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Message |
    
millie amoresano
Citizen
Username: Millieamoresano
Post Number: 297
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 8:46 am: | 
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My husband and I are in the middle of a divorce. I have been told by a some close friends that he purchased a house for his girlfriend. According to the tax info at town hall the house in her name. He is self employed ane alot of his business is in cash. I called the county clerk and asked about the deed the woman at the clerks office siad that a deed would not have mortgage information on it. His girlfriend is stupid enough to go around telling people in town she could never of afforded the house and that he bought the house for her and her daughter. I do have a divorce attorney who has ways ( i believe) of looking mortgage information up. But I thought if I could do this on my own I would save some money.
Thanks for your help |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7817
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 9:08 am: |
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Millie - I know that it can be done, but I don't have the info right at my finger tips. I had a friend in a similar situation and she retained the services of a forensic accountant. Those guys are scary-good at finding every penny. You may want to look into that, especially since it sounds like you may own half of a house.
Also, if he does a lot of cash and you co-signed tax filings, be careful.
At any rate, I am sorry that you are going thru this. It has to be very painful. |
NJguy99
Citizen
Username: Njguy99
Post Number: 43
Registered: 3-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 9:21 am: |
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Millie - sorry to hear about this very unfortunate situation.
The person you spoke to at the clerk's office is half-right. The deed shouldn't have the mortgage info on it, but the County Register should have a copy of the mortgage documents too. In most NJ counties, the mortgage is "recorded" just like the deed - assuming that there's a legit mortgage on the property. I'd go down to Newark and try to find the deed. Once you have that, you should be able to find the recorded mortgage. (The Register won't do a search for you, but they have a whole computer system that's fairly simple to use - especially for recently recorded deeds).
Of course, if he gave her the money to buy the place, and it's all in her name, there may be no way of proving a connection.
I second what Greenetree said - get a forensic accountant to track this and any other spending down. It's going to cost some money, but if your husband does a mainly cash business, it's going to be very tough for you on your own to find out where all the cash went.
Register's office number, btw, is 621-4960.
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Soparents
Citizen
Username: Soparents
Post Number: 411
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 9:35 am: |
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NJguy99 and greentree have given you two good and solid pieces of advice.
Millie, this is a very unpleaant situation for you and I hope it can be dealt with quickly.
Don't try and handle something like this yourself, there is too much involved and I am sure whatever money you pay the professionals to handle this it will be worth it.
Try and keep your spirits up, you will come through this ok...
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Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14441
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 9:58 am: |
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Close all joint accounts now. If you don't, he has the legal right to take all the money out. Cancel jointly held credit cards.
Very sorry this is happening. I think my divorce was the toughest period in my life.
But things do get better, I can promise.
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eliz
Supporter
Username: Eliz
Post Number: 1479
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 10:01 am: |
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Can't you just run his credit? Go to myfico.com and enter his SSN and info - a mortgage should show up (along with all his other accounts).
Very sorry to hear this. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7821
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 11:07 am: |
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I am sure that Millie would not do that if it were illegal. |
ess
Citizen
Username: Ess
Post Number: 2031
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 11:46 am: |
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Millie, I am sorry to hear that you are going through this. It sucks. It's amazing how many married men find it necessary to deceive their wives.
As far as advice, Greenetree, NJGuy, and Tom have given you good advice. Definitely close your joint accounts. If he has a legal right to take money out, then so do you.
Not sure if running his credit report is at all illegal. First of all, he is her husband. Second of all, employers, credit card companies, etc., do it all the time.
Good luck, and stay strong.... |
Bklyngirl
Citizen
Username: Bklyngirl
Post Number: 73
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 12:11 pm: |
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Millie-
Sorry to hear about your unfortunate situation. Know that you will be fine.
I agree with ess. I don't think running a credit check on your husband is illegal.
bklyngirl |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14449
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 12:28 pm: |
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It's amazing how many married men find it necessary to deceive their wives.
I can assure you that men don't have a monopoly on this type of behavior.
