| Author | Message | ||
     clkelley Citizen Username: Clkelley Post Number: 61 Registered: 6-2002 |
Waldo posted his entry at the same time as me. Waldo, do you live next door to me??? You certainly sound like my next-door neighbor, but I don't think he's on MOL. Anyway - whoever you are, you are one of those people worth their weight in gold. And you are one of those that makes Maplewood & S. Orange such a great place to live. | ||
| barbara wilhelm Citizen Username: Bartist Post Number: 115 Registered: 1-2003 |
My street (sidewalks) are a mess. I clear my property and my neighbors. I went out right after the snow stopped on Sunday night. Monday was a holiday and I expected neighbors to shovel. Just a few people were out. I went out Monday and cleared what was left. Ice was not a problem Monday am. I am in the mood to just stop clearing my sidewalk and just sticking to the drive and front walk. Just a little rant! | ||
| jrbell Citizen Username: Jrbell Post Number: 40 Registered: 10-2003 |
My wife and I both work in the city. We closed on our house end of September but did nto move in until December 31 and you'll all remember the big snow we had. I made arrangments to ensure that my walks were cleared even though I was still living on the upper west side. During the recent snow, I shoveled during the snow so that I wouldn't have as much to do when it finished. I also shoveled part of my neighbor's walks on both sides. After the plows threw slush up on my walks that froze solid, I went to Home Cheapo and bought a flat spade (like a hoe that isn't bent) to break up the ice. If I wasn't able/willing to do this myself, I'd be paying someone to do it. I don't think there's any excuse for not keeping the walkways clear. | ||
| Tom Reingold Citizen Username: Noglider Post Number: 1821 Registered: 1-2003  |
I find myself in an in-between viewpoint. I agree with the suggestions of kindness but I also agree that homeowners have responsibilities. I clear the sidewalks of my neighbors on each side if I am out there before them. (I have failed to beat one of them so far.) I am willing to ask the neighbors up the street to do their part, but I can't shovel a dozen sidewalks for them. There are probably over a dozen on my block that are not adequately clear. My generosity must have its limits, no? Tom Reingold the prissy-pants There is nothing | ||
| clkelley Citizen Username: Clkelley Post Number: 62 Registered: 6-2002 |
jrbell ... Just try finding someone to do it. I have, and they won't. I can't even get anybody to pick up the phone or answer my calls. I gave up trying a few years ago, it was just pointless. I couldn't even get an estimate done. I probably can't afford it anyway, but I have tried several times to at least get an estimate and can't get one. It is essentially impossible to get somebody to clean your driveway or sidewalk on a one-time basis, unless one of those kids with a shovel happens by (which has happened ONCE in our 7 winters in Maplewood). If you want your driveway & walks cleared by a service, you need to pay for the whole season. Sometimes inability to clear the sidewalk is temporary (such as: Having the flu. Being unexpectedly out of town.). You don't want to get a service for the whole winter on the off-chance that you will get the flu, do you? Sometimes people don't have excuses, they have reasons. That's all I'm saying. You really can't know what is going on in your neighbor's mind unless you ask. And offer assistance. Or confront even. Instead of venting on MOL, tell your neighbor you think he needs to deal with his sidewalks. Unless he's reading MOL, and you use your own name, he won't even know you're aggravated, and nothing gets accomplished. Look, my sidewalks are clean too. Sometimes I do it, sometimes my neighbor does. The point is I've been challenged enough myself in this that I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. | ||
| clkelley Citizen Username: Clkelley Post Number: 63 Registered: 6-2002 |
You can't do it alone, Tom, but if everybody ranting here did a little bit there might be less of a problem. | ||
| sac Citizen Username: Sac Post Number: 879 Registered: 5-2001 |
I do think that this particular storm was particularly troublesome with the timing, temperature change, etc. It is reasonable to rant about folks who are always delinquent about this, but if this is the first time, I would cut them some slack. Here is a different but somewhat related rant - a house on Prospect Street across from Prospect Church apparently has a snowplow service for their driveway. It appears that the snowplow guy (gal?) simply pushed all the snow out of their driveway and across the street up against the curb. There is now a big, very frozen, pile of snow there, blocking a good portion of the limited parking in front of the church. This happens to be the area that the church reserves for handicapped parking on Sunday mornings. I am not speaking for the church, but I think it was terribly inconsiderate for that snowplower to do this. After plowing up that pile, before everything "froze up" completely, they could have taken a parallel pass along that side of the street to re-clear the area next to the curb with very little extra effort. | ||
