| Author |
Message |
    
Richard O'Connor
Citizen
Username: Roconn
Post Number: 53
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 30, 2003 - 8:36 am: |     |
Hey All,
Figured I'd throw out this info as there is a lot of talk of how much the PSE&G bills are getting to be.
In the fall (October) I had installed a fireplace insert in my living room. I could not be happier with the quality of heat or what it costs. At the rate I'm going, it really pay for itself in 2 years of heating.
So here are the specifics.
The unit is a high efficiency fireplace insert branded Lopi made by travis industries. www.lopistoves.com The model I got is called the Freedom and I could not be more impressed with it.
The output is nearly that of my boiler and it has a power fan unit that moves the heat out 'into' the room. As my first floor is pretty open it does a good job, and given hot air rises, it doesn't do badly at getting the second floor.
Usually, I light it around 4PM and it burns till sometime in the middle of the night/early morning. Given all that, my gas bills and use are down by about 3/4 as the only time I'm using the boiler is in the morning. (I don't mind being a bit of a frontiersman, but lugging firewood at 6am is a bit much.) 
Its actually very controllable so I can keep the house anywhere from comfortable to hot.
Figured given that most of the homes in the area have fireplaces this might be something you'd want to take a look at.
I paid about 360 for 2 cords of wood, and I'm about half way through it. (Mid Nov). That number reflects what I paid a month to PSE&G last year for gas, as most have noted, its gone up dramatically.
I purchased the unit in Summit at "The Fireplace Place" and it was installed by them at a total of just over $3000.
The best part .... last winter thermostat at 65...ok...but not comfy! .. this year house consistently around 70 (which is a little warm for some of my friends)
Oh...and duh... for those of you who have or have gotten central air secondarily installed ... once my living room (and first floor get to about 68, I can turn on the ac FAN and then the heat gets focibly moved about and the whole house gets warm.
(I turn the fans off when I go to bed.)
Hope this helps those of you looking for ways to reduce the pse&g burden.
Richard (ROC)
--Never be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the ark; professionals built the Titanic.--
--AIM: ROConn |
SoOrLady
Citizen
Username: Soorlady
Post Number: 225
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 30, 2003 - 9:11 am: | |
We bought a fireplace insert back in the 70s during the oil crisis - worked great - then we converted to gas because it was so much cheaper. Richard reminded me how well they work - perhaps it's time to fire it up again. (Although lugging wood and ashes now that I'm 25 years older doesn't sound like fun.) |
Tom Reingold the prissy-pants
Citizen
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 1570
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 30, 2003 - 12:51 pm: | |
I'm under the impression that burning wood creates a lot more pollution than oil or gas. Is this right?
The previous owner of my house left a woodburning stove. Her late husband had had it taken out, so it's not hooked up. I've been meaning to try to sell it. The widow told me it was a real pain, because they had to get up in the middle of the night, after the fuel had run out, walk downstairs in the cold house, and add wood to the furnace.
We lit a fire in our fireplace this weekend for the first time. We did it for recreation only. As it turns out, it hardly casts any heat into the living room at all. No wonder there's a market for these fireplace inserts. Some fireplaces are designed for looks and not utility.
Tom Reingold
There is nothing
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tourne
Citizen
Username: Tourne
Post Number: 276
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 30, 2003 - 3:28 pm: | |
Wood burning creates more of some pollutants, less of others. Gas is much cleaner than wood or oil. Wood does create a lot of particulates(bad for asthmatics). It also creates greenhouse gases, carbon monoxide, etc. Plus your cutting down trees for the wood--that's obviously bad for the environment. A wood fire is great for recreation--but it's the dark ages for heating. I think it's better to save money by building energy efficient houses and spending the money to upgrade existing houses. Passive solar is the best way to heat a house(ie. south facing windows, greenhouses). And there are now some newer solar evacuated tube hot water heaters that can be used for hydronic heating. See www.sssolar.com. |
bobk
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 4177
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 6:30 am: | |
I suspect that most who try to heat their homes with wood will soon get tired of the work involved.
One of my wife's sisters and her family live in a small New England town and during one of the energy criseses her husband decided wood was the way to go to heat their one story bungalow.
Hubbie, another Bob, bought a stove and set it up in the basement. He also rigged a duct system to get warm air to the living areas. Wood in their neck of the woods was usually free for the hauling, but had to be split and dried. Bob, a clever lad, built his own woodsplitter with a hydraulic ram purchased from Northern Hydraulics, a scrounged I beam and the rear axle off a Fiat 128.
They were reasonably comfortable for several years, but grew tired of the work involved and the fact the stove usually required a 3:00am feeding if the house was going to be toasty in the morning.
They now are back to using their oil fired steam system. |
Richard O'Connor
Citizen
Username: Roconn
Post Number: 56
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 8:54 am: | |
Well some additional info is called for.
