| Author | Message | ||
     Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 251 Registered: 1-2004 |
I just spoke with the parking authority and despite the fact that I have been on the waiting list for a parking spot for 3 years now, there has been little to no movement during that time. First of all, I want to know who has all these permits, do they actually commute, or are they long time residents who are just holding on to them? Second, I bought a house in this town because of the commute and because I was told that the waiting list for a spot was about 2 years. Now I am told that it is indefinite. Then, last year, I filled out a form for jitney service and was hoping that they would institute some service for my neighborhood (between Ridgewood and Walton), and I was told that there was not enough of a need for it there. It is crazy that the people managing this town can't focus on real needs (like parents who need to pick up kids at daycare and don't have time for a 20 minute walk home before doing so) instead of on SOPAC and sculpture for the town. I would love to know of one resident who moved to this town for SOPAC and the sculpture vs. all those people who moved here for the commute. The town goverment needs to serve its constituents!!! | ||
| joel dranove Citizen Username: Jdranove Post Number: 731 Registered: 1-2006 |
Tell the Board at the next meeting, this coming Monday. jd | ||
| Soparents Supporter Username: Soparents Post Number: 2173 Registered: 5-2005  |
It's a very valid point Neen - Go to the meeting and ask your questions and while i'm sure the full answer won't be forthcoming at that meeting, they should look into the concerns you have.. | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 1696 Registered: 3-2002 |
Neen, I'd say most of the permits are in active use, and furthermore, if they are not, then you do a parking survey and oversell the lots somewhat. We use ours, but if we hit a year when we both worked out of the city, we would keep paying for it rather than risk having to go on the list again. I'm guessing you would too, once you finally get off the mailing list. We moved here in the glory days when the wait was "only" 18 months or so, but we moved here knowing we would have to make it work without a permit for a good while. Parking is a problem, and we need to keep working on solutions. If you speak to the Board, don't forget to ask how many members of the Parking Authority commute into the city (I think it may only be one). | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 1459 Registered: 7-2005  |
Yeah how about an Irvington avenue jitney? Uh, yeah irvington ave jitney needed. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2854 Registered: 4-2002 |
There is a Parking authority meeting tonight. I suggest you go there first to express your concerns about the jitney routes and related questions. SOPA did the surveys to help select the initial routes. I would request that another one be done before another route is added to help determine where there is the most need. Parking utilization surveys are done on a regular basis by SOPA. Currently one SOPA commissioner is a commuter and one used to be a commuter. I will add that we did not even have jitneys several years ago and the commitment has been to continue adding more routes as long as they are utilized. At one point we hope to expand to have service later in the evening. | ||
| MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 4430 Registered: 5-2001  |
Since the Parking Authority is still missing a Commissioner, will there be enough people present for a quorum? | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2855 Registered: 4-2002 |
Three of the four need to show up. As far as I know they will have a quorum but you can confirm by calling the parking authority. | ||
| Daddy B Citizen Username: Daddy_b Post Number: 1 Registered: 7-2006 |
I had the same discussion with the parking authority and feel so misled about moving to South Orange - even though we really tried to do our due diligence to make sure we were making the right decision when moving here. We moved to South Orange about 15 months ago and were told that the resident waiting list was approx 4 - 4 1/2 years and that the non-resident list was about 2 - 2 1/2 years. When I called recently to ask about my position on both lists, I was told that there has been virtually no movement on either one and that the wait time is now "indefinite" for both. Unfortunately, I'm not in a very convenient location for taking the Jitney and often have to work late evenings when the Jitney isn't running. We moved here in large part for the commute (of course there are other strong attributes) and did realize that we would have to work something out for a while but the inconvenience of not being able to easily park in the foreseeable future may unfortunately outweigh the benefits of living near the midtown direct. We've thought about moving to another location where we can walk to a station or park more easily (and where the taxes are lower) but our home's value hasn't increased enough to cover the cost of listing and selling where we could break even. I'd be happy to contribute towards my portion of SOPAC and even the new sculpture if I could just realize the alleged benefit of paying to live in a town on the midtown direct. | ||