Be sure to document what you do, for your own purposes, which will also allow you to be fair when you need to be. For instance, documenting the bank balance at the time you close the account will entitle him to half of that asset later. Of course, you're entitled to half of all the assets, too, whether they are covert or hidden.
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ess
Citizen
Username: Ess
Post Number: 2033
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 12:34 pm: |
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Tom, you are right regarding the above (on all counts). I just happen to be looking at this from the wife's vantage point. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14452
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 12:38 pm: |
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Yeah, divorce is dirty. It's very common for at least one of the people to play unfairly. I don't believe one sex does it more than the other.
Your reflex to blame husbands is kind of like saying that in a car accident, the fault almost always lies with the "other driver."  Thank you for coming around.
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Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1517
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 12:59 pm: |
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Millie, so sorry to hear about this. As a veteran of divorce, I have been there. Some pretty strange financial things came up during mine too.
I can definitely understand the impulse to save money, but I would leave this to a professional. When big money is at stake, you need their expertise. For all you know, you might miss the one detail that pulls this whole thing together.
Hang in there....and there are many people on this board who are divorced, who can offer good solid advice. I wish I'd been more in touch with them during my own one three years ago. Good luck. |
millie amoresano
Citizen
Username: Millieamoresano
Post Number: 299
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 1:38 pm: |
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Thanks for all of your support. I went to the county clerk today and the mortgage is in her name as well as the deed. His cousin who is attorney was the lawyer for sale of the house. Iam sure he has a documnet somewhere with his cousin stating he gave money towards the house especially because the girlfriend is going around telling everyone that he is paying all the bills in the home and that he bought her a house.. The unfortunate thing is the house in the same town which I live in. My daughters have had girls from the other school come up to her and ask her if she knows ____my daughter replied "no" the little girl said "well you should know _____ becasue your father is living with her mother" He continues to deny there is someone else,even when I saw him walking out of the house at 7am in the morning. |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 7824
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 1:45 pm: |
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Definitely get the forensic accountant. Follow the money to the house.
And what a complete and utter jerk. I never understand why, if nothing else, these people don't care about their kids. |
Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1521
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 1:49 pm: |
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Millie, as I am sure your lawyer will tell you, if he bought a house while you're still married, it has bearing on whatever money you get, as long as the money used for the house was in both names in joint accounts -- if it was his own money in his own account, I don't think it has much impact on you. He is making himself look terrible -- and while "terrible" behavior is indeed subjective, it does come into play if your divorce goes to litigation. This will only hurt him when it comes down to sitting down to the settlement table. Get your lawyer on it pronto. He/she can file motions asking that your husband explain the source of the money used to buy the house, then take it from there. I think it's even possible that the funds being used to pay the house's mortgage, bills, etc could be frozen.
As for that girlfriend, try to ignore her. She sounds classless and mean. I'm sorry your kids have to be involved. That's the worst thing of all. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14454
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 1:54 pm: |
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Zoesky1, I think that's not true. I believe that all assets are joint, no matter whose name is on them. I'm speaking of assets acquired during the marriage. One spouse may be entitled to his/her own money that he/she had before the marriage, but that depends on how long the marriage was.
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peteglider
Citizen
Username: Peteglider
Post Number: 1968
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 1:56 pm: |
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Millie, also keep in mind that the grounds for divorce usually have no bearing on the settlement (unless there is something illegal or extreme moral issues). So even though you might like to file against him for say adultery, how much of this part of your lives do you really want on file at the court house? Particularly since you have children together. It may also antagonize him, which won't help you or the kids in getting this sorted out. best -- Pete |
Zoesky1
Citizen
Username: Zoesky1
Post Number: 1522
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 2:10 pm: |
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Tom, you are right about assets acquired during marriage. I was referring to his own money that he might have had prior to marriage. I should have been more clear. These topics are on my mind a lot lately because Mr Zoesky1 and I are combining households (we are not married), but we are each keeping our assets separate....we are both divorced and neither of us want to muddy the waters by commingling. Commingled money was the big central issue in my own divorce. Too complicated to recount here, but the subject of inheritances, equitable distribution and commingling became very messy. |
LilLB
Citizen
Username: Lillb
Post Number: 1711
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 2:33 pm: |
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Millie - I'm so sorry to hear you're going through this ordeal.
