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Thread Originator Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post Archive through June 21, 2005 jayjay Amie Brockway-Metcal 20  1  6-21-05  12:54 pm   Closed: New threads not accepted on this page

Author Message   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2009 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 2:10 pm:        Jayjay: At least one resident in S. Orange reached out to Taste of Asia and helped put them in touch with S. Orange/Main Street. They have kept their Chatam location and have been successful there for years. It seemed a good fit since there was not a sit-down Asian food restaurant in town and TOA has a great reputation (evidenced by their Zagat review). I guess one could argue he should have spent more to fix up the space, but I am not sure that would have made enough of a difference. As for franchises like Wild Noodle (or any one of the mexican places cropping up or Salad Works, etc) the franchisees pick their locations. Based on a variety of factors (polulation, density, access to major roads, closeness to a destination store, etc) they usually seek out opening in Marlboro, Westfield, Ridgewood, Hackensack, Malls, Hoboken, etc. Since the investment is about the same to open in S. Orange or Westfield, one can easily understand why a person would make that choice. My guess is that unless one is willing to take a larger risk, we won't see a wild noodle or similar until there is more market saturation and a franchisee is looking for a secondary location. For those who are interested in pursuing a franchise with Wild Noodle, here is the link to their webpage: http://www.wildnoodles.com/locations.asp   Kristen Williamson Citizen Username: Kris219 Post Number: 30 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 4:30 pm:        I've only been to TOA once and I absolutely loved everything except the price. The dishes that I tried were great, but it is not worth a $10-$20 per person for lunch or dinner when I can get one for less than $10. I can say that is why I did not have much of a desire to go back, but I don't know about everyone else. As far as SHU is concerned, 1st the bike idea isn't going to float. Bikes are popular in Universities where the campus is spread over many acres or across a town. It takes no more than 5 minutes to walk anywhere on campus. The bike investement won't be used for campus and wont be used enough around the local areas to be worth the purchase. Are there even places to keep them in town? I believe I have seen a few, but I always keep in mind the night my friends were driving up South Orange Ave and they literally watched two guys steal a bike, jump into a car and speed away. It was pretty obvious the bike wasn't theirs, because then that house would have been theirs too. Seton Hall knows that $90,000+ a year for funding another bus/jitney/shuttle/whatever won't come out of the clouds. Don't keep assuming that SHU is looking for an expensive transportation handout. Cmonty: I agree with your entire post. It's nice to know that one more person can see this all clearly! O&G: I like to compare our cafe to eating at your favorite restaurant for every meal. Granted our food isn't as good as your favorite, but you really get sick of it after a while. They try to work on providing a variety, but sometimes it all seems just the same. Our cafe is open til 1am, but at point, you can only get pizza, sandiwches and ice cream. Students have been asking for other sections of the cafe to be opened later so that there is coffee and other foods, but that is comething in the future. Who knows if there still will be an off campus calling...I'm guessing there will be. Sitoyan: You're right that it is hard to get students off campus during the day. Walking there in between classes might not get you back in time for class, not to mention being discouraged by any unfavorable weather. On the other hand with driving, it just isn't worth it to leave your parking spot on campus to fight for one in town, to then fight for on on campus again, and hoping not to miss a class. Also some students just aren't familiar enough with the to be confident enough to walk down and back in time for class. Students generally either have 10-15 minutes or 1 hour break between classes. This trend is mainly among commuters who schedule classes consecutively, as compared to a resident like me who had an 8am, 1pm, 4pm and 5:45pm on Thursdays during the Spring semester. I have the freedom to do that since I live right here. Kristen   AntoninaKC Citizen Username: Antoninakc Post Number: 19 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 6:18 pm:        Everyone who says that SHU students dont contribute any money towards SO restaurants/cafes/pubs etc obviously dont live here. To the people who say that SHU students would only come to town if they had a shuttle, must not live here either. To the people who imply that SHU students never go downtown or eat out at any establishment- I must assure you that even though all 10,000 people arent walking the 10 minutes into "town" every single day year round- it doesnt mean that none of them do. In short, lighten up and realize that SHU people (students, staff, teachers/visitors) constantly shop/eat/drink downtown just like "real" residents.   