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Soparents
Supporter
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 1968
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 8:46 pm: | 
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I got to the meeting late and also couldn't quite make out what was being said when I got there, but I heard our VP say something about leaving and coming back at around 9.30. This was before the section where the public were allowed to speak.
Was there a reason given?
Thanks for any info. |
Lizziecat
Citizen
Username: Lizziecat
Post Number: 1317
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 8:48 pm: |
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He said he had to pick up his children. |
Mayor McCheese
Supporter
Username: Mayor_mccheese
Post Number: 1790
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 8:50 pm: |
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I wonder if he was lying... |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4398
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 8:54 pm: |
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Mayor,
It depends. Were his lips moving? |
Mayor McCheese
Supporter
Username: Mayor_mccheese
Post Number: 1791
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 9:03 pm: |
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Some say that he lies to himself when his lips are closed. |
Soparents
Supporter
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 1973
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 11:13 pm: |
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Tks lizziecat, I didn't know what the reason was. It was shame he wasn't there, I heard several people at the podium say that they had wanted to ask him questions. |
Matt Foley
Citizen
Username: Mattfoley
Post Number: 728
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 11:34 pm: |
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My question was going to be...How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?
The world may never know |
bets
Supporter
Username: Bets
Post Number: 23532
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 11, 2006 - 11:41 pm: |
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One, two, three...CHOMP!
Three!
Quote:.How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?
The world may not believe the owl but I certainly do!
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bets
Supporter
Username: Bets
Post Number: 23533
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 12:50 am: |
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On a more serious note: i think the tenor of the meeting on Monday night was very uncomfortable. The elephant(s) in the room were obvious and overwhelming. The Village President skedaddled immediately prior to public remonstrances and thereby was not available for most of the meeting.
Government under glass indeed. |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 682
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 9:43 am: |
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He skedaddled at the moment I daddled in.
Alchemy at work.
jd |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1666
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 11:32 am: |
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Yes, very convenient that he had to excuse himself for 90 minutes to pick up kids and houseguest.
Even if his logistics problems are fully legit, it just looks bad when the meeting is organized such that remonstrances begin the moment he leaves the room, on a night when he is one of the key issues. (caveat, I haven't finished watching the meeting yet, so don't know when he came back, or if there were any remonstrances after his return). |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4402
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 11:40 am: |
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Susan,
He came back at the very end and Betsy Black did get to address him & his slanderous comments at the prior meeting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Fv8pYmns50
He had the nerve to say he WOULD apologize IF he said anything to offend anyone.
WEAK! |
Soparents
Supporter
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 1993
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 11:44 am: |
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Then we should take the man at his word....
At the next meeting, would we be permitted to take a recording of that segment and have it shown/broadcast so that he (and everyone there) can see and hear the comment?
Once Mr.Calabrese has been assured that he did indeed speak and act in a very unprofessional and un-VP/elected official like manner, perhaps he can issue the apology.
After all, he said IF he said anything, he would apologise, so please allow us to afford him the opportunity. |
SoOrLady
Citizen
Username: Soorlady
Post Number: 3413
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 11:49 am: |
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Interesting, Ms. Black states only that he maligned a local business - first he feigns ignorance of the remark and then says that IF he offended he would appologize to the proprietors of Bunny's, the Cuccinellos and Poganys. How did he know who he should apologize to if he didn't remember the remarks? |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4404
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 1:00 pm: |
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Good catch, SOL! |
Steve Hickson
Citizen
Username: Shickson
Post Number: 52
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 10:07 pm: |
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I have a feeling if you go back to Ms. Jennings remarks during Monday's BOT meeting (regarding Bunny's) you may find more unsavory comments which I will not repeat on this forum.
There's an old saying that our Village President and the BOT may want to consider---"if you find yourself in a hole, throw away the shovel." They just continue to dig deeper and deeper.
Mr. Taylor may also want to watch the infamous "Bunnysgate" video before his next lecture on respect. Now a brief lecture from me.
