| Author |
Message |
    
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4991
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 10:58 pm: | 
|
http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/16/hersh.iran/index.html
(Checking to see if there are WMD first this time.)
|
jerkyboy
Citizen
Username: Jerkyboy
Post Number: 33
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 11:01 pm: |
|
It looks like the scare machine is up and running.....
......again |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4992
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 11:04 pm: |
|
You must be referring to the guys in the administration who are leaking this information to the reporter. |
Nohero
Citizen
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 4256
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 11:13 pm: |
|
Sheesh, we had inspectors in Iraq before the invasion, and the President told them to get out, because he wasn't going to wait for them to finish.
And anybody who suggested that it might be a good idea to not invade, was called bad names at the time.
So, is this "Groundhog Day" again? |
Bobkat
Supporter
Username: Bobk
Post Number: 7245
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 6:47 am: |
|
I certainly hope the Joint Chiefs are working on plans to take out Iran's nuclear capability if it comes down to that. To ignore a possible military solution would be negligent.
I just hope that Wolfowitz and his crew are not going to have a roll in this. I think one case of unfounded optomism is enough. |
Dr. Winston O'Boogie
Citizen
Username: Casey
Post Number: 975
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 11:06 am: |
|
what's Farsi for "flowers?" we don't want our guys mixing up the words for bouquets and bombs again. |
Chris Prenovost
Citizen
Username: Chris_prenovost
Post Number: 253
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 12:17 pm: |
|
I wonder if this story was deliberately leaked to encourage the Iranians to co-operate with the U.N. arms inspectors. |
Dr. Winston O'Boogie
Citizen
Username: Casey
Post Number: 977
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 1:27 pm: |
|
Read the article. According to Hersh's sources, the administration has NO desire for Iran to submit to a diplomatic solution. In their words, our fearless leaders believe Iran needs to be "whacked." |
notehead
Supporter
Username: Notehead
Post Number: 1873
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 1:38 pm: |
|
Good thing we came up with something for our troops to do. I'm sure they're getting fat and bored in Iraq.
I do have a question for George, though:
WHERE'S OSAMA?! |
Strawberry
Supporter
Username: Strawberry
Post Number: 4292
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 1:42 pm: |
|
story not accurate.
Statement from Pentagon Spokesman Lawrence DiRita on Latest Seymour Hersh article
The Iranian regime's apparent nuclear ambitions and its demonstrated support for terrorist organizations is a global challenge that deserves much mores serious treatment than Seymour Hersh provides.
Mr. Hersh's article is so riddled with errors of fundamental fact that the credibility of his entire piece is destroyed.
Mr. Hersh's source(s) feed him with rumor, innuendo, and assertion about meetings that never happened, programs that do not exist, and statements by officials that were never made.
A sampling from this article alone includes:
· The post-election meeting he describes between the Secretary of Defense and the Joint Chiefs of Staff did not happen.
· The only civilians in the chain-of-command are the President and the Secretary of Defense, despite Mr. Hersh's confident assertion that the chain of command now includes two Department policy officials. His assertion is outrageous, and constitutionally specious.
· Arrangements Mr. Hersh alleges between Under Secretary Douglas Feith and Israel, government or non-government, do not exist. Here, Mr. Hersh is building on links created by the soft bigotry of some conspiracy theorists. This reflects poorly on Mr. Hersh and the New Yorker.
· Mr. Hersh cannot even keep track of his own wanderings. At one point in his article, he makes the outlandish assertion that the military operations he describes are so secret that the operations are being kept secret even from U.S. military Combatant Commanders. Mr. Hersh later states, though, that the locus of this super-secret activity is at the U.S. Central Command Headquarters, evidently without the knowledge of the commander if Mr. Hersh is to be believed.
By his own admission, Mr. Hersh evidently is working on an "alternative history" novel. He is well along in that work, given the high quality of "alternative present" that he has developed in several recent articles.
