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Message |
    
Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 752
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, March 7, 2005 - 7:47 pm: | 
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Fwiw, the Montclair state program starts in grade 2. They also have a distance program starting in 4th grade. I know the guy who runs it, and I also know the woman who does the tech part of the DL program. They're good people and I believe the program is very good. I've been thinking about it too, it's just a pain to go up to Montclair on a Sat. morning.h |
viva
Citizen
Username: Viva
Post Number: 630
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 7, 2005 - 7:56 pm: |
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R--
How is your son's attention/focus? Do you think he is an auditory, visual or tactile/kinesthetic learner? |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1875
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 7, 2005 - 7:59 pm: |
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Regarding the Child Study Team experience. I am not a member of one but have a desk in the same office as a CST. From what I can tell they are required to do an eligibility determination. And part of that determination is whether a child's "disability" (which is really what CST work is supposed to address) is causing a discrepancy between ability and performance. But, as I understand it, the performance has to be significantly behind grade level i.e. a year and a half lag behind age peers. The CST has virtually nothing to offer (and no legal responsibility to as far as I can tell) gifted kids. The kids with emotional difficulties they refer to me for counseling mostly have average/above intelligence but don't perform to grade level because of emotional and/or behavioral issues. The teachers keep hoping I'll wave my magic wand. Instead we just slog through it week by week.
There is a G & T program at Montclair State that meets on Saturdays. I think 3rd graders can get in on teacher recommendations. Older first timers have to get certain test grades, I think.
I think if I were in your shoes I'd try to scrape together some private school tuition to try it out for one year. If that seemed to be the answer I'd look for a really good scholarship.
I would also give him all the challenging software I could get my hands on (and there is quite a bit out there) so that he can continue to be challenged somewhere. We have used some of that as our own private G&T program at our house. What are his real interests?
Cathy |
nan
Citizen
Username: Nan
Post Number: 1869
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 7, 2005 - 8:15 pm: |
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Rudbekia,
I have at least some idea of what you are going through since my kid is a, "school gets in the way of his education" type. Until the middle of first grade he refused to do almost anything except complain about how the lack of recess and the shortness of lunch. Homework was always completed laying down with his face in the rug. When it came to reading he used to pull his ears out and squeak, "I'm a non-reading elf."
He's doing much better now (3rd grade) but he still says he does not like school and "dreads Sundays." Part of me thinks about switching him to a different type of school and part of me says, "deal with it, we are not going to have any 'wipe my butt' types in this house." It's so hard to know what to do sometimes.
I don't know if he's gifted or talented, but I do know that I doubt he would want to be in any program that would require him to do MORE school work. That's something I think some people just assume about bright children--that they need special programs to give them more stimulating and difficult schoolwork. Some kids just LOVE school, and can't get enough of it. Some kids just love finishing their work first so they can sit and stare into space and not do anything or read a book they are interested in or draw pictures or fight aliens on Gamecube (my kid's choice every time) or recite every detail from every Spongebob or Simpsons episode ever written.
One thing I have been absolutely firm about is reading and lately, writing. I have completely pounded it into his head that reading is the key to being smart and that smart kids read all the time and where is his book? He'll leave the house without his hat and gloves before he leaves without a book. He's become very self-confident and proud about his reading ability and it has been key to getting attitude improvement at school, and something of a safeguard aginst academic failure.
Another strategy is giving him more responsibilities and chores around the house. I'm really convinced some of this is just not wanting to grow up and who can blame them. I'd love to be a baby again myself.
There's probably no magic bullet solution and sometimes they need a change of venue and sometimes they need a kick in the pants. You just have to try to tune in to which one in needed in every particular situation and be ready to change again. You have to be very sensitive to when they are really upset or when they are just pushing your buttons which they are masterfully good at doing. My kid is ready to argue cases in the Supreme Court. Just don't ask him to write a story using his spelling words.