I believe the good citizens of South Orange respect the fact that our Village President and the BOT do volunteer their time for public service---that is admirable and deserves a level of respect. They have a tough job and we must acknowledge that.
But, ultimately, respect is earned---it is earned through results. Our taxes are ridiculously high, we have a reassessment on the horizon---with all due respect to Mr. Rosen our taxes will go up dramatically (including mine on Meeker Street)---our central business district looks like Beirut compared to our neighbors, we have a crack-house across from the train station, a huge dirt pile at the Beifus lot, a hole in our library roof, an unpaid for gazebo about to be dismantled, a $250K sculpture on order that we're paying for without our consent and a Village President that openly disses one of South Orange's longest standing businesses---so, who is it really that is being disrespected? Maybe its not the BOT after all? Could it be us?
Oh, I almost forgot what we don't have---a real plan and vision for this town (at least one that's been done in the last decade). |
vermontgolfer
Supporter
Username: Vermontgolfer
Post Number: 481
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 10:25 pm: |
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What he said! |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1670
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 9:33 am: |
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Yes...the speeches on respect by various trustees were very nicely done. But they started with the great respect that I give to people who take on such large and often thankless jobs.
Then I started actually watching the meetings, and have felt my respect for many of the trustees (and yes, one or two of the frequent attendees) gradually seeping away. Manners, respect, and factual clarity (or their absence) all speak loudly to me.
Respect may be granted based on service and position, but even in the best of cases it can be eroded by results and behaviors. |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 4412
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 10:34 am: |
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Susan, VG, Steve,
I agree. Perhaps Mr. Taylor should watch the following clip, before he decides to lecture the public on "respect" again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FHUFJTw9gA |
Howard Levison
Citizen
Username: Levisonh
Post Number: 646
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 10:41 am: |
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And he may run for Village President. |
Nuff Sayid
Citizen
Username: Parkingsux
Post Number: 441
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 10:45 am: |
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If we prevent the low voter turnout - the village will win! Dan nailed it. |
peteglider
Citizen
Username: Peteglider
Post Number: 2069
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 11:55 am: |
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Is there any question that Art Taylor will run for VP?
How much money do think he'll be able to raise for himself and his slate of candidates vs a "new village slate" of relative unknowns (except to MOL and perhaps from remonstrances on BOT TV)? (or more importantly, how strong an organization can he muster?)
IF the village ever gets 5,000 voters to turn out -- it will *never* be because of TAU -- it will be because of diligent, relentless campaigning and messaging by the "old guard" BOT. Don't doubt it for a second.
Negative issues don't win campaigns, nor do they define a candidate or slate. Being "against" the way things are currently won't win new seats on the BOT. And being for "open government, accountability, etc." -- is something ALL candidates will say.
(BTW -- do you think its a coincidence that the reval won't happen until after the election???)
Dan's blog is awesome -- I feel his passion and pain about the village. And identify with it.
But the assumption is wrong -- unless there is serious fundraising and the campaign starts now, the newcomers will be swept away. (and still, the "old guard" will likley be able to out finance, out campaign, out message).
Mr. Levison -- you may be our best hope for the village. You are articulate, empassioned, involved, absurdly well informed, have never posted anything that could be used against you ;-), and have "been there."
Pete
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Howard Levison
Citizen
Username: Levisonh
Post Number: 647
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 12:27 pm: |
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pete: I appreciate your kind words and support. Thanks |
Dan Shelffo
Citizen
Username: Openspacer
Post Number: 189
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 1:20 pm: |
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Pete,
Thanks for the plug.
You are absolutely right on about the money. It takes money to communicate the message. We can complain on MOL, blog all we want and rant to each other in our living rooms but without funding the message will not get through to the majority of the voters.
Time is running out.
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bets
Supporter
Username: Bets
Post Number: 23550
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 13, 2006 - 10:05 pm: |
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DAN SHELFFO FOR BOT!!!
