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Message |
    
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 61
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 30, 2006 - 10:28 am: | 
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I noticed this morning that the old Blue Moon sign is coming down and the new Village Diner sign is being put up. I wish our new business all the best and I am so happy to see the final remains of the Blue Moon gone! I will be supporting our newest establishment and I hope the entire town comes out to show their support as well! |
composerjohn
Citizen
Username: Composerjohn
Post Number: 806
Registered: 8-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, March 30, 2006 - 10:42 am: |
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When is the grand opening?
PS: concerning your thread title, it's spelled "positive" (with an "i") |
Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 367
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, March 30, 2006 - 11:13 am: |
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CJ: Are you posetive about that?
Jeep: A much needed addition to town - we are excited for its opening as well. |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 536
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Friday, March 31, 2006 - 4:41 pm: |
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I wonder what happened to the old sign. My recollection was that these signs used to be paid 50% by the business owner and 50% from funds from the South Orange cedit card from which the town dervied revenue. I think that credit card is now defunct, but I am curious about whether these signs are paid from the public trough. With the turnover in businesses, there must be a garage full of them. There was Stoney Hill Creamery, Sweet Apples and Pears, now Blue Moon Diner. I'm trying to think if there were others. They are kinda folk-artsy, not at all Tau-dry. |
Elaine Harris
Citizen
Username: Elaineharris
Post Number: 137
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, April 2, 2006 - 11:00 pm: |
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To add to the list: Java Cafe and Sloan Street Emporium. Can anyone else add to the list? |
Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1643
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, April 2, 2006 - 11:02 pm: |
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Suki's |
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 63
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 9:57 am: |
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Jay Jay for you information the sign for the new diner was paid 100% by the owner. They used to be funded 50% by mainstreet.
Now also for your negative information. The blue moon diner sign is the original sign and has been hanging there since the diner opened some 10 years ago. I think Cait and Abbey has been there for the same if not longer amount of time. The sign on Starbucks is the second the remax is the first the Urben femme is the second the dry cleaner is the first the cold stone is the 3rd. Now these are the only signs of their type in the town and there are only in total 4 that have been removed in the 10 year or so that is hardly a garage full.
So Jay Jay your negative comments are incorrect.
Elaine, Spitz please take a stroll through town and look at the condition of some of the signs. There should be an ordinance to make everyone buy this sign. Sloan street is a model that every business owner should have to follow.
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jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 64
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 10:07 am: |
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And Jay Jay for your information the Sloan Strret emporiam sign was removed because the owner closed the business because She had cancer and sadly has passed. So before you say such negative things get your facts together. |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 548
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 10:31 am: |
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Jeep-
Speaking of facts, there have been 6 signs listed so far, not 4. And one was not on a Sloan St. business. And no one is being negative or maligning anyone who closed due to illness. It is simply my attempt to understand how things are financed and the line between private and public monies. I wish the new diner owners well and hope they flourish. That has nothing to do though with what I was asking. |
Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 376
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 10:49 am: |
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Jeep: I agree that the Sloan Street building facade should be a model for the other downtown buildings. However, as posted many times before, many of the other building/store owners have no interest in improving the way their exteriors look. We have some pretty dilapidated store fronts in town, like Yeva Salon and Neelam's that I wish would be improved. |
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 65
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:05 am: |
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Jay Jay this is what you said -With the turnover in businesses, there must be a garage full of them. That sounds negative to me.
Well John I agree but what is Main Street doing or the Chamber Of commerce doing to help these businesses?
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jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 549
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:13 am: |
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Look, let's be honest here. The primary responsibility is on the business owners. The Chamber and Main Street can do some things, like create collaborative events between merchants or represent the collective interests of the merchants, but they cannot make a business successful per se in my opinion. The owners must have reasonable business plans, attractive facades, the right product offerings, friendly and helpful personnel, good customer service, etc. And unfortunately, many of our businesses fall down on one or more of these. Look at stores in Westfield or Summit. They get it, and I don't think they have a Main Street organization, or rely on their Chamber for success. |
Spitz
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1644
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:16 am: |
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jeep - I agree with you that Sloan St should be a model for other businesses. I was simply responding to what businesses are no longer there. Suki's moved to Millburn and I think it's no longer there.