| rckymtn Citizen Username: Rckymtn Post Number: 223 Registered: 5-2001 |
All of us with shoveled walks, let's pat ourselves on the backs for being such great people, great citizens, and guardians of public health and safety. But I can't forget about the elderly, the disabled, the pregnant women with husbands who are traveling or who work sunup to sundown, and the poor among us who may not be able to pay somebody $20 or $30 to shovel their walks. (Yes, there are many among us who are poor, believe it or not, right here in upper-middle class Mayberry.) I know many of these people in my part of town. And where do you find someone to do that anyway, especially on a one-time basis -- just try calling a landscaping company late on a Sunday or a federal holiday (Monday) to do that. And when do you think these folks are going to get out to Home Depot to lug a heavy bag of sand (if they have it in stock) from the store to the car, from the car to the garage, and then handle it enough to sprinkle it on the sidewalks? You think shoveling snow is strenuous. This is a struggle for even an able-bodied young person. Have none of you been listening to the warnings about how cold it has been, and that if you don't have to go out, you shouldn't? For crying out loud, a woman froze to death on Long Island the other day. And don't get me started about using environmentally-friendly, dog-friendly, stroller-friendly methods and products. Give me a freaking break! Makes me want to melt my snow with anti-freeze just to tick you off. Each of you whiners should take the time to go shovel the walks of just ONE house about which you've complained. If you were anywhere near as good a person as you think you are, you already would have done it. And this just kills me: "No judgements, just reminding people that clearing your walks is something you NEED to do, mostly because it affects other peoples' safety. " Yeah, it's a safety issue -- but you are judging. You judge that the people whose walks aren't shoveled are (1) lazy; (2) inconsiderate; (3) boorish; (4) rude; (5) incompetent; or most galling (6) not as cool as you. | ||
| algebra2 Citizen Username: Algebra2 Post Number: 1562 Registered: 5-2001  |
So, in my mink and heals on my way to the train I should stop and shovel some poor shmo's walk just because? I THINK NOT!  | ||
| SoOrLady Citizen Username: Soorlady Post Number: 305 Registered: 9-2003 |
Oh yea..... after reading that post... algebra is definately Straw's wife. | ||
| Tom Reingold Citizen Username: Noglider Post Number: 1825 Registered: 1-2003 |
sac, it's not just inconsiderate to plow snow like that, it's illegal, according to the ordinance that TomR (the other Tom R) pointed us to. You can't plow or shovel into the street if the street has been plowed by the town. rckymtn, it's not necessarily a judgement of someone's character to say that he hasn't fulfilled his duty. We don't know why he didn't do it, but we do know that he didn't. The duty remains, whether or not he is able and willing. Therefore, since we don't know why someone hasn't shoveled, it makes sense to approach him nicely and offer help or just make a gentle request. But it doesn't mean we should just say it's OK. Tom Reingold the prissy-pants There is nothing | ||
| algebra2 Citizen Username: Algebra2 Post Number: 1565 Registered: 5-2001 |
SoOrLady -- I know you mean that in the nicest way possible, right?  | ||
| LCM Citizen Username: Lcm Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2003 |
Forget about citizens who aren't shoveling their walkways properly, what about the town? The sidewalk behind the train station has been dangerously slippery for the past three days; the far pay parking lot hasn't even been attempted to be plowed. How can the town ticket anybody with the standards they are setting? | ||
| marian Citizen Username: Marian Post Number: 75 Registered: 9-2001 |