Unohu Citizen Username: Wmsmith Post Number: 3 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 6:20 pm:        Where is the Wordsmith when we need her?   pat houlahan Citizen Username: Imsocurious Post Number: 12 Registered: 9-2004 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 9:23 pm:        I have been reading all the postings regarding the feedback of likes and dislikes of our local restaurants. I am shocked and surprised that even if the restaurant serves great quality food and I quote, "...and I absolutely loved everything except the price. The dishes that I tried were great, but it is not worth a $10-$20 per person for lunch or dinner when I can get one for less than $10" cannot ask for a more reasonable price? What are we comparing it to? For less than $10, are we comparing them to a Chinese Take-out? If that's the mentality, any Asian restaurant come to town will suffer. Premium quality cost extras and if that's not the factor why they charge higher prices then there is no point to encourage quality markets or restaurant to come to South Orange. Taste of Asia might not be the greatest looking in design, nobody takes the amenities such as wine buckets, flowers on the table, table clothed with batiks, wine glasses, frozen beer glasses, proper dinner ware, computerized system (no miscalculation) which was all neglected. I personally pay a lot of attention to minute details which enhance my dining experience and appreciate it. If food value of unappropriate comparison is what we do, other quality establishments will receive unpleasant remarks. My other concern is people complaining about the wine prices in Voro is too high, does anybody know how much does the liquor license cost? 100% - 150% mark-up is not consider high compare with a lot of places does 200% and more. We want quality places but we are not willing to pay, what's wrong with the picture here.   pat houlahan Citizen Username: Imsocurious Post Number: 13 Registered: 9-2004 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 9:44 pm:        Jayjay: "Given the building and the look, probably would have done great as a down and dirty Chinese eat-in restaurant, which we could use in town." We have one in town, it's called Family Buffet.   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 34 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 9:53 pm:        Pat- In order to get me in in the first place, there has to be curb appeal. Taste of Asia does not look like a fine restaurant from the outside. The whole building (or combination of 2 buildings)looks sort of tacky. They should have paid more attention to that. Consider CentAnni in Maplewood. The place really looks like a quality restaurant. It makes you want to go in and that is the first requirement. Maybe the place could make a go of it as a restaurant, but certainly not as a pricey destination sort of place. You've got to get the mix right to be successful.   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 35 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 9:55 pm:        Pat- I don't consider Family Buffet or (---ily Buffet as its known these days, to be a Chinese restaurant. I don't know what it is. I'm thinking more of Hunan Spring In Springfield or Mr. Chu in East Hanover. Good Chinese restaurants in former diners.   susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 722 Registered: 3-2002 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 10:01 pm:        Pat, Kristen is a student I believe...please don't be harsh on her for being cost sensitive, and caring more about price than wine glasses and computerized ordering systems. It's those of us who have finished our degrees and gotten full time jobs who have to keep the town's better sit-down restaurants going. I'm thrilled that we have students coming to town to eat, but I know that they are looking for different qualities in a restaurant than I am!   Kristen Williamson Citizen Username: Kris219 Post Number: 31 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 10:29 pm:        Thanks for the defense Susan! Pat, I have eaten at places just as good or better and the meal didn't cost me that amount. The food that I had did not cost anywhere near that much to prepare, so the markup was way to much for me, especially if the atmosphere, service, etc. didn't overwhelmingly compensate. One great Asian restaurant in Chicago costs you over $30 for dinner, but you're not just getting a chicken breast on a bed or rice. I can cook up some ginger with chicken and rice any day, but I don't need to pay that much for just a small dish. The take-out places don't serve food as good or healthy as TOA, but the mark-up is still unnecessary to me... especially when a federal work-study job doesn't permit me to be spending that kind of money per meal. Antonina- Great post, but let me ask you, do you agree that SHU is an under-utilized consumer base? I am working on a few programs that might help remedy that and encourage students to spend more time and money in SO. I will open a new thread soon to get everyone's feedback on the ideas. Kristen   pat houlahan Citizen Username: Imsocurious Post Number: 14 Registered: 9-2004 Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 10:47 pm:        Kristen, I apologize for being harsh. We are talking about two catagories altogether. I shouldn't criticize you for being a student with a budget on spending. I've been down your path before and I understand.   