| Author |
Message |
    
Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 15
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, August 13, 2006 - 7:49 pm: | 
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Yes, I agree. The police spend a lot of time harassing teens who congregate at the train station, and may actually help deter theft (it's not our teens who are stealing our bikes), and not too much time doing something about these robberies.
Tom R., where are there lots of people after hours in Maplewood (for those of us whose jobs don't stop at 5)? Also, it is clear in my case, at any rate, that the thief was a pro. I would imagine that there are regulars who case and hit the train station periodically. Have the police ever made train station bike theft a priority and spent some time undercover, watching the bikes? If so, what did they learn? If not, why not?
If the bike racks are in a spot which makes it easier for bikes to be stolen, maybe we should think about putting the racks somewhere else. Usually when you see bike racks and you have a bike you use them, on the assumption that they wouldn't be there if their use was unsafe. Lastly, if all else fails, let's put up a big warning sign that explains that bike theft is rampant and users are advised to make use of the biggest, best locks they can get, and that even then, there is a high probability that their bikes will be stolen.
I am encouraged by Art's suggestion about the surveillance camera, in conjunction with a sign that lets people know they are being watched. However, we'd better think about how to install the camera so that it doesn't get vandalized. |
tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5488
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, August 13, 2006 - 8:36 pm: |
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True; one of those harassed teens is mine, and he and his friends lock their bikes up there, too. So they do have an interest in keeping their eye on things. |
ken (the other one)
Citizen
Username: Ken
Post Number: 433
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, August 13, 2006 - 10:47 pm: |
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Use the bike rack next to the Police Station. It was put there for the reasons you speak of... |
Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 16
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, August 13, 2006 - 11:48 pm: |
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So what are the other ones for? And what happens when the police station moves? |
mem
Citizen
Username: Mem
Post Number: 6572
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 14, 2006 - 10:53 pm: |
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Why shouldn't we blame the town? We're all paying godawful taxes to it, the least we should have is peace of mind for whatever we do to commute to our jobs. Put a camera there if the cops can't handle it.
Sheesh.
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15316
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2006 - 6:28 pm: |
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Fine, blame the town. Sure, they should prevent all bad things from happening, and the bike owner isn't responsible for anything.
Seriously, I don't mean to say the police can't or shouldn't do anything. Just that if you learn that the bike rack is dangerous, don't keep using it until you know there has been a substantive change.
A bike can be a deeply personal thing. I know this very well. I was devastated each time one of my bikes was stolen. But on the scale of concerns the town faces, I can't claim they should divert a heck of a lot of resources here. Some, yes. But let's put this problem -- as real as it is -- into perspective. Every issue, big and small, looks like an earth-shaking problem on MOL. If everything is urgent, nothing is.
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tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5517
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2006 - 10:28 pm: |
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Hyperbole will get you nowhere. Nobody expects the police to prevent 100% of all crime, though it would be nice. But how many bike thefts have the police broken up? The bike owner is responsible for picking what appears to be an appropriate spot -- like a bike rack on public property -- and locking it up. By all accounts, these crime victims have fulfilled their responsibility. Is there something else you'd like them to be responsible for?
But when the police learn that a particular spot is a prime target for property crime they should give it extra coverage. We shouldn't have to run away every time a bike rack gets dangerous, or a block, or a street, or a neighborhood.
(OK, maybe that's a little hyperbolic, too. But remember the "broken window" model of law enforcement). |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15318
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2006 - 11:59 pm: |
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OK, good points, tom. I certainly buy the broken window point.
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Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 17
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 1:46 am: |
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OK, now this: I got off the late train this evening, about 12:30AM or so. I went to the bike rack where my new used bike (#3) was secured by three locks, including one which cost about half what the bike did. Whew! They worked.
But as I rode off I noticed a guy on a bike just kind of circling around in the street by the bike rack. When he saw me it looked like he rode off. I rode away down the hill then came back up again just as he was coming up again. Maybe he was scoping me out as a thief too. I decided it best to report him, given recent history. So I rode over to our police station, went in and tried to get the attention of the 4 or 5 guys in the back offices on the other side of the windows.
