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Message |
    
Dave Ross
Supporter
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4494
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 1:16 pm: |     |
Perhaps law if it's over asking price. Not a bad idea, Deborah. Any legislators out there? |
Bjp
Citizen
Username: Bjp
Post Number: 70
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 1:33 pm: | |
I agree that disclosing bids over asking price isn't a bad idea. That would raise asking prices. And AZ, you're right that realtors don't have to work to sell houses in our area right now. But in other parts of the country, they do. It makes this market seem all the more like a bubble. |
jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 72
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 1:52 pm: | |
More laws? Yeah!! Let's model home selling on rent control. Home values can only increase by eight percent for each year owned. That's fair, right? And let's do the same for investments! Heck, we can do for everything. Call it the
"Eight Percent is Fair" law. We can change the grading system -- No student shall receive a grade greater than 8% over another...nor shall any sport team exceed a lead greater than 8 points, 8 runs, 8 shots, 8 etc. We can level the playing ground for everyone based on the "Eight Percent is Fair" law. Our campaign motto: "Life is not fair, but we can make that way." Please send donations to "The Fair Maplewood Society" @ 888 Fulloshit Lane.
Great idea, Dave, Deborah! You will be greight leaders!
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jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 73
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 1:58 pm: | |
A seller is entitled to whatever amount a buyer is willing to pay or over pay. That's it and that's all. Not hard to understand. |
AZ
Citizen
Username: Azaltsman
Post Number: 81
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 2:12 pm: | |
Jeb, no one is trying to limit what a seller can make. The central point is that bidding should be disclosed. The price that the seller is selling their house for has to come from somewhere, right? Someone sits there and says, hey let's sell our house a certain amount. So that means the seller is ready, willing, and able to accept offers for a certain amount. So if you have multiple offers, no matter how high, the offers are disclosed. That's fair. If one guy wants to offer 200K over asking price, more power to that person. As long as the other buyers are aware I have no problem with that.
Rent control stands to solve a different problem and that is when rental housing becomes unaffordable for a certain percentage of people living in a community. This is an entire separate issue because local laws implement specific ceilings on rental units. None of my arguements for sales of real estate have anything to do with limiting how much a seller can make on a house. Hell, when I'm ready to sell my house I want the most I can get for it. |
AZ
Citizen
Username: Azaltsman
Post Number: 82
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 2:27 pm: | |
Jeb, your scenario does not represent the concept that I am trying to demonstrate. In my scenario, the agent would take the $625K offer, call back the guy who offered at asking, and tell him "Look, we have an offer for $625k do you want to beat it or what?". The guy on the phone says, no thanks. Seller sells to the guy offering $625K. OR the guy on the phone says, yeah, I'll offer $628K. Then the process goes all over again. What is wrong with that? AND all this would be made public and in writing. Guess what? No seller takes any offers until they are in writing anyway so why not make it public? THAT is what I am talking about.
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ffof
Citizen
Username: Ffof
Post Number: 1098
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 2:41 pm: | |
that's not a bad idea...kind of like an auction. |
bobk
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 2822
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 3:11 pm: | |
Interesting concept. I love to watch the classic and collector car auctions broadcast on Speedvision. People do get caught up in the moment and, to be honest, do some real dumb things.
The problem with the idea of the real estate bid process being open is that it will take for ever with bids increasing in $1,000 increments. Not a pleasent prospect. Also it presupposes that the seller will want to sell to the high bidder, which isn't always the case. A cash offer at X might be more attractive than an offer at X + $25k from a bidder who is really stretching to be able to buy the house and may not be able to close on a timely basis.
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jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 74
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 3:36 pm: | |
Once again:
A seller is entitled to whatever amount the real estate agent can get for his/her property.
Food for thought:
With the "auction system" would we need Real Estate agents?
Let's try it!
Florham Park House for sale: Center Hall Colonial, 4 bedroom, 2.5 bth, big enclosed porch, 1/2 finished basement, 2 car garage. Lots of hardwood floors, fireplace ( mantle not included). Appears to be on a busy street but car count is truthfully rather low. Taxes 5500+- Great Schools. Great sports systems for kids.
Asking price: $534,000. This is a deal of a steal!! What is my first bid? Do I hear....Yes, at this price I will include washer and dryer, both purchased not long ago! And a 198? Honda with 60,000 original miles!