The insert I got is very efficient, and yes, although it is higher in pollutants than a good gas burner, it is very low in relationship to older style stoves and inserts. It is in fact one of the highest rated in terms of low polluting. I am sure it is better than some of the oil boilers and oil furnaces that are in the homes up here.
In terms of what I can and can't do economically to improve the efficiency over-all of my c.1925 home, this was a boon! I am not ready to incur the debt for new windows and insulation in the walls (or for that matter the work involved in either) and although replacing the steam heat with baseboard hot water (the best heating) is an option, it too, is not an option in the near future. (Money's tight.)
Yes, lugging firewood is a bit of a bother, but I'm spending half as much on gas so . . . its a swap
SoOrLady, I don't have to lug ashes very often, maybe once or twice a week, and then not huge quantities. The insert I have burns very hot and thus large amounts of wood are reduced to very small amounts of ash.
Bob, I think if I was my dad's age, this wouldn't be an option, but it really (so far) doesn't seem like a "lot" of work.
Oh, and just for the sake of the point ... all fireplaces are for looks and not utility the way we build a fire in them today. To get 'utility' from a fireplace it has to have a literally ROARING fire which may be a concern for most folx. On top of this, once you stop tending it (to go to bed) the heat it produces, along with all the heat your home heating plant is producing, is going up the chimney and out of the house.
The sealed fireplace insert however is designed to use (overnight) minimum inside air for combustion and to return more heat to the room than it extracts to burn.
During an evening, on average, I add 2 or 3 logs every 1.5 or so hours (good hardwoods is the key) and when I set it for overnight, I pack it pretty much full and then set the draft to mimimum. This morning it was still hot enough to re-ignite without any additional fuss.
I admit, it isn't for everyone, but it has both the scenic beauty of the fireplace (it has a glass door) and provides the heat which I want. (It also has a cooking surface (ham and eggs anyone?)
Richard (ROC)
--Never be afraid to try something new. Remember, amateurs built the ark; professionals built the Titanic.--
--AIM: ROConn |
ashear
Citizen
Username: Ashear
Post Number: 889
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 9:37 am: | |
Anyone have experience putting a wood stove in a house with no fireplace. Our chimney is no where near where we want the stove so I think we would have to run a stovepipe up the side of the house. |
SoOrLady
Citizen
Username: Soorlady
Post Number: 229
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 9:46 am: | |
Yes, you would ashear - my brother-in-law turned his two car garage into a family room and put in a wood-stove. You'll need to get the exact specs for installation for fire safety - certain amount of space from the wall - certain size brick/stone base - certain amount of space from the house for the exterior pipe and how far the pipe must be above the roof line. |
Tom Reingold the prissy-pants
Citizen
Username: Noglider
Post Number: 1588
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 10:37 am: | |
ashear, you may want to look at my house. Email me at noglider@pobox.com if you want to. There is a woodburning stove in the basement, and they installed an extra chimney on the side of the house. The stove and chimney are no longer in use. The stove is available for sale, if it's worth anything, or for giveaway if it's not. The chimney is an eyesore, but luckily it's not visible from most viewpoints. I'm sure they could have done a more esthetic job for a bit of money.
Tom Reingold
There is nothing
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bobk
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 4183
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 11:09 am: | |
An alternative might be a direct vent gas fireplace. No traditional chimney is needed. The fireplace vents through the sidewall through a stainless steel pipe. The gasses go out through the inner pipe and ventalation air for the fire comes in through the outer shell and also cools the gasses so that no chimney is needed. There is a vent and plate on the outside of the house maybe 12 inches by 12 inches.
A friend put one in an addition and really enjoys it. |
tourne
Citizen
Username: Tourne
Post Number: 282
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 12:12 pm: | |
ROC,
You might check out the contractors page at www.bpi.org. The BPI had a workshop at Kean College recently on making an existing home more energy efficient. You may find that it is not all that more expensive to make your house more efficient than it was to install your fireplace. Especially if you are doing some of the work yourself. Cellulose insulation can be blown in through holes made under the siding at the base of the house and cellulose insulation can be blown into an attic space after it is vapor sealed. Foam is used to seal air holes in the basement and the attic to limit heat loss (see www.efi.org for products). There is an ever growing need(as fuel prices rise) for contractors versed in these methods, especially in northern NJ. In the long and short of it, addressing where the house is losing heat will make your fireplace investment go a lot further. There is nothing like a warm wood fire(in an energy efficient house) to gaze into on a cold Winter's day! |
millie amoresano
Citizen
Username: Millieamoresano
Post Number: 10
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 31, 2003 - 3:19 pm: | |
We use a fireplace during the winter and it does warm the house the only thing is you should close the fireplace damper when it is not in use because the heat will esacape thru the flue and also you can feel a draft. |
wnb
Citizen
Username: Wnb
Post Number: 71
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Friday, January 2, 2004 - 12:15 pm: | |
http://www.woodheat.org/
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