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Message |
    
Howard Levison
Citizen
Username: Levisonh
Post Number: 541
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 7:12 am: | 
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Through an OPRA request I have obtained details to the original cost of the Gazebo ($30,000), Fountain ($40,000) and miscellaneous items ($30,000 estimated) destined currently to the dump.
The purchase order authorizing fabrication of Tau was issued on 3/10/06 ($100,400). So the clock is ticking to have the sculpture base completed within six months and the destruction of the Gazebo unless there are other plans. |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 3839
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 7:55 am: |
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Howard,
When was the gazebo & fountain purchased & installed? |
Soparents
Citizen
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 132
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 7:59 am: |
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I thought the cost of fabrication was $90,000? What is the other $10,400 for? |
Harvard A. Ganiff
Citizen
Username: Parkingsux
Post Number: 382
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 8:02 am: |
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The mailing stamp for the purchase order? |
Howard Levison
Citizen
Username: Levisonh
Post Number: 543
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 8:17 am: |
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MHD, the spreadsheet for the total project ($1,656,877.24) was signed off on 3/8/99. |
Soparents
Citizen
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 133
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 8:34 am: |
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Yes, I know postage rates went up in January, but not that much...
Is that extra 10,400 towards the fabrication and if so why? I heard that that part of the project was 85,000 then I saw posted that it was 90,000. If it isn't for the fabrication then what is it for? |
dgm
Citizen
Username: Dgm
Post Number: 294
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 8:44 am: |
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Why don't we stop obsessing on Tau and start obsessing on bonded expenditures and tax abatements and PILOTS on this site. We missed you guys when the gaslight commons was going in. |
SOSully
Citizen
Username: Sullymw
Post Number: 1225
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 9:07 am: |
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oh, this just keeps getting better....$100,000 just thrown away! |
Bailey
Citizen
Username: Baileymac
Post Number: 215
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 9:11 am: |
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The Gazebo would look great near the duck pond! |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 4631
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 9:22 am: |
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Why did the BOT not wait when they knew there were so many people speaking out against the money being spent on this? |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 3840
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 9:27 am: |
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JTA,
Because for 4 years, they have been falsely telling the public the money was coming from a GRANT, so there weren't "so many people speaking out against" this.
Now that the TRUTH has come out, you are absolutely correct that this should be revisited.
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Josh Holtz
Citizen
Username: Jholtz
Post Number: 386
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 9:35 am: |
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Hey ... if there are no plans for the gazebo I could probably use it in my backyard. Who should I contact for this request? |
Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 505
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 12:10 pm: |
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See thats the type of thing that makes me think someone or...or multiple people in the town government are embezzling thousands |
Shanabana
Citizen
Username: Shanabana
Post Number: 298
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 4:33 pm: |
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It's a terrible ida to put the Tao there. Why not in front of SOPAC? |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 327
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 4:36 pm: |
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Glock:
That would be wrong.
jd |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 4634
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 4:47 pm: |
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MHD
I'm aware of the bull they've been feeding us from the beginning. If it wasn't for you and the others that uncovered the truth and have been persistent in first asking for answers, then demanding them when none were given, none of us would have know the truth. After you exposed the truth and people, now aware of what was really going on came forward asking to please reconsider spending the taxpayers money, the BOT shouldn't have gone ahead with anything without first listening to the public.
According to what Howard posted "he purchase order authorizing fabrication of Tau was issued on 3/10/06." This was AFTER a number of people passionately spoke against tax money being spent. Some of those speaking were torn because while they would love to see Tau, they knew at this time we just can't afford it.
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Rastro
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 2820
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 7:48 pm: |
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Shanabana,
Calabrese and Tayor said that that WAS in front of SPOAC. Didn't you know that most people are expected to come to SOPAC through the unerpass, and not by parking in the ... parking lot right in front of it? |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 569
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 8:32 pm: |
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I think the sculpture people should include the cost of the items they are having removed from the site as part of the project cost. Afterall, they are lost assets. Plus there are no plans to dis-assemble the gazebo and relocate it. The only line item is "demolition". I think its toast once the bulldozers show up. |
Matt Foley
Citizen
Username: Mattfoley
Post Number: 630
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 7, 2006 - 10:36 pm: |
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Erin Cartman
Citizen
Username: Carnac
Post Number: 50
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 2:38 am: |
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That picture comes up really small on my screen. What is it a picture of? |
Pdg
Citizen
Username: Pdg
Post Number: 837
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 7:52 am: |
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Howard, thank you! I find this info very relevant!
