she's deranged. I do doubt she will get much help (other than perhaps being medicated into oblivion) in a maximum security state mental hospital in Texas. Not sure it's an easier option than prison for all of those out for blood.
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Bettina
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 4:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

People aren't medicated into oblivion anymore. Medications and how they are prescribed have vastly improved such that while nobody recovers from Schizophrenia, which I'm sure Andrea Yates has, she should be in good control. But I'm sure she'll always be too sick to function normally.

As for her husband, Cynical Girl, I'm sure he feels responsible in some way, don't you? He might have been a rotten husband. All I'm saying is, hasn't he been punished? All of his children are dead!
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frannyfree
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Username: Frannyfree

Post Number: 211
Registered: 1-2004
Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 4:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

His attitude seems awfully strange to me. He married very quickly.
If he says she is a great person then why did he divorce her so fast?
He seems to be very self serving.
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doulamomma
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Post Number: 1626
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 5:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

one of those Primetime/48 Hours shows is on tonight covering this case
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Factvsfiction
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Username: Factvsfiction

Post Number: 1210
Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 5:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think the person that is really insane is the guy that wants to date her.

Expect her myspace profile very, very soon.

Or perhaps she can find true love with.... Scott Petterson?
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Southerner
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Post Number: 1356
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 7:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm going to laugh my arse off when some liberal doctor who believes he has the magic tough declares her sane and she is released and moves to Maplewood. I can't wait to see her hanging out at the park.
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Cynicalgirl
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Username: Cynicalgirl

Post Number: 3019
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Posted on Thursday, July 27, 2006 - 8:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

At the time of the original trial, much was made of Mr. Yates' sort of unemotional flatness, and (to most people) odd attitude towards what had happened and anything he might've done differently. Some attributed it to being an engineer.
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Cougar86
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Username: Cougar86

Post Number: 26
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 9:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I understand sometimes people are unable to understand their actions and as a society we should be compassionate and attemt to rehabilitate them.

That being said I think murdering your own children crosses a line. I see no reason she should be able to take another breath on this earth. There is no amount of treatment supervision or containment that would satisfy me. I would never under any circumstances trust that she would not harm another living being let alone a child.

I truly believe she is defective as a human and should be terminated. I know that sounds cold and lacks any compassion. I have 2 sons the same ages as two of her kids. The horror that they must have felt at the point they realized their mother was hunting them down to drown them is unimaginable and actually haunts me as a parent. I don't believe she was or is sane, but I dont' care.

This wasn't about religion or her enviroment, this was about a defect that turned her into a child killing machine.

Also Southerner you are a dispicable human. If you were attempting humor there is nothing funny about the subject. If you were attempting to make a political point you did so at the expense of 5 children's souls.

Sorry to be so serious.
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LilLB
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 10:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Reading this thread makes me very glad that we have established law instead of living simply by emotion.
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Scully
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Username: Scully

Post Number: 839
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 12:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sure Southener. Dead children. Very funny.
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Parkbench87
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Username: Parkbench87

Post Number: 4952
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 12:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Reading this thread makes me very glad that we have established law instead of living simply by emotion."

AMEN
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combustion
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Username: Spontaneous

Post Number: 291
Registered: 4-2006


Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 2:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"All I'm saying is, hasn't he been punished? All of his children are dead!"

Did he forcibly hold his children under the water until they were dead? No, but I don't believe should be 100% in the clear either. Yes, his children are dead, because he chose to ignore his sick wife and force his views on her. What did he say? He wanted a baseball team? Funny just how Christian and God-fearing he was when it came to birth control and homeschooling, but when it comes to divorce, he drops her like a hot potato and gets a new victim, I mean, wife.

And think about it, the above argument could also be used for Andrea Yates. Not that I would ever try to defend her actions, I personally think she should rot in hell. But if you think your children being dead is punishment, then she's already been punished and should be set free, right?
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finnegan
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 3:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cougar86:

"I truly believe she is defective as a human and should be terminated. I know that sounds cold and lacks any compassion. I have 2 sons the same ages as two of her kids."

Interesting.

I have a son about the age of one of Andrea Yates's kids and guess what? He has a profound neurological impairment. Much more impaired than Andrea Yates by most measures of independence; she could at least talk, drive, live independently, which my son won't be able to do.

