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Kirk Petersen
Citizen
Username: Kirkpete
Post Number: 1
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 10:10 am: | 
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Any time now the nice men with shovels will start ringing our Tuscan Road doorbell, and we're trying to figure out how much to pay them. Front and back walk, longish driveway ending in two-car garage. Seems like $60-$80 should be enough even for heavy snowfall... Any ideas? |
Mergele
Citizen
Username: Mergele
Post Number: 242
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 10:19 am: |
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After snow like this I pay whatever it takes 
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greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 3723
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 10:24 am: |
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Kirk - where do you live? We'll be right over.
That sounds like a lot of money. For all that, I'd go $50, tops. And we live on a corner. TS just shoveled a path from the front door to the street for the dog & it took 5 minutes. Not that it did any good, but that's a different thread.
The snow is very light. |
Kirk Petersen
Citizen
Username: Kirkpete
Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 11:04 am: |
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I'm pretty much in the "whatever it takes" school of thought myself -- one year I paid $70 for a bad snowstorm, which may have been too much.
greenetree, you say you'd be willing to pay $50 tops... that's fine, but have you actually been able to purchase that service at that price?
My wife and I are going to go out and do some shoveling, see how light the snow really is... |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1829
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 11:56 am: |
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We just had our 50 foot long sidewalk and the 20 foot walk to the front door done for $20. (We had done a first run on both last night around 8 or 9 p.m.) But we live near Irvington and there are always folks coming by asking if they can shovel and usually naming their own prices. We threw in a pack of tissues and a clementine which the guy really appreciated. Our neighbor just got his new snowthrower running and is doing the end of our driveway (which adjoins his and is the real difficult part because of street plowing.)
Cathy |
Kirk Petersen
Citizen
Username: Kirkpete
Post Number: 3
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 12:32 pm: |
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OK, it's done... A man and his two sons drove by and asked if we needed help while we were doing the front walk. My wife negotiated $40 for the long driveway and double garage, and my wife and I finished the walks. At the end I gave them a chance to ask for more, but they didn't, so I handed over two twenties and kept my liberal guilt in my pocket. I think everyone was satisfied. greenetree was right, the snow was pretty light.
Shook hands with all of them and chatted with the man for a minute, he said he was doing this mostly for his sons, to teach them about making an honest living. I said God bless -- it doesn't get much more honest than this
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gemini
Citizen
Username: Gemini
Post Number: 359
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 1:55 pm: |
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Hey Cheapos!! those kids are freezing! I always overpay and give them Hot Chocolate sometimes, too. Give them a break! (it could be MY kids someday.... ) |
Local_1_crew
Citizen
Username: Local_1_crew
Post Number: 348
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 3:05 pm: |
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i paid 10 dollars for a shovel. |
spw784
Supporter
Username: Spw784
Post Number: 634
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 3:50 pm: |
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I happened to be baking slice and bake cookies when some guys from Orange rang the bell.. Cookies were done about 10 mins before they were done with the driveway,etc, so I wrapped about a dozen in some foil and gave them some warm cookies with their money. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 3725
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 5:30 pm: |
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Gem- interesting thought. I usually do offer too much. Last summer, my neighbor told his kids that they weren't allowed to accept what I offered for washing my car. He felt it was too much; he wanted them to learn about working, but not just for "big" money.