One thing that might be affecting your child right now is that the NJASK tests are coming up and in at least some of the schools they are doing heavy duty test prep which is mind-numbingly dull for some kids. Some kids like it though because they can just tune into the worksheet format and just coast along and get some good day dreaming in. Generally, though, I am in favor of a more meaningful curriculum based on real purposeful tasks because they are by nature multileveled and appeal to a wide range of students and also make more sense to skeptical and cynical kids like mine. |
silkcity
Citizen
Username: Silkcity
Post Number: 298
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 7, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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I recommend the NJ Assoc for Gifted Children membership for all parents. It's an advocacy group with an info exch much like this one, just focused on education. It's a good place to learn what your kids deserve! |
Montagnard
Citizen
Username: Montagnard
Post Number: 1458
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 12:36 am: |
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I asked my son (now in middle school) for advice on what would be best for a gifted third grader. Here's a few things to consider.
1. Ask your son's teacher if she can get some math worksheets from the Grade 4 teachers and let him do them in place of the regular class exercises.
2. Get him advanced in math. I'm not sure about Grade 3, but in Grade 4 a student can advance to Grade 5 math. The school will do this on the recommendation of the teacher and the District Math supervisor, Dr. Caroline Beattys (here's hoping she's still here next year!). Dr. Beattys has been very supportive of the gifted children in the MSO school system and is a good person to make contact with.
3. FYI, students in Grade 5 math can write the Grade 6 exit exam, which enables them to skip directly to Grade 7 math when they go to middle school. This puts them in an advanced stream that takes Grade 8 Math (level 5) in Grade 7, and Grade 9 math at CHS when they reach Grade 8. It is also possible to skip two years of math although this is harder because of the scheduling issues involved. The teachers in the advanced classes are supportive and open to parent involvement.
4. Help your son learn the importance of "testing well", since it helps avoid a lot of needless argument with the many teachers and administrators that don't grasp the special needs of gifted children. Remember that a genuinely gifted child (1 in a 1000) comes along only once or twice in the typical teacher's career. Most teachers do not know how to recognize them and (not unreasonably) want some tangible evidence before giving them special treatment.
5. Do not expect help from the District's Special Needs Department. You can only get your child classified if their mistreatment in the general education program has driven them into emotional disturbance or social maladjustment. Moreover, classification will at best get your child into an out-of-district program for emotionally sensitive children, many of whom will not be his intellectual peers.
6. Get counseling. There are several local psychologists that have experience in dealing with the MSO schools. Several offer group sessions for children as well as individual sessions. Some of these may help your son develop coping strategies for the classroom. Also, a good psychologist can help you in working with your school to develop a "504 Plan" for your child, which can be put in place even if they are not classified as Special Education students. It may also be helpful to have your child's psychologist accompany you to some of the meetings with his teachers.
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Rudbekia
Citizen
Username: Rudbekia
Post Number: 95
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 11:05 am: |
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I wish I had the time right now to go through and thank you all personally for the time and effort you've put into your posts and PLs to me. I am truly grateful and moved. Unfortunately, work today looks to be a bit busier than yesterday ;) .
Cody--your post hit close to home , esp. your closing comment "no one should be asked to do something they hate day in and day out for 15 or more years," which sums up exactly how I think he is probably seeing school now--like an indefinite prison sentence. I guess "formulating new ideas" and "seeing things in a different way" are his creative strengths. He's also very imaginative--can easily play an imaginary game with his friends from 7 am to 9 pm without stopping at all, not even to eat (I have to hand him a hot dog as he comes by, hehe). He comes up with endless storylines and characters, etc. He is his most blissful during one of these play sessions, and sometimes he will write his stories down. I know the way he tested in kindergarten at Morristown--the way he went about finding solutions to the little problems they presented--was considered unusual and creative. He doesn't really test much at all right now, and I can't imagine him ever testing well regardless of his knowledge of its importance. I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that the system is simply not set up to reward, challenge, or accurately asssess his type of strengths. He is completely obsessive about his interests and has been since he was 1. His first obsession was books, having me read them over and over and over. He could quickly memorize and "read" them back to me, pages full of very long passages, by the time he was 18 months, but he was very slow to learn to actually read when the time came for that. He simply wasn't interested. His next obsession was brass instruments. This started when he was 2 and went on for about a couple of years. We could take him to see an orchestra and he would sit there silently for 2 hours without moving staring at the performers. But this interest never translated into wanting to play enough to actually learn and practice. I even got him a trumpet and a trombone at a house sale, but once he saw that he couldn't just blow and have music come out he lost interest, although he still has a large interest in music and can sing elaborate melodies on perfect pitch. He's a total perfectionist and if he can't do something perfectly the first time, ie pick up the tuba and play a tune, he doesn't want to do it, something that I also feel could be one of the main things keeping him from succeeding in the classroom instead of a learning disability. And if you see it from his point of view, why should he put in any effort at all to learn something he doesn't care one whit about in the first place. Appeals to him that it will help him in the future are, of course, much too vague for a child his age. I mean, really, what is there else to say but that "it's just what you're supposed to do" or "you'll be able to build on this knowledge later"? Those answers, while meaningful to us as parents, mean nothing to him when he just wants to be doing something else.