So, am I right to understand that the gazebo and fountain were not yet installed as of 3/8/99? I think I recall that some on the BOT tried to blow off a question regarding the past costs of funding of the gazebo as insignificant since it was installed "12 years ago." By my math, it was less than 7 years ago.
Do you know whether a bond was issued to pay for this project and what the term was?
You mentioned the "cost" of the gazebo, fountain and other misc. items were a total of $100,000. Are the trees that they plan to replaced with "ginko" trees included in this total?
Also, the Tau fabrication itself is projected to only be $85,000 (although it seems like it will be over $100K per your figures), yet the total cost of the project is $410,000. Most of the costs are in site prep and installation.
Does the $100,000 for the gazebo/fountain include all costs for installation and prep that you are aware of?
Again, thanks very much for bringing this information to light!
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joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 330
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 1:48 pm: |
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what prep?
the site is there, and metal is heavier than air.
it will not float.
neither will our bonds.
jd |
Howard Levison
Citizen
Username: Levisonh
Post Number: 546
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 5:50 pm: |
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PDG:
So, am I right to understand that the gazebo and fountain were not yet installed as of 3/8/99? I think I recall that some on the BOT tried to blow off a question regarding the past costs of funding of the gazebo as insignificant since it was installed "12 years ago." By my math, it was less than 7 years ago.
All I can tell is that the final payment was made on 3/8/99. I assume that the project had been completed prior to that date.
Do you know whether a bond was issued to pay for this project and what the term was?
Yes:
OFFICIAL PROCEEDINGS OF THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE TOWNSHIP OF SOUTH ORANGE VILLAGE SPECIAL MEETING, MARCH 8, 1999
#99-5 - Bond Ordinance Providing for Capital Improvements in and by the Township of South Orange Village, in the County of Essex, New Jersey, Appropriating $3,520,000
$50,000 Carter Park Improvements
$40,000 Infiltration &Inflow Cleaning &TV Inspection
$500,000 Street &Road Improvements
$50,000 Storm Drain Improvements
$25,000 Storm Water Master Plan
$100,000 Geographical Improvement System
$50,000 Sanitary Sewer Improvements
$2,500,000 Downtown Improvements/Spiotta Park Improvements
$40,000 Curb &Sidewalk Program
$100,000 Chip Seal Program
$65,000 Brookwood Ditch Improvements
$3,520,000 Total General Improvements
You mentioned the "cost" of the gazebo, fountain and other misc. items were a total of $100,000. Are the trees that they plan to replaced with "ginko" trees included in this total?
I did not include in my estimate but are part of the project.
Also, the Tau fabrication itself is projected to only be $85,000 (although it seems like it will be over $100K per your figures), yet the total cost of the project is $410,000. Most of the costs are in site prep and installation.
Plus $71,500 for Site Study
Does the $100,000 for the gazebo/fountain include all costs for installation and prep that you are aware of?
No. I cannot differentiate some of the items
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jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 572
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 6:03 pm: |
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Let me understand this. The cost tossed about by the BOT and the sculpture people for Tau is either $410,000 or $440,000, depending on whose figures you believe. But neither figure includes the $71,500 the town paid previously for a site study, and nobody will talk about the $100,000 at least spent for the gazebo and fountain which will be ripped out. So the real cost is over $600,000!!!!!!!! |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1491
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 7:26 pm: |
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Jayjay, let's not get tangled in numbers. If you decide to rip out tile and put in a hardwood floor, the sunk cost of the new tile you bought a few years ago does not become part of the cost of your new floor.
The earlier costs would, however, suggest that you are not very good at having a long term vision on home renovations,and may not be a good steward of home renovation dollars (in this hypothetical example).
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Bill C. Grant, BS
Citizen
Username: Parkingsux
Post Number: 385
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 7:43 pm: |
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I think jayjay hits it straight on when he says in another thread:
Quote:The first time I went in (Baird Center) to register for the pool, I wondered why it looked so awful. Of course now I know that our politcians, VP especially, simply pander to the group with the sexiest project at the moment and with whom they can court political points. Today its a sculpture, then its a riverwalk, or a bike path or a tennis bubble. Infrastructure...building maintenance...roads & curbs...nothing sexy about those. In a few years, old Tau will be a rusted eyesore, and they will have forgotten about maintaining it as they have all the other "pieces of art" like our village hall and Baird.
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Pdg
Citizen
Username: Pdg
Post Number: 843
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, April 8, 2006 - 9:13 pm: |
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Thank you for answering my questions, Howard. I appreciate the work you have done very much. 
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