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Thenewguy
Citizen
Username: Thenewguy
Post Number: 40
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 5:36 pm: |
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4 kids. $40 for the sidewalk and walkway. |
Michael K. Mc Kell
Citizen
Username: Greenerose
Post Number: 542
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 5:36 am: |
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I need to push snow in Maplewood and South Orange. I plow driveways in Long Valley that range from 100' to 800' in length for a max of $100.00
Of course, there are no side walks in the country so I don't get out of the truck. |
Michael K. Mc Kell
Citizen
Username: Greenerose
Post Number: 543
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 5:56 am: |
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Continued: That's every 6" of snow. |
CFA
Citizen
Username: Cfa
Post Number: 1285
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 6:23 am: |
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I don't pay anything. We don't get snow! |
thegoodsgt
Citizen
Username: Thegoodsgt
Post Number: 734
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 10:37 am: |
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This may be unrealistic in a wealthy community like ours, but if I were going to pay someone else to do what I can do, I would first shovel the area myself to see how long it takes and then determine an hourly rate for paying someone else. Peronally, I can't see paying someone more than $10-15/hour to shovel snow. |
ReallyTrying
Citizen
Username: Reallytrying
Post Number: 590
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 1:52 pm: |
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thehoodsgt, I disagree. Would you accept that rate of pay for hard work in the cold outdoors? I certainly wouldn't. Yesterday, I paid three grown men $30 for the front steps, sidewalk, walkway to front door, all around three cars, and the driveway apron. My son and I had already started a pathetic effort at this job, so the men weren't shoeveling virgin snow. OTOH, they made nice, wide paths. It took tham about ten minutes. (I wonder what it's like to be big and strong.  ) I made them hot chocolate while they were working. They seemed to appreciate that. |
Kirk Petersen
Citizen
Username: Kirkpete
Post Number: 4
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 3:46 pm: |
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I'm all in favor of generosity and fair wages, ReallyTrying, but I don't think "what I would be willing to accept to do the work" is the proper yardstick for determining how much to pay. If I'm setting the price at what I would be willing to accept, then almost by definition I should do the work myself. The only reason for hiring someone to do it is that the labor can be purchased for less than I would charge to do the work.
$10 to $15 is almost 2-3 times the minimum wage, which doesn't seem bad for unskilled labor, even physical labor in the cold. The challenge is to estimate the time well enough to set a flat rate for the job, which is usually how the shovelers want to be paid.
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Spqr
Citizen
Username: Spqr
Post Number: 13
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 5:12 pm: |
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When we have had snowstorms in the past like this, it has taken me up to 8 hours to clear my driveway, walkway, etc. This is mostly due to the fact that my house is very close to my neighbor's house (a driveway width apart, let's say), so every shovelful of snow that gets removed from between the two houses needs to be carried the 60 feet to the front or back. Snow blowing presents the same problem - no where to put the snow in between the houses except directly in front of you. This presents the problem of ending up with a 6 foot snow drift in front by the time I reach the end of the house. Given all this, I contracted with a landscaper this year for snow removal. For 6 inches it costs $60. For snowfalls like the one we received this weekend it costs $120. So to recap - cost of snow removal: $120. Knowing that the snow removal guys were on their way when I got home Sunday night from being away this weekend - priceless! Also priceless is the fact that I don't have to stand out in my driveway and flag down some randoms looking for extra work to shovel. I understand that this may seem too much for some posters, but I'm willing to pay that much because I generally don't have 8 spare hours to clear that much snow. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 3730
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 6:12 pm: |
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Kirk - I have to say that I disagree. In the case of snow removal, it will always be cheaper to do it yourself. That is, if you are talking monetary costs. This is one of those things that, unless you are physically incapable, you pay for because of convenience and/or not having to do it yourself.
As Merg said, it's what it's worth to you. I know that, before we split a snow thrower with our neighbor, sometimes I did it myself & sometimes I paid someone. Depended on what they were charging.
I also disagree with the correlation between unskilled labor and compensation. If someone is willing to do a job that "anyone" can do, but "anyone" isn't, they deserve a living wage.
Some would say that people with MBA from Harvard who sit in an office and produce nothing don't deserve what they make. Hell, I don't deserve what I make for what I do. Frankly, there are times I think the cleaning lady who empties my garabge can in my office every night contributes more to the common good than do I.
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DeborahG
Citizen
Username: Deborahg
Post Number: 1172
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 10:14 pm: |
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Two guys knocked on our door and offered to do walkway (about 80 feet), sidewalks, and long driveway with two-car apron for $45. It thought that was a good deal. But as it happened, a fantastically wonderful neighbor who had just gotten a plow attachment for his ride-on mower spent the morning riding around, doing the whole neighborhood for free! Gotta love this town -- actually, the neighbor lives just over the border in West Orange, so gotta love that town as well. |
Michael K. Mc Kell
Citizen
Username: Greenerose
Post Number: 544
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 8:05 am: |
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I would laugh in the face of anyone who wanted to pay me slave wage such as mentioned above. $10-$15 per hour!!!! Double the minimum wage!
My advice to you is do it yourself and then tell me how much you liked it and what your time is worth.