Mr. Hersh's preference for single, anonymous, unofficial sources for his most fantastic claims makes it difficult to parse his discussion of Defense Department operations.
Finally, the views and policies Mr. Hersh ascribes to Secretary Rumsfeld, Deputy Secretary Wolfowitz, Under Secretary Feith, and other Department of Defense officials do not reflect their public or private comments or administration policy.
|
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4994
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 1:55 pm: |
|
Interesting. This statement does not refute any of the claims Hersh makes in his story regarding activities in Iran. |
notehead
Supporter
Username: Notehead
Post Number: 1874
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 2:03 pm: |
|
Shhhh! You're not supposed to notice!!! |
Strawberry
Supporter
Username: Strawberry
Post Number: 4293
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 2:07 pm: |
|
Notey,
Quiet, the grownups are talking.
Dave,
Not sure that matters since his sources weren't legit. That's the point. He can claim anything he wants to claim but w/o real sources it's just not a real story. |
Dr. Winston O'Boogie
Citizen
Username: Casey
Post Number: 979
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 2:37 pm: |
|
welllll....
Hersh's sources on the (lack of) WMD in Iraq were apparently better than W's, so as far as I'm concerned, he's infinitely more believable on this particular story than anyone in the Bush Admin. |
Dr. Winston O'Boogie
Citizen
Username: Casey
Post Number: 980
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 2:40 pm: |
|
for example:
http://www.newyorker.com/printable/?fact/030512fa_fact |
Nohero
Citizen
Username: Nohero
Post Number: 4257
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 5:25 pm: |
|
The Pentagon spokesman's denial, makes the original story seem more credible. |
anon
Citizen
Username: Anon
Post Number: 1604
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 5:47 pm: |
|
Between Seymour Hersh and the Government of the United States, who's more credible? Check out both their track records. |
Chris Prenovost
Citizen
Username: Chris_prenovost
Post Number: 257
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 6:04 pm: |
|
If we could leave the usual polemics aside for a moment. . .
Iran is enough of a danger to begin with. I, for one, do not want to see them with nuclear weapons. Talk about a destabilizing influence. A Taliban-style, wildly repressive, anti-female, reactionary government, armed with nukes? Not my idea of world peace.
I am not defending the Bush administration and it's record of incompetence, WMD's in Iraq, Non-existent ties between Saddam and Osama, and fiscal mismanagement of the highest order. But we cannot allow Iran to get nukes, period. If the UN or the Euroweenies can negotiate a way out of this mess, fine. If not, send in the Spirits. |
bottomline
Citizen
Username: Bottomline
Post Number: 153
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 6:23 pm: |
|
This is pure saber-rattling. The administration won't invade Iran any more than it will invade North Korea. It's too late, and they don't have the military resources or domestic political support.
As for Hersh, he has a long history of breaking major stories and of having reliable sources. I agree with Anon, his track record for telling the truth is superior to the Pentagon's.
|
wharfrat
Citizen
Username: Wharfrat
Post Number: 1516
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 6:32 pm: |
|
Hersch isn't partisan, either! He's been a thorn in the side for the following- LBJ, Nixon, Carter, Reagan, both Bushes, and Clinton. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4996
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 6:44 pm: |
|
Of course we're going to invade Iran -- if we don't Israel will. |
Mustt_mustt
Citizen
Username: Mustt_mustt
Post Number: 204
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 7:12 pm: |
|
And then the s..t will hit the fan |
Chris Prenovost
Citizen
Username: Chris_prenovost
Post Number: 261
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 7:17 pm: |
|
I hate to intrude with the facts, but. . .
1-) No one is going to invade Iran. A country of 70 million people is a rather tough nut to crack without adding a religious dimension.
2-) An extended air campaign coupled with commando/special forces on the ground is what is being discussed.
