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pan
Citizen
Username: Pan
Post Number: 99
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 2:38 pm: | 
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I think people should be more careful when using the words SHU. It includes SHU students, SHU faculty, SHU administration. Each one is a separate body when it comes to relationships with the town, and it should be dealt accordingly. You can't blame the students for SHU's low tax payments (they have a PILOT), as you can't blame the administration for the students' behavior out of campus. Yes, they should respond to the Village residents' complaints, but students will always be students. |
Washashore
Citizen
Username: Washashore
Post Number: 231
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 2:39 pm: |
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DAVE FOR BOT ! ! ! |
singlemalt
Supporter
Username: Singlemalt
Post Number: 889
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 2:44 pm: |
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I actually agree with Taylor M. Why does the town need to provide more to Seton Hall? It should be the other way around. What did ADE promise for this endorsement other than all day jitneys? It appears South Orange is getting nothing from Seton Hall (as usual).
Jeff DuBowy and David Belasco seem to be the candidates worth watching at this point. From the number of signs that went up this weekend, it appears Jeff has an awful lot of support (more than I thought he had).
With all due respect, I can care less who Seton Hall endorses. Until they come to the plate with how they can help this village, let them rot on the far east side of town. |
noracoombs
Citizen
Username: Noracoombs
Post Number: 69
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 3:01 pm: |
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Pan: Really good point. I think in the past year, the STUDENTS of SHU have made a huge step towards improving relations with Villagers (thanks in no small part to people like the fabulous Sheena). The problem, IMO, is not the students--it's the SHU administration. I feel like "being liked by Villagers" is just about the lowest priority on their list. Why shouldn't it be? After all, SHU gets pretty much everything they need from us already--why should it matter whether they have a good relationship with the town or not. IMO, it's the attitudes of the administration--from Father Bob on down--that need to change. |
Sheena Collum SHU
Citizen
Username: Sheena_collum
Post Number: 22
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 8:56 pm: |
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Noracoombs - that's again for your words. We'll definitely be working on this over the summer and I'd love to send you some proposals to get your insight. Thanks again for being supportive of our students (esp. the ones who wish to work with the residents)
Singlemalt,
Re: "With all due respect, I can care less who Seton Hall endorses. Until they come to the plate with how they can help this village, let them rot on the far east side of town."
What a charming individual you are... If only all people had such a positive outlook on life there would perhaps be world peace. |
Sheena Collum SHU
Citizen
Username: Sheena_collum
Post Number: 23
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 23, 2005 - 8:58 pm: |
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Noracoombs, I meant to say **THANKS AGAIN**. |
Scooby Doo
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 996
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 12:10 am: |
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There's a big difference between "make available" and "provide."
I've bever been a big supporter of fighting between lcoals and sudents. It's not productive. But the town seem to provide quite a bit to the school, while the school makes available some things to residents. Note, I'm not talking about students. I'm talking about the school.
I must confess a level of ignorance on this. But what has the school itself (not the students) provided to the town? I'm curious. And I don't just mean in the past couple of years. Historically, what has the school provided to the town? |
Sheena Collum SHU
Citizen
Username: Sheena_collum
Post Number: 31
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 12:33 am: |
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Scooby Doo,
First of all, I really like your name.
Second, by the end of this week, I will post a breakdown of what the University has done for the village. Hopefully this can clarify some questions many people have.
Thanks again,
Sheena
On a sidenote - the students in the ecology club did some wonderful work in S.O. this past week.
http://domapp01.shu.edu/depts/affairs/Setonian.nsf/(WebDisplayView)/5C9B6EA0CA809AA485256FEA0071F4B0?OpenDocument
(Copy and paste the entire url into your browser) |
Scooby Doo
Citizen
Username: Rastro
Post Number: 998
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 25, 2005 - 12:54 am: |
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When you provide that list, please don't include things like the money fOR SOPAC, which was given to accommodate changes that SHU requested, or the dugouts, which were done so that SHU women's softball could meet certain NCAA(?) requirements.
The town provides quite a bit on the backs of taxpayers. I'm interested in things the school provides to the town. As I said, I'm pleading ignorance on this. It's quite possible that the school provides a lot of things to us. I'm simply unaware of them.
Thanks for making a dialog possible between us residents and the town. One thing to remember (and I don't mean this in a condescending way), most of us have been to college, and remember it well. Whether we went to commuter colleges, city schools, private campus schools, or something else, we've been on both sides of this. And we know what we thought about our host towns. So don't assume (and I'm not saying you did assume) that we don't know what it's like to be on the other side of the gown/town debate. Many of us have.
