| Author | Message | ||
     Eliot Spitzer Supporter Username: Doublea Post Number: 1035 Registered: 3-2003 |
And my wife makes two. | ||
| John Pogany Citizen Username: Pizzaz Post Number: 1766 Registered: 11-2001  |
We are not proposing the taxpayers cover the cost of the transportation. As Sheena indicated in another post, the SHU community offers a considerable untapped resource. The jitney service which is funded initially through grants is not envisioned to be a burden to the community. We have been designated as a "Transit Village", we need to think out of the box as to how this service will be self supporting. As Howard said, it must be an integral part of an overall master-plan which the collective community will support. Doublea, we are looking for solutions to the problems of traffic, parking, commuting and development. Please understand our focus. I'm 100% with you as to not increasing the tax burden on the residents. I hope to gain your understanding and perspective. We are the candidates who want to engage all residents in the decision-making process, and not to favor one over another. The DMC committee recommendation is the first step to align our efforts for the downtown and then to incorporate the other services into a viable self sustaining organization. The DMC initial budget request must be aligned to a realistic revenue plan which will not burden the resident taxpayer. It can happen, we ask for your support. May 10th VOTE for South Orange-ADE Howard Levison www.howard-levison.com John Pogany www.johnpogany.com Eric DeVaris www.ericdevarisfortrustee.com | ||
| Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 2974 Registered: 5-2001  |
"I am proposing an immediate start of a regular all-day jitney, back and forth from campus." Doubletalk, John. -s. BTW: It's easy to understand why, as operator of a watering hole & eatery popular -- and certainly desirous of becoming moreso -- with SHU's student population, you'd be in favor of any measure easing their already short trip to Bunny's (and, of course, the rest of Downtown S.O., NJ Transit, etc..). That said, since you're asking Villagers to vote for you for Trustee, you should be asked to present your civic PRIORITIES. They should be relevant to the entire Village, and not pander to any small segment (of either the electorate or potential customers). | ||
| MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2148 Registered: 5-2001  |
Ignore the Troll | ||
| hariseldon Citizen Username: Hariseldon Post Number: 314 Registered: 5-2001  |
Not a troll post at all. I, for one, am very interested in Mr. Pogany's answers. (BTW John, it was good of you to change your screename, finally.) | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 551 Registered: 3-2002 |
MHD, Soda is no more of a troll than you are. Both of you are opinionated, sometimes gadflies, with strong perspectives on the issues. I too am interested in the candidates' answers on this issue. I thank John for his. | ||
| Eliot Spitzer Supporter Username: Doublea Post Number: 1038 Registered: 3-2003 |
Thank you Patrick Joyce for suggesting to Sheena this evening at the BOT meeting that it would be helpful if Seton Hall contributed to the operational costs of the jitney if additional service is provided to Seton Hall. Patrick, as we all know, is a big supporter of improving relations with Seton Hall and making it more a part of the community. The fact that Patrick made this suggestion should be considered seriously by all parties. Patrick - You have been a voice of reason on the BOT and we'll all miss you. | ||
| Taylor M Citizen Username: Anotherusername Post Number: 450 Registered: 8-2004 |
John- Don't the South Orange and Maplewood commuters who use the Jitney have to pay to use it? Will SHU students have to pay for it? If the town is going to get a Jitney to SHU, why not one for those living in Newstead? There are plenty of nannies in Newstead without cars who'd love to go to the Village as well. And what are you demanding from SHU? Why does it seem they have a list of DEMANDS that the canidates are considering, when there are plenty of more important things the town needs. Please tell me why these students aren't DEMANDING this service from the college they attend? Want to know why? Because then their tutition will go up! Sure they want a Jitney; as long as the taxpayers of NJ pay for it. Why can't the WALK or take the bus? A lot of us walked a lot further then SHU to the Village when we went to Columbia High School! If we could walk as high schoolers, why can't college students? I was at an award dinner tonight and the young lady sitting next me happened to go to SHU. Actually she just graduated. She can't understand why these students, who btw don't live here year round, even want to vote in BOE or BOT elections. National elections are a different story. I'd like to know how many of these students, especially those vocal ones, have SHU listed on their driver's license as their 'legal' address. If they own a car, is the car registered with a South Orange address? I'm willing to bet "NO!" That's one of the points I'm trying to make. Those who live in the apartments year round are one thing. How can the students who have moved off campus at the end of the semester still vote? | ||
| bets Supporter Username: Bets Post Number: 1192 Registered: 6-2001  |
Isn't Bunny's Ristorante the longest-running local business still in operation? Nice shot, tho, Popseldon. The current administration has been tango-ing with SHU for years - where is your outrage over the bond the VILLAGE certified with the "promise" of repayment for the SOPAC? We have still never been given a straight answer for that one. Instead, people are attacking an engaged local entrepreneur who works a full-time job, coaches youth sports teams, volunteers for many local organizations. But because he supports a jitney from the campus of SHU to downtown he's maligned. Maybe more students will get their drugs from Bill!! Ever consider that? And, as Howard points out above, regular jitney stops at SHU were always planned. Hey - if you live up the hill, you're allowed at least 2 cars and 1 child. And unlimited Starbucks coffee. | ||
