| Author |
Message |
    
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 3532
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 5:28 pm: | 
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I drove past the new Livingston Town Center today & it looks like it will be opening imminently. According to the website of one retailer there (http://www.freshcity.com/) the Grand Opening is March 29th.
As I recall, demolition & construction began in Spring 2004 & the site will open in Spring 2006.
They even have a jazzy website about the property & the retailers that will be there: http://www.livingstontowncenter.com/
Cool! |
AntoninaKC
Citizen
Username: Antoninakc
Post Number: 201
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 6:26 pm: |
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Your right! that IS a jazzy website! I cant wait to see this place in person. |
Suzanne Ng
Citizen
Username: Suzanneng
Post Number: 663
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 6:31 pm: |
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Some stores are already open -- I think the eyeglass place, and another store. |
AntoninaKC
Citizen
Username: Antoninakc
Post Number: 203
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 7:39 pm: |
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Anyone see the homes or condos? Very nice.. Any idea of the price range? |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 474
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 8:50 pm: |
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Its amazing what they have done in a location which doesn't even have the train line. Look at the retailer they have recruited. It shows what professionals can do. I don't know whether to be envious of them or so angry at our elected officials for failing us all these years and putting their chips on a bunch of novice developers who don't know what they are doing. There has never been a cohesive vision and strategy for the town. Calabrese keeps talking of his vision. I think it is better characterized as a hallucination. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 4320
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:11 pm: |
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Antonic
Condos begin at $699,999
Townhouses begin at $839,900
Village Homes begin at $1,023,9000 |
AntoninaKC
Citizen
Username: Antoninakc
Post Number: 205
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:16 pm: |
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Jeez.. sounds like highway robbery.
Where did you find those?? |
peteglider
Citizen
Username: Peteglider
Post Number: 1859
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:19 pm: |
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The village DOES NOT develop -- developers do -- in the case of Livingston Center:
"the Eastman Management Corporation of Livingston, Jacobs Enterprises of Clifton and the Roseland Property Company of Short Hills"
Also note --
**the planning took YEARS
**the project (as initially designed) was not economically viable so was expanded (sound familiar? Millennium wants more, too - and it suggests that the Beifus and Sayid are small potatoes developments that will never do that well)
**retail space is NOT for local merchants, but national chains (e.g., Mom & Pops are simply not stable long term)
--
The nearly 14-acre, $60 million project, to be completed by 2006, will be built under a redevelopment plan township officials adopted in 2002 after years of planning, debate and legal wrangling over the future of the strategic site.
Jerry Rockoff, who handles the New Jersey market at the Manhattan retail brokerage firm of Robert K. Futterman, added that the project was in an area where demand for retail space had remained strong and rents had held steady. He said it also reflected ''the resurgence of downtowns,'' a trend in the last five years during which occupancy of retail space has been evolving from local merchants to more regional and even national tenants as consumers prefer to walk to shops in their own towns rather than drive to enclosed malls.
Livingston Town Center will have up to 14 stores, each with 700 to 6,000 square feet of space... the space would be marketed to retailers not now in Livingston.
Getting to this point has not been easy. After years of seeing the old plaza steadily deteriorate and worrying over its impact on the town's aesthetics, local officials in 2000 declared the plaza site an area in need of redevelopment. The owners filed a lawsuit against the township that resulted in an out-of-court settlement two years later.
The plaza's owner and town officials agreed on the current redevelopment plan and area, which grew to its present size from 3.8 acres, as well as on the developer group.
...the project...also calls for 17 single-family homes to ring the property and buffer the residential neighborhood beyond.
There will also be 24 condominium apartments and 73 town houses. Residences are expected to range in price from $300,000 to $1 million....
In my opinion the mistake made in SO is to designate home grown, amateur developers, on small scale projects -- rather than bringing in experienced, well backed retail and residential developers.
Pete |
Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1505
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:25 pm: |
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By way of information, only the retail space was piloted. None of the residential was piloted.
Also interesting is that on the website, proximity to the N.Y. train is mentioned as a plus. Guess which train station. |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1413
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:37 pm: |
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Spitz, that is a key point -- South Orange should have no more PILOTs for residential space. It just isn't necessary. |
Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1506
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:45 pm: |
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Absolutely! |
J. Crohn
Supporter
Username: Jcrohn
Post Number: 2412
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 10:17 pm: |
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Folks, I checked out the Livingston Town Center link above, looked through the site, and clicked on the "Tour" link. Immediately, my Norton Internet Security blocked an attempted attack on my computer. The report:
Attempted Intrusion "Apple QuickTime and ITunes Overflow" against your machine was detected and blocked.
Intruder: www.livingstontowncenter.com(66.241.238.23)(http(80)).
Risk Level: High.
Protocol: TCP.
Attacked IP: localhost.
...
You can get detailed information about this attack at Symantec Security Response. (http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/nis_ids/)
Not a nice list. |
Dave
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 8884
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 10:27 pm: |
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Yeah, the developers got what they paid for. A site that will be on search engine blacklists for years. Hope they used better materials in the actual construction.  |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 4324
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 12:01 am: |
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I didn't have a problem with the link. I use Norton too. Now that I've read the posts in this thread, I'm going to run a scan. |
Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 10941
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 7:33 am: |
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Good heavens, there are only 70,000 square feet of retail. I thought the original concept was to build a downtown area in a town that doesn't really have one.
In the end my impression is that they have built a residential community with a small strip shopping center on premises.
Guess things just had to morph to make it an economical deal.
Crabby Bob |
Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2595
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 9:25 am: |
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The message J Crohn got is not necessarily indicative of a real threat, just poor site design.
Antonia, those are not atypical prices for the area. Not highway robbery - just a hot housing market. |
mrosner
Citizen
Username: Mrosner
Post Number: 2674
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 10:26 am: |
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Spitz: Although the PILOT was only for the commercial portion, the property for the residential portion was sold at a steep discount to the developer. The extra acreage is what made the deal work because that allowed them to build the residential component.
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Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1514
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 10:32 am: |
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Beifus really got a steep discount - he already owned the property. (I know you voted against the pilot for Beifus,in large part because of this )  |
mrosner
Citizen
Username: Mrosner
Post Number: 2675
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 10:47 am: |
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PILOT's are supposed to be a tool to help attract development and developers to help make a project economically feasible. In Livingston's case, they could not find a developer to take on the project (And remember they started looking in 1995) until they agreed to a PILOT and discounted property.
Like them or not, every town in Essex county plans to use them so very few developers will consider building without a PILOT (or similar abatement). In our case they actually helped our bottom line (each taxpayer) because we share a school system with Maplewood. Same can't be said for Livingston or Montclair - two towns that also have used PILOT agreements. OF course, if/when Maplewood uses a PILOT agreement, then it will balance it out again.
And of course, one day the county will stop approving PILOT agreements - expect that to happen next time they have a major budget crunch.
The real thing to remember is we can use a PILOT to attract the type of development we want in place NOT THE DEVELOPER's VISION. |
Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1515
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 10:55 am: |
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Mark - As you know, others have spoken highly of you in the other thread. I share their opinion. On the subject of pilots, you're the one public official that I would listen to if you said a pilot was necessary. I think you, more than any other official, really understand them and if they are absolutely necessary.
Having said that, I would hope they would not be needed or used for residential projects, particulary where the units are for sale units. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 4329
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 - 11:08 am: |
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Ant-
This is the link I got the information from
http://www.print2webcorp.com/news/njcom/StarLedger-RealEstate/20050508/p06.asp
You think that's bad, the ones being built on Northfield cost more. |
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