BTW, I PL'ed, but I'm not sure if you saw... try www.tinyurl.com to fit those long URLs on a single line. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 6142
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Monday, May 2, 2005 - 9:08 pm: |
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[moved from the election forum to here] |
Jennifer Lackie
Citizen
Username: Jennifer_lackie
Post Number: 19
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 1:04 am: |
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I've been reading a lot about the idea of making Seton Hall a "college town" and discussion of exactly how Seton Hall students can take advantage of the town and surrounding communities. (This was all on another board, but I felt I should bring the discussion back to the SHU thread...) So, as I just finished my freshman year at Seton Hall, I wanted to give you all an honest overview of my year here, particurarily in relation to South Orange.
I'm originally from a small cow-town north of Boston. I worked on a dairy farm there. As the oldest of four kids, my car has always been my independence. I don't have a car here at Seton Hall because freshman are not allowed to have cars on campus. Even if they were, I still wouldn't have a car, because my sister and I share. (The life of a family!) I'm paying for college myself. My parents contribute a minimum to negligeable amount and my scholarship doesn't help enough. I'm a hardworking student. I don't drink as I'm underage and can't stand the smell of alcohol. As my friends will attest to, I'm a bit of a work-a-holic. I like to make sure I get good grades and read everything. But I still like to relax and let loose once in a while too, its necessary for my sanity.
So what exactly do I do on weekends when I am 'worked out'? Well... good question. Sometimes my friends and I will go out to eat, usually to Bunny's or Cryans. Great places, inexpensive food. Perfect. Sometimes I'll head into the city. That can get pricey though - $7 roundtrip for the train alone (if its not rush hour), and we all know that NYC isn't the cheapest place to visit alone. I love going into the city, especially to Canal Street, but, again, that is weather permitting, time permitting, money permitting. It's not a weekly event by any means.
If I'm really lucky, I can hit up one of my upperclassmen friends who has a car, and maybe we can go to Applebees for half-price appetizers. But, that's happened once this entire semester. And the mall is closing down soon... I don't drink, and am underage, so the bars in town aren't really my thing either.
I could go to the Maplewood movie theater, and I do, but coordinating the train schedule and movie start/end time can prove to be quite the challenge. And honestly, its kind of a pain to walk downtown sometimes. The walk back to SHU is worse because its uphill. At night, its dark because there are no/few streetlights. Very scary...
And about going in to Newark to go a museaum. I would do that except I am very afraid of Newark and I don't feel comfortable wandering around mindlessly there. I'll go to other towns, its hard though, especially since I don't know my way around.
I hear there's a bowling ally somewhere close. I'm excited about that because who doesn't love bowling?! They need to advertise more on campus.
I'm VERY EXCITED about the ShopRite going in in town. I'm not sure if you are aware, but Seton Hall food isn't the best in the world. They do have an area we you can get "grab and go" things, but everything is so pricey. (A 6 oz yogurt is $1). RiteAid is nice, its certainly been a life saver for me, but again, its pricey. A half a gallon of Skim at RiteAid costs about the same, if not more, that a gallon of Whole in Massachussetts! I also crave fruit and healthy foods that aren't packed with chemicals so they can sit on a shelf for years. I work for a doctor downtown and one day she gave me a box of strawberries. They went SO fast when I brought them back to school because fruit isn't really offered at school, and what is is of such poor quality.
I can't go back to my parents on weekends. It's a long ride...
So, just keep in mind, when you discuss redevelopment that there are students like me at Seton Hall. Yes, a good portion of our students are commuters, but a good portion aren't. 2200 students live in the residence halls on campus. This does not include those residents who live in appartments, etc off campus.
I know South Orange has many issues to juggle when it comes to redevelopment. But I strongly encourage you to take a look at the vast numbers of college students that could potentially be frequenting South Orange businesses. In order for students to go downtown, I believe the following things should be in place (just my opinion here, but I know of others who share the sentiment).
1. A moderately-priced grocery store to buy all kinds of food, not just junk food like RiteAid.
2. A bowling alley (where is it?), a movie theater (when will it be finished?) and other "destinations" that both college students and families of South Orange would enjoy.
3. Moderately priced restaraunts with variety (Variety is a wonderful thing!) Ie: Applebees? or other popular restaraunt that students would know of. I know Applebees in the mall is closing down and people LOVE Applebees. Good, relatively cheap food. Great.
3. A way to get there and back. I would prefer to avoid debate on who's going to pay for it, etc, I know that will come. But to be perfectly honest, all of my friends who I've talked to would love a ride downtown and would be frequenting downtown South Orange more often as a result.
4. Advertising! These places need to advertise on campus so much more!!!! The only way I heard about many of the businesses in South Orange is through my work with the Village Liaison Committee. South Orange has a lot to offer already, the businesses can't just wait for students to come to them though!
I know there's things I'm missing. My brain is still somewhat fried from all those finals, but I think the things above would be a good start.
Please don't make the assumption that we are all commuters who go party and destroy your lawns on weekends. Perhaps (and this is just my opinion), but perhaps there would be fewer alcohol-related incidents in town if there was something to do besides drinking. I know my suitemates drink because they ask me what else is there to do.
