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Message |
    
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4131
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, May 27, 2006 - 10:23 pm: | 
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At the BOT Meeting on 5-22, Calabrese claimed that "Tau" cannot go in front of SOPAC because it is the location of our 9/11 Memorial.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbnyo_21ez4
I had never heard that before, so I went to go see it for myself today.
I found a Construction truck parked on top of it:
The site overgrown with weeds:
and only a business card-sized reference to 9-11:
THIS is a respectful memorial to 9-11 that cannot be altered, so the gazebo & fountain must be eliminated at taxpayer expense?
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Dave
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 9622
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Saturday, May 27, 2006 - 10:40 pm: |
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I feel physical discomfort seeing those photos. |
Soparents
Citizen
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 487
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 28, 2006 - 6:59 am: |
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THAT is upsetting. |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 523
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, May 28, 2006 - 4:22 pm: |
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I was at the meeting, and nearly choked when Calabrese played the patriotism card to support the corrupt Tao process.
Nothing shames him.
jd |
Erin Cartman
Citizen
Username: Carnac
Post Number: 61
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 28, 2006 - 10:10 pm: |
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Would it be safe to assume that once the the construction is done the memorial will be in much better shape and maybe even dedicated in a formal way? |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4132
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, May 28, 2006 - 10:44 pm: |
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Erin - well, that is sort of the point. Calabrese made it seem like "Tau" couldn't possibly be placed in front of SOPAC because there was already a 9/11 memorial there. As the pictures above prove, what is currently there isn't much and could easily be replaced with "Tau" or anything else. I guess Tau COULD even be a 9/11 Memorial - as several people have seriously asked me if it was symbolic of the twisted steel of the Trade Center.
However, Calabrese has no concern for wasting the GRANT dollars that were used to install the Gazebo & Fountain, just like he has no concern for the irresponsible use of over $250,000 TAX dollars to rip it out 7 years later for the installation of Tau. |
Erin Cartman
Citizen
Username: Carnac
Post Number: 63
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 2:46 am: |
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AHHH okay, now I understand. - Thanks or the eplaination MHD. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5186
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 3:18 am: |
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Those pictures of the 9.11 Memorial are sickening. I was there the night it was dedicated several years ago. I never thought it would be treated with such disrespect. Back when it was built, I thought to my self what a dumb place for it. I think it should have went on Sloan Street near the gazebo and the fountain. Or in one of the parks, instead of a parking lot.
Maybe instead of destroying the gazebo Tau could be put there and the Memorial can be moved to a nicer place. One where people can sit a reflect, if they want to. Then we can put Tau there.
MHD I sure hope you were kidding about making Tau the 9.11 Memorial. I think that would be a disgrace to the memory of all the innocent people who lost their lives. |
red_alert
Citizen
Username: Red_alert
Post Number: 260
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 3:08 pm: |
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I guess Calabrese thinks is silly to put Art in front of an Arts Center.
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tom
Citizen
Username: Tom
Post Number: 5033
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 3:32 pm: |
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Isn't there a memorial over near the gazebo? I seem to remember a plaque with the names of the South Orange victims there. |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1593
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 4:35 pm: |
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That's what I thought too...isn't there a rock with a plaque somewhere near the gazebo and parking lot across the street from it?
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Steve Hickson
Citizen
Username: Shickson
Post Number: 18
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 7:19 pm: |
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Wow---that 9/11 Memorial needs some serious landscaping---what a mess---is that how we're showing respect to our SO citizens that were vitims on 9/11? Can we do better? |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 527
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 7:24 pm: |
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A new village government is needed.
Now that the disgrace is outed, action will take place, if we keep their left feet to the fire.
jd |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 528
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 7:28 pm: |
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The steps from the "gateway to SOPAC," (per Rosen), are broken and dangerous.
I was over there today, and noticed the very dangerous, broken steps.
Likely from heavy construction equipment.
jd |
jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 667
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 29, 2006 - 8:42 pm: |
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I don't remember any public discussion about this memorial. Who deisgned it? And is this just another example of doing something without thinking it through. And if they were going to build it, how could they not maintain it, and somehow put a plaque or something to explain its meaning.
But wait. Wasn't the reason that Tau couldn't be put by the obelisk was because the obelisk was on NJ Transit property. I thought Calabrese said that at one point too. If that is so, who paid for and who owns the obelisk.
Finally, i remember that there was another 9/11 memorial behind the Gaslight Commons building in the park back there. I haven't been back there in a while. I wonder what that looks like, and wonder why two memorials were constructed. |
mrosner
Citizen
Username: Mrosner
Post Number: 2793
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 9:14 am: |
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NJ transit put in the obelisk and it was not built as a memorial. After 9/11 a ceremony and gathering was held there with a candlelight vigil. A lot of people used that as a memorial after 9/11 (pictures, flags, etc).
VP Calabrese has stated (although there nothing official has been approved) that he would like to see that site as a permanent memorial.
The playground behind Galsight Commons was completely done over a few years ago and was dedicated to Chris Faughnan who was a S. Orange resident who passed away on 9/11.
There is also a plaque at the edge of the sloan street parking lot by the circle dedicated to Russ Sommers who was the driving force behind the creation of the parking authority.