Sheena Collum SHU Citizen Username: Sheena_collum Post Number: 172 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 5:15 am:        Pat - Very nice post! Students would generally love to go to the more expensive restaurants but financially it's not something we can do on a normal basis. I know Kristen likes Texas Weiner (she always drags me there) Just a quick recap (and please no one look at the time of this post - I promise I have a life, lol) Bret W - I understand what you're saying about discouraging the "after hours" crowd but Old and Gray has it right - it would be a smart idea to extend hours on Friday and Saturday nights. I think it's fair to say that the non-college crowd is out and about later during the weekend hours as well as the high school students. If business slows down when students leave there's always a chance to go back to normal operating hours. Tom - a large portion of our students are commuters and I don't think the majority of them are in favor of putting a bike in their trunk and using it for the 1/2 hour they have in between class. Also I fear that if the majority of students decided to do the bike thing, the village would then be concerned about bike traffic on the sidewalks along S.O. Avenue and I'm sure pedestrians wouldn't be too thrilled. But don't fret, the university is working on solutions right now (both Kristen and Brian have worked endless hours on transportation concerns). Cmonty - right on - come hang out on campus; think the students would like you, lol. Two sense - you're right on target, I frequently go back to businesses where the owners are down right remarkable - two examples are Cryan's and Bunnys (not just b/c the beverages) - the owners are soooo good to the students and they get rave reviews on campus. Susan & Antonia - sooo smart... Trustee Rosner, last but not least - I can understand how franchises pick their ideal location but I imagine a little encouragement from S.O. wouldn't hurt. I imagine efficient and effective redevelopment plays a crucial role in attracting new businesses to S.O. Once SOPAC is finished (and eventually the Beifus lot, God willing) and all the other projects, I think it would be a premiere area for a place like "Wild Noodle" (I'd go just because that name is hot). I’m sure businesses also examine parking as a major factor. Is it easily accessible to people? A clear domino effect - lovely downtown - lovely residents and wonderful students going downtown - more appealing to new restaurants to come to S.O. Make sense, eh? And not to open a big can of worms but if PILOTS are so beneficial to S.O. (as stated by all members from the BOT) - why would you not utilize this incentive as leverage to bring more restaurants here? Long post – please accept my humble apology   Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 3389 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 8:10 am:        Sheena: Please. You're killin' me. Enough with the "lol"s already! Use a smilie if you've simply gotta, but please... I'm beggin' ya! Thanks very much. Your pal, -s.   Sheena Collum SHU Citizen Username: Sheena_collum Post Number: 173 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 9:32 am:        Geez... sizzle down Soda   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2010 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 9:49 am:        Sheena: A little encouragement is how we got Cold Stone in S. Orange. I am sure as we get closer to the grand opening of SOPAC we will have less trouble getting other businesses in town. I know that we talked with at least two other franchises and both have said they are not ready to come to S. Orange yet. When pressed, they both said they want to see the theater open and some improvements to the retail space that is currently available (in other words, the landlords have to make their space more attractive or lower the rent). One of the important reasons for Beifus to be built was because it brings almost 12,000 square feet of retail space. He has been given a PILOT to help insure the success of the project. He will have the location and the type of space that a place that a franchise might consider (and I know many have their own favorites).   Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 3393 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 10:50 am:        Oh, and Sheena: ...Before my fazzizzle is completely shazzizzled, here's a peace offering: Of course, never having had the personal pleasure of meeting you, I can't be sure, but don't you think this version looks more like the real you? Please feel free to copy and use it as your avatar, knowing that it was my pleasure to allow MOLers to view you in a more realistic light. Or not... -s.   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 37 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 10:51 am:        Mr.Rosner- Why is solicitation of franchises done without public involvement as to what the public would like to see in town? This again speaks to the need for professional development people who can set a vision and strategy and work development efforts against that. This piecemeal approach is not the way to go about it, in my opinion.   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2011 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 11:30 am:        Jayjay: Not sure what you mean about public involvement. In the case of Cold Stone, Main street worked with the landlord in seeking out an ice cream business. Main Street is made up of volunteers who are residents of S. Orange. In the case of one potential franchise, I reached out myself to a franchise owner who has a place in another town. I discussed S. Orange with him. I hope that he will open a place in the village within two years (his time frame, not mine but he won't open before SOPAC does). If you are asking how you can be involved, I would suggest joining Main Street (or the DMC as a volunteer when/if it is created). Even though another professional might help, in the end a lot of what happens depends on the landlords that own property in S. Orange. Some seem willing to sit with empty property (waiting for the absolute highest rent they can get without having to make improvements to the space). Some landlords have said they do NOT want outside help or the village interfering with them. Some businesses where the business owner and the propertyowner are the same are doing well enough that they have no intention of selling their building or spending one dime to fix up the space (I won't mention any names online - and you can check out the thread where you have posted - business hall of shame).   