Yes, this is a real offer. All bids will be revealed. but mind you, not guaranteed to be accepted. }Leave your bid on this thread with facts for contacting. |
crazyguggenheim
Citizen
Username: Crazyguggenheim
Post Number: 319
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 4:42 pm: | |
Florham Park? I wouldn't bid a dime over 10 cents!
Call me crazy |
Bjp
Citizen
Username: Bjp
Post Number: 72
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 4:43 pm: | |
I was once involved in an auction like that, on a co-op in Manhattan. The seller (who employed no realtor) plainly stated that the apartment would be auctioned on a given date and that anyone interested should plan to be home that evening. He required mortgage pre-approval letters (granted, they're not worth much) for all participants and didn't allow people to participate if they couldn't meet the co-op's rules. He called each participant in a given order revealing the highest current bid and asked if we wanted to bid again. I dropped out when the price reached my limit; at that point I was one of three people left bidding. It was a very efficient and fully disclosed way to sell the property.
That system would work right now in Maplewood and other such "hot" markets. It wouldn't work if nobody showed up for the auction! |
AZ
Citizen
Username: Azaltsman
Post Number: 83
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 2, 2003 - 5:51 pm: | |
Bjp spelled it out! That's the way to go! |
jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 75
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, April 3, 2003 - 7:34 am: | |
CrazyG,
No doubt you could not afford it.
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jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 76
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, April 3, 2003 - 7:57 am: | |
Another law for the Maplewood "Greighters" to consider.
"Westdeutsche Rundfunk, in Cologne, just passed an unusual new city regulation. Joggers going through the park would be required to pace themselves to go no faster than eight mph. Any faster, it was felt, would unnecessarily disturb the squirrels who were in the middle of their mating season."
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AZ
Citizen
Username: Azaltsman
Post Number: 84
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, April 3, 2003 - 9:22 am: | |
I personally like squirrels and would not want to see them extinct because of marathon joggers. Though I think a law for that that is going a little too far.  |
davec
Citizen
Username: Davec
Post Number: 80
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, April 3, 2003 - 10:10 am: | |
So running faster than 8mph could lead to fewer squirrels. . . time to start training |
alia
Citizen
Username: Alia
Post Number: 105
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, April 4, 2003 - 4:38 pm: | |
Jeb,
You wrote, "With the "auction system" would we need Real Estate agents? "
I hope you were being flippant, because I know from my experience (buying 4 houses, selling three) there is a lot that a Realtor does behind the scenes. The past four-plus years in Maplewood is a total abberation in the work it takes to sell or buy a home. When we bought our home in 1995, it was in a fabulous location, but run-down, hadn't had an offer in six months, and our great Realtor, Sandy Nash at Weichert Short Hills, told us that. Would the owner have? We bid accordingly, and easily got our home. Now homes on our street are sold in days, above or near asking, even the run down ones.
We have used Sandy for four of the seven transactions. She's great. The last sale we did on our own and I wished we'd used her, cause I didn't like having to remember (or forget) to put the ad in the paper, run around showing the house, field the barrage of phone calls, etc.
I completely understand the frustration with the sorority-rush secrecy of the bidding process, but does that mean that we'll sell FSBO? The vast majority of us won't, because it's worth our five to six percent to let a professional handle the details and try to get us a wide potential-buyer base and a selling price of more than five to six percent of what we could have.
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mwoodwalk
Citizen
Username: Mwoodwalk
Post Number: 82
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, April 6, 2003 - 12:43 am: | |
Way back about 30-40 posts ago a few people made 2 crucial points: (1) pick based on neighborhood, above all else; and (2) if you can, try to time your bidding for the "off season" b/w Fall and late winter. I agree w/ both statements, mostly b/c my wife & I bought in a great neighborhood (7 minute walk up the hill from train in S.O., Maplewood side of S.O. Ave, but not on busy street); and (2) we contracted in Jan. on a house that decided to first list just before Thanksgiving. As for statistics to back this up, when we had a bid accepted in late Jan. ('03), we got a printout from our broker showing that approx. 50 % of houses listed on MLS in the area (Maplewood) went above asking while about 50% went at or below asking--which seems to contrast sharply w/ the stories I'm hearing about the more traditional/popular bidding times (ie, now--through the summer).
End result is we got a great price on a house that needed a little work, but nothing major (another bit of advice you've prob. already gotten--look through bad decorating choices and accept homes that are fundamentally sound but have been owned for years by people w/ questionable taste).