rckmtn, Maybe you'd feel differently if you (or someone you loved) fell and seriously injured themself in front of someone's unshovelled/unsanded/unsalted house. And I don't buy that it's just plain impossible for some folks to shovel. I was heavily pregnant last winter and my husband had a neck injury and couldn't shovel and somehow between doing a little shoveling myself, getting some help from our neighbors, keeping an eye out for one-time shovelers roaming the neighborhood and throwing kitty litter down (they come in small bags and are available at the local King's) we managed to keep our walkway, front steps and sidewalks relatively clear. (AND WE HAVE A LARGE CORNER LOT WITH A HELL OF A LOT OF SIDEWALK.) So don't tell me it's impossible for some folks to obey the law and protect their neighbors. And yes, I HAVE found the time this week (while working full time in the city and having an 8 1/2 month old baby) to make an extra trip to the King's after work to buy extra salt (they come in easy to carry jugs there) and kitty litter to help a neighbor with her walk and steps. | ||
| JJC Citizen Username: Mercury Post Number: 176 Registered: 12-2002 |
All agreed that we should all be shoveling - I was out there Sunday too. But it was difficult. I also walk about 10min to the train station and many people don't shovel. However, I just watch where I am going, wear the right shoes, take responsibility for myself.=, etc I think we've lost perspective - if I was going to pick a battle, this would not be it | ||
| marian Citizen Username: Marian Post Number: 76 Registered: 9-2001 |
JJC, You can watch where you're going and wear the right shoes, etc. and STILL take a header -- as can postal carriers, delivery people, the eldery, children walking to school, etc. I went to college in Wisconsin and learned how to walk on icy streets and on ice-packed snow. The most important lesson I can impart is that the best way not to fall is NOT TO WALK ON ICY STREETS OR ICE-PACKED snow! | ||
| clkelley Citizen Username: Clkelley Post Number: 64 Registered: 6-2002 |
marian ... I think you're missing a critical point: Your neighbors helped you when you were in need. Imagine if they hadn't. And instead posted rants about you on MOL. I think that's the point here - people should stop ranting and lend a hand. You have done so, and I think that's great. I think your post is an even clearer rationale for helping our neighbors - because by doing so, we protect ALL of our neighbors!! By helping Neighbor A who can't manage the shoveling on his own, we are not only helping him but also Neighbor B, who has small children who need to walk to school, and Neighbor C, who is elderly and might break her hip on Neighbor A's sidewalk. Seems like a good deal to me. Oh and by the way: Yes,I have been injured on sidewalks - three times actually, twice resulting in small but noticeale scars on my face, once leading to an emergency room visit. These were the result of broken sidewalks (not in Maplewood). The third injury was on an icy restaurant parking lot, I fell backwards, hit my head and was very briefly knocked unconscious. So these weren't "serious" injuries, but certainly worthy of mention. I never tried to get money off of anybody, just didn't seem worth the hassle. | ||
| TomR Citizen Username: Tomr Post Number: 84 Registered: 6-2001 |
More talk of slip and fall incidents, so I inquire again. Does anybody know the status of the law in the great State of New Jersey for such suits in situations where an owner hasn't shoveled? TomR. | ||
| Joan Citizen Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 2377 Registered: 5-2001 |
The footing has been miserable for the last couple of days. Town sidewalks have been every bit as bad as those in front of private-owned properties and the area in front of the train station (NJT responsibility?) has been the worst. For the first day or two everyone's sidewalk was impossible. A few still are here and there. On my way up the hill this afternoon, I saw one woman shoveling her sidewalk just as the fresh snow was coming down. Those who are doing their best to keep the sidewalks safe should be praised. Everyone else should get with the program and try to maintain their sidewalks. | ||
| Tom Reingold Citizen Username: Noglider Post Number: 1828 Registered: 1-2003 |
TomR, I did a little searching with google and http://www.findlaw.com in response to your question about the law. I didn't find exactly what you're looking for. http://library.lp.findlaw.com/articles/file/00487/005663/title/Subject/topic/Inj ury%20%20Tort%20Law_Personal%20Injury/filename/injurytortlaw_2_191 http://library.lp.findlaw.com/articles/file/00464/006406/title/Subject/topic/Inj ury%20%20Tort%20Law_Personal%20Injury/filename/injurytortlaw_2_191 http://www.harwoodlloyd.com/publications/njsupreme/davenport_closter.pdf or http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cache:tf3_GCIkyMIJ:www.harwoodlloyd.com/publicati ons/njsupreme/davenport_closter.pdf+snow+sidewalk+suit+injury+new+jersey&hl=en&i e=UTF-8 Tom Reingold the prissy-pants There is nothing |