I'm looking forward to the new Village Diner. I have no doubt it will be a success. |
Elaine Harris
Citizen
Username: Elaineharris
Post Number: 138
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:23 am: |
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Jeep, you are asking me to take a stroll and look at signs? Why? Am I responsible for the condition of signs? No doubt, the wooden signs you refer to are very attractive and add to the beauty of the downtown, and they are not just on Sloan Street, they are in many locations. However, you said "there should be an ordinance to make everyone buy this sign?" Why? Are we incapable of originality? or creativity? or self-reliance? or individualism? Are we the "Stepford Wives" of the business world? I would like you to explain why you believe that "Sloan Street is a model that every business owner should have to follow." Have to? Are we communists? I have been in many other towns, take Maplewood for example, and there are multiple examples of beautiful signs that are not cookie cutter the same. Why do you think everyone has to look alike? And why did you accuse JayJay of negative information? It was simply information and I fail to see where the negativity enters. I suppose to follow your logic, we should all have the same opinion, too. } |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 53
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:57 am: |
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Jay Jay,
If the businesses in Summit or Westfield are successful it's because the residents of the town shop there. South Orange has a reputation for shopping elsewhere.
If I were going to build a business in this town I'd be leary after reading these posts. For instance, people are buying cabinetry online and even in other states. I bet lots of people from this area loved going to Expo to "shop." Now that it's gone lots of people miss it, but did they buy there?
Even though I have wholesale accounts with manufacturers, I made it my business to buy from Expo as well as other merchants in the immediate area.
Just an aside to those people buying cabinetry online--call one of these manufacturer's whose product you've bought online, they will tell you they only service product bought from a bricks and mortar displaying showroom.
BTW What kinds of "right product offerings" are you referring to. Maybe some propective business owners would like to know. |
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 66
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 11:58 am: |
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Personally Elaine I think you need to take a chill pill and not attack me so quickly.
Sloan street is a total success story. The landlord has standards that are obviously working. As a business model Sloan Street represents a collection of businesses that have accepted the standards that are set by the landlord (The communist leader as you have pointed out) and have proven to work. And quite honestly Elaine you asking me to explain why Sloan Street is a model that every business should follow just tells me you know absolutely nothing about what it takes to make a successful business community. And there is nothing wrong with that. You are obviously a very bright person and I am sure you could learn. When you walk through town regardless if you like it or not when you get to Sloan street you realize that this is the pulse of the town. It is working.
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jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 67
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 12:09 pm: |
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Jay Jay you are 100% correct it is up to the business owner to run a business properly. Main Street and Chamber are only there to help. And as far as Westfield go I believe there is a Management group for the town funded by a SID. So perhaps a SID should be put in place? Good idea! |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1467
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 1:49 pm: |
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Kitchenguru, to answer your question, I tried to buy at Expo. But when they told me I should take a day off work and come back on a weekday if I needed customer service, I wrote them off forever. (In my case I haven't bought online, I've just failed to do the work!) |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 54
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 5:57 pm: |
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My point is we can't compare our town to upscale communities who demonstrate they are willing to spend their money in town. That's what attracted those businesses to the town. The buying habits of the people. |
Elaine Harris
Citizen
Username: Elaineharris
Post Number: 141
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 6:30 pm: |
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Jeep, please note that I did not call the Landlord a communist. How did you ever twist my words to that result? If anything, he is the ultimate capitalist. We were talking about signage, that's all, just signage, and I meant "communism" as a metaphor for the idea of a governmentally mandated sign conformity among all business owners, i.e. lack of individualism, which you were advocating. You weren't attacked, but you were challenged, and you obviously have a low tolerance for that. I never called any one particular person a communist. If every store front in our community had the same style sign, it would look ticky tacky. The carved wooden signs are very nice, but there are other ways to make beautiful signs, and I would not want to live in a community where everyone had to be the same. I like individualism and creativity. |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 550
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 7:06 pm: |
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Kitchenguru-
You said: "If the businesses in Summit or Westfield are successful it's because the residents of the town shop there. South Orange has a reputation for shopping elsewhere." I have to take issue here. Plenty of people shop in Cait & Abby's from South Orange and other towns as well. They deliver a great product in a good location, nice people and service and a great aroma when you walk in. Why wouldn't someone shop there? Lots of people go to the Carvel, and Cafe Arugula, Mail Boxes Etc., and so on. You can't say South Orange residents have a reputation for not shopping here. That's a copout by businesses who haven't delivered what the residents want, and so are struggling. If you build the better mousetrap, they will come. But if you are the GM of businesses in South Orange, instead of the Honda or Toyota, its a matter of time before you fold.
