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pag
Citizen
Username: Hueylove
Post Number: 32
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 8:06 pm: | 
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I have a 46 ft by 25 foot back yard that is entirely bricked. the bricks are easy to remove but I have no idea what it would take to do that backyard so that I can seed it and have grass. Any suggestions would be helpful. I am on a budget and would like to do it as inexpensively as possible. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7852
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 8:11 pm: |
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Start with talking to your neighbors & see if you can find out why it is bricked. Perhaps it was a drainage solution; are there drains anywhere? Do they have water problems when it rains? Depending on your neighborhood, lots of us have major drainage issues when it rains. We raised the level of our back yard about 6 inches last year to deal with it.
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Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 465
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 8:24 pm: |
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Also, is your backyard shaded or exposed to sunlight. If heavily shaded growing grass will be difficult.
If drainage and sunlight are non issues then seeding is the least expensive option to having grass (versus sodding). |
Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1531
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 8:53 pm: |
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Unfortunately, you missed the springtime window of opportunity for doing a lawn (we just seeded a new backyard this past spring). Now that the hot weather is here, grass won't grow from seeds successfully. Your next chance is in the fall. You really have to plant grass seed in cooler weather. We planted ours in April, and by early May it was quite lush.
Actually, it's not necessarily true that growing grass in shade is difficult. We have a very shady back yard. But because we started in early April before the trees had leaves, the grass got a good start. Also, we fertilized very heavily and used a shade mixture of grass seed....hardier grass that doesn't need as much sun. Anyway, it grew very well and is now very thick. We were starting out from a completely bare (rototilled) yard with NO grass in it. Total investment: about $65 for seed, $20 for fertilizer, $80 to rent a rototiller...and lots of sweat (on the part of Mr Zoesky1, thankfully).
Anyway, it's smart to think about how to do it now, but you should wait until fall at this point. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 11672
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:33 am: |
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Pag,
First off what are the bricks set in, in other words what is the underlayment? The traditional method of setting a brick patio is in several inches of compacted sand.
Grass wouldn't grow in the sand, so you are probably faced with bringing in a lot of topsoil (over 50 cubic yards?) to spread four inches or so over the sand. The sand will make a good drainage base btw.
The good news is that if the brick is in good shape it is worth quite a lot of money. A lot of people are looking for used pavers.
You may be able to negotiate a reduced price for the work in return for the landscaper taking the bricks.
I kind of doubt that the bricks were put in to solve a drainage problem. But look at how the water flows off them when you have a heavy rain and make sure the new lawn is pitched away from the house. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7856
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:52 am: |
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Bob - I thought about it because I know some people who had smaller backyards with major drainage problems. They solved it by making the entire space into patio. Maplewoody had posted a pic of his work a couple years back; it's stunning. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 11673
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:05 am: |
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I remember the pictures and the cute little dogs.  As I recall he has a very narrow backyard surrounded by higher properties (I seem to remember retaining walls). I suspect he has a drainage runoff system of some sort under the patio.
Bricks absorb water and aren't a really good way to control drainage, at least in my opinion. Go for sloped concrete. |
Elizabeth
Citizen
Username: Momof4peepers
Post Number: 81
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:19 am: |
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Having done the same thing in Boston (ripped up brick - plus concrete AND asphalt) here's what I did:
1) pulled up all hardscape, including raking up all rocks, paid a dumpster company to haul it away
2) dug up 6" of dirt below entire thing, called dumpster company to haul it away (I did this because the dirt being under so much stuff for so long was probably devoid of all usefulness not to mention who knew what chemicals)
3) brought in topsoil, peat moss, compost, manure and spread in layers over 1" of wet newspaper. Rototill the entire mixture together.
4) raked smooth
5) planted plants and grass
If you're looking to do something cheap, while it seems ripping up a patio to put down grass may seem like it, the reality is that it's really pretty expensive. In my case, the pavers were not salvageable, so you may get lucky there.
Can you skip the lawn and do pots of plants instead? |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7858
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:27 am: |
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Eliz - what was the newspaper for? |
wnb
Citizen
Username: Wnb
Post Number: 393
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:29 am: |
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Keep in mind you are contemplating taking something that is virtually maintenance-free and turning it into something that will require a regimented regimen of care and support, water, chemicals, fertilizer, and mowing mowing mowing.
You could "green up" your back "yard" in other ways which may prove to be less demanding with other types of plantings including container plants and even taking up some of the bricks and planting shrubs or flower beds etc.
Just something to consider. Lawns are a lot of work and/or money to maintain.
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Deidra
Citizen
Username: Deidralynn
Post Number: 587
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:51 am: |
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You may want to keep brick for partial coverage of your backyard. We are finishing up redoing our backyard that sloped toward the house. Here are some before and after pics. We're doing all the landscaping work ourselves. We purchased sod & soil from Orange Garden Supply (and getting more sod this Friday) and building the retaining wall (w/ blocks from HD). Luigi did the patio and Tico's installed the pergula. We have some more planting to do but I am loving it so far!....and drenching the sod to take root.
Good luck and always keep the function of the yard in mind when attempting to redo your yard.
Before....
After....
