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blue angel
Citizen
Username: Blue_angel
Post Number: 6
Registered: 5-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 12:46 pm: | 
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We're about to close on our new house and are planning to do some updating.
The biggest job is the renovation of the kitchen (replacing cabinets and appliances, installing new sheetrock ceiling, new lighting fixtures etc.). We'd also like to put in some new lighting in a couple of rooms and change the vanities in both bathrooms. We're thinking of hiring a contractor to do all this.
We're also thinking of having the walls painted in the whole house, excluding trim, doors and ceilings. We got a good estimate from a painter who'd do the job for a fraction of what a big contractor told us.
And we also found a floor guy who would pull up the wall-to-wall carpeting in the bedrooms and refinish the wood floors there.
My question is: does it make sense to use 3 separate groups to do this work? Our rationale to go with various people is that we're hoping to get a better price and perhaps a better end result, as well, since we'd be using specialized workers.
Does anyone have experience dealing with several companies simultaneously? Are we right in thinking that we might save money this way (compared to hiring one contractor to do everything?). We're still living in NYC so figuring out how to "babysit" the workers in another issue.
We very much appreciate any input since this is our first experience venturing into house buying territory...
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Oldstone
Citizen
Username: Rogers4317
Post Number: 754
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 12:54 pm: |
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blue angel, you are lucky to have the wherewithal to have found 3 different guys to do different things in your house before you move in. when i bought my house a couple years ago, i didn't have a clue about contractors here and hired one guy to do all i needed to have done in order for me to move in. it was expensive in hindsight. i think one of the positives in one guy is that he will be able to properly schedule everything whereas if you use 3 different people it might be tough to coordinate and get everything done in a timely manner. for instance, i wouldn't want the floors and painting done before the kitchen was redone as that project is a huge mess and kitchens are notorious for dragging out to completion. i bet you would save money using 3 separate guys though.
good luck in whatever you decide to do ! |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 134
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 1:38 pm: |
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You can find a designer (South Orange resident)who will do design, complete drawings, supply materials hire and manage all the trades at www.thekompletekitchen.com
Great references in the area.
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NJguy99
Citizen
Username: Njguy99
Post Number: 49
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 1:48 pm: |
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Welcome to the world of being your own General Contractor, Blue Angel.
In essence, you're doing what that one guy (or gal) would do for you - arrange all the specialists. No matter what a contractor tells you, there's no one out there who does it all themselves - even if he or she does 99% of it, they still need to get an electrician to put in the lights and a plumber to hook up the sink, etc.
If you choose well, and have the time to devote to it, you can save money. Just be prepared to spend a lot of time coordinating the various sub-contractors. That's what you're really paying a general contractor for - the time spent coordinating. If it's worth it to you to spend your time, and you know what you want, then it is worth it to oversee the project yourself. |
Smarty Jones
Citizen
Username: Birdstone
Post Number: 768
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 1:56 pm: |
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My advice is only this...do as much as you possibly can before you move in....we wish we did. |
Brooklynlady
Citizen
Username: Brooklynlady
Post Number: 11
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 2:49 pm: |
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We are also in the midst of trying to get work done before we move in, but alas there are always obstacles. I strongly recommend doing one project at time as it will be totally overwhelming to control or oversee all the workers especially when you are not nearby. Also, if you have never used someone before you don't want to use this person to do such a large job right off the bat. Give him/her something small and see how they do with that.
On another note isn't Kitchen Guru really Antoinette Fraser of the Komplete Kitchen? I got a PL from Kitchen Guru just a little while ago giving me the same message as she gave you -- I am doing a major kitchen overhaul as well. I personally don't like companies disguising themselves with a different name and using MOL to promote their business. If they are good there are plenty of folks on MOL who have no problems recommending them. What they should not do is create a fake identity and act as a satisfied customer to promote their business. |
moving soon
Citizen
Username: Movingsoon
Post Number: 117
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 2:51 pm: |
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We were in the same boat as you exactly a year ago.
I went the route of hiring a General Contractor for everything (we were doing everything you were, plus finishing an attic and enclosing a porch).
The bad news: the GC basically takes a markup on all the subcontractors stuff. So for every dollar the plumber billed him, he billed me $1.50. I'm sure markups vary.
The good news: there was lots of coordination to be done, plus permits/inspections, etc. I was a newbie, wouldn't have known where to begin, and wasn't able to be here every day for the MONTHS that it took to complete this.
The bad news: the subs he picked were of variable quality, plus he did a mediocre job of supervising them.
I think you're going down the right path. The kitchen stuff (which may require permits if you're moving lights or appliances) has interconnected parts, makes sense to get a GC to manage it. Floors and painting can be done seperately, the GC would add little value, you can do it on your own (assuming you're around, able to find/manage them).
People gave me the 50/50 rule: it will cost 50% more and take 50% longer than the estimate. The cost overruns were not nearly that bad, but timewise, it took more than 50% longer than the estimate. This is a busy time of year, and it can be very challenging to get the right GC/painter/plumber/electrician on your job when you need them.
If you use a GC, be as thorough as possible when you get bids. Otherwise you end up thinking of things later (which will happen anyway) and those extras are often where the $$$ start magically growing.