| SO1969 Citizen Username: Bklyn1969 Post Number: 359 Registered: 7-2004 |
This - PARKING - should be THE ISSUE in this town. All the energy around Tau and SOPAC should be on this point (because these ill conceived projects were foisted upon us, we're forced to divert energy to them. but in a perfect world, we wouldn't have them as a distraction). The raison d'etre, to try to be a little fancy without knowing if I'm spelling it right, for South Orange is now Midtown Direct. Any strategic vision for SO has to have that as its foundation. Instead, we are acting on a 12-15 year old notion of creating an "arts community". Calabrese and most of the BOT just don't get it. Calabrese on TV (in an interview with the Community Coalition)dismissed people who say that Midtown Direct is the reason people are moving to SO. "There needs to be a reason to get off the train. What's another 5-8 minutes?" Well, first, 5 to 8 minutes more generally means a lot more $$$. Second, 5 to 8 minutes do matter...if he were or had ever been a commuter, he might get that. I literally looked at the train schedule for SO/MW and compared it to Montclair and we decided to look in SO/MW almost entirely based on the shorter train ride. I'm not saying people don't self select MW/SO for reasons beyond the train schedule or the relatively lower housing prices - we're among those who like the "vibe". But there are practical considerations that ultimately come into consideration for nearly all buyers: how much do I pay (for house and taxes) and what do I get (the full package of community, services, aesthetics, convenience), ie, how strong is the value proposition? Calabrese & Co. are doing a great job making it more expensive to live here, jacking up the Cost side of the ledger. They're not doing much on the Benefit side, and what they are doing they're doing at exorbitant prices (thus the Cost side, see SOPAC discussions of late). | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 1698 Registered: 3-2002 |
Calbrese is clueless (or self-serving) on this point...he consistently underestimates the impact of Midtown Direct, and the pain of those who cannot get parking. Many of us consulted train schedules (and priced Summit real estate too) before moving here. Now there have been discussions of closing the PA waiting list, presumably so that they don't have to keep telling us how long they are. Parking may actually be the one issue that is the greatest threat to property values in some parts of town...imagine if you call the PA next year, and they tell you that they won't even bother putting you on a wait list if you buy a house here. NJT also helped to create the problem by not having the guts to insist that other towns with stations add non-resident parking. As I recall it, at the time, NJT threatened to create non-resident parking by emminent domain, and then backed off, leaving us the only nearby town that actually allowed them to build non-resident parking. Thus the long wait even for the more expensive non-resident parking in the NJT lot. | ||
| cmontyburns Citizen Username: Cmontyburns Post Number: 1911 Registered: 12-2003  |
I have a hard time believing someone will move to South Orange with the promise that they'll be able to have a parking spot in two years, but somehow won't move here if they learn it's 3 years, or 5 years, or indefinite. (Also, the town HAS been expanding jitney service -- an entirely new route was added in the past year.) | ||
| Daddy B Citizen Username: Daddy_b Post Number: 2 Registered: 7-2006 |
Well put SO1969 and Susan1014....5-8 minutes of extra commuting time really does make a difference to many of us that commute and also want to strike a work/life balance. When I called the PA about a few weeks ago for my status on the waitlists I was told that names are no longer being added to the list since there has been no movement during the past year. While I love my home and our community in many ways, I would not have bought it had I known the real parking situation. It's also scary that there is so much proposed downtown residential development when there is already no place for those that do not live within walking distance to park. | ||
| Montrose13 Citizen Username: Montrose13 Post Number: 39 Registered: 8-2004 |
Lack of parking is problem everywhere in the are. I have family scattered across Essex county and they face the same issues as SO. In some towns, believe it or not the parking issues are worse. (But everyone in SO thinks that we have the worse of everything...so many whiners...) Name any town on Midtown Direct line and parking is a problem. However, Brick Church has a lot that may have space. Ad you might do what I do: I park in the daily lot at Mountain Station in SO--take the train to Broad Street and then get on Midtown Direct train to Penn Station. Takes a little more time but it's not bad. | ||
| G. Webb Citizen Username: Bam Post Number: 7 Registered: 5-2006 |