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jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 668
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 3:51 pm: |
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Mr. Rosner-
Thanks for the clarification. Given the veracity of what you say, I don't see how the VP can say he wants a 9/11 memorial on NJ transit property. |
jeep
Citizen
Username: Jeep
Post Number: 143
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 3:56 pm: |
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Mr. Rosner don't we have a park location that would be better suited for a memorial dedication? |
mrosner
Citizen
Username: Mrosner
Post Number: 2795
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 4:01 pm: |
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Jeep: Memorial park on Valley (which is also where the VP would like to see the gazebo placed). There is currently a memorial there.
(Please, I ask those who are going to state the obvious to try and refrain).
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jayjay
Citizen
Username: Jayjayp
Post Number: 669
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 4:41 pm: |
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We have THREE 9/11 memorials??? I'm confused. There's the one to the individual who died on 9/11 behind Gaslight Commons. There's the unofficial 9/11 obelisk memorial in front of SOPAC. AND there's one in Memorial Park?
I mean no disrespect to 9/11 victims and their families, but how does this make sense? One well tended, well designed, well placed memorial would be much better than what we've got. To me, this speaks to a lack of a cohesive vision for things in town.
As for the VP wanting the gazebo in Memorial Park, what does he know of park design? Our parks are our assets, and should be given the right thought and care. I don't know if the gazebo fits that park or not. What I do know is that Sloan Street was professionally designed and shows it. Trying to save face over the decision to take down the gazebo by putting it in Memorial Park because the VP wants it there is reflective of the attitude of South Orange being his personal fiefdom. |
red_alert
Citizen
Username: Red_alert
Post Number: 264
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 7:56 pm: |
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I can't believe we are talking about where to put a 9/11 memorial. It's been almost 5 years. Shouldn't this converstation happen a long time ago?
I'm confused too. |
Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5203
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 - 8:43 pm: |
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Something I don't understand. If this isn't an 'official' 9.11 Memorial behind the train station; why (borrowed from MHD)
"At the BOT Meeting on 5-22, Calabrese claimed that "Tau" cannot go in front of SOPAC because it is the location of our 9/11 Memorial."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbnyo_21ez4
And Mark, what is the obvious you think we might state that you want us to refrain from? |
mrosner
Citizen
Username: Mrosner
Post Number: 2796
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:21 am: |
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jayjay: Memorial Park on valley road was there long before 9/11. There is a plaque there, but I do not remember the exact wording.
The obelisk became the memorial for 9/11 because many residents put pictures, flags and flowers there. Then we had a candlelight vigil there about 2 weeks after 9/11 and it has sort of become the unofficial memorial for 9/11. The VP would like to make it permanent.
The park dedication was done specifically in memory of Chris Faughnan and not as a 9/11 memorial (although some see it as one).
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Just The Aunt
Supporter
Username: Auntof13
Post Number: 5207
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:55 am: |
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Memorial Park on Valley, if I remember correctly had been a cemetery... |
buddybak
Citizen
Username: Buddybak
Post Number: 18
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 12:30 pm: |
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The VP wants to put an Enternal Flame where the SUN DIAL is now for the 9/11 memorial; as he has said many times in public at the town meetings. That why he wants to put a gas main back there. |
phd6786
Citizen
Username: Phd6786
Post Number: 25
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:44 pm: |
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Doesn't Calabrese have any sense? Some place he picked for a 9/11 memorial!
A memorial is supposed to invite meditation. It is a place to contemplate on the lives lost, and to reflect on our existence.
Hardly what you would expect people to want to do as they walk into SOPAC for a fun evening at the movies, or in their way out of it.
Hardly a place when we would feel comfortable stopping and praying, with all the buzzing of an entertainment center and the activity of a huge parking lot around us.
Did he ask anybody else before he made that decision? The public? The BOT? Can't anybody stop him from this absurd idea?
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Glock 17
Citizen
Username: Glock17
Post Number: 1028
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:57 pm: |
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http://www.interment.net/data/us/nj/essex/southorange/southorange.htm
http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/weirdso/
Correct JTA. I've had these links in my "other" bookmarks for years.
They moved the headstones, but not the bodies. |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4135
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 2:09 pm: |
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phd,
I agree. Frankly, one would think that the location of the existing GAZEBO is actually much better suited for a contemplative spot to reflect on 9/11 than the middle of a movie theater parking lot.
If as buddybak says is true that an "eternal flame" is to be installed - all the better. Install it under the existing gazebo on Sloan Street in memory of the victims and at the same time, the flame will likely keep the pigeons from congregating & defecating under the gazebo. AND IT WILL COST SIGNIFICANTLY LESS THAN TAU.
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joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 537
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 2:27 pm: |
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He was just speaking to deflect attention from the debate about the placement of the tau anti-gift.
jd |
buddybak
Citizen
Username: Buddybak
Post Number: 19
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 3:42 pm: |
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joel, I'm not trying to deflect attn. of the tau. Go back and ask him at his store. |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4136
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 4:00 pm: |
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buddy,
I THINK Joel was referring to Calabrese, not you.
--------
http://www.notaxesfortau.com |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 539
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 4:00 pm: |
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No thanks.
I was there, and in context, his statement was just what I wrote it to have been.
jd |
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