Sheena Collum SHU Citizen Username: Sheena_collum Post Number: 174 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 11:45 am:        Soda, WHOA! Major thread drift and the answer is that picture screams "too much flash". And due to a bad run in with some hair dye... I actually now have really dark hair, but if it makes you happy, I will update soon. In the meantime, I could definitely not accept your ever so gracious gift without one of my own. Please accept this avatar... (I regret I am not as photoshop saavy however... I learned "paint" just for you) Oh... and BTW Soda: lololololololololololololololololololololol From... Your Pal, Sheena   Lucy Citizen Username: Lucy Post Number: 17 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 1:19 pm:        Sheena Blonde or brunett we love you! Soda you're just flat.   Two Sense Citizen Username: Twosense Post Number: 235 Registered: 7-2004 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 2:30 pm:        MRosner: "One of the important reasons for Beifus to be built was because it brings almost 12,000 square feet of retail space. He has been given a PILOT to help insure the success of the project. He will have the location and the type of space that a place that a franchise might consider (and I know many have their own favorites)." Does Beifus' tax abatement (oops, PILOT) include any provisions for qualifying retail mix/use? Or, can Beifus benefit from our generous PILOT, and merrily lease his tax-unburdened space to another unneeded bank (our 8th), unneeded nail salon, or retail-unfriendly medical practice -- to name just a few high-paying, less desirable "retail" uses?   Sheena Collum SHU Citizen Username: Sheena_collum Post Number: 175 Registered: 4-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 2:37 pm:        well there's nothing more to say than "I LOVE LUCY!"   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2015 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 2:43 pm:        Two Sense: He can rent to anyone - no limitations in the agreement. However there are ordinances that prevent certain things (including Doctor offices on the first floor ). Theoretically, it could be cost prohibitive for a nail salon to open there because they would have to vent out the fumes via the roor (this is what was stated at a planning and zoning meeting about two years ago). Mr. Beifus uses his own realtor that he will be using. He has not wanted any help from the village. It was just one of the reasons I was not comfortable in giving him a PILOT agreement.   Two Sense Citizen Username: Twosense Post Number: 238 Registered: 7-2004 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 5:49 pm:        MRosner: Without any limitations, it's folly to suggest how Beifus' will use his space, and that a PILOT will ensure any particular use of his retail space. And, since you brought up the village ordinance prohibiting opening a doctor's office in a ground-floor retail zone, how exactly did our village president get a variance to convert the retail space in his building on Scotland Road and Taylor Street into a doctor's office, completely screened by opaque shades? Anyone who knows anything about downtown revitalization will confirm that this is among the worst actions that a municipality can take, if it's the least bit interested in revitalizing its downtown. That's why there are ordinances prohibiting this; to protect the public's interests. P.S. Since that space is now for rent, again, can his variance be revoked?   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 38 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 7:21 pm:        Two Sense- Excellent points. It seems like these PILOT's are granted without some important aspects considered. Wouldn't it be just great if the PILOT were granted only to find that we have another cleaner or bank or worse move into the retail space. I don't know why the BOT's think they are experts on redevelopment. Maybe South Orange and Maplewood could have worked together using the same re-development professionals. We might get some cost efficiences plus, a redvelopment strategy could have taken into account the needs of both communities and insure that recruitment efforts for businesses worked synergistically, rather than competitively. P.S.: I, too, wondered about that doctor's office.   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2018 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 10:04 am:        Two Sense: First off, just for the record, I voted against the PILOT and I have given several reasons in the past. You will have to ask the zoning board why they gave a variance or the village president. I don't know the reason. The argument is that prime space will attract better businesses. Only time will tell. It would seem that every town in NJ has a surplus of nail salons, cleaners and banks. Somebody must be using them and their services. One would think at some point there would no longer be a need for new ones. Of course, I could say the same thing about Starbucks especially since I don't drink coffee.   MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2539 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 10:15 am:        Mark, It's unfair to compare us to "every town in NJ", because obviously there are plenty of towns that have found a way to gentrify the sagging downtowns. Freehold has gone from "Main Street's whitewashed windows" in Brice Springsteen's song to a thriving "restaurant town", despite a major mall being a mile away. Red Bank has also come back from the dead. There are plenty of other examples. And Yes...those towns did not come back overnight, but they clearly did SOMETHING right to make it happen.   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2020 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 10:40 am:        Actually, MHD, it is fair to compare the number of salons, cleaners and banks to every other town. The fact remains that every town seems to have more than needed although obviously that can't be true. No question that we need to make sure something happens at Beifus and New Market in order to get to the next step, but the fact remains that nail salons, cleaners and banks are part of every town in NJ including successful ones.   MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2541 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 10:54 am:        Mark, Except in many other towns there are OTHER destinations, so the nail salons, cleaners and banks are not so noticable.   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2023 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 11:03 am:        MHD: I am glad you realize that. That is why it is important to get New market, Beifus and SOPAC completed. Clearly SOPAC will be a destination as will the market.   cmontyburns Citizen Username: Cmontyburns Post Number: 957 Registered: 12-2003 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 11:28 am:        Blue Moon diner, Coldstone Creamery, Starbucks, Cait & Abby's, Dunkin Donuts, Voro, Taste of Asia, Domino's Pizza, Bagel Shop #1, Bagel shop #2, sushi place, three chinese restaurants, Antonella's, Caribbean Cuisine, Dancing Goat, Reservoir, Bunny's, Lot 15, Papillon, Niecy's, Pirate's Pizza, at least two Chinese restaurants, Texas Wiener, Cafe Arugula, Heart and Soul, Japanese place by Heart and Soul, Cryan's, Toro Loco, Salad/catering place over by Toro Loco... These are the food places I could think of off the top of my head that are ALL easy walking distance from the train station. Again, don't get me wrong, the lack of new development pisses me off as much as it does everyone else. But all the talk about how we have only nail salons and banks... Have you actually walked around downtown? Yes, I want more, and I want it now. But talking about South Orange as a ghost town is absurd. I haven't done a count, but I'd bet we have more eating establishments than Maplewood already. And unlike Maplewood, we have some choice real estate sitting empty that could be occupied by some great restaurants.   MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2545 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 11:31 am:        Cmonty, Have you ever walked down South Orange Avenue past 8pm? Ghost town is a good word.   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2024 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 12:02 pm:        MHD: I was on S. Orange ave the other night after 8pm. There were several people in the Dancing goat. There were several people sitting at the tables in front of Bunny's. I saw several people standing in front of Resevoir pizzeria. And there was at least a 20 people by Cold Stone Creamery. There was no shortage of people and I am talking about a weekday night - not a friday or saturday.   MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2546 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 12:12 pm:        ...then maybe we should cancel SOPAC, Beifus and the Market. This town is already hoppin', eh?   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2026 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 12:19 pm:        MHD: The point is that the town is hardly a ghost town. It might not be perfect, but it is not as bad as you make it out to be.   AntoninaKC Citizen Username: Antoninakc Post Number: 22 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 6:16 pm:        mrosner- please lets not talk about another nail salon being put in south orange- enough is enough! kristen, yes, I agree SHU is under utilized-Im interested to find out what you are planning to get more of SHU into town~   Minimalist Citizen Username: Minimalist Post Number: 26 Registered: 12-2004 Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2005 - 12:50 am:        I thought I'd restart this thread after the study was published in USA Today, etc, about the obesity problem we seem to be having. I realize I've been posting what might seem like slightly off-topic replies to messages lately. But hey, it's fun and it's not hurting anyone, right? I was hoping to start some meaty political discussion, but so far no takers. Anyhow. So this study. Talk about propaganda. We keep spending more to treat "obesity related" diseases now. Everybody panic and bring on the hate. Let's just define every illness as "obesity related" and then blame obesity. "Related" does not mean there's a simple cause and effect. These chronic diseases typically result from multiple factors. People are living longer, fat or not. WE extend people's life expectancies with expensive treatments and then complain that it's costing more to keep people alive. The "reporting" does not even raise these questions. Why bother when we can just roll over all the complexity and find some group everybody already disrespects to blame. Fat brings out the hypocrisy: they bring out the intolerance on the left, just the way gay people do on the right. At the very least, why can't people see that public policy policy-wise and public education-wise that focusing on a diverse group of people (the "obese") has different consequences and implications than does focusing on a discrete behavior like, e.g., smoking? This could tie into the smoking thread, but nah. Anyhow, thanks for your time.   