I would add to all of this unsolicited advice the following: try to find the cheap-ass sellers that go w/ the discount brokers; we did that totally on accident, but probably got the deal we did (contract price was 30K BELOW what the mortgage co's appraiser gave us--and our finance guy said that we should prob. add 10K on to that b/c the mortgage appraisers usually just give you enough to get the mortgage) based in part on the decision of the sellers to use a dicsount broker who doesn't get the high traffic (and crazy bidding wars) of the mainline brokers (of course our broker was from one of the majors).
So, if you can avoid the Spring/Summer craziness & expand your horizons w/in these towns (and really FOCUS on location, location, location WITHIN the town), you might luck out like my fam. did--I emphasize in particular looking at houses during the "holiday season" b/w Thanksgiving & Xmas--true bargains then (although fewer homes advertised). Then again, perhaps this is just b/s borne of my unique personal experience. Good luck to all those going through the bidding crap right now (& FYI, we got outbid twice before settling on the strategy that landed us this gem). Cheers,
mwoodwalk |
lseltzer
Citizen
Username: Lseltzer
Post Number: 1414
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, April 6, 2003 - 7:22 am: | |
Price psychology is funny about fixer-uppers. $3000 doesn't seem like a hell of a lot in the price of a house, but think of what you could do to a kitchen with it, and you would end up having it the way you want. I would definitely look for the one that obviously needs some work. Then you get one of those mortgage packages that also comes with a home equity loan and use that money to fix it up. |
1-2many
Citizen
Username: Wbg69
Post Number: 96
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, April 6, 2003 - 6:40 pm: | |
wow... lseltzer, what CAN you do in a kitchen with $3000?? (paint doesn't count) maybe it would buy new kitchen applicances, but that's about it. new countertops are at least $5k. what significant changes can be made on this budget?
After my recent home-buying experience, I have the opposite advice - do NOT shop for a clear fixer-upper, unless you are getting it at a very good price, because even with a non-fixer-upper home I have put in tens of thousands and am still going strong, with plenty left on my to-do list. with ANY house that has not just been totally remodeled, there are PLENTY of repairs that become necessary with the passage of time, without even getting to obvious defects.
my experience is that home repair and improvement cost a tremendous amount. a new, BASIC bathroom is $17,500. a nicer one is $35k. a new BASIC kitchen is $40k. nicer ones can go, I am told, up to $100k. and then, there are some places that want to sell you just cabinets for $100k. I am not kidding. totally rehabbing a house would easily be $200 to $250. sheesh, just new window treatments and a coat of paint for everything is in the $7k to $10k range. and that doesn't include all the little extras that you find you need in your new home - like the bath shelves, kitchen carts, and other acoutrement (not talking major furniture) that make your new space liveable.
I feel like we were kind of sold a bill of goods on what things cost to repair or improve. the reality has been very, very expensive - and we have never (yet, knock wood) run into unexpected problems that are common. after learning these lessons, I am passing them along to others, so they don't find themselves asking, "it costs HOW MUCH? I thought I could do this for $3000?!" |
lseltzer
Citizen
Username: Lseltzer
Post Number: 1415
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, April 6, 2003 - 7:29 pm: | |
Next time you need renovations come to me. I want to be selling to you. |
1-2many
Citizen
Username: Wbg69
Post Number: 97
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, April 6, 2003 - 8:02 pm: | |
now THAT's funny.
I shopped around... a LOT. because I had the same attitude as you.
after putting in many foot-hours, I learned:
the price just is what it is for this stuff. |
bobk
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 2846
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, April 7, 2003 - 8:05 am: | |
Every home improvement article I have ever read indicates major home improvements such as kitchens, baths, additions, don't add dollar for dollar value to a home.
I have seen quite a few houses around here that need some big work; Kitchens, baths, replacing galvanized water pipes, roofs, ancient asbestos loaded boilers, etc. and the selling, or at least asking, prices don't reflect the amount of work.
One house I saw recently is on the market in the low $300,000s. The broker thinks it will go for around $340,000. It needs at least $50,000 in work. The neighborhood is a $350,000 to $375,000 one imho. |
jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 77
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Monday, April 7, 2003 - 8:15 am: | |
1-2Many,
"I feel like we were kind of sold a bill of goods on what things cost to repair or improve..."