Good luck. We found the process very stressful, but extremely educational, and ultimately worth it. Feel free to PL if I can be of help. |
akb
Citizen
Username: Akb
Post Number: 435
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 2:55 pm: |
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FWIW, I would have the ceiling and trim done when the walls are painted - esp the ceiling which you want done before the floors are refinished. It is much easier to have all the painting done at the same time and while the house is still empty. Also even if the trim and ceilings look fresh now, they might not next to the newly painted walls.
Ignore this is everything had been painted white immediately prior to the house being marketed and you are just updating with colour. |
moving soon
Citizen
Username: Movingsoon
Post Number: 118
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:01 pm: |
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A couple of follow-up thoughts after seeing brooklyn lady's post:
Absolutely, it's better to know a contractor before you hire them for a big job.
I also think it's better to live in a place before you renovate...only with time do you know what you really want & need.
But we did neither of the above, because we wanted to be in before school started, and we didn't want to live through renovations.
So, Blue Angel, my 2 cents: don't be shy about jumping in and getting it done now. Be careful about picking a contractor, SEE EXAMPLES OF THEIR WORK, assume that not everything will come out perfect, and hopefully you'll learn to love it anyway.
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melicious
Citizen
Username: Melicious
Post Number: 468
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:03 pm: |
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I broke everything up into separate contractors, so I wouldn't be too reliant on one person's schedule. Boy am I glad I did that. Everyone has finished (or is finishing) at vastly different rates.
Just make sure to consider the order of things. Paint last if you can. That way, all the other stuff doesn't mess up the paint job.
Good luck!
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Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 135
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:07 pm: |
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Brooklynlady,
I responded to your request for information. I am not disguising myself or promoting myself in anyway. I have responded to many area resident's requests for information on many topics and did so today as well. I hope this doesn't inconvenience you in any way. No one has ever asked for my identity and certainly you have no need of that information.
Kitchenguru |
Brooklynlady
Citizen
Username: Brooklynlady
Post Number: 13
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:14 pm: |
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Kitchen Guru - bottom line you are promoting your business under a false alias. If you are the J. Antoinette Fraser just say so.
There are many other construction folks, painters, etc...online that offer their services, they just come right out and say it right off the bat "I am a handyman and I can help you with yada yada yada. What they DON'T do is act like a satisfied customer who is writing in a recommendation for a particular company.
Just come out and be honest and tell folks that you are the person that actually owns the company. |
Psychomom
Citizen
Username: Psychomom
Post Number: 156
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:14 pm: |
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I don't know if you need a painter reference but I would recommend Dilly Brothers in Springfield. Their parents were members of my church and truly nice people. Their sons are just as great, really humble, honest guys who won't soak you on price. We had some sheet rock replaced on kitchen ceiling, kitchen wallpapered, ceiling painted and trim and doors painted a few years ago and the whole job was under $400. He also installed a light fixture which wasn't really his job, but we decided to replace light at last minute and he just threw it in. He also cleaned up after himself and didn't dog it...they worked the whole time they were here. |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 136
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 16, 2006 - 3:16 pm: |
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BTW, has any one seen my recommendations from my experience as a satisfied customer? Definitely, I have recommended a painter, flooring contractor,
and furniture refinisher and said I had great experiences with these folks, I have never given given any personal experience recommendation to anyone regarding kitchen remodeling and I never will. I have said many times you hire people based on meeting a satisfied client or two of theirs and viewing the work.
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Rich
Citizen
Username: Veneto
Post Number: 8
Registered: 5-2006
| | Posted on Monday, June 19, 2006 - 8:34 am: |
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Ahhh, welcome to our world; the place of 100 year old houses and decades of owners who haven't spent a dime on them. Having done this multiple times in a different area, then having to do it here, I hope I can spare you some of the pain.
Yes, use different people. If you are going to paint the walls, do the ceilings and trim too. Once the walls get painted, the ceilings and trim will look like crap (unless the trim is natural wood, of course). There are some great painters in this area. It will be expensive, but the work is good.
I would keep the carpet down until all of the other work is done. It's suprising how much damage can be done to hard wood floors just from people with work boots walking over them. The painters will appreciate it too.
Be selective in where you are installing new lighting. If you want to put recessed lighting in your family room and you do not intend to remove the ceiling, it could get time consumuing and expensive. Access is everything for electricians.
PUT EVERYTHING IN WRITING. Make a check list of what you want done. Give the same list to each contractor, don't think that just because you told somebody something verbally that they heard it and put it in the price quote.
Don't think that anyone cares as much about your house as you do. If you and your partner both work full time, make sure someone is always accessable when the contractors are working on your house. There are always questions that need to be answered throughout the day; which way do you want this molding? how far from this wall do you want the sink?, blah, blah, blah.
Don't pay for labor until you are happy with the work. It's only fair to pay for the materials up front, but if someone needs money to pay workers to show up, run from them. The good contractors in the area are cool with this.
I'm not a contractors, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night and we do have a Newcomers Club in the area so join us when you move to town. www.somnewcomers.com |
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