Just food for thought. Constructive criticism is, as always, appreciated! Or, if you feel more comfortable, email me at lackieje@shu.edu.
Oh, and for those of you who have asked via MOL and email, this is probably my last summer back in MA (my mom still doesn't like that idea). I went back this summer because I was offered a managerial position at my old job with a raise and 50 hours a week. I'm a broke college student, how could I possibly turn that down?! Next summer I plan taking classes and/or getting an internship somewhere. I'll be around though. |
Jennifer Lackie
Citizen
Username: Jennifer_lackie
Post Number: 20
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 1:25 am: |
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Haha, I forget to answer my own question.
Usually on weekends I end up doing homework  or Sheena drags me into doing VLC stuff (and don't even try to deny this Sheena!  ) or I end up doing work for one of the other organizations I'm in. We also will have Cranium tournaments between my friends and I. After Cranium, we'll watch some movies or just chill out. It's fun, but it gets old after a while and options of things in town to do would be nice. |
MHD
Citizen
Username: Mayhewdrive
Post Number: 2351
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 2:22 am: |
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"And the mall is closing down soon"
What do you mean??? |
Erin B. Whitham
Citizen
Username: Erin_whitham
Post Number: 9
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 2:54 am: |
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The word on the street is that St. Barnabas bought it and will be expanding. |
susan1014
Supporter
Username: Susan1014
Post Number: 590
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 9:43 am: |
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That rumor floated around on these boards months ago, with no verification. I'll believe it when I hear it for real...I can't honestly think why St. B would need that much space.
Regarding businesses and destinations in town...I can see that S. Orange isn't a great college town, but I don't think the town can fix it. There are plenty of available store fronts...if there is a good business proposition, I'm assuming that someone who knows the student world better than I do will see the opportunity and make the investment.
But if I were starting a business in town, honestly I'd start one aimed at the much larger number of upper middle class families in the neighborhood, rather than the 2200 students who live on campus. No matter how you slice it, downtown continues to be too far from campus, and a shuttle service frequent enough to make it convenient would be expensive to run.
I really hope that someone starts the businesses that you need, and that your university subsidizes the shuttle service that you need (as both my undergraduate and graduate institutions did, on some scale). How to create inexpensive student-focused haunts in an expensive suburb is not a minor problem. |
Lizziecat
Citizen
Username: Lizziecat
Post Number: 648
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 9:45 am: |
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Are students allowed to have bikes? In good weather you could bike into town, or even into Maplewood. |
Eliot Spitzer
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1081
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 10:26 am: |
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Lizziecat - I suggested that in another thread. I went to the Universiry of Michigan, and cars weren't permitted until the junior year. I kidded that Ann Arbor has more bicycles than Amsterdam.
It really is something that students should think about. Cuts down on the parking problem too.
Jennifer, Erin - What do you think?
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woodstock
Supporter
Username: Woodstock
Post Number: 984
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 11:46 am: |
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Having gone to a school in western NY (don't ever call it "upstate"), I can attest that bikes are fun, good exercise, utilitarian, and worthless more than half the time students are around. Between cold, snow and rain (and the fact that most students are not in town for most of the riding season), having one to use is nice, but hardly a substitute for a car or other covered transportation. |
Jennifer Lackie
Citizen
Username: Jennifer_lackie
Post Number: 21
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 12:03 pm: |
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I would love to have a bike on campus. I bike everywhere at home, its a great way to get around. Cheap too!
Having a bike on campus is really hard though. There is really only one, perhaps two places on campus to lock a bike up and its in front of one of the freshman residence halls. As woodstock mentioned, however, having a bike during the winter months and rainy season can pose quite a challenge. I don't know if any of you have seen a SHU dorm, but the rooms are really small. There is no way a bike could fit in there and still have a person be able to function normally in that room.
A bike would be nice, but really not feasible on campus. |
Soda
Supporter
Username: Soda
Post Number: 3122
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 12:07 pm: |
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Maybe the school could spring for some more bike racks. They're cheap, although not required by Title 9 like dugouts...
-s.
BTW: Thanks for the dugouts! |
Dave
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 6264
Registered: 4-1997
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 12:14 pm: |
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How about one of these: The SHU Skybus:
 |
Soda
Supporter
Username: Soda
Post Number: 3124
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 12:26 pm: |
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Jennifer Lackie
Citizen
Username: Jennifer_lackie
Post Number: 23
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 12:30 pm: |
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Soda: Although that seems like a good option, I'm not so sure how it would play out. I certainly hope that perhaps the school might spring for more racks, but for the few months (month, even?) that they would be useful, I'm not sure if thats the most cost-efficient way of going about things.