I have actually read Mel Levine, but I should probably look into his work some more and will do so. I have asked him how he would design a school, and basically the answer is that he wouldn't have to do the things he doesn't want to do (which is basically everything there. Even music, which he loves outside of school, becomes just another chore when in school). His main academic interest is science. He is also very bothered by any disruptive behavior and any noise, of which there is a lot in all the classrooms he's been in. Mostly, his teachers allow him to go out in the hall to take tests/get away. As a baby and toddler, he was the definition of the "highly sensitive child," but has since grown out of or found coping strategies to deal with most of his sensitivities, except for the one to noise. He is also rather baffled by the kids in his classroom who are very into the whole MTV culture and who do a good deal of trash talking and talking about sex etc at lunch and on the playground (I had quite the education about this when I accompanied his class on a field trip, but that's another looooong story that would horrify you).
Nan--I laughed out loud at your son's "non-reading elf" comment. Hilarious, I already love your kid! You totally hit the nail on the head with this: "I don't know if he's gifted or talented, but I do know that I doubt he would want to be in any program that would require him to do MORE school work." Exactly! He just wants to be engaged in creative play. Again, you echo my thoughts exactly with: "Part of me thinks about switching him to a different type of school and part of me says, "deal with it, we are not going to have any 'wipe my butt' types in this house." It's so hard to know what to do sometimes." So good to hear someone else can't tell the difference. This too is something I've thought of a lot: "I'm really convinced some of this is just not wanting to grow up and who can blame them." And again, exactly us: "There's probably no magic bullet solution and sometimes they need a change of venue and sometimes they need a kick in the pants. You just have to try to tune in to which one in needed in every particular situation and be ready to change again. You have to be very sensitive to when they are really upset or when they are just pushing your buttons which they are masterfully good at doing. My kid is ready to argue cases in the Supreme Court. Just don't ask him to write a story using his spelling words." And of course, that last line made me laugh out loud again because it is so true for us. And I totally wonder too if the prep for the NJASK is what's bringing on this latest spate of reaction to what he would call, if he could, mind-crushing boredom. And can I ask why it's necessary for a child to explain how he got his math answer when he gets it. This particular thing drives him crazy. So thanks, Nan, maybe our kids will meet up someday.
Okay, I've rambled here enough for now. Thanks again to everybody who took the time to write such thoughtful and helpful posts and PLs (I'll try to respond to those a bit later today).
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sk8mom
Citizen
Username: Sk8mom
Post Number: 109
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 11:47 am: |
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Rud,
As a mother of a "spirited, challenging" boy I really feel for you. Here are some thoughts I have had in reading your posts--
1. You will know in your heart what is right for your kid. Be his advocate and don't give up!
2. If you are checking into private schools, check into The Darcy School in Livingston. They have a website and there have been posts on this board about them. I'm sure it's expensive, but I'm also sure scholarships are available. It's worth a look.
3. I don't mean to be forward or impertinent, but if you haven't already done so, do somereading on AD/HD, Inattentive Type. I speak from personal experience, and I notice some overlap with what you are describing. Among the criteria are boredom, failure to focus when things aren't interesting to you, and conversely the ability to focus intensely ("hyperfocus") when things ARE interesting or in times of crisis. These kids are often very smart and creative, but are pegged as "dreamers." And the AD/HD diagnosis is missed because the hyperactivity element is virtually absent. If left unaddressed, secondary consequences can develop such as self-esteem issues and depresssion.