Princess Citizen Username: Princess Post Number: 7 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2005 - 1:32 am:        minimalist- ur a moron   Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 3476 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2005 - 8:03 am:        What this town needs is a smokers-only eatery. -s.   SO Refugee Citizen Username: So_refugee Post Number: 567 Registered: 2-2005 Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2005 - 8:47 am:        Discreet? Smelly clothes, bad breath, yellow fingernails, throwing butts on the ground... I see you're line of thinking.   User58 Citizen Username: User58 Post Number: 236 Registered: 8-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 11:17 am:        the closing of TOA is a huge loss to our town. For anyone to compare this restaurant to a $10.00 per person restaurant simply missed it. Go to LingLing and you will find similar prices and that is chinese food not Pan Asian. I enjoyed TOA many times and the food was always fresh, delicious and served by the nicest propritor and staff I have had the good pleasure of supporting. A sad loss for our town.   User58 Citizen Username: User58 Post Number: 237 Registered: 8-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 11:21 am:        TOA was a dining experience not just a restaurant. If you need cheap food go to a cheap restaurant. It had great dishes, stemware, place settings, table cloths, flowers on the table, wine buckets, all the little things that make a nice experience when dining.   MHD Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 2580 Registered: 5-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 11:36 am:        ...except decor....   Sitoyan Citizen Username: Sitoyan Post Number: 83 Registered: 7-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 3:26 pm:        It had a beautiful fishtank. Who needs decor   Josh Holtz Citizen Username: Jholtz Post Number: 36 Registered: 4-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 3:33 pm:        I have said it before ... no ambience ... sterile decor. Voro might not have the greatest food but the experience of dining there makes it successful.   susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 771 Registered: 3-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 3:55 pm:        Sorry you'll miss it, user58, but we ever found a dish that we really liked at TOA, in spite of multiple tries, so won't miss it. We really wanted it to succeed, so gave it more tries than it deserved in our books. If the food had been to our tastes, the decor and amenities would have been just fine. Hoping to like their second try (and hoping they decide to offer actual tea in addition to herbals!). Voro, on the other hand, I have to defend. They made me one of the best pieces of salmon that I've had recently, as well as some lovely tapas chicken and lamb chops the other night. Lovely food, ambience, and a liquor license all help make it a success (and busy on a Tuesday night).   AntoninaKC Citizen Username: Antoninakc Post Number: 42 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 4:14 pm:        Am I the only one who hasn't been to Voro? I dont even know where the place is to tell the truth~   mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 2050 Registered: 4-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 4:17 pm:        When you are on S. Orange ave turn down vose when you get to Dancing Goat. One block down on your right. Plenty of parking right next to it in the library lot. If you go on a Saturday night, make sure you make a reservation.   Pizzaz Supporter Username: Pizzaz Post Number: 1996 Registered: 11-2001 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 5:11 pm:        News from around the Village... Lot 15 and O'Reilly's in Maplewood are seeking new owners... Susan: We miss you. Any Princeton games coming up soon?   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 53 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 5:16 pm:        I thought LOT 15 just opened and the owners were the folks from CentAnni in Maplewood. Are they selling already?   Brett Weir Citizen Username: Brett_weir Post Number: 722 Registered: 4-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 5:18 pm:        And Toro Loco.   jayjay Citizen Username: Jayjayp Post Number: 54 Registered: 6-2005 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 6:14 pm:        I also saw on a website that the Dancing Goat was for sale. What gives?   susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 773 Registered: 3-2002 Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 8:30 pm:        Pizzaz, we're there once or twice a month...you can't miss us too much!   AntoninaKC Citizen Username: Antoninakc Post Number: 43 Registered: 5-2005 Posted on Friday, July 1, 2005 - 11:38 am:        thanks for the directions mrosner!