| Eliot Spitzer Supporter Username: Doublea Post Number: 1039 Registered: 3-2003 |
bets - At the meeting last night, Sheena used the information provided by Howard to support the argument why SHU should be provided with extra service. It was pointed out that this information was in an application for an operating funds grant made by the Village. This wasn't the request for the actual jitney. The full request for operating funds wasn't granted and in fact it was explicity stated that the grant was only for commuter purposes. It was mentioned that we are getting a second jitney. As I noted above, Patrick Joyce suggested to Sheena that Seton Hall contribute to the costs. Why don't the ADE candidates just say they will pursue this additional service by working with the students to get the university to help? Sheena said in another post additional service will be provided only if businesses help, the university helps and with grants. As pointed out last night, the grants provided so far have been restricted to commuters only. Why can't Seton Hall contibute to the jitneys. Patrick Joyce suggested balancing the needs of university and its students with the tax burden of the village taxpayers. I don't understand why any candidates wouldn't try to do the same. | ||
| Eliot Spitzer Supporter Username: Doublea Post Number: 1040 Registered: 3-2003 |
I know Sheena said she is busy with finals and wouldn't be able to post for a while. Perhaps when she returns she can post what the administration told her regarding the elimination of the van/shuttle service. She said she was going to discuss this with the administration yesterday. | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 554 Registered: 3-2002 |
I'm happy to have as much Jitney service as Seton Hall and local merchants find economically appropriate to fund -- but I'm not willing to put my tax dollars into it without a significantly higher standard of proof. I suppose I'd be OK with helping fund it (significantly less than 50%), but only after the University/Student Association and/or the local merchants have voted for its importance and viability by putting significant "skin in the game". How much is it worth to you in student fees to have shuttle service to downtown every 15 minutes? How much is it worth to me in tax dollars? How much is it worth to the downtown merchants? This is real money that we are talking about. Service every 15 minutes with 4 stops on campus would presumaby require two full time drivers per shift. Presumably you are talking both day and evening shifts. If we assume four full time drivers and two vans, I'm assuming that we are talking $200-300,000 per year. (someone with more motor fleet experience is welcome to edit my numbers...but include cost of ownership and maintenance for vans, gas, salaries and benefits). We have about 5500 households in town. Seton Hall has roughly 5200 students. If totally subsidized by taxpayers, it would be about $50 per house. If totally subsidized by student fees, it would be about $50 per student per year. So far, grant makers have been unwilling to fund. If the van charges for service, some money would be recouped, but not nearly the cost of the service (not 700 riders per day at $1 per ride!) So, if it is proposed, how much of the cost is to be born by each of us? Is this a realistic plan? I'm happy to debate with real numbers, but not to sign blank checks. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 1872 Registered: 4-2002 |
Susan: Good post and right on target. Everyone but SHU seems to be willing to contribute to the jitney. I do want to point out that NJ Transit runs a bus (runs no less than every 30 minutes) that stops at SHU and in the downtown. The taxpayers of NJ subsidize all bus routes. The bus runs all day and night. Also, NJ Transit has stated that grants for jitneys will be awarded only for the purpose of getting commuters to a train station or to their bus routes. They will not subsidize a jitney service that competes with their bus routes. Each jitney route right now costs about $60,000 a year to operate (driver, gas, repairs, etc). That is for five days a week. The students want jitney service all day and at nights plus weekends. So I think Susan's numbers are on the mark. Plus remember, most of the students disappear by mid May and don't return to the end of August. Added to the three week break at Dec./Jan. plus the sping break and long weekends means running empty jitneys. Part-time residents making demands to the village and using the threat of impacting our election should not be acceptable to anyone. I would like to know (and this was asked last night), how much pressure have the students put on SHU's administration to contribute to the cost of the jitney. (Remember, they wanted parking permits at a discount ). OR as pointed out earlier why can't SHU run their own jitney. There are universities and corporations that do just that. Since the students say there is such a large demand they should be able to add a fee to their tuition to cover the cost. Also, the can put ads (on the inside of the jitneys) from local establishments that want to participate to help offset the cost. Our taxes are high enough and I will never vote to give free jitney service to SHU before providing service to all the residents who pay property taxes. Quite frankly, I am amazed this is an issue this election and I would think all 8 candidates would be on the same page. | ||