If you think there's something there, don't settle for a "no" answer until you've gone to a professional who deals with this all the time and knows it when he or she sees it.
3. I may live to regret this, but I use a rewards system for home AND school-related behavior -- for example, 100 stars on the chart will get him some toy or video game he is dying for.
I am pulling for you and wish you strength. I hope you have your own support system to turn to during these times. |
Joan Auer
Citizen
Username: Joan
Post Number: 125
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 12:20 pm: |
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Rudbekia,
If you are thinking of other schools, it might be worth taking a look at Seth Boyden. My son, who is a first grader, is having a wonderful experience there. While his teacher's main focus is getting the students to read and write well this year, she manages to do this in a very fun and creative way. The class performs plays and reads and writes (very simple) poetry regularly. Also, his extra classes, such as music and gym, seem to be more interesting and enjoyable than what he experienced last year. For instance, storytelling through movement is used in one of his gym class. He loves this. The school also has fun lunch clubs and afterschool classes run by the PTA. My son espcially looks forward to the days when he has a lunch time drawing club and an afterschool drama class. As I have a child who is not very excited about the "work" part of school, i.e., learning to read, practicing handwriting, etc., these "add-ons" are very important. They keep him excited and happy with going to school and help him to deal with what he sees as the boring parts of it.
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C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1879
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 12:31 pm: |
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sk8mom, I had some thoughts about the ADD issue as well but hestitated to post them. I've spent a good part of the last 6 months boning up on ADD in order to do a better job at work (I do school-based counseling and LOTS of the kids I work with have ADD, with or without the hyperactivity.) I think you're right that it's worth checking into. If you go to About.com or simply google ADD you'll find some good info, Rudbeckia.
Cathy |
sk8mom
Citizen
Username: Sk8mom
Post Number: 111
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 1:30 pm: |
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Cathy, thank you.
Rud -- Again, feel free to ignore this if you want. I got a few URL's so if you wish, you can go directly to information I would view as pertinent:
http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/adhd/symptom.htm
http://www.addvance.com/help/parents/gifted_child.html
(this article is called Does Your Gifted Child Have AD/HD?)
http://www.additudemag.com/ourkids.asp?DEPT_NO=302&SUB_NO=16
http://www.aboutourkids.org/aboutour/articles/about_adhd.html#what
http://www.additudemag.com/ourkids.asp |
ashear
Supporter
Username: Ashear
Post Number: 1705
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 1:49 pm: |
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Rud - your comment about noise made me think of something my sister in law is dealing with in her daughter: sensory processing disorder. This might explain why he does well in the quite surrounding of your home but not in the bustle of school. Its something to look into. Also keep in mind that it may not be one thing but several in combination. Good luck. |
Morrisa da Silva
Citizen
Username: Mod
Post Number: 161
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 2:23 pm: |
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From reading your posts I would say it is imperative that you get your son evaluated. Besides certain cognitive and processing disorders and AD/HD inattentive type as others have mentioned some of the behaviors you describe bring to mind Aspergers Syndrome or at least Aspergers type behaviors. I'm not a professional and do not claim to know very much about this but my friend has a son who is very gifted and was recently evaluated. Some of your experiences sound very similar to hers.
The testing is indeed expensive but I do not believe the district can ignore the findings of valid independent testing. I know of a lot of people who have had independant testing which resulted in an IEP being set up to accomodate their issues and most of these kids were not behind grade level. You will need to be a persistant advocate but it is not impossible.
Good Luck.
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viva
Citizen
Username: Viva
Post Number: 631
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 3:51 pm: |
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I asked earlier about attention/focus because I was thinking along the lines of add/adhd.
