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Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 779
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 5:33 pm: | 
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I have a question.
When I was a kid / teenager, my parents (who were both in mid-management positions in their workplaces) refused to sell any of our fund-raising stuff at work. They said it wasn't fair, because the people at work would feel obligated to buy from the boss.
Other kids I knew had parents in higher positions than this, who had no trouble bringing the order forms in to work, and as a result they cleaned up. We had an annual sub sandwich drive for the band, and this one guy I knew had a dad who was some top banana at 3M. We got a percentage of our individual sales credited towards the cost of our annual band trip, and this guy always got a free trip because he sold so many subs. I always found that brutally unfair because he was rich already.
I never bring order forms into work, as I internalized my parents' practice. I am reasonably certain that if I did, there would be people who would buy stuff that they don't want from me in order to make a positive impression.
I just wonder what people think of this - is it OK for a boss to bring fundraising order-forms to work and pass them around? |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 3997
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 5:46 pm: |
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Absolutely not.
With something popular like GS cookies, I've seen it where someone with a daughter or niece will leave the form in a central location & people can buy if they want to, no pressure.
I once had a boss who passed his daughter's cookie form around the table during a staff meeting. He was overcome with emotion at the fact that all of us supported his daughter. With only 7 people, who was going to be the one to forgo the purchase? She was 16 and well old enough to do her own selling.
In fact, I hate coworkers bringing fundraising things to work. The only person I will buy from is my own admin. If the kids are old enough to do it, they should go door to door and hit up relatives. If I bought one thing from everyone who ever sold something at work for their kids' schools, I'd be broke.
In a former company, managers were not allowed to collect money or sell anything. In fact, when my boss's husband died, my staff had to do a collection because I couldn't. |
gozerbrown
Citizen
Username: Gozerbrown
Post Number: 663
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 5:48 pm: |
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I kind of go either way. Sometimes, depending on what people are selling, it's fun when people bring in their kids' stuff to sell. I wouldn't feel obligated to buy from a higher-up; I think they would understand if you didn't want to buy anything. However, it bugs me when you see kids, like the Girl Scouts, selling stuff at tables and it's the parents doing all the work. Occasionally, the parents are doing everything while the kids are sitting back playing Game Boys. Even as a youngster, I remember going door-to-door selling stuff (hating every second of it, too). I think the kids should also pull their fair share. |
sac
Supporter
Username: Sac
Post Number: 1899
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 7:37 pm: |
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I bring Girl Scout cookie order forms to work, and people there are happy to order them. But, I've never been a high-up boss, so I can see where that could be a problem. I do not ever recall any senior managers doing this kind or thing, unless it was anonymously. (Such as the box of fundraising candy labeled "benefit xyz school, place money in envelope" left in a common area.) Also, I always let people know that I encourage them to buy their Girl Scout cookies from a relative or neighbor if they have the opportunity to do so, but that I have them if they don't have another way to "get their fix." |
The Libertarian
Citizen
Username: Local_1_crew
Post Number: 513
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 7:46 pm: |
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once i discovered that girl scouts themselves are not an ingredient in the cookies i stopped buying them. |
Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 781
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, March 10, 2005 - 7:53 pm: |
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sac, I think it's fair enough for a person without people reporting to them (or maybe just one or two people) to bring the form in to work. But I'm glad others agree about bosses, because there are times when I feel like I'm a bit loony or out of touch, or a prig or something.
I do know a couple of guys in higher positions than me who routinely bring order forms in to work. I don't think people actually mind the Girl Scout cookies - everybody really wants them. But I think it's pretty skunky for a "big boss" to bring in orders for various candies, pretzels, wrapping paper, yadda yadda yadda, and then pass them around the office. Especially since not all of the employees are American, and in some cultures it would be extremely nervy to face down the boss on something like this.
I don't think they recommend that kids sell door-to-door these days though. At least not without a parent there with them. I also used to sell stuff door-to-door and totally, thoroughly hated it.
Here's another ethical thing that I found shocking: Our band director tried to tie our sub sales to our grade in band (it was a regular class that we took for credit). A parent complained (obviously) and he had to stop. But can you imagine a teacher thinking that this is OK? This was many years ago, in Maryland in the 1970s. |
Lizziecat
Citizen
Username: Lizziecat
Post Number: 540
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 12:12 am: |
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I do not approve of any organization which uses children selling things to raise money. I would rather be asked directly for a contribution. |
Cynicalgirl
Citizen
Username: Cynicalgirl
Post Number: 1188
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 6:43 am: |
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I'm torn out this, as a parent of a girl scout. My daughter comes to work with me a fair amount, so she is known. At the same time, we have scarcely any family and all far away. What we did was walk around our immediate neighborhood with the cookie form (wouldn't send her alone). And, I did bring the form to work. I put it next to the copier for a week so anyone who cared to could buy cookies. I do have about 8 people reporting to me, so I am sensitive to feelings of coercion. For what it's worth, I really couldn't tell you who bought cookies and who didn't. |
redY67
Citizen
Username: Redy67
Post Number: 668
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 9:14 am: |
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Cathy I thought I was the only one whose parents wouldn't sell at work! I would always have to do on my own, and never able to do as well as those whose parents took the forms to work.