No luck. Everyone was busy doing something. I picked up the phone and got a secretary. I told her I had recently had two bikes stolen from the station and that there was kind of a suspicious guy riding around up there. She said someone would talk to me. Meanwhile the guys just all kept doing what they were doing behind the glass. Some walked around and I thought they were coming to me but they were deep in conversation about something else. After a while I pounded on the glass and a guy gave me a very cross look. Finally he came over and i told him what was up and he said they would have someone check it out. It had taken about 5 minutes or more to get someone's attention. Seemed slow to me. No one else was there.
Is there a bike crime wave underway or not? If so, do the police know? Has anyone ever seen any police presence later at night around the bikes? I haven't and I come home late at least 1 night most weeks. It's not like I don't see police at all. I do see them cruising around town and appreciate it. But If I was going to steal a bike, one technique I'd use is to hang around the station when the trains come in and see what bikes don't get taken, especially after that last train. Any bikes left over are free picking for the night. I suggest that a policeman be at the station for 5 minutes when the later trains arrive. Make everyone feel safer - certainly me. Especially right now, while there's a crime wave.
Again, I apologize for my frustration, but I don't like paying heavy taxes, touting how we encourage things like bike riding, and then when I lose 2 bikes in a few months using the town designated bike rack and discover that the problem is common, nothing can be done. Of course I'm using better locks now, but I'd like my town to take some responsibility, and action, too. (Again, Art I appreciate your camera suggestion and I'll be really happy when it's up and secure and running.)
Just in case the problem is me keeping my mouth shut, I'm going to speak to a detective tomorrow.
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ajc
Citizen
Username: Ajc
Post Number: 5424
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 6:26 am: |
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...I'm going to speak to a detective tomorrow.
Good idea... better idea, the Township Committee will be holding court on Springfield Avenue and Prospect Street this coming Saturday from 9 AM until noon. Why not do both! I didn't bring the subject up at last nights meeting as they planned to have a short meeting and this matter deserves their full attention. As it was, their meeting was over by 8:30 PM, probably one of the shortest on record...
However, I stopped by the station last night after the meeting to check out additional space for more bike racks. Actually, as Joan mentioned there is some space behind the fence on the south side behind the 911 Memorial Tree planting. They would need to black-top the area and put up some additional fence with a gate, but it would make a decent size bike corral as suggested by Jet... Thanks for your follow up Lawnboy. We all need to stay on top of this if we really want anything to get done.
BTW, I noticed the pole behind the Memorial Tree has an eye level open electrical box with the wires just hanging there. Somebody either took it off and forgot to replace it, or some vandals knocked it off???
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eliz
Supporter
Username: Eliz
Post Number: 1677
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 9:22 am: |
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Lawnboy I have to echo ajc's comments. While it's a good idea to speak to a detective your best bet is to speak to the township committee. If I were you I would email Fred Profeta (frp713 @ aol dot com). He's pretty responsive (in my limited experience).
Good luck - I think it sucks. |
tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5518
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 12:02 pm: |
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FWIW, I PL'd Fred and Vic about this earlier, but I'm disappointed to have to say that there's been no response from either of them. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15328
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 12:05 pm: |
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PL'd or emailed? PL isn't as reliable as email.
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tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5520
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 12:11 pm: |
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PL, which may explain it (in which case, I'm disappointed with the PL featyre, as opposed to Fred and Vic). |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15329
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 12:14 pm: |
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It's unreliable only because people stop checking the address with which they registered with MOL. MOL can't do anything about that.
Well, the email can look funny, which could lead someone not to read it. Worse, the email is not replyable. You must click in a special place or take careful note of the address and fill it in when replying. You can reply and think your reply gets back but then learn several days later that you were wrong.
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Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5929
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 1:30 pm: |
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Tom-
I'd try going to the Offical website for the town to email Fred and Vic. Or call Town Hall and ask what address you should use to send them an email. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15330
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 1:32 pm: |
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Township Committee Members
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jet
Citizen
Username: Jet
Post Number: 1184
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 1:48 pm: |
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I've been to the MPD station twice , both times I had the same experience as Lawnboy . Next time I'll be sure to were a hat , sunglasses & gloves . Just to be sure I don't get the invisible civilian act . These guys are getting a new station ? |
tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5528
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 3:31 pm: |
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Maybe if you told them kids were skateboarding there, or someone had a dog off the leash, it might get their attention.