(seriously) |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 693
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006 - 10:26 am: |
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Who is running, and when do the fundraising events start?
jd |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1683
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006 - 4:15 pm: |
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Yes, I'm not in the inner circle making these decisions (or volunteering to run!), but I stand ready to give support when there are named candidates ready to be supported. |
Sitoyan
Citizen
Username: Sitoyan
Post Number: 179
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006 - 6:58 pm: |
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susan1014,
you mean you would support anyone who comes across, or would you check their credentials? |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1686
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006 - 7:34 pm: |
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Sitoyan, if it is not obvious, let me say it explicitly, I stand ready to give support to quality candidates.
I follow town politics closely, and watch way too many town meetings for my own good (as well as reading too many MOL postings?). There are people I definitely would not support, and am hoping that we are able to put together a slate that I can stand fully behind, with no extra candidates to split the opposition vote (unlike last time).
Having said that, I would vote for almost anyone over certain current trustees, after the last few meetings that I've watched. |
phd6786
Citizen
Username: Phd6786
Post Number: 40
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 5:18 pm: |
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Quote:Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006 - 10:26 am: Who is running, and when do the fundraising events start?
joel dranove
So, Joel Dranove, did you get any responses to your questions? Any offers for candidates? Any volunteers to organize fundraising events?
Deafening silence.
Let’s face it, neighbor, all we are here is a bunch of complainers, loafers with our arses glued on a chair, posting ad infinitum on MOL, and doing nothing to bring about the changes we talk about, other than talk. I am one of us. We keep talking to ourselves, sometimes intelligently, but we don’t carry our message to the rest of the Village.
If you want to find who is running in the next elections and who will run a fundraising campaign, you will have to look outside MOL. You are wasting your energy here. Go and mingle in other circles, meet some serious candidates, talk with them, excite others to support your slate, and start already. There is very little time left.
Just a friendly advice.
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SOrising
Citizen
Username: Sorising
Post Number: 506
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 5:33 pm: |
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6786 would like to know opposition details, the better to support the current BOT with.
Perhaps she should take her own advice and stop wasting time on MOL as SOsiren. |
Soparents
Supporter
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 2158
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 5:56 pm: |
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phd6786
I don't think it is deafening silence. I think that there are people out there either who have made their minds up to run, or are strongly considering it, and will no doubt (hopefully) think it through over the Summer. I don't think that standing as a potential Trustee is something that should be decided rashly, and I would much prefer to have a candidate who has weighed up the pros and cons, knows how they wish to proceed, knows that they are able to dedicate the time to the Village and knows the Villages strengths upon which to build, and its weaknesses and how to address them in a logical and well constructed way.
So, to have "silence" at the moment, be it on MOL, or elsewhere, is not something that I am concerned about. |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 726
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 5:59 pm: |
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Things are not what they seem.
Nor are they otherwise.
jd |
Stuart0628
Citizen
Username: Stuart0628
Post Number: 298
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 6:21 pm: |
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If you recall from the campaign a few years ago, Spot has a Ph.D.
That might explain the screen name... |
phd6786
Citizen
Username: Phd6786
Post Number: 41
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 6:29 pm: |
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Quote:6786 would like to know opposition details, the better to support the current BOT with.
More paranoia from SOrising. If you continue with your persecution obsession, Johnny baby, you'll never get anywhere. You will keep alienating people with your suspicions. I am not asking for your "opposition details" you can keep those. I am asking for a viable opposition slate, which should be out there campaigning already. That's no detail. That's the brunt of everything being said (but not done) on MOL.
If you want to start a campaign you have to come out of the closet and start dealing with real people. You should already be out in the open with a slate of candidates.
My posts here are meant to show you that there are out here some of us who, like Susan1014, are eager to see a good slate that we can support, without splitting the vote to too many candidates. My posts are meant to highlight the futility of trying to start a campaign from MOL alone; nothing has come out of it so far, other than sympathetic comments. My posts are urging the most vocal posters/complainers here, you, Joel Dranove, MHD, Jayjay, and others, to set aside your paranoia, get together with other people outside MOL and start a campaign. You seem to have time in your hands for posting here, use that time more constructively.