So, would you call my son defective, too? Should he be terminated, as well?

And, btw, who gets to decide which "defective" people we will terminate?

You?

And you call Southerner "dispicable"??? (sic)

Your use of the word "defective" is profoundly and irredeemably abhorent to all of us who love and advocate for people with disabilities of various sorts.

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Cougar86
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Post Number: 31
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 3:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If your son were to chase his 5 kids down in his home and drown them one by one over the course of an hour, yes I might call him defective too.

I'm not completely comfortable with my feelings either but like I said she crossed a line with me.
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Psychomom
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 3:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm not a psychiatrist, but isn't post-partum depression a temporary condition brought about by the imbalance of hormones following pregnancy? If so, I don't think the husband is culpable in this case and I don't know that she would be a threat to society as long as she didn't have any more pregnancies.

But killing 5 children is a horrible thing too, and I agree that there has to be some kind of penalty, but I don't think life imprisonment is quite the answer in this case anyway
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MeAndTheBoys
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Username: Meandtheboys

Post Number: 4287
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 3:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"No, but I don't believe he (the husband) should be 100% in the clear either. Yes, his children are dead, because he chose to ignore his sick wife...."

Absolutely!

People can only be so oblivious (him), or so stoic (her). There had to be signs that something was amiss, somewhere along the way. I don't think she just woke up one day and snapped. It was probably more of a downward spiral she saw no way out of.

Not making excuses. Killing the kids was horrific. But I don't believe it was as cut and dried as some folks seem to see it. "Mental illness" is very difficult to understand if you've never experienced it's effects.
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BGS
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 3:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I saw about half of the presentation last night on TV (can't remember the name of the show on channel 7 at 10).
We have a lot of armchair psychiatrists and doctors and lawyers on this board.
I think that not one of us can judge this woman or her husband until we have either walked a mile in their shoes OR if we have available to us all the information that the judicial system had.

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finnegan
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 5:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cougar86, well it's nice to know you'll point out to the rest of us who is "defective" and who isn't.

Seriously, though, there is a difference between condemning someone's behavior and deciding that they are "defective." Let's remember that one of the first groups put to death by the Nazi's were those with developmental disabilities, those in institutions for the "handicapped," etc. But I guess since that's how you feel, it's okay. (Good thing you're not posting under your real name or the "Not-Dead-Yet" crowd would probably be picketing in their wheelchairs in front of your house!)

Interesting to me that while so many people here are seriosuly wrestling with culpibility in the face of mental illness, some brook no ambiguity and resolutely call for Yates' head on a pole. I'm just noting how often our overwhelming love for our own children seems to render us incapable of exhibiting any compassion whatsoever for those who fail, sometimes spectacularily, in their role as parents. This is not the first time I've seen this on this board.
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Cougar86
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Post Number: 32
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 5:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

finnegan sorry you don't agree with my opinion, I expect few will. AS for comparing me to the Nazi's I think the distintion is the Nazi's sought the destruction of entire races to further their own power. That is entirely a different subject we can debate if you wish.

I think it fine to have compassion for those who fail as a parent...to a point, but she didn't fail as a parent, she failed as human being to me. I do think there is a point past which there is no return and she is far beyond that point. In this case specifically it is how I feel.

I have never said that everyone with a mental illness is defective, I said SHE is defective, her being mentally ill not withstanding. We as a society judge people every day in courtrooms and jury boxes.

Perhaps your compassion grows from your hope or belief that there are no genuinely evil people in this world and to do such a horrible thing would require that some outside force be the cause. I dont' feel that compassion for Andrea Yates.

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Southerner
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 6:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cougar,
While I agree with you, your attack on me is unfounded and ridiculous. You obviously have a problem with murdering little children. Do you have a problem murdering them when they are a day old? What about murdering them when their mother is on the way to the hospital to deliver them? What about murdering them when they are comfortably in the womb at 7 months? What about at 5 months? I feel your outrage but please be consistent, otherwise this is what we get. Some murderers go to jail and some go to hospitals. I just find your attack on me and your outrage on this subject are inconsistent. Besides, the majority of us believe it is okay for a mother to kill her children prior to birth so I don't see why we have such outrage if a mother kills them after birth. Just be consistent in your beliefs otherwise you have no beliefs.
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The3ofUs
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Post Number: 74
Registered: 4-2006
Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 6:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Just be consistent in your beliefs otherwise you have no beliefs."

