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Nohero
Supporter
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 5116
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:29 am: | 
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I'll say it again - if South Orange wants a new name, I suggest "Upper Maplewood". |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 12719
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:34 am: |
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No, I think LibraryLady is onto something. South South Orange could be abbreviated as SoSO. Or we could call it Doubly South Orange.
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Nohero
Supporter
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 5117
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:36 am: |
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Mr. Reingold, you're going to get a lot of opposition from the people who are pushing for renaming us "East Millburn". 
As for the whole nickname issue - a lot of these nicknames can be either derogatory, or simply amusing, depending on the intended audience and the intended meaning of the speaker. Sometimes those are hard to distinguish, on a message board. Maybe the best approach is to "assume good will" at all times, absent evidence to the contrary. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 12720
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:38 am: |
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What are you TALKING about? I live in West Irvington!
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Monty Burns
Citizen
Username: Shrimplover
Post Number: 1
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 6:40 pm: |
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Dear Straights and the gays/lesbians that want to be like them,
First of all, to ask an online community comprised mostly of heterosexuals about gay friendly or gay places is moot. They don't know anything for real like that, they only know what their friends tell them and what they see. Two women with a kid in this area means lesbian family, or nanny. If you really want to know the gay friendly places, drive up to South Mountain Reservation and ask all the dads and husbands there that are cruising for their "first time."
Now to say what place isn't gay friendly in Maplewood. How about everywhere?
This area is attractive to gays and lesbians because it's filled with progressive thinking people, for the most part. However, when they move here and get old and stuffy, they aren't so progressive thinking. This place is a succubus for individuality.
Maplewood/South Orange is tolerant of gays, not accepting.
Then there's the very fiber of the question. Gay friendly businesses? Lesbian friendly places? Gays, lesbians and straights are not all fighting the same fight.
When was the last time a straight man was murdered for who he loved in this country?
When was the last time you are someone you know didn't make fun of a kid that is being raised by a gay/lesbian couple?
Do you really think a 5 year old is gay? Already?
And the best is, I'm going to my gay neighbor's house. Or my lesbian neighbors party.
Do gay people say, I'm going to my straight neighbors party? Straight entitlement will never go away with such inequalities.
It's not so much really even about gay/straight. As so much as it is about men and women. Once those inequalities simmer, then the gay/straight struggle black/white struggle won't be so harrowing.
As for gay friendly places. Stop by any local "wanna be's" social event of the year. All the men are in one room, the women in another. Have you been to a gay or lesbian bar? Men all together, women all together.
We like to spend our money at gay/lesbian owned businesses because we want to support "our kind." And I will say, "our kind," because who doesn't want to be around like people at some point in their week? Who wants to constantly be surrounded by straight people who have no idea how it is to be completely persecuted because of who they love. Not who they choose to love. Because it's a choice to NOT be gay. Never an actual choice to be gay.
It's not a preference. Because comparing the two, is no comparison at all? Being with a man or a woman is two completely different situations. Why do you think your wife prefers doing things with her female friends? Why does your husband want his best friend with him for important things like birthdays?
And let's face it, gay and lesbian couples nest. Most of you think and then we start to think ourselves, that if I'm a lesbian woman having lunch with simply another woman, there's sparks. If a gay man and another gay man go to a movie, they could very well be friends. No one is constantly "jake on the make" simply because they are near another gay person.
So why wouldn't we nest? Why would we want to be apart of groups that will never understand us? People that will never be asked, "Do your parents know you're straight?"
We start to nest, and isolate ourselves after a bit of "trying" to be social, because the injustices and inequalities are too much to handle. So we go home. We hang out with the people we are in relationships with and family as we get older. We focus on our beautiful homes and our love for one another. We get fat, just like you hetties. We fight just like you hetties. But at the end of the day, we are going to bed with someone that knows exactly what it's like to be so oppressed. To be tokens. To be novelties.
And at the end of the day... reading this thread from start to finish. I'd like to thank the straight community for once again taking a gay topic and making it straight.
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Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1208
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 7:56 pm: |
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Quite a first post!
I've got to say, I've NEVER felt more guilty about being heterosexual. Forget the whole white man thing, now I'm REALLY depressed about myself...
... but getting back to that last post - I swear this isn't a gay joke.... but would you like some cheese to go with that whine?
Sorry you feel so alienated. It must be tough watching the close-knit heterosexual community (each member of which LOVES each other, with no strife or dissention... we're like one huge happy Walton Mountain family). Please tell us - how may we be more accepting? Just tell us, and gosh darn it we'll do whatever we have to to STOP THE WHINING.