Pete - I haven't been through this before, so I'm probably missing the obvious but I'm not sure why someone would care what's on file about them at the courthouse. Does it come up later in life in a negative way for the people who filed?
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las
Citizen
Username: Las
Post Number: 1760
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 2:44 pm: |
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Millie, you are so wise to have posted here.
There is an entire community of people who want to help you through this.
I p/l'd you. |
Peter
Supporter
Username: Peter
Post Number: 247
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 2:58 pm: |
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You need a lawyer. Now.
I believe running his credit is illegal unless you have his consent (or obtained it at some time without expiration). You can go to www.ftc.gov to obtain a credit report, free, but you'll see all sorts of things you have to agree to. If you have estate planning documents that include a general power of attorney signed by him for you to act on his behalf, that might make it legal. You should IMMEDIATELY run your own credit report and make sure he's not messing with your joint accounts. Consider putting a fraud warning on your credit reports with all three companies, to prevent someone from using your credit. I think in NJ you can demand a "freeze" on your credit reports.
If your husband gave his girlfriend the money for the house, the lender may have required a "gift letter" that states he gave her the money. It depends on how strong her credit/income is on its own. If there is a legal proceeding underway, a lawyer can find a way to demand a copy of the loan file from the lender. If necessary, a lawyer can file a lis pendens against the house, clouding the title, and stopping her from selling it or getting additonal loans against it, until the matter is resolved.
Also bear in mind that houses can be bought for as little as 3-5% down, and the actual money involved might not be that much. |
peteglider
Citizen
Username: Peteglider
Post Number: 1970
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 2:59 pm: |
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LilLB -- when I got divorced now a few years ago, I really didn't want the specifics of what happened to be on file for anyone who cared to get a copy. in particular my kids. for instance, unless you file for something pretty generic, and instead file for say adultery ( or one of the other "for cause reasons") -- then you need to add details. Since it doesn't impact the divorce, and rarely, if at all, impacts the financial settlement, then why do so? (it could impact custody -- but even then, a savvy lawyer can deal with those issues in your favor without putting them in the papers). -- Pete |
LilLB
Citizen
Username: Lillb
Post Number: 1713
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 4:08 pm: |
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Gotcha Pete. Figured it might be out of concern for the kids, but first thought that they would never bother looking at the divorce paperwork. Thinking about it again, I'm probably very wrong about that... |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14461
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 5:56 pm: |
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I don't intend to show my divorce record to my kids. I don't think they have a right to see it, even after I'm dead. Is it public record?
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emmie
Supporter
Username: Emmie
Post Number: 752
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 7:04 pm: |
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Millie,
What you are going through is really tough, I've been through it too. My divorce was final several years ago and to this day I regrete that I didn't get a forensic accountant for discovery. I felt it was too expensive and it was my loss. I found out later that he was hiding big bucks! You must reconsider. Good luck to you, keep us posted. |
emmie
Supporter
Username: Emmie
Post Number: 753
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 7:09 pm: |
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Tom,
The "notice of complaint" is public record and can be obtained by anybody for a small fee at the county clerk's office in whatever county the divorce occured. I don't know if the actual divorce decree is public record though. |
Tom Reingold
Supporter
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 14466
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 25, 2006 - 7:21 pm: |
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Well, live and learn. I can console myself with the fact that my kids will probably not be curious enough to seek the notice of complaint.
The decree was a consent decree, and I wouldn't mind their stumbling on it as much.
Why would children seek the record of their parents' divorce? That's like wanting to watch them have sex. Ick. My parents told me a little of their divorce, and I wish they hadn't.
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LilLB
Citizen
Username: Lillb
Post Number: 1720
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Friday, May 26, 2006 - 8:49 am: |
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I can't imagine that I would ever want to see the nasty details of my parents' divorce (they're not divorced, but if they were, I really don't think I would ever want to). |
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