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pag
Citizen
Username: Hueylove
Post Number: 33
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:41 am: |
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thanks for all your info. the problem with the brick is that we have young children playing in the back yard all the time. there is zero grass back there. I know what you mean about the maintianence but, truthfully, I find maintaining this pretty labor intensive. Weeds come up all the time and I have difficulty knowing I am putting chemicals on the ground where kids and animals are going all the time. I have to keep the bricks free of moss growing, etc. This is too much for me to maintain. Thought that grass, althought there is a lot to do with it would be more user friendly for kids. |
Deidra
Citizen
Username: Deidralynn
Post Number: 588
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 12:37 pm: |
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Then just GO FOR IT! Definitely check to see what's underneath the brick, so you know what you're dealing with. Also, do you have a shovel and rake and other such landscaping tools? You can have top soil delivered to your home also. |
Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1532
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 3:48 pm: |
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I have to say, go for it, but I do think you will be sorry if you go to all the expense of tilling and planting grass just as the hot weather is upon us. You may find yourself simply having to redo it in the fall. Good grass seed (Scotts, for instance) isn't cheap. Of course, if you want "instant lawn," you could do sod, but that's quite expensive. And even sod, i am told, does best if installed in the spring or fall, not summer. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 11678
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 3:54 pm: |
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Deidra, love your pergula. Now all you need is some wisteria. |
Deidra
Citizen
Username: Deidralynn
Post Number: 590
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:47 pm: |
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Thanks Bob, I was thinking of staining it or painting it white before I added that....wisteria is lovely but I know NOTHING about growing it. |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 938
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:40 pm: |
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You don't have to know anything. Just buy it, plant it, then post here asking for help.
That's what WE all do.
J.B. |
Deidra
Citizen
Username: Deidralynn
Post Number: 593
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 1, 2006 - 2:37 pm: |
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I'm sure it can't be that difficult but it does take time to climb. |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 945
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, June 1, 2006 - 10:56 pm: |
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Deidra,
First, let me say, "GO BLUE."
Second, when I moved into our house in S.O. there were these little leaves that had been mowed by the previous owners. I started to water them LIKE A CRAZY PERSON.
My wife made fun of me, but after one season, wisteria had competely grown up this arch that was bare when we moved it. This spring is season two, and I've read that it takes three years to bloom. I've been cutting it back lovingly, or if your my wife, "LIKE A CRAZY PERSON."
Hey next year there may be awesome wisteria blooms. Or, maybe I'm CRAZY.
J.B.
From what I've read, it's not hard to get wisteria to grow. It's hard to get wisteria under control, or to bloom. |
Elizabeth
Citizen
Username: Momof4peepers
Post Number: 86
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 2, 2006 - 3:36 am: |
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The newspaper was suggested as part of the "lasagne gardening" concept. Which, given the incredibly poor soil condition, a slow-to-break down product under all the other stuff I was putting down seemed like a good idea.
Diedre - the garden & patio look BEAUTIFUL! |
heroman
Citizen
Username: Heroman
Post Number: 107
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 8:00 pm: |
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Pag, we had our front and back lawns sodded and a sprinkler system put in for a few thousand dollars. Our lot is 60x100. It's not a small amount of money, but I asked one of the big landscapers for an estimate for some foundation plantings, walkway and seeding/regrading about 1/5 of the back lawn and it was $10,000! When we moved here we kept the previous owners' lawn guys---they killed our lawn! So, now we do our own lawn and Lawn Doctor fertilzes (there's also an organic option). It's easy. The kids love it. We used Emerald Lawn Sprinklers and they got us the sod guy. |
Melonious
Citizen
Username: Melonious
Post Number: 115
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 9:06 pm: |
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At this point, I'd go for the sod. If you can swing it, have a pro do it, so that you and your family can just get down to the business of enjoying it (since we're halfway through June anyway. Good idea to keep some of the brick, so that you can also have some grown up space.
As Deidra said, sod does need thorough DAILY waterings (unless the area drains poorly) in order to "take". Speaking of LIKE A CRAZY PERSON, that's how I watered mine. You could also get lucky and have another rainy few weeks like we're having now, in which case you wouldn't need to do a thing. |
Deidra
Citizen
Username: Deidralynn
Post Number: 605
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 8, 2006 - 11:02 pm: |
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..I just finished sodding that last strip in the back and it looks great and my kids love it!!!! That is the ONLY THING I am loving about all this rain. The sod is growing just lovely! But if I had to do over again, I would leave it to a pro because it is HARD WORK!!! I did save us A LOT of $$$ by taking my time and doing it myself. Now I have to get back to building my little wall and leveling that pile of soil behind it so I can do some more planting and figure out the hysteria of wisteria for my pergula. My traveling husband is still looking at me in amazement that I had this vision for the backyard and brought it to fruition! |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 185
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 8:28 pm: |
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Be careful with wisteria -- it can overtake anything!! You might want to research some less invasive options -- clematis, grape vines....... |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 186
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 8:29 pm: |
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Forgot to add Deidra, your yard looks fabulous!! Like a makeover show -- enjoy |
Jersey_Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 1023
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 9, 2006 - 8:51 pm: |
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Deidra,
Don't listen to Nob. Wisteria just needs to be trimmed properly. Like most plants, it won't flower if it's busy leafing. Cut back the new growth to force the photosynthesis energy into the "old wood," once you have some. Then the blooms grow on the short stems growing from the old wood.
It's not a low maintanence vine by any means, but I've been reading about it voraciously, and I think one's intuition that lots of leaf growth is healthy is wrong. Look at the blooming wisteria that you see. It has thick vines with little stems and the flowers come from them.
The untended wisteria are big bushy things that look green and healthy, but don't flower. I'm at least a year away from blooming, and I'm not going to mess it up. I've worked too hard.
Good luck, and Go Blue.
J.B. |
Nob
Citizen
Username: Nob
Post Number: 188
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, June 10, 2006 - 9:29 am: |
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Deidra
Am a voice of experience --have twice bought a house with a well established wisteria vines in a place that is hard to cut back-- they grow voraciously and need to be cut back frequently....just be aware of what you are getting yourself into. They are gorgeous when blooming for a few weeks but tons of work in between. Maybe easier to handle if you start from scratch. Good luck whatever you decide. |
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