Life sucks - buy a helmet. |
Pdg
Citizen
Username: Pdg
Post Number: 590
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 9:58 pm: |
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hetties? Is that a word? 
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cmontyburns
Citizen
Username: Cmontyburns
Post Number: 1770
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 10:23 pm: |
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I wonder if you've ever stopped to consider that there might be something about you other than your sexuality that has (apparently) turned most of humanity against you.
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Jersey Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 280
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Friday, March 3, 2006 - 11:10 pm: |
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Maybe it's the username.
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ess
Citizen
Username: Ess
Post Number: 1277
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 1:22 am: |
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Or the comment about South Mountain reservation, which, frankly, was nauseating.
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Oldstone
Citizen
Username: Rogers4317
Post Number: 608
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 7:36 am: |
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monty...geez. were you trying to hurt the str8 folks in town with that south mountain comment? gimme a break. if the homos weren't up there already on their knees in the woods it wouldn't be such a candy store for ANYONE.
as a gay guy, nothing makes my skin crawl more than being surrounded by ALL gay guys. the one-upmanship, the tired sense of humor, the faggy behaviour for the fun of it, the underlying sexual tension ALWAYS. it would be a better world if everyone would just be comfortable together instead of segregating.
if you need to frequent gay venues so you feel comfortable and "accepted", move back to "chelsea".
but don't bring "chelsea" to the places we are "tolerated" because frankly, this is the way to live...together, not in your own little, gay world because you sleep with guys. in the interest of growth, hang out with PEOPLE. integrate the lifestyle with other PEOPLE. that is progress, not spending your money at international male or the gay bar.
personally speaking, whether in a relationship or not, i have never been unaccepted by the people i care about. BUT, i have experienced the scrutiny of the "gay eye" and sorry to tell you, nothing hurts more than THAT and you know it.
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6yearrez
Citizen
Username: 6yearrez
Post Number: 147
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 8:14 am: |
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Oldstone, you can probably insert many minorities or majorities in place of gay and be right on the money for anyone who didn't want to be surrounded by their own kind. My wife and I grew up in predominantly Jewish towns, were raised by Jewish supremacists, have both experienced anti-semitism (the "Jewish eye" perhaps?) when we left and purposely sought out a community with a little bit of everything where everyone can (hopefully) be comfortable regardless of what they bring to the table. But, oy vay, the taxes....sorry, wrong thread. |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1209
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 9:37 am: |
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I'm very upset. I just realized I could have parlayed the Walton Mountain thing into a joke about South Mountain Reservation.
I'm really off my "A" game lately.
I'm glad to see the comments following (the fake) Monty Burns', but I have to wonder about the backlash once brunch is over.
(OK, I admit it, THAT was a gay joke).
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Kent
Citizen
Username: Kentgib
Post Number: 9
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 9:39 am: |
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I promised my husband I wouldn't get into a debate on the message board, but.....
Case I couldn't agree with you more about the WHINING.
There have been a couple of posts prior to Monty's that have rubbed me the wrong way. My feeling is I'm gay, Monty may be gay, Case I'm assuming your not...OK so can we all just get over it already. The persecution martyrdom for any group just starts to sound strident and tiresome. It is obvious to any open minded human being that people are different and we all generally learn to TOLERATE each other. It seems to me that this utopian idea of a completely integrated lovey dovey, everything is rainbows and sunshine community completely lacks acknowledgement of human nature. As humans we differentiate, we get given the eye, if you will. Ok...so what.
And before any other homo gets all self righteous, activism is about changing people's minds to lead to acceptance and/or tolerance. It appears to me that in this community that is being achieved by many LGBT (less not to leave anyone out) living here and integrating into the community. These small acts of just living changes people's point of view.
Ok, so I'm sure I lost my complete thought in there somewhere, but bottom line. If one needs to be nested with their "kind" they should find an area that is ghettoized (Chelsea / Hells Kitchen) amd be wrapped in the warm glow of inclusion. But, for those of us who choose to live in the whole world, there is bound to be points at which we have to tolerate our neighbors. Especially, the ones who insist on wearing white leather shoes and belts.
As another MOLer says, "flame away"
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Grrrrrrrrrrr
Citizen
Username: Oldsctls67
Post Number: 330
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 9:42 am: |
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"Strident and tiresome"--Awesome! Time to put those babies back in the active vocabulary! Thanks! |
CFA
Citizen
Username: Cfa
Post Number: 1592
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 3:15 pm: |
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I'm gay and it grosses me out when another "homo" refers to his partner as his "husband". It makes you sound NELLY. |
Jersey Boy
Citizen
Username: Jersey_boy
Post Number: 285
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 3:28 pm: |
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Kent, tell your husband (Sorry CFA, partner?) Jersey Boy says he's glad you entered the debate. I welcome an intelligent voice like yours to this and all debates.