3-) Israel has few means to strike Iran. The two countries are a thousand miles apart, and the IDF/AF does not have the capacity or the logistics to mount that kind of operation over histile territory. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 4997
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 7:25 pm: |
|
Since when have facts been an issue at the Pentagon? I think the real reason for wacking Iran now is to keep it from basically annexing their weakened foe, Iraq. They've invested $1 billion in that activity so far. |
singlemalt
Citizen
Username: Singlemalt
Post Number: 792
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 7:34 pm: |
|
Why Iran? We should invade France. |
cjc
Citizen
Username: Cjc
Post Number: 3018
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 8:43 pm: |
|
Hersh is non-partisan, and Chris Matthews identifying him as a liberal proves that.
I should hope we're conducting covert activity in Iran.
A full-scale invasion would 1) be too late given their advances in nuclear technology and 2) risky in tipping the already anti-mullah sentiment in Iran into a reactive nationalist response to any outside military intervention.
This is a great story to get out for the Iranians to read. When I heard that the IAEA was going to inspect installations weeks or months after the Iranians agreed to them, it reminded me of the old baseball steroid testing regimen. Trust, but pay for it. Wait..that was N. Korea with the Clinton Administration. I'll get back to you on this.... |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 5035
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Friday, January 21, 2005 - 9:28 am: |
|
Confirming my previous guess about the situation, Cheney now says Israel may take out Iran's programs:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/21/politics/21cheney.html?oref=login |
Phenixrising
Citizen
Username: Phenixrising
Post Number: 329
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Friday, January 21, 2005 - 11:11 am: |
|
Now that's serious.
Great! A 2005 Holy Apocalypse in the making. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 5080
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Sunday, January 23, 2005 - 8:58 pm: |
|
Partial confirmation of the original story. Iran not mentioned, but these are the units deployed. Wonder why other nations don't like our forces flying in and out of their sovereign boundaries?
http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/23/pentagon.intel/index.html |
court07040
Citizen
Username: Court07040
Post Number: 183
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 8:29 am: |
|
You're right, we should just leave those poor innocent Iranians alone. Let them build their nuclear bombs in peace. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 5083
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 9:15 am: |
|
Not sure where you got the impression that I'm against intelligence missions. |
Carl Thompson
Citizen
Username: Topcat
Post Number: 97
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 12:06 pm: |
|
Here's what Imus said about Cheney's visit to his radio program (from the New York Times):Afterward, Mr. Imus said in an interview that he had gotten "a good vibe" from Mr. Cheney. "And I was surprised at how healthy he looks; his skin tone was good and his eyes were clear," Mr. Imus said.
Also, he said, "he seems like he can be funny, but he isn't quite sure whether he wants to be or not."
|
ffof
Citizen
Username: Ffof
Post Number: 3276
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 12:14 pm: |
|
his skin tone was good and his eyes were clear? Wha? |
Dr. Winston O'Boogie
Citizen
Username: Casey
Post Number: 1002
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 12:31 pm: |
|
apparently Imus was expecting Mr. Cheney to look like a slightly warmed-over cadaver.
 |
Michael Janay
Citizen
Username: Childprotect
Post Number: 1476
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Monday, January 24, 2005 - 1:31 pm: |
|
Imus is not the person whose opinion I'd take as far as "looking good"
Imus gets up every morning, looks at himself in the mirror and says "Beautiful Baby!"
The guy looks like a trainwreck. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 5205
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 - 9:04 am: |
|
Inch by inch, step by step... deja vu all over again...
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/02/09/rice.iran.ap/index.html |
Michael Janay
Citizen
Username: Childprotect
Post Number: 1541
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 - 12:29 pm: |
|
How awful,
2 years from now there may be free and democratic elections in Iran...
Terrible, just terrible. |
Dave
Moderator
Username: Dave
Post Number: 5209
Registered: 4-1998
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 - 12:39 pm: |
|
Hey maybe we can install the former Iraqi Ba'athists in Iran after we topple the Mullahs to bring back a balance of power in the region? Playing nation-builder is so much fun even if we're totally distracted from finding actual terrorists. |
Closed: New threads not accepted on this page