SO1969 & Susan 1014- I agree with you 100% in your characterization of Calabrese's mind state. Several months ago I saw him on "Meet the leaders" and he actually said his vision for SO was for a place where "people can walk down the street and not be afraid of their neighbors" He also went on to characterize SO as a community recovering from "flight" blah blah blah. He definitely sees his role as saving a community that already managed to save itself. I don't fault the PA for our parking situation. It's a basic rule of supply & demand. Since midtown direct came to fruition (and possibly before that) demand has been much higher than supply. I've only been here three years (put our names on the waiting list the day we closed), and yes we did decide to purchase here in part due to the convenience of getting to work, that said, being city folk, we new that moving to jersey carried some sacrifices, namely not being able to walk 5 min to a subway (or a grocery store) and be on our merry way. One long term solution may be to petition NJT to add Mountain Station on the direct NYC route at key times. I don't know that section of SO that well, but it seems to me that it may be easier to find additional resident parking within walking distance of MS. The fact of the matter is we have a very dense downtown area, and I think some thought should be given to decentralizing parking, shopping, and other basic operations. We have a home population of 17K, not including the residents at the Hall who definitely use the train station to commute back and forth to the city. Unless we plan on building a 10 story parking structure, there will never be enough parking "downtown". (boy, could we use a real master plan) I also don't think we should demonize the commuters who come from other towns to use the train. In the long run IF we are able to improve our infrastructure, and spruce up our downtown, they will be key source of new patrons for our "coming soon" cool new restaurants & shops and hopefully spreading the word on how SO has such a great offering. | ||
| Stuart0628 Citizen Username: Stuart0628 Post Number: 299 Registered: 2-2003 |
Agreed a thousand times over. It bears repeating: The reason your property has gone up in value more than certain neighboring towns is because people have been clamoring to move here more than elsewhere. And the reasons for that are: (a) Midtown Direct; (b) our short commute on Midtown Direct. I hate to repeat it because this suggestion will cost me money: If the waiting list is so long, the market price of a parking permit is higher than what is being charged. | ||
| Daddy B Citizen Username: Daddy_b Post Number: 3 Registered: 7-2006 |
cmonty You can count me as one of those people that would not have moved to South Orange (or at the very least not considered a home that's not within a reasonable walking distance of the train station) if I knew that the wait would be 5 years or indefinite for a parking space. For my family, it's a critical issue. Also - yes, the Jitney has been expanded and I could walk to a Jitney stop much of the time but it does add a minimum of 20 minutes to my commute each direction. While I'd like to take advantage of it more often (for environmental reasons alone), it's difficult to add that time to the commute each day. | ||
| jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 721 Registered: 6-2005 |
What is stopping the jitnies (don't we have 2 of them?) from making continuous loops throught the village through out the day. From very early to very late? It could then be used for transport to the pool, the trains, the movie house, etc, and it would take a large burden off the parking situation. And It would have to be cheaper than building a parking deck. I wonder if anyone has done the cost comparison. It should also be functioning for villagers at the least possible fare on a break even basis. | ||
| cmontyburns Citizen Username: Cmontyburns Post Number: 1912 Registered: 12-2003 |
If parking is critical, why did you move to a town knowing you couldn't get a spot for two years? What have you been doing for two years that becomes burdensome to continue doing? | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12178 Registered: 5-2001 |
Since the chances of creating significant additional commuter parking near the station are slim (to be polite) I think you are going to have to look to increase jitney service. Another possibility is to create sattelite lots in various parts of town with regular shuttle service to the train station. And, no, I don't know where there is land to do this either. | ||
| Elaine Harris Citizen Username: Elaineharris Post Number: 217 Registered: 12-2004 |
G. Webb: In reply to your comment that you don't fault the PA for the parking problem, I would like to share a different opinion with you. I do fault the Parking Authority, and I would like to emphasize that this is one exception to the rule that the BoT is totally responsible for the problems we are experiencing. With respect to parking, the PA is also at fault. In the past 20 years, the PA has failed to seize virtually every opportunity it could have had to increase and enhance our parking facilities. The most notorious blunder was its total failure to purchase the land behind Bunny's so that it could control the parking in our village, and perhaps even return a profit for us. But there were other blunders, for example, by re-conveying the Rescue Squad parking lot to the village and then purchasing the additional land behind Gulf. Instead of one well designed parking lot, we have two next to each other and the necessary buffers and dividers cause loss of spaces. The PA has bonding capacity which as far as I can see has been underutilized in