Some kids with add/adhd can be difficult to motivate if the task is not intrinsically rewarding. These kids are bright and highly imaginative -- have very innovative ways of looking at things. I personally don't like labels, but if your child is suffering, there may be help out there. |
viva
Citizen
Username: Viva
Post Number: 632
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 4:48 pm: |
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also, a child who is social and has good relationships with peers would NOT fit the aspergers profile. |
cody
Citizen
Username: Cody
Post Number: 683
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 7:29 pm: |
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If you think there's a possibility of ADD or ADHD (and many of these individuals are extremely creative and extremely challenging for an educational system to successfully cope with), I strongly recommend taking a look at this site:
http://www.drhallowell.com/ Dr. Hallowell himself has ADHD and has written several excellent books about the topic and also runs an on-line support group for adults with this classification. I've heard him speak and he has any number of real-life suggestions to help kids like this. I don't know if your child fits this profile, but you might want to take a look through the site or see if any of his books are in the library or available through the Parenting Center. Since he's presented through the District, they may have some of his work available for parents to borrow.
I can hear your frustration at not knowing what would be the best way to support your son - I hope there may be something here that you can use.
(on a lighter note, I've always been 'serially obsessive' myself with my interests - it's absorbing at the time and is very helpful when you're playing along with "Jeopardy" at home! But it did drive my mom crazy when I was a kid - between the 6 years of horses, and 4 years of Gilbert & Sullivan, it's no wonder the poor woman talked to our dog a lot!) |
millie
Citizen
Username: Millie
Post Number: 140
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 8, 2005 - 8:09 pm: |
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It is tempting to dismiss homework as unimportant, but as your son progresses through his education, (specifically fifth grade and beyond) he will be held more accountable for getting it done. All of my children at one point or another, have had their grades seriously affected from not doing and/or handing in their homework. Speaking from experience, by middle school, even if your child places in the 99%ile on the standardized tests, his failure to do homework will result in a recommendation for diminished class level placement.
That's the bad news, but here's some hope. My son was diagnosed with ADD in third grade. We asked the district to test him, at the recommendation of his teacher. Until the diagnosis, his homework sessions were exactly as you describe. Maybe worse. After his diagnosis and medication, he was a NEW BOY. The change was dramatic. Even better... it was miraculous. He hasn't had a notable problem since and it's now five years later.
Here's a resource: Summit Center for Learning (Morris Ave in Springfield) ran a battery of tests on one of my kids who was having some problems focusing. They'll break the testing into shorter sessions if your son can't handle the normal length tests. After they evaluate his performance, you'll know where his deficits and strengths lie, will give recommendations about what to tell his teachers, and help determine whether he needs medication.
Good luck.
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Rudbekia
Citizen
Username: Rudbekia
Post Number: 101
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:40 pm: |
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Thanks, again, to all. I'm still trying to answer the many PL messages I got. I am asking once again that he be evaluated by the Child Study Team. His teacher says that she doubts they'll do it since he's not behind grade level, but I figure I'll try again. If not, I'll pursue another independent evaluation (which he already had in kindergarten, though now I really wish I'd waited!). I suppose it could be ADD, although no teachers have ever thought so, and it's definitely not Asperger's. The psychologist he's been seeing said that if there's anything it's probably a hard-to-detect processing disorder and that he can test him in his office. His name is Michael Gerson and there's a Dr. Antonelli in the office as well who's an EdD. Anyone have any interaction with these professionals? |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1895
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:48 pm: |
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If kids are reasonably smart and not hyperactive, teachers don't necessarily think of the ADD possibility. I'm reading an interesting book right now called Classroom Success for the LD/ADD Child. I think the author is Sandra Spencer. She starts out with a story of an obviously gifted young man who became a drifter of sorts, dropping out of school early because of total lack of success and therefore interest in school. Worth a look, I think.
Cathy |
CageyD
Citizen
Username: Cageyd
Post Number: 245
Registered: 6-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 10:03 am: |
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Rudbekia
Your son doesn't need to be so behind for him to qualify for special services. My child was at or above - in one instance 3 grades above - his grade level in most every indicator (there were about 20+ such indicators). However, there were three areas where he was slightly behind. Getting qualified for special services also has a lot to do with his psychological/social profile. Good luck |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1899
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:18 am: |
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CageyD, I think you are referring to what is known in CST circles as "discrepancy." That is, a large inconsistency in performance from one area to another. That is a good indication of some kind of learning disorder. Sometimes it turns out to be a processing disorder, sometimes a coding disorder or something else altogether. Usually, though, the area of difficulty has compromised the performance at a below-grade level. You don't always see this in the report cards because humans have amazing ways of compensating for weaknesses. But testing by a combination of people i.e. a learning consultant, a psychologist, and possibly a neurologist if warranted, will bring out the discrepancies if they exist. Note, we're not talking about run of the mill "I'm better at verbal skills than math" stuff. It's more complex/profound than that. But also possibly more subtle.