Hilarious.


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Southerner
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Username: Southerner

Post Number: 1371
Registered: 2-2004
Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 8:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Now your're coming around. I love this.
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The3ofUs
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Post Number: 75
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Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 8:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Now your're coming around. I love this."

Excrutiatingly hilarious.
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SO Ref
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Username: So_refugee

Post Number: 2014
Registered: 2-2005


Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 8:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Southerner - chances are that she wouldn't move to Maplewood, but rather a trailer park near you...
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finnegan
Supporter
Username: Finnegan

Post Number: 370
Registered: 6-2001
Posted on Friday, July 28, 2006 - 8:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Nazi's believed and promulgated the belief that the Jews, as a "race"," were defective human beings. Cougar86, your delegation of Andrea Yates (or anyone else for that matter) to the category of "defective" human being places you squarely in their ideological camp. I'm just making the point about how that word and the category of "defective" has been used historically, especially against those with disabilities.

But I think you've made it clear, this is just how you "feel," and those feelings are, to you apparently, self-justifying. I was asking you to think through your feelings and attend a little to history and see if you can't perceive the value in separating out someone's ACTIONS/BEHAVIOR (which may well be morally repugnant and worthy of societal condemnation) from their worth as a human being, since judging people's worth as a human being, as history tells those willing to listen, is a dangerous and slippery slope.

Not to mention the very real practical problem of determining who is "defective" and who is not. Only people who kill five of their children? What if someone kills four of their children? Three? Two? One? Or should we all just give you a call so you can tell us who is defective and who is not? What if someone kills somone else's children? Defective or not? Human or not?

Feelings are not by definition immune from rigorous examination. Just because you feel a certain way does not mean you shouldn't also strive to be intellectually consistent, or should ignore history with impunity.

And, yes, I do think people do evil things for which they remain responsible. But I hold that this is different from calling them "defective.". Saying they are "defective" is worse, and more important it is dangerous to many people who are not in a position to defend themselves.





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combustion
Citizen
Username: Spontaneous

Post Number: 314
Registered: 4-2006


Posted on Saturday, July 29, 2006 - 1:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Maybe Cougar86's choice of words was iffy, but I read the post as a whole for content; I often have difficulty finding the "correct" word to convey an idea, so I can sympathize. The term "defective" here looks misleading, I don't think the intent was in any way to include disabled people, but instead referring to truly sick and evil people. Think Timothy McVeigh, Ted Bundy, Dennis Rader. What term would you use to describe these people? What was truly sick was that she was their mother, she was supposed to protect them from the evil in this world, and instead she herself became that evil monster. Mom is supposed to protect you, not kill you. It's as simple as that.
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Sandi and Paul
Citizen
Username: Momsandi

Post Number: 99
Registered: 10-2005
Posted on Saturday, July 29, 2006 - 8:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well stated, Combustion. A lot of this argument was over semantics - the use of the word defective. Some of us think she should be in a mental hospital and some want her in jail or facing the death penalty, but I only saw one person suggesting that she could be released at some future date.
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Camnol
Citizen
Username: Camnol

Post Number: 430
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Saturday, July 29, 2006 - 9:37 am:   Edit Post Delete Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow, so many are so quick to judge without all the facts. The way I look at it, this isn't a woman who did something horrible out-of-the-blue, and suddenly says, "look at me, I'm insane." This is a woman with a long, serious history of mental illness. If you care to know, below is a link to the timeline of events that led up to the moment that she killed her children.

I do hold her husband partially responsible for this. This is clearly not a woman who should have been having child after child and homeschooling them to boot. The reason I hold her husband partially responsible was that he was warned that she should not have more children, and at the time this happened, it came out that he wasn't making sure she took her meds.

It's a horrible, horrible event. But I think people need to realize that there is more to this than another person oh so conveniently claiming insanity.


http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/news/state/15127785.htm

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