terms of acquiring additional property for development. Quite frankly, why do we need a Parking Authority? To collect quarters and then not account for them? If this organization was truly effective, there would be no parking problem in South Orange at all. When the Parking Authority was first formed, I was totally in favor of it because it promised to take over the day to day chores of issuing parking tickets which was consuming the time of the local police officers. In all the years that have followed, all I can see is that some people have managed to acquire good jobs from that money, and except for a token (no pun was intended until I saw it) amount that is donated back to the village, not much profit is in it for us. Please understand, my comments are directed at the "ideology" of the PA and are not meant to impugn the efforts of any persons who are working on it or for it. Again, as with the BoT, this needed professional expertise, not simply volunteer or "selected" residents. Which reminds me, the total failure of the BoT to appoint a parking commissioner to fill the vacancy only proves how political and imperfect the system is. It is a disgrace that this simple task has not been accomplished, and I congratulate Jeff DuBowy for having the courage to have so stated in a public manner. Well, I guess I stirred the pot today. | ||
| Elaine Harris Citizen Username: Elaineharris Post Number: 218 Registered: 12-2004 |
and I forgot to mention, the Jitney "Service" is too little too late. | ||
| G. Webb Citizen Username: Bam Post Number: 8 Registered: 5-2006 |
Thanks for the added insight Elaine. Do you really mean that the ticket revenue collected by the PA, doesn't actually end up in the village coffers? And btw, I wasn't trying to totally absolve the PA of any responsibility. I just don't think they have any control over the demand side of the equation. The supply side, to a certain degree yes, but given that open land is at a minimum in SO and that the folks who have lived in and run SO for the last 20 years, didn't foresee the influx of new residents that need daily commuting into NYC as well as the jump in other jerseyites who use SO as a port of embarkation post midtown direct. Also, does anyone know whether or not the Jitney service has been a success. The times I've used it from Newstead I've never been on the bus w/ more than 3 or 4 other people. | ||
| Elaine Harris Citizen Username: Elaineharris Post Number: 219 Registered: 12-2004 |
The ticket revenue (for overtime meters, etc.) does go to the Village coffers. But all the rest does not. It goes to the PA coffers. That amount includes all the change in the meters and all the permit fees. All I can add is this: The people at the helm saw it coming and knew that we were expecting Midtown Direct. The split second Midtown Direct started service, West Orange had attractive communter jitneys up and running and bringing commuters back and forth to our lot. We, the People of South Orange, had to wait several years for a jitney. Why? It is almost embarrassing. | ||
| Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 252 Registered: 1-2004 |
In response to cmontyburns' comment about why one would move to a town with two years to wait for a spot. When I first moved to town, I had no children and didn't think that the walk to the train was all that bad. Now, three years later, I am dealing with coordinating a family and do find that the walk, while not horrible, is longer than originally perceived and difficult in bad weather with a child. | ||
| Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 253 Registered: 1-2004 |
Also, cmontyburns, that is nice that you are championing the new routes added by the jitney, but until we have served all of our residents with this service, more is not good enough, we need to serve everyone. My tax dollars are going to a jitney service that doesn't come anywhere near my neighborhood. As for your assessment of waiting time. Look at it this way, if you had some medical problem and the doctor said, if you take one remedy which may cause you some discomfort but that you will only have to live with the discomfort for two years, you would probably say, ok, I can do that. If they said, you can take this remedy and deal with the discomfort, and it will never solve the problem, you would probably not bother. In this case it refers to people who wouldn't have bothered to move to South Orange for the commute had they know that two years would become indefinite! | ||
| Daddy B Citizen Username: Daddy_b Post Number: 4 Registered: 7-2006 |
My personal situation is this: we load up the car with my 4 month old daughter every morning to drive me to the train station - repeat in the evening. We moved here planning to start a family and decided to deal with the lack of a parking space for a couple of years. Now that those 2 to 2 1/2 years have become indefinite it would have changed our decision. I realize that there are definitely bigger issues that my family could have to deal with but it's just not what we thought we were getting into and it is burdensome. Regarding the comment by Montrose13 - I do realize that there are other towns with similar parking issues but we live in this town and there's no reason why we can't do it better - and doing it better would allow many more of the residents of this town to enjoy the convenience of the midtown direct. | ||
| Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 255 Registered: 1-2004 |
I just read in the News Record that the town is spending $3.5 million more on SOPAC. With taxes through the roof as is, and a desparate need for parking, why is our money going to fund SOPAC. This is not Newark that desparately needed cultural venues to draw people to town. South Orange is not a slum in need of this sort of thing, we have residents here paying high prices for houses with high taxes, we need to keep those people here, not offer movies!!!! What is wrong with people. The town government is completely lacking in any sense of fiscal responsibility. If you want a performing arts center to be funded, go out and raise some money for it or get out your own check book, don't just offer it up from the town's coffers. Why wasn't this budget issue offered up for a vote like the school budgets are? | ||
| Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 256 Registered: 1-2004 |
I just read in the News Record that the town is spending $3.5 million more on SOPAC. With taxes through the roof as is, and a desparate need for parking, why is our money going to fund SOPAC. This is not Newark that desparately needed cultural venues to draw people to town. South Orange is not a slum in need of this sort of thing, we have residents here paying high prices for houses with high taxes, we need to keep those people here, not offer movies!!!! What is wrong with people. The town government is completely lacking in any sense of fiscal responsibility. If you want a performing arts center to be funded, go out and raise some money for it or get out your own check book, don't just offer it up from the town's coffers. Why wasn't this budget issue offered up for a vote like the school budgets are? | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2856 Registered: 4-2002 |
Neen: We do not vote on the school budgets in S. ORange/Maplewood. Evidently, nobody went to the parking authority meeting this past Tuesday to find out what other routes are being planned. I suggest you try to get to the next SOPA meeting or at least send them a note. More jitneys are on order and the routes are planned based on where they think the demand will be greatest (surveys have been used in the past). | ||
| SOrising Citizen Username: Sorising Post Number: 522 Registered: 2-2006 |
Trustee Rosner, what you report is very good to hear, but I have heard similar remarks (additional jitneys coming soon) for several years and I have no idea what they did with the last survey they did. You can understand that this is a disincentive to spend valuable time attending meetings that talk with no follow through, I hope. Additional new jitneys might improve the PA's credibility, but they would need to come quickly and be more than one. Expectations are low for very good reasons. | ||
| cmontyburns Citizen Username: Cmontyburns Post Number: 1918 Registered: 12-2003 |
"I have heard similar remarks (additional jitneys coming soon) for several years and I have no idea what they did with the last survey they did." I can tell you what they did with the last survey: they launched a new jitney route. It has been running for several months now. (There were large banners at the train station announcing it.) And from what mrosner says, there are more on the way. If you want input on where they go, you should go to a parking authority meeting. | ||
| SOrising Citizen Username: Sorising Post Number: 524 Registered: 2-2006 |
The last survey I heard about did not result in a jitney service, along routes they were discussing. Perhaps one survey resulted in one more jitney while other surveys resulted in nothing. The bottom line is that there should have been many more operating for some years now and that others need to be introduced quickly. They have been talking and surveying for far too long with little to show for it. Elaine Harris is correct that they should have been introduced years ago, when the Midtown Direct first started running. The fact that there are still so few, so many years latter, is inexcusable. The longer it continues, the worse it becomes. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2857 Registered: 4-2002 |
Will try to put this in perspective. Each jitney route costs about $60,000 a year to operate. This does not include the cost of the equipment (which so far has come from grant money). W. Orange does not have a train station so they took a different route (since they can not just build a parking lot in S. Orange). S. Orange did add spaces in anticipation of the midtown direct but the mistake made was the same one many towns made. The impact of having a direct line was greatly underestimated (easy to see with 20-20 hindsight). Again, I would strongly suggest going to a SOPA meeting to give your input regarding the new jitney routes or for ideas on parking. They have been open to suggestions. | ||
| SOrising Citizen Username: Sorising Post Number: 527 Registered: 2-2006 |