Thanks for the contact info on the TC -- I'll check 'em out. |
Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 18
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2006 - 11:52 pm: |
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Thanks for the contact info and the confirmations that the police were not specifically ignoring me. I've sent my complaints on to the TC. I'll report the results.
By the way, I noticed a broken lock and a lone wheel at the train station this morning. Another one bites the dust. |
Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 19
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 12:04 am: |
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Thanks for the contact info and the confirmations that the police were not specifically ignoring me. I've sent my complaints on to the TC. I'll report the results.
By the way, I noticed a broken lock and a lone wheel at the train station this morning. Another one bites the dust. |
Rebecca Raines
Citizen
Username: Robin_realist
Post Number: 525
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 5:04 am: |
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Lawnboy, been following your story. I'm currently living in The Netherlands: the land of bikes. There are more bikes in Amsterdam than residents. I just wanted to sympathize with your situation. We had both our bikes stolen (from our back door, out of sight of the street) when we lived in Maplewood. I imagine it's even easier to steal a bike from a rack if you can get the lock undone, everyone expects people to go to a bike rack and ride away with a bike. Here there's a saying "spend more on the lock than the bike". Sounds strange and isn't reality, but everyone uses at least two locks: the one that locks the back wheel and a separate cable lock through the wheel and frame attached to a fixture like a pole. Most people also have really cruddy looking bikes that are oiled and in perfect condition, but you can't tell by looking. No real advice here, just sympathy. Good luck. R |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12416
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 7:56 am: |
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Bike theft has been going on for ever at the train station A neighbor when we first moved here in 1979 lost his "Pee Wee Herman" special there in the first month he started to ride to the station. I can't count the times that I have seen new, nice Canondales, Giants, etc. show up and then disappear in a week or so.
Art should be complimented on trying to put a camera covering the racks.
Unfortunately bike theft is so common around Maplewood, it really doesn't get anyone, other than Lawnboy, all that excited anymore. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15346
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 7:59 am: |
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bobk, are you saying it's an insoluble problem? Or are you merely saying that the problem is old and no one has addressed it yet?
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Ken Scout
Citizen
Username: Lightningken
Post Number: 148
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 8:18 am: |
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Guys involved in bike theft (particularly thefts requiring chain cutting, etc) are most certainly involved in other illecit activity. A camara would go a long way to making inroads into crime rings by photographing criminals and forumulating a log.
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Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12418
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 8:37 am: |
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It is impossible to have a police officer stationed there 24/7. I think the best solution is a camera, of the type discussed here a few months ago. However, there are a lot of people who view crime prevention using cameras a civil rights issue.
Better a thousand criminals go free than someone gets photographed scratching their butt.
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Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5962
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2006 - 7:20 pm: |
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i'm wondering if South ORange has the same problem with bike thefts at the station. I haven't heard they have. Does anyone know? |
Lawnboy
Citizen
Username: Lawnboy
Post Number: 20
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 12:08 am: |
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I sent my web posts to the TC, and got a call from Ken Pettis who assures me that after speaking with the police chief there has been no increase in theft, actually a decrease. Which means 2 bikes stolen in 3 months (probably more, those are just my thefts) is normal, or even better than normal. I guess compared to murders or house breaking they are minor crimes. But it still doesn't seem like a very good record to me. What it means is someone is casing the bikes regularly, awaiting some sucker who doesn't lock up correctly or uses a crappy lock. I guess you could consider that normal, but it's still disturbing.
Ken does say the police will be more of a presence at the station in the future, checking both sides rather than just the town side. He also advises if you ever face a situation like I did, when I went to the police station to report a mysterious guy at the train station and the police were disinclined to notice me waiting outside their window, you should call the chief.