I don't understand. Who sold them to you?
Did you attempt to do anything on your own?
Alia,
Real estate agents have their place although
I just sold a house in Maplewood without one. However, I do wonder if the property could have sold for more had I used an aggressive agent ( one who could foment a bidding frenzy).
By the way, how many thousands of dollars did you save by selling your house on your own? Sometimes the inconvenience is worth it. That money not spent on agent commission translates into some top of the line improvements for the new home (or a year of college tuition).
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1-2many
Citizen
Username: Wbg69
Post Number: 99
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 7, 2003 - 9:36 am: | |
jeb -
I guess it's not fair to say we were sold a bill of goods on home repair/improvement costs. We were a little bit as we relied on some estimates obtained by realtors (DUMB). but in addition, we did our own homework and found ranges of numbers for these projects, but we are guilty of being hopeful and figuring we would be at the low end. That's just not the case around here.
we did do a lot of work on our house on our own, and we continue to do so. painting, wallpaper stuff, stripping, repairing and staining woodwork, minor plumbing repairs or even upgrades, plaster repair, we have done ourselves. none of this work is very hard - it's more tedious - but it IS time-consuming. often, after these working weekends, I feel I need a true weekend to recover! I and my husband both work full-time, have a child, have regular home/lawn maintenance work we do, do our own taxes, etc... and we also need our downtime. we can't put every waking moment into our house or the work that it takes to keep up our lives. so where we are beyond our patience or our comfort level (or both) we hire some of this out, too.
AND, it is really way beyond our skill level to remodel a bathroom or kitchen, or refinish floors (we tried, and did NOT do a good job - created more work than there was to begin with). although we are more handy than most of our neighbors it seems, the stuff we can do ourselves is nickel-and-dime value in terms of labor costs for someone else to do it: for example, if you are already paying labor of $14,400 for a bathroom remodel, really what's the extra $400 for painting? It's worth it to me to save a weekend of very tiring work for $400, especially when I am doing so much else myself. |
Bjp
Citizen
Username: Bjp
Post Number: 79
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 7, 2003 - 10:11 am: | |
1-2, you must have a lot of counter space. I paid less than $3,000 for a whole kitchen of granite. And I totally rehabbed my house for a whole lot less than the range you stated. |
1-2many
Citizen
Username: Wbg69
Post Number: 100
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 7, 2003 - 10:38 am: | |
Bjp - I talked to your contractor - the numbers he quoted me were a decent amount higher than the contractor I ended up going with! and, higher then the numbers you and I talked about last fall. I would be interested to know why that is. |
jeb
Citizen
Username: Jeb
Post Number: 78
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 8, 2003 - 8:32 am: | |
1-2 many,
I am currently working with a handyman/interior house painter on my own major renovation. And he is a fantastic mural painter - really unbelievable stuff ( must see a restaraunt in Summit). The charges for his handyman services are $22.50 an hour. I pay for all materials. For the past month he has been shimming out the ancient walls and ceilings studs of a very large house ( plaster and lathe came down ). In addtion he framed the bathrooms and doors. He is somewhat slow, however his work is meticulous and I am fortunate to have him. About middle/end of May he will be off my job and looking for other work ( he's been working for me for a year ). Please leave a message on this thread if you are interested in hiring him.
Fee for mural work is $35 a square foot depending on the content.
Incidentally, I will soon be teaching him tile skills using Tile Council of America standards as well of state-of-the-art shower/bath waterproofing systems.
Note: I do not make any money for referring him. |
1-2many
Citizen
Username: Wbg69
Post Number: 104
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 8, 2003 - 9:57 am: | |
I very likely would like to hire this guy; the rate is fantastic, and I could really use the help at a better price. Especially if he can do tilework - yahoo! I desperately need some tile repair but am afraid of having a new tile bathroom floor turn into a whole bathroom remodel, which I just cannot afford or justify at this time.
Please post the contact info, or send me an e-mail to legalspice@comcast.net. Does your guy do floor refinishing?
Thanks!!! |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 106
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 8, 2003 - 9:59 am: | |
Wow! Two Guys from Newstead charge $60 an hour! |
sac
Citizen
Username: Sac
Post Number: 745
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 8, 2003 - 11:45 am: | |
I would like to get in line, especially if he is interested in picking up more than one customer, as we are going to have some work that might be off and on. You or he can email me at sac07040@yahoo.com |
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