I can hear you coming back: "how about you SOsiren? How come you don't look for candidates and start a campaign?" I do not have the luxury of time to go to BOT meetings like you do, I have a job and a family to take care of. Besides I am not a leader. I am a follower. Show me the direction and I'll follow. Show me a good slate and I'll work for them.
Now, if you suspect me as a spy for the BOT so be it. Stay in your isolation and deal with your paranoia.
BTW I like "SOsiren". I might adopt it as my username. Thank you. |
Dave
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 10163
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 7:05 pm: |
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phd6786 actually makes a lot of sense in terms of getting active in the community, speaking to your neighbors and networking about making positive change a reality next year. With that said, it's painfully obvious he's not in touch with things that are happening and that the monicker he assigns to those people who are trying to make a difference as "complainers" without action is so far off base he may as well live in another time zone.
If in fact we had Joel, MHD and Jayjay running the town I can promise you we would have a qualitative difference in town that would make residents of other zip codes envious of the intelligent, open and thoughtful people we had running things. |
joel dranove
Citizen
Username: Jdranove
Post Number: 727
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 9:11 pm: |
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How much will that one cost us?
jd |
SOrising
Citizen
Username: Sorising
Post Number: 510
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 9:31 pm: |
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How much does it cost to run a campaign, Joel? I think you'd get it covered.
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Dave
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 10169
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:24 pm: |
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First one is always free. |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 1693
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:31 pm: |
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Phd, just because you haven't been invited doesn't necessarily mean that discussions and planning aren't underway. Well meaning or not, your screen persona does not come across as trustworthy for a not yet public campaign.
I chose not to be involved in the in person discussions, so don't know what is going on (first trimester exhaustion took precedence over political discussions earlier this year). However, I'd give a good guess that candidacies are being planned, and I'm looking forward to details (and yes, a donation, etc.) when the time is right.
Most of us have jobs and families to take care of, so you don't need to say it as if it is your special issue. Do you really think our next slate of candidates will all be childless and out of the work force? (and no, I'm not pushing you to throw your hat into the ring)
I actually suspect that debate on MOL will turn out to have been one of the more important local political developments over the last year or two, given how few other forums (fora?) are available to those who disagree with the status quo in South Orange. |
Sheena Collum
Citizen
Username: Sheena_collum
Post Number: 754
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:33 pm: |
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Name recognition is a deciding factor on how much a candidate would have to spend...
A slate of fresh blood (3 BOT + 1 VP) would easily cost $15-20k in a place like South Orange. |
SOrising
Citizen
Username: Sorising
Post Number: 512
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 10:44 pm: |
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susan1014, I am glad you are patient. |
phd6786
Citizen
Username: Phd6786
Post Number: 42
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 18, 2006 - 10:11 am: |
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Dave, you may be right that Joel, MHD and Jayjay would make a qualitative difference in town. However, as Sheena says, name recognition is important in an election. The names Joel, MHD and Jayjay mean nothing to the average voter. Real names should be out there already pounding on every voter’s head.
Susan, I am glad to hear that there are discussions and planning underway for the formation of a slate. But it is time that the discussions and planning come to an end. You have to screen among possible candidates, assemble a viable slate of four, convince those left out not to run on their own, build a platform agreeable to all four candidates, raise $20,000 (Sheena knows), summon volunteers to organize a campaign, and make your candidates household names. All that in ten months.
As for your: Do you really think our next slate of candidates will all be childless and out of the work force? No, but in selecting your candidates make sure that they will be able to put all that is needed to do their job, like Mark Rosner does, and not part-time trustees like Terriann Moore-Abrams. Their job is demanding much more than Monday night meetings.
And when you have all that ironed down, I would ask SOrising to let me know: I would like to know opposition details, the better to support the current BOT with. |
SOrising
Citizen
Username: Sorising
Post Number: 514
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 18, 2006 - 12:27 pm: |
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Thanks for your brilliant advice, 6786. Of course anyone who had not thought of it long ago and more has no business running for office. |
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