He says putting up a camera pointing at the bike racks will be difficult since it is on NJT property. In fact, he says even putting up a poster warning riders of the risks in using the rack is NG because if the town issues a warning about one thing, then they can be sued for anything that might cause harm that they didn't issue a warning about. As I said to Ken, I never want to be in a place where I am unable to do something to help because I might get in trouble for not thinking of every possible way someone could be at risk or in danger. But Ken doesn't really think warning riders about the risks involved in using the station bike racks is necessary anyway -- that is, it's not the town's job. User beware. Maybe that's true. But I see the flimsy locks a lot of people use and know the risk they are taking. Why not tell them? Isn't that the Mayberry neighborly thing to do? I would have appreciated it. The more I mull it over the more upsetting I find it. When fear of litigation overides what I consider common decency it is a bad sign to me.
I did come up with one temporary solution, which you will see on the train station bulletin board, unless someone takes it down.
I'd like to appear at a TC meeting. Just to put a human face and voice on the non-crime wave. When are the meetings?
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Dreamer
Citizen
Username: Dreamingguy88
Post Number: 9
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 12:54 am: |
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okay. there was a question about SO bike thefts. and last year my bike was stolen from south orange. it was stolen with about 6 other bikes at the same time. i went to the police station to file a report when they told me that a bike owner was returning to his bike when he encountered someone attempting to steal his bike. after a brief encounter the attempted bike thieves apperantly rode off but a greater majority of them were caught when the police took off. unfortunately enough for me i wasn't one of the lucky bike owners who was able to recieve his bike back.
about a year later my friend got his bike stolen in front of us. it was at underhill field in maplewood right behind an ELEMENTARY SCHOOL (CLINTON). We were on the field and just crossed over the fence recently when two guys came up to the bike and rode off. they came with one bike and the other theif took his. we gave the hardest chase nearly catching the two theives whom were on bikes and was possibly a foot away from us when fatigue and unpleasent running conditions (construction by the fence which we had to jump over in a heart beat.) struck. one friend had to stop the chase pretty early but another and i continued to follow for nearly all of garfield headed to boyden. as the situation progessed I reached maplewood police depart. on my cell.
the operator who picked up took atleast two minutes to actually send a call to local police to meet up with us. i gave her every single piece of information needed from description of situation and location to description of suspects. it was also understood by the operator when she confirmed with me on what i had told her. the police took five minutes to get to us. to me that was ridiculous. the kids were not very fast on the bikes and would have been easy to catch had the police who came to our assistance took our directions and followed suit. instead they asked for our information and for our friend's (the owner of the bike and fatigued runner) location. two cop cars. one regular police car with sirens and such and another buick unmarked car took us in their back seat (as if we were the criminals) to go pick up the owner and return to the crime scene. after filing a report at origin the police told us they would search for our described suspects...
the police couldn't have handled that any better....
entire situation and description given easily understandable and as a whole over the phone while following suit of suspects. five minute gap after hanging up phone with MPD and the first squad car appearence. putting victims in back of car to goto crime scene when suspects on bikes were possibly close enough to continue suit even when police were given directions as to which streets the theives had followed. a twenty minute gap after incident and the police reassured us that they would start a search. all taking place close enough to newark and irvington for police report to not matter.
that day it seemed to me that maplewood police (some not all, because i have met some, by that i mean two, good police officers here) might not care about bike thefts and the clinton elementary school area in general.
btw i recently bought a new bike from the maplewood bike auction and my bike came with its old lock still on it. i went to the fire department and they told me as easily as they showed me that a bike theif needs a pair of bolt cutters and in about a second they can cut off almost any expandable lock (the type with a combo and wrap around bikes and bike racks). I went out and bought myself a U lock which can't be cut at the tip of the lock as easily because the most vulnerable part of the lock is actually the strip right before the lock, the combo area for which the original lock had. |
Dreamer
Citizen
Username: Dreamingguy88
Post Number: 10
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 1:00 am: |
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only two bike thefts in three months? for some reason that descirption sounds more then inaccurate but fabricated. not maybe from your spokesman/town politician but possibly the 'cheif'. whomever it may have been the accuracy of that report seems to have a large margin for error. |
Ken Scout
Citizen
Username: Lightningken
Post Number: 150
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 3:19 pm: |
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I highly doubt that LB and I are the only two thefts this summer. I know that I submitted a full police report on my second theft, which took place this summer. |
kap
Citizen
Username: Kap
Post Number: 261
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 3:57 pm: |
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A slight correction to Lawnboy's post. I did not say that there had been only 2 bike thefts in three months at the train station this year. What I did say is that police records show a decrease in all catagories of crime in the township this year and that would include larceny (under which bike theft is catagorized). Speaking specifically to the issue of bike theft at the train station, Chief Cimino told me that there has not been any spike in reported crimes at that location. I have no reason to doubt his statement.