Keep that "strident and tiresome" phrase handy, it can be useful in a lot of situations around here.
J.B. |
Kent
Citizen
Username: Kentgib
Post Number: 10
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 4:27 pm: |
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CFA.. "grosses me out" Isn't that just like teenage girl. And you call me "nelly" isn't that like so 80's.
And on the decision to use the word husband, it was a specific choice. We had a wedding, we got married and calling each other partner doesn't lend the same weight to our relationship that calling each other husband does. Partner or lover to me are a way of not engaging. I am married, and hopefully legally soon in NJ. And I have no intention of apologizing for that by using a different label.
Thanks for your indulgence on this, however I'm pretty sure this should be a new thread...Soapbox maybe.
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Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1212
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 4:58 pm: |
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Kent,
You know you've got a problem when someone sporting a rainbow flag calls you a Nelly.
OK, I don't know what being a Nelly means. Its part of the incredible burden of being not-gay, I suppose. But I can figure it out from the context! And yes, the "grosses me out" does sound like it's coming from a 14 year old girl, or possibly from Paris and Nicole. Regardless of the source its kind of funny, in an ironic sort of way.
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Bob K
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 10866
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 5:27 pm: |
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Try spouse, it seems to work for a lot of people. I don't really know how to respond when someone introduces their same sex spouse as "husband" or "wife". I never know what to call the spouse. Is this some form of role playing? Should I call the "husband's" spouse a "wife"? Or the "wife's" spouse a "husband"? Spouse works really well and keeps this middle-age, moving towards old fart, guy from total confusion. Hell, I even have started using it to describe straight relations, even my own.
I don't claim to be "tolerant', a term I agree is somewhat condescending. Can't we all just get along?, to steal a phrase from the great Rodney King.
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greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 6843
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 5:56 pm: |
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This is a great idea!!! Let's all the gay posters have a public debate about the current internal political climate and call each other names on a public bulletin board!
Maybe someone should e-mail the link to Pat Robertson; he'd probably love the ammo. |
wendy
Supporter
Username: Wendy
Post Number: 2028
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 6:29 pm: |
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greenetree, you always come up with the best ideas! |
Case
Citizen
Username: Case
Post Number: 1213
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 7:13 pm: |
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A great idea, but still divisive - don't we get to call people names too?
I'm stealing comments from someone (don't ask who), but there's a huge difference between tolerance and acceptance, isn't there?
I quote here a single sentence, taken out of context I'm sure: Now to say what place isn't gay friendly in Maplewood. How about everywhere?
Boo hoo. Not everyone loves you and welcomes you with open arms. Put on your shorts and tank top, grab a few kids and head down to the Gaslight restaurant. Bring your cell phone so you can call your friends and relations, just to make sure you feel loved throughout the meal.
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Lydia
Supporter
Username: Lydial
Post Number: 1701
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 8:01 pm: |
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Bobbest -
Try not defining your spouse/sig.other/spouse w/ benefits - just introduce by first and last name, "Hello, and have you met Sally Jones?"
I've been testing it out, and it is jarring to eliminate the definition of "husband" when I make intros.
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sac
Supporter
Username: Sac
Post Number: 3197
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 4, 2006 - 9:49 pm: |
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I tend to refer to my spouse/husband as spouse about as often as husband, maybe even more often. (I'm not really keeping track.) It never occurred to me to be an issue either way. And so it should be for everyone. How one refers to themself or their significant other is really nobody else's business but their own. (Assuming that the SO is comfortable with it.) |
gemini
Citizen
Username: Gemini
Post Number: 423
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, March 5, 2006 - 2:47 pm: |
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I'm a little confused here. Gay people are actually arguing over the what makes a comfortable environment, and I still don't know what the answer is. Is it better to be singled out for being gay, and given special treatment? or welcomed into a a community regardles of orientation? and if the latter, is it a "sell out"?
Sounds to me that in this and other threads, some gay people are just looking for like minded people to share similar experiences with. ANd I think that's why the original question was asked. Heck if I was from the country "Veronica" or enjoyed punk music, i'd like to frequent those places that draw similar people. I always have the option of being accepted anywhere else in town, but it's nice to sometimes sit next to someone from "Veronica" too. I think the origial poster just wanted some "ins" as to the "gayer" places. And I think Monty Burns (sans C) has some insight into the straight community that maybe is not so often discussed. I found it interesting how at "strait" parties men are with men and women w women; same goes for "gayer" parties??? ha! |
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