I never mind when people ask me at work to buy, be it my boss or a co-worker. If I don't want it, I say no. |
shoshannah
Citizen
Username: Shoshannah
Post Number: 780
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 10:37 am: |
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My husband brought my daughter's cookie form to work. He sent out an email telling people that he had the form in his office and anyone who had nobody else to order from could stop by and order. Also, I think it's good to tell people how much money the troop earns from each box (60 cents) and what the troop is raising the money for. If it's for a charity that people like, they may be more inclined to buy. |
Valentine Michael Smith
Citizen
Username: Umbert
Post Number: 102
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:11 am: |
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my only chance to get my thin mints/samoas are when someone brings an order form into work on behalf of their daughter. that didnt happen this year and now i have to go without. very tragic indeed.
anyone looking to unload some thin mints/samoas? |
SoOrLady
Citizen
Username: Soorlady
Post Number: 1858
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:12 am: |
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This is really a hard one... Girl Scout cookies are an entity all to themselves - people love them and wait for "cookie season". I wish someone in my building had a scout. But - allowing for cookies also means allowing for popcorn, wrapping paper, etc.. for which most people don't exactly mark their calendars in anticipation. |
sac
Supporter
Username: Sac
Post Number: 1903
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:37 am: |
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There are lots of Girl Scouts setting up "booths" around the community - shopping areas, train stations, etc. for the next few weeks, especially on the weekends and other heavy traffic times. You should be able to find some cookies if you look in those types of locations.
PS (to Girl Scout folks) - Please see the other thread on this topic and heed the warning against posting your booth sale info here. |
mommydee
Citizen
Username: Mommydee
Post Number: 105
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 11:43 am: |
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my husband also brings the cookie forms to work but just has it in his office on the wall and by word of mouth people will wander in and order without any pressure. He has some direct reports and also feels he does not want to push it on anyone. However every year most people love when they hear it's cookie time again . Many are young singles who would not get the opportunity otherwise. Every year though my daughter has to write a short thank you note to each of his coworkers and also gets all the orders ready herself. This way she is being more involved and the workers love it. My husband's boss was so impressed by her note he hung it up on his bulletin board! |
Taurus5208
Citizen
Username: Taurus5208
Post Number: 67
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 3:08 pm: |
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My parents would never bring my Girl Scout order form to work with them because 1)they did not want anyone to feel pressured into buying from them and 2)they did not want to have to buy from every person who bought from them. In my office, there are order forms and books passed around on a weekly basis (although never from management) and it is up to the individual to buy or not. I think this is a good way to do it and doesn't pressure anyone into buying. |
SoOrLady
Citizen
Username: Soorlady
Post Number: 1864
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 3:25 pm: |
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Back in the day.. the boxes sold for .35 cents - we didn't take orders - had to pre-order what we thought we'd sell. Then go door-to-door. Since I lived in the country, that wasn't easy - so I sold them on the bus to the high school kids. |
Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 785
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 3:33 pm: |
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Another related ethical question - If you are in management, and you buy one fundraiser-type thing from one of your reports, does that obligate you to buy something from all of your reports who come in with order forms? |
greenetree
Supporter
Username: Greenetree
Post Number: 4006
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 3:34 pm: |
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Yup. |
Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 786
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, March 11, 2005 - 3:38 pm: |
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So you shouldn't buy even one, unless you're prepared to buy from all - right?
This makes you into the big bad b- boss-lady, mind .... Not that I have a serious problem with this ... |
tulip
Citizen
Username: Braveheart
Post Number: 2098
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 7:21 am: |
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OK, obnoxious brag time and in the interests of partial disclosure:
My husband is a descendant of (among other old American families) the Gordons.
Who are the Gordons you ask? Well, none other than the family to which Juliette Gordon Low belonged.
Who was Juliette Gordon Low, you might ask? Good question! As some loyal and devoted Girl Scouts of America already know, Juliette Gordon Low was the founder of the Girl Scouts. She, incidentally, was a good friend of Lord Baden Powell, founder of Boy Scouts (guides or something like that) in England.
And what would my husband's father, who actually met "Great Aunt Julia" say about her take on this cookie business?
Well, he described her as a really adventuresome, one would say "pre-feminism feminist" who truly believed that girls should be independent, forward thinking, modern and strong. So, "Let your daughters sell their own cookies," I would venture she would say.
The whole point of the project is to give girls a sense of their own strength and wisdom, ability to plan and follow through. The money-making angle helps the Scouts, for sure, but it's not the point of the adventure. Have a good time, and learn something from it, she would admonish.
Don't you think?
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nan
Citizen
Username: Nan
Post Number: 1872
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 7:34 am: |
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I HATE when people sell their kid's stuff at work. It rarely happens anymore but years ago I used to get besieged every week for overpriced candy, huge cheesecakes and crappy wrapping paper etc. Since I'm so "nice" I'm also very approachable and sure enough I always bought from everyone. Little did they know the deep resentment that lurked in my pure heart. 
I especially hate when bosses put out the stuff because all the suck ups would go over and buy lots in a pseudo enthusiastic manner. Sometimes this could be amusing to watch. Once I had a boss that put out a box of candy with a sign that read "Help Homeless Programmers" and sold out in an hour with big fanfare. This was