Trustee Rosner, it all comes down to priorities and leadership. The $250,000 to $500,000 or more the trustees are determined to spend on Tau, would undoubtedly increase not only the number of Jitney routes, but the speed with which they become available to South Orange residents. It is difficult to understand why puting so much money to draw people from outside of town (maybe, if you believe the dubious claims), is more important to the Board of Trustees than getting several more Jitneys operational a long time ago, but immediately, if several years later than they should have been. If a government agency is unable to accomplish even the most obvious needs a town has, why would anyone volunteer time for or with it? The government should not do things because people are watching its every move. It should do things because it is run by professionals who anticipate needs, priortize them, and act in the best interest of the town and its residents regardless of whether it is being watched or not. All appearances are that the Parking Authority and whoever else is responsible for the lack of Jitneys, does not possess the requisite professionalism the town and its residents need. Please do what you can to change this dismal state of affairs. | ||
| SOrising Citizen Username: Sorising Post Number: 528 Registered: 2-2006 |
By the way, I and many others gave our opinions to the PA years ago, to no avail. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2860 Registered: 4-2002 |
Tau will costs less than 20k per year (if you want to compare to an annual expense) and I really do no think it is helpful to bring up TAU in every discussion as an argument for spending money for other things. According to some, the 250,000 for Tau is the answer to every financial problem in the village. This seems to be the most obvious need to you, but based on the actual number of people who responded to the surverys, the actual number who use the jitney (and in other towns too) it does not seem obvious to me. This is not a case of run more jitneys and everyone will ride them. No matter what, running a jitney is expensive and to just add hundreds of thousands of dollar to the annual operating budget is not something that can be done overnight (and still be financially responsible). | ||
| MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 4454 Registered: 5-2001 |
The simple truth is that the "$250,000" for Tau is symptomatic of the poor financial decision making that is evident in so many other issues in town. (SOPAC, Old Stone House, Firehouse, ShopRite, John Gross tenure, subsidizing the Quarry developer, etc etc) Tau will cost us far more than $250,000 because the costs to move & re-site the gazebo are not even factored in to that number. Decisions are made too simplisticly without any thought for the bigger picture which is why the municipal taxes in this town are so high & continue to climb rapidly. edited to add: Mark - please note that I realize that YOU did take the right position on many of the examples above. However, the majority of the BOT did not. | ||
| Neen Citizen Username: Neen Post Number: 257 Registered: 1-2004 |
This Tau thing is absolutely absurd. That is not where tax money should be spent. If you want Tau and it costs a mere (as you imply) $20K annually, then instead of having petitioners downtown to prevent this from happening, I think you should be out there with a tin cup fundraising for this project. I would love to see if you could get this funded if you had to do like nonprofits do and actually fundraise instead of just creating a budget and increasing taxes every year to cover your whims. This is an elective expense, unlike bulk garbage pick up days, parking, and jitney service, which are all real needs. It's just like medical insurance. If you are sick and need care, they will cover it, if you simply choose to have your nose look a different way, they won't. | ||
| MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 4455 Registered: 5-2001 |
Tau = South Orange Nose Job ?  | ||
| SOrising Citizen Username: Sorising Post Number: 530 Registered: 2-2006 |
Trustee Rosner, since the BOT has not placed a cap on Tau spending, how can you claim that it will only cost $20,000 per year? What is this figure, anyway, maintenance costs after the initial $250,000 to $500,000 or more is put out? It would be great if Jitney service had unlimited amounts, as Tau does, to fund it. I would be interested in how many people responded to all Jitney-related surveys versus how many have spoken in favor of Tau before the BOT? Yet Jitney services are woefully underfunded while Tau receives unlimited funding. Why? | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2861 Registered: 4-2002 |
Neen, Sorising: Nowhere did I say only or a mere. That was the number that the CFO stated. My point is if we are going to have a discussion about a topic, there is no reason to bring up TAU in every thread. If more Jitney service is needed then we should be able to have the dialogue by itself. I am sure there are many residents who do not want to see a large tax increase to subsidize a jitney. I would like to think we can continue to increase jitney service, but at the same time, I would like to see more residents take advantage of the current routes and I would like to see spending increases kept to a minimum. Eventually, I would like to consider joint routes with Maplewood on weekends along with service running later on Fri-Sat nights as well as just having commuter jitneys. | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 1709 Registered: 3-2002 |