It kills me to think how you can actually even consider it. As I said above, I plow snow and spent 20 hours in my truck over the course of this storm. I can't tell you how many times someone flagged me down to plow their drive way trying to aviod a heart attack doing it themselves. In most cases the big money homes with $200K in vehicles in the way were the cheapest people I've ever met and told them have a nice day. The homes with cars on blocks offered me more $ and coffee.
Hmmmmmm, who has actually work for a living here? I'm not taking shots at anyone on this thread but have to stick up for "Mr. Plow" and those who walk all day in sub zero weather to make a dollar. I was in the same shoes myself when I was a kid right here in South Orange in 1976.
I rely on additional income to insure that I can take care of my family when work is slow.
I apologize if I sound angry and don't want anyone to be offended by my response. But, it has to be said. |
Duncan
Supporter
Username: Duncanrogers
Post Number: 3841
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 10:23 am: |
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Michael, you do sound angry. But for kids walking the street 10-15 bucks an hour is fine. For a grown man like you, no. But the point is how you want to spend your time and money. If you are willing to pay more so you dont have to go out in the cold then great..pay more. If you enjoy getting out in the fresh, albeit, cold air and getting some exercise so that when you are older you are less likely to have that heart attack then more power to you. I am obviously not talking about people who drive plows. When the snowfall is on the weekend the township has to job out the plowing of all the towns streets and let me tell you I saw two trucks in my neighboorhood going back and forth back and forth, beyond just doing a good job clearing the street and venturing into taking the town for all they can get.
Personally we turned down 3 or 4 offers to do it cause my son and wife and I love to bundle up and make it fun...not a chore. It only becomes a chore when the plow comes by and packs it against the end of the driveway. And when we finish we go help the neighbors. Our neighbor across the street took his snowblower up and down the sidewalk for 2 or 3 houses on his side and offered to dig out anyone working with a shovel.
It really is in all about how you want to spend your time and money. It has gotten very easy to pay people to do just about anything for you so you pick and choose what you do and what you pay for. Personally, I want my son to learn that you do for yourself and that work doesn't have to be "work". That it can be fun. It will pay dividends later in life for him, guaranteed.
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mjc
Citizen
Username: Mjc
Post Number: 182
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 11:29 am: |
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Michael, I hope you're getting some well-deserved rest. In the days before we had teen-age boys, there was nothing more welcome on a snow day than to see the guy with the plow coming down the street to clear our driveway.
(drift related to what you said about houses with fancy cars vs. those with cars on blocks: When my husband was researching the effects of stroke on patients' families, he found it was the better off who were more upset about finances; those we'd probably think of as having "nothing" were often more confident, saying "we'll be OK," and always seemed to have time and space to care for the patient in the family.) |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 694
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 12:20 pm: |
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I'm still trying to find someone around here who will give me the deal that my friends on Long Island have. They pay a flat rate of $150 at the beginning of each season, say by November 15. Then they get unlimited snow-plowing for the season, regardless of the amount of snow. Some years they win, some they lose. It's probably a wash over the course of ten years or so and I like the simplicity of it. |
Michael K. Mc Kell
Citizen
Username: Greenerose
Post Number: 547
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 12:45 pm: |
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I'm sorry.... I'm very tired. |
Hillsider
Citizen
Username: Hillsider
Post Number: 7
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 25, 2005 - 3:24 pm: |
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I paid $50 for sidewalk + walkway +1/2 driveway.
Also had them put ice melt all over... there were 3 men doing the work and it took them 20 mins...
IMO, worth it... It would have taken me 2 hours at least... I like shoshannah's idea of a flat fee... like buying snow showelling futures...
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spw784
Supporter
Username: Spw784
Post Number: 640
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 26, 2005 - 3:58 pm: |
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I live in West Orange and we have never shoveled our front sidewalk in the 5 years we've lived here (mainly because none of the surrounding neighbors did, so we didn't). Got a violation notice last night because of it (as did the rest of the neighbors) . Called my landscaper last night to see if he would come over today and snowblow the sidewalk (left a message with his wife). If it has not been done by the time I get home from work today, is there anyone willing to travel to West Orange (near Kessler) to do it? Health reasons prevent me from doing it myself in a timely manner. Private Line me if interested. Thanks! |
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