I think the better question to postulate is why the type of businesses you find in Summit and Westfield choose not to locate here. While this may be a delicate topic, I think it has to do with our location next to Newark. Will a store owner risk safety, whether actual or perceived, if he has other locations to choose from? This should be an issue Main Street might want to address. Sit with successful business owners in other communities and find out what the impediment is to locationg in South Orange. Its something the BOT should tackle head on, instead of fooling around with sculptures, and dubious accounting practices. Let them do something to really foster an environment where great businesses choose to locate. |
Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 377
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 7:26 pm: |
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I think the key to a successful downtown is to not only get the support from local residents but from people living in other towns as well. South Orange is a small community and no matter how much the residents come out to support its town ulitmately the downtown will need help from the outside. We spend as much money as possible in town - but there are many types of businesses not located here. As a result we are forced to go elsewhere.
jayjay: I do not think crime is as much of an issue as parking is/will be. Other towns are fighting the parking issue, i.e. Montclair (and that's with two new parking decks). I think a prospective retailer would look at the Village and say, "So where are my customers going to park." |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 56
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 8:22 pm: |
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JayJay
Buying habits are tracked. The types of businesses you are speaking of research their markets and locate accordingly. I find parking to be less of an issue here than Maplewood or Millburn. I rather shop here. I just discovered the shoe repair and custom leather goods store next to Mailbox etc.,Center Shoe.
I went in to buy some shoe polish and they polished my shoes, made suggestions on how to maintain them and wouldn't hear of charging me. I took six pairs there the next day for repair and plan to get a custom purse. On the other hand, I went to a restaurant which will remain unnamed for the fourth time and had an awful meal--wrong wine,scorched inedible food. I assumed since all the other times it was great, that they were having a bad night and because it is my town I will go back again.
Would you care to elaborate on the security issues in town, since I am not aware of any. I have been here for several years. |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1469
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 3, 2006 - 9:39 pm: |
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Jayjay, the lack of Westfield type stores has much more to do with the proximity of the Short Hills Mall. (Note that Summit and Morristown have both recently lost their historic downtown department stores also).
Gap and Banana Republic just aren't going to set up competing stores here. Whole Foods went in where one of the local department stores used to be. The Saks location in Springfield (across the street from Short Hills) has been empty for about 10 years and has yet to hit "coming soon" status".
I'm eager to continue to add restaurants and unique stores like The Orange Tree. But I don't delude myself into thinking that we can make our downtown, a few miles from two malls and without easy highway access, into another Westfield. Honestly, I think continued development as a restaurant strip, with a mix of service stores and boutiqes, is probably our best bet for downtown renewal. |
Kitchenguru
Citizen
Username: Kitchenguru
Post Number: 57
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 9:22 am: |
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There are a stunning plethora of reasons why our downtown looks the way it does. The Westfield model is a real reach, I think we will settle for just having stores period(ie Maplewood). |
JoRo
Citizen
Username: Autojoe51
Post Number: 95
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 10:09 am: |
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What about contracting with a new firm to inject some fresh thinking into the equation. Based on quick a search of recent AIA award winners:
http://www.som.com/
http://www.goodyclancy.com/
http://www.hillier.com
(Resources for planning help)
http://www.planning.org
http://www.pps.org/
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jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 72
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 10:42 am: |
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Jay Jay you are off the wall. You think the reason businesses do not open in out town because we are next to Newark? We have many nice businesses in our town.
sporting goods store, several clothing stores, many restaurants, gift store, toy store, candle store, Starbucks, Coldstone, bakery, frame shop, Fine art store, pharmacies, rite aid, shoe repair, banks, nail salon, beauty parlor, barber shop, florist, home store....an on. Where do you get your information? Do you support the local businesses? I think you need to re discover your town. |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 556
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 10:59 am: |
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Jeep-
We also have many businesses in town which look awful, which is not something you find in a Westfield and Summit. I, for one, would like to know why? I postulated one reason why many more upscale businesses choose not to locate here despite a demograhpic which would support them. There are likely others, like the lack of parking, unreasonable landlords, etc. I think its something Main Street and the BOT's should investigate. We all want a vibrant successful downtown and we don't have that now. |
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 73
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 11:12 am: |
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In your opinion which businesses look terrible? |
Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 379
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 4, 2006 - 12:39 pm: |
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Yeva Salon's window, Hunan Garden's decades old window soda cans, Neelam's awnings, Texas Weiners' gyro lady, etc.
I, too, have a hard time with stores and landlords who do not take care of their store fronts. |
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