Also, Soda, what do you propose we do when it gets too cold/rainy/snowy to ride a bike everywhere?
Even if I could have a bike on campus, I'm not sure I would bring one just because its too hard. There's no place to put it in the winter months and its not like I can just bring it back and forth easily.
And in addition, times have changed a bit. Bikes are no longer as popular as they were even five years ago, especially among college students. I know that other schools still have a lot of bikes on campus, and that's great. However, my gut is telling me that the majority of SHU students wouldn't be crazy about pedaling around. |
Erin B. Whitham
Citizen
Username: Erin_whitham
Post Number: 11
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 1:17 pm: |
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I would love to have a bike on campus, but as soda and dave have hinted at it would be useless for 5 or 6 months of the year. Not only that, but I don't know if I could trust Jersey drivers to share the road with me.
Another issue that Jen brought up was redevelopment. What would we ride our bikes to? |
Eliot Spitzer
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1082
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 3:03 pm: |
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Motor scooters (Vespas and Lambrettas) were (are?) popular in Ann Arbor. We didn't know about helmets back then. Hint - don't make a sharp turn on your Vespa on Washtenaw Ave. when it's icy.
I think that seeing some Seton Hall coeds riding around South Orange on the rear of a motor scooter would do wonders for the relationship between Seton Hall and the Village.
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Erin B. Whitham
Citizen
Username: Erin_whitham
Post Number: 13
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 7:42 pm: |
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Hmm... what a suggestion. Can we expect to see residents at SHU, too? Despite the parking problems we've talked about, we always make room for our fellow villagers. Come join us on the green someday! |
Sheena Collum SHU
Citizen
Username: Sheena_collum
Post Number: 76
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 7:43 pm: |
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Jennifer Lackie,
Re: Usually on weekends I end up doing homework or Sheena drags me into doing VLC stuff (and don't even try to deny this Sheena! )
I LOVE YOU JENNIFER! You're one of the best workers at SHU! 
(Note to self: we need more Jenn Lackies in the world)
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Eliot Spitzer
Supporter
Username: Doublea
Post Number: 1083
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 7:56 pm: |
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Erin - I would guess that you might see more residents at SHU events. You and your schoolmates have done a pretty good job of being ambassadors for Seton Hall. |
Soda
Supporter
Username: Soda
Post Number: 3129
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 8:23 pm: |
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Jen&Erin: You both sound perfectly charming and well-intentioned, but you're also uninformed and, evidently, rather sheltered. In fall, winter, and early spring as well, all over the northern tier of these United States, college students ride bikes all over their campuses and their towns.
Both the photo I posted above and this one right here (taken in Illinois)
are typical campus scenes.
Perhaps students who bike are just more robust people, but maybe you both should look into bike transit as an alternative to grousing so much. It's fun, healthy, non-polluting, socially acceptable, and good exercise. You're young! It won't kill ya!
-s.
BTW: I hear they make bikes these days that practically do all the gear-shifting for you, making hills a non-issue. And the insurance on a bike is loads cheaper than just about anything except shoe leather... |
Jennifer Lackie
Citizen
Username: Jennifer_lackie
Post Number: 24
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 8, 2005 - 10:38 pm: |
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Soda: I'm originally from MA, and believe me, I know about cold weather and bikes. It gets cold up there, believe me, and yes, people do still bike around all the time. I've worked at several Boston-area colleges, and I've seen it first hand. (I truly believe that some of them are genuinely crazy - would you be thrilled to go down to the grocery store in the middle of winter on your bike?)
I'm all for the bikes, but then again I work on a farm. I can drive a tractor and milk cows like the best of 'em! Getting a little down and dirty doesn't bother me very much. Prada is big at Seton Hall. As is Kate Spade and Armani Exchange. People who sport clothing from places like that are not huge fans of getting on a bike and travelling to Maplewood for the movie theater.
It's unfortunate that not everyone is open to such ideas, but then again, I can't force them to think otherwise.
To be honest, bikes are a great idea, but would not work at Seton Hall. The student body as a whole simply is not open to the idea. Putting money into something that won't be used is a waste, and contrary to popular belief, Seton Hall doesn't have money to throw away.
And Erin made a good point. Say everyone loved the idea of bikes... where would we possibly go?
Also Soda, a little grousing is a good thing. Everyone complains on MOL... look at the election thread if you don't believe me. There is a differance however because we try to work pro-actively to improve relations between the town and the school by opening a dialogue and voicing concerns on both sides. Through our discussions I've certainly learned a lot about the South Orange perspective of things, and I hope that non-student readers begin to better understand the Seton Hall perspective of things. I think, eventually, with transparency and open communication, Seton Hall and South Orange will be able to fully embrace each other. The road to get there will be tough, there's no doubting that, but the best things are never easy.
Let's work together to understand each other's points of view. If we don't, things are just going to get much harder for everyone . |
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