Cathy |
mjc
Citizen
Username: Mjc
Post Number: 373
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:38 am: |
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Here's something perhaps off the wall, and I'm being lazy about re-reading the thread, AND maybe too nosy, but...
bek, how long has this been going on? I see you're planning a wedding (congratulations and very best wishes!). Could the extra excitement, upcoming changes, and/or your attention to the preparations be part of what your son is up against at this time? Could he be looking for some extra attention and reassurance?
best wishes to all for a happy outcome, as always -
MC |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 787
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:38 am: |
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I know very little about these issues; however, I will relay this story: My friend's daughter had large discrepancies in performance among different subject areas and also hated homework. Turned out there was some sort of visual impairment that is not readly apparent to laypeople. The professional involved was a developmental optometrist, and once the problem was addressed, the issues disappeared. |
Rudbekia
Citizen
Username: Rudbekia
Post Number: 103
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 12:03 pm: |
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MJC, thanks for your good wishes. Your speculation is completely off-base, although I wish I could attribute his learning problems to something so incredibly simple! His learning issues became apparent in kindergarten, which is why I had him extensively tested at Morristown Memorial at the time. Unfortunately, it was really too early, since he hadn't learned to read yet and therefore some tests can't be given/aren't very useful.
CageyD, in our meeting with the child study team last spring in which we requested an evaluation, they said that unless he was behind grade level they could not evaluate him. All I know is what I was told, and that notwithstanding, I'm asking for it again even though he's still not behind grade level. Now if we have him evaluated privately and find something, I do believe that they do indeed have to provide services whether he is behind grade level or not. It's a tricky little thing, ain't it? |
breal
Citizen
Username: Breal
Post Number: 450
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 3:07 pm: |
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Don't wait for the district to do an eval. Get one of your own. If the finding is ADHD alone, your child will not be classified. He will be offered a 504. A 504, in this district, means his classroom teacher will make accommodations, which is already happening in your child's case. 504 kids are also eligible for home copies of textbooks. The 504 plan can include that the teacher must sign his assignment pad each day. These two modest supports can be very helpful to a dreamy child, especially if he is of the exploded desk/exploded backpack ilk. They can lead to him turning in his homework more regularly, which is HUGE! The child starts to feel a sense of efficacy. He starts to feel like he can get a job done.
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Rudbekia
Citizen
Username: Rudbekia
Post Number: 105
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 3:37 pm: |
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Thanks. He already has a 504 plan based on the anxiety diagnosis he got last summer. It allows him extra time to take tests and things like that, but provides no services. I *will* wait to see if the district will do an eval as evals are very expensive. He is very organized, very neat (one of the neatest desks in the class according to his teacher, keeps his room and his collections very organized), always turns his homework in on time, etc. so I'm not sure where those things you suggested would help him, but thanks for the input. Like I said, no one, except for on this message board, has ever suggested he might have ADD, so while I don't discount the possibility, I tend to defer to the experts who've actually worked with him. I still maintain that there is equally every possibility that he is just bored out of his gourd. |
wendy
Supporter
Username: Wendy
Post Number: 603
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 4:40 pm: |
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Rudbekia, In spite of your (imo) inaccurate assessment of public schools (and this district, in particular) where you said:
"I hate the idea of him spending 10 more years in this unhappy, brain-numbing, creativity-killing state. Or is that just the definition of public school?"