| singlemalt Supporter Username: Singlemalt Post Number: 909 Registered: 12-2001  |
I have a dream - A SHU 100% funded jitney running 24 x 7 x 365 with a Bunny's Pizza advertisement lining both sides of the bus as it makes it way up and down SO Ave.  GO PIRATES! | ||
| Two Sense Citizen Username: Twosense Post Number: 84 Registered: 7-2004 |
Don't forget that SHU's residential students are heavily skewed towards "suitcase commuters," who arrange their class schedules around 3-4 days of classes, and head home for a long weekend. Of its 4,800 undergraduates, 70% are from NJ, and less than half of all undergraduates live on campus. When SHU starts investing in building a true residential student program, complete with weekend events and activities, South Orange will see a positive impact -- with or without shuttles. Having said that, SHU must step up to the plate and provide shuttle service for its students -- linking the campus with South Orange's downtown and public transportation. It's as fundamental as providing food service and a bookstore. | ||
| Scooby Doo Citizen Username: Rastro Post Number: 1007 Registered: 5-2004  |
Can anyone name another town that provides shuttle service for their resident college? I don't doubt there might be some. I'm just curious of which ones do. When I was in school, the school ran a "drunk bus" each night, Thursday through Sunday. When I worked int he boonies, my company ran a shuttle from the train station to the company's buildings. I don't thin it occurred to either my school, nor my company, to ask the town to subsidize this cost. | ||
| Two Sense Citizen Username: Twosense Post Number: 85 Registered: 7-2004 |
Colleges and universities routinely provide student/employee shuttle service to nearby services and destinations to enhance the quality of life on campus -- particularly outside of cities where public transportation alternatives typically are limited. Since the number one complaint among SHU students allegedly pertains to quality of life on campus, including limited meaningful evening/weekend student leisure activities, its clear that SHU student leaders and thoughtful BOT candidates should be channeling more of their time and energy towards working with SHU's administration -- both respect to shuttles and parking for students. It may be clever politics to pander to students most visceral concerns with parking and transportation, particularly since NJ politicians have a long history of pandering to voters over auto insurance and parkway tolls. However, are these issues really central to successfully governing South Orange into the future? Let's hope ADE's new campaign isn't "It's the shuttle, stupid." | ||
| Stuart0628 Citizen Username: Stuart0628 Post Number: 20 Registered: 2-2003 |
Princeton instituted shuttle service in the early 1980s. As I recall, the original reason was not to shuttle sobriety-challenged students back to dorm rooms, but rather to provide safe transit for those who feared personal assault. Here's a link to that info: http://www.princeton.edu/main/administration/transportation/shuttles/ Important to note: The Princeton system only makes stops on campus. Several of these stops are near downtown, but downtown is not expressly served. Princeton University is much closer to downtown Princeton than SHU is to downtown South Orange. | ||
| Arjay Citizen Username: Arjay Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2003 |
For what it's worth. From the SHU admissions guide... Seton Hall’s location provides students with the best of both worlds: close to the action, fun and excitement of a major metropolis thriving nearby without being engulfed by it. Nestled in the charming Village of South Orange, New Jersey, our campus is only 14 miles from New York City. South Orange is a suburban residential area with tree-lined streets, old Victorian homes and a quaint town center with bookstores, coffee shops, and restaurants. Right in the center of town is the South Orange train station (only a 10-minute walk from campus). Frequently scheduled trains will take you into the heart of mid-town Manhattan in just 25 minutes. The capital of finance, fashion, art, entertainment, the United Nations and unparalleled internship opportunities are all just a few short minutes from our campus. The possibilities are endless! "Only a 10-minute walk from campus" they say, in emphasizing its closeness. | ||
| Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 2983 Registered: 5-2001 |
Many universities (albeit most with campuses considerably larger than SHU's) operate intra-campus shuttles for both of the reasons just cited by Stuart0628, without asking for subsidies from the surrounding municipalities. -s. BTW: I believe that offering free jitney service to the SHU community (even if justified as a means of increasing business in our Village) is purely an act of political pandering -- and worse, those who base campaign promises upon it miss the larger point: SHU students will visit our Downtown ONLY if they are attracted by the eating, shopping, and service options offered there, which (natch) is also the case with most S.O. residents. I want to spend my time and money locally, but if my needs and appetites aren't satisfied in the Village, I'll go elsewhere. Where I differ with some of the comments made by SHU students on that subject is: I do not believe that more "franchises", as they were referred to (fast food especially) are the best long-term way for South Orange to grow. We need more astute merchants, creative restaurantuers, and niche-filling service providers to open up here. We need Trustees committed to THOSE objectives, which are the REAL incentives to patronage. |