Ken Pettis |
Joan
Supporter
Username: Joancrystal
Post Number: 8125
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 4:16 pm: |
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Ken:
Does that mean that bike thefts at the train station are a long standing problem or that bike thefts at the train station are less of a problem than this thread would seem to indicate? |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15385
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 4:26 pm: |
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A third possibility, Joan, is that bike thefts are at a steady rate and the police or TC (or both) don't see this as a serious problem.
I'm sorry for the tone I spoke with recently. I should not belittle this problem. I am not lucky enough to commute by train. If I were, I would like the ability to cycle to the train without needing to worry about my bike's safety.
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kap
Citizen
Username: Kap
Post Number: 262
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 9:16 pm: |
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Joan:
I see detailed, monthly reports on criminal activity in town. I also speak to the chief on a regular basis. In response to your question, my take is the latter.
kap |
Joan
Supporter
Username: Joancrystal
Post Number: 8134
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2006 - 7:27 am: |
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Ken:
Thanks for the clarification. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12453
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2006 - 7:43 am: |
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I suspect many of the bike thefts at the station are never reported to the police. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15408
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2006 - 7:57 am: |
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I suspect bobk is right.
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Joan
Supporter
Username: Joancrystal
Post Number: 8137
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2006 - 8:02 am: |
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How can the police and the TC react to the problem of bike theft if these thefts are not reported? If your bike is stolen, you should definitely report it. Even if your own bike is not recovered, you may be helping others in the future who won't lose their bikes because of your action. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12456
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2006 - 8:11 am: |
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While this may have changed, in the past people tended to have "station" bikes picked up at garage sales and at the police auction for commuting.
I am not a bike expert, but looking at the racks this morning I saw a lot of bright, shiny Mongooses, Giants, Specialized, etc. mountain bikes. This is a change. |
Earlster
Supporter
Username: Earlster
Post Number: 1603
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Friday, August 25, 2006 - 4:38 pm: |
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This is part of the bike parking at the train station in Heidelberg, Germany. The sheer number of bikes makes it a lot less likely that ones bike is stolen. Kind of while it is safe to park your car. There are so many that the odds that yours gets stolen are a lot lower. |
KRNL
Citizen
Username: Krnl
Post Number: 125
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 25, 2006 - 5:58 pm: |
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How many bikes are sold at the police auction? While likely not from the train station, these bikes are an indice of how under-reported bike theft is in the township.
And, how many bikes reported stolen are recovered and returned to the owners?
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 15452
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, August 25, 2006 - 6:06 pm: |
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I've been to a few of the police auctions. A very rough guess is 50 bikes are sold.
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Ink
Citizen
Username: Pageturner
Post Number: 145
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, August 26, 2006 - 12:58 pm: |
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Just to add to the sad bike theft story (this in South Orange) - not only did my lovely bike get stolen from our yard this summer, but my daughter's bike (they were nice enough to take off the training wheels!), and then the f'ers came back a few weeks later and took her scooter. Her bike was like a pink ruffled parasol - exremely girly - her godmother had gotten it for her at a charity auction. I know the solution is to get a beat up unappealing old bike, but I haven't had the heart yet(and yes I reported it to the police.) |
Tuscan Papa
Citizen
Username: Tuscanpapa
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, September 7, 2006 - 8:33 am: |
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Why doesn't the MPD get themselves a nice Tommasini with a Campy record groupo and stake the bloody thing out? After a month or so, the perps will be caught, or at least the MO familiar. The notion of creating a covered corral, off to the side of the station, seems a bit too "government bureaucrat" to me. Study the problem first, because in all likelyhood there is no problem with the current location. There is clearly however a problem with the policing not being done. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 12604
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, September 7, 2006 - 6:30 pm: |
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I think the train station is under the juristiction of the NJ Transit Police. |