I feel for you and your son. My son is in seventh grade and is a generally well-adjusted, socialable, bright kid. He has peers however who are extremely bright and have managed with the schools' help and their parents input to make a wonderful success of all this district has. Before you leap to private school - should that be an option - just remember that private schools (and I speak with the experience of being close friends of parents who send their kids there for many reasons) are notorious for giving MUCH more homework than do the public schools. Your posts mentioned how much he dislikes homework so I just offer that tidbit as a suggestion, for what it's worth. Good luck on your road to discovery. |
Rudbekia
Citizen
Username: Rudbekia
Post Number: 106
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 5:15 pm: |
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Thanks for your good wishes. I thought I'd addressed and explained my comment about public schools in subsequent posts. But anyway, this thread is not about public vs. private school, and it is my sincere hope that it not be hijacked as such.
There is really no chance of my leaping to private school as I'm sure I can't afford one that I'd be interested in sending him to, but if I won the lottery I'd certainly send him to one. What I would hope to get out of one would be a much lower student-teacher ratio, far less class disruption, any services that he needs (without having to fight for them), and a curriculum that he could relate to or that could be more tailored to him (as far as I know a public school really does not have much control over these issues nor does it have the resources to devote). Also, there is no reason why he would be expected to do more homework at a private school of my choosing, since clearly I would not choose one where that would be a requirement. |
breal
Citizen
Username: Breal
Post Number: 451
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 10:27 am: |
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Ah. I misunderstood about the homework. A lot of projection going on in this thread, I imagine. Certainly on my part, anyway. The image of a quiet third-grade child in a classroom that's loud and peppered with street talk made me think of one of my kids, who read defensively throughout the school day that year. The classroom situation was very bad.
I'll just add my good wishes to everyone else's. |
C Bataille
Citizen
Username: Nakaille
Post Number: 1901
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 10:43 am: |
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Breal, I loved your description of "read defensively" as I have done it all my life. My guess is that if he wasn't already one, your son turned into a great reader that year. It does sound like the teacher did not have a handle on discipline that year. The year that happened to my kid was in first grade and she did not yet have the skills/option to do that so she got lots of stomach aches before school. It was only later, in a well-handled second grade class (with fewer students and a better gender mix) that she and we realized what a daily emotional assault first grade had been, between acting out kids and a screaming teacher. Luckily she'd had a great kindergarten teacher and we'd instilled a deep respect and love for school/learning early on or 1st grade might have had a more far reaching negative impact. But learning to survive those situations is something we all need to be able to do. Your kid obviously has real personal strengths and resources.
Cathy |
breal
Citizen
Username: Breal
Post Number: 452
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 17, 2005 - 2:40 pm: |
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Thanks for the kind words, Cathy. Just to clarify, it was my daughter, not my son, who had a rough third-grade year. My son had a glorious third-grade year with the deeply creative, experienced, kind Suzanne Ryan. I still have the haiku she coaxed out of my writing-challenged, "just the facts, ma'am" boy.
An observation: Third grade is when many kids needing special services finally get referred for special ed in our district. The work gets harder, and children with learning disabilities are less able to "pass." It's sad to see. Some act out. Some fade into the woodwork. In my daughter's third-grade year, there were lots of kids acting out, for whatever reason.
By fourth grade, more children with learning disabilities are getting the resource room support they need. It's better situation for all concerned. Both my kids had fourth-grade classrooms in which learning was possible. I think it helped that more kids were getting the support they needed by then. |
cbbk
Citizen
Username: Cbbk
Post Number: 15
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 1:22 am: |
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Rudbekia,
Children who have ADD are eligible for Special Services under IDEA. It would be classified as other health impairment.
Our family just went through this entire process. My child was diagnosed as ADHD (5th grade). My child has had some issues prior but nothing major. This year the homework was crazy. My child would do anything but homework. We requested an eligibility meeting and from there testing etc. was done and my child now has the accommodations and assistance needed. By the way my child was and is performing at grade level with limited weaknesses in writing. The actual physical aspect of writing was making my child crazy!
An extremely good book which helped alot you might want to check out..
Right Brained Children - in a Left-Brained World
Unlocking the Potential of your ADD Child.
by Jeffrey Freed, MAT and Laurie Parsons.
Some creative strategies.
Some ideas we have used with success:
learned sign language alphabet used for spelling words.
tell stories into a tape recorder then either child types or an adult.
card war good for math add/sub/mult.
dice: math same
create scenes with lego/blocks have child act out story while someone writes it.
Good luck Hope it helps. |
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