Mr. Rosner, Tau has become a touchpoint in this town, whether you and other trustees like it or not, because it is such a potent symbol of both the financial decisions made and the way the actual costs of these decisions are hidden from the townspeople until it is too late to question or make changes. The amount of playground talk on this and related topics has become amazing. Remember the alleged Marie Antoinette comment "Let them eat cake"? There is a risk that Tau is taking on that position in S.O. politics. I increasingly feel that the BOT is fighting the last war, building arts centers and erecting sculptures to "save" our town, when, bluntly, NJTransit already did it for us. I fear our lack of parking options puts this revitalization more at risk than any lack of downtown shopping or theater options. When prospective buyers are told that we don't even both keeping a waiting list for parking anymore, it has to eventually make a difference. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2864 Registered: 4-2002 |
Susan: Your points are well taken (and well stated). However, it makes it difficult to try and answer a question or have a dialogue if every time someone feels a need to throw Tau into the discussion. In this case, someone raised some concerns about the lack of jitney service and I was trying to respond to that concern. | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 1710 Registered: 3-2002 |
Mark, then ignore the Tau comment and discuss the finances of jitneys (unless you are signalling your support for Tau as currently mismanaged). For the moment, Tau (and SOPAC) will be mentioned by someone every time we are told that something is too expensive, like it or not. If you criticize those who bring it up, you sound like other BOT members who show little concern for the opinions of the townspeople, and little understanding of why the handling of Tau has rankled. I don't know if jitneys are viable answers or not. What are they costing the user and the town per trip? Do we have other viable options? Is anyone really clamoring for a jitney option to get downtown on weekends or Friday nights? Jitneys are a band-aid for the parking problem in a town where many people don't work perfectly reliable hours. Let's have a real discussion about building parking, preferably not linked to a discussion about building PILOT subsidized housing for hundreds of additional residents via "redevelopment" and eminent domain. We may decide that we want a large structure, or we may decide to take the risk of having a large commuter population that never gets the parking that we longer-term residents enjoy. Either way, we should have the discussion. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2865 Registered: 4-2002 |
Susan: I agree we should have the discussions. We are about to appoint members to a redevelopment committee and one of the charges will be to figure out about dealing with parking issues with developers. As for jitneys, I agree they are a band-aid at best and most people will tend to use them as a last resort. As for Tau, I have already stated I had issues with how it was presented to the BOT and to the public. (I am very curious to see what the TS committee wants to present tonight). | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12238 Registered: 5-2001 |
I am not sure jitneys are a last resort. Having lived in Maplewood up to a few months ago, a lot of people use the jitney because it was convenient, inexpensive and reasonably reliable. Maplewood has plenty of street parking for train commuters. At worst,you can park no more than a five minute walk from the station even if you don't leave your house until well after 8:00am. However, people still use the jitney regularly, which I admit is probably why one can park reasonably close to the station even at 8:30am. I suspect that in the long run jitneys are a lot cheaper than building and running large multi-story parking decks. | ||
| Mama Cloudy Citizen Username: Mamacloudy Post Number: 27 Registered: 1-2006 |
I heard talk of building a parking deck (ala Montclair) at the site of the now-closed gas station on Valley Street near the Volunteer Squad building. Was that just a rumor? | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 1717 Registered: 3-2002 |
"Last resort" may have been bad wording. However, jitneys do not work well for people who sometimes have to work late, like the commuter in my family. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 12240 Registered: 5-2001 |
Agreed, but there is a two word answer for most of us, "car voucher".  Incidentally, I hate the jitney. For the last few years we lived in MW during the summer I used the jitney to accomodate the home from college kids, at least in the evening. I always spent the whole trip home glancing at my watch in hopes of not missing the jitney. | ||
| Former Cowgirl Citizen Username: Formercowgirl Post Number: 161 Registered: 3-2006  |
Exactly, Susan. They also don't serve people who want to take the train in for a day trip. Hard to find any parking near the train with more than 2 hour meters. More jitneys: great. Alleviates a bit but does not solve the problem. | ||
| Howard Levison Citizen Username: Levisonhw Post Number: 108 Registered: 1-2004 |
The difference is that our Village President's vision is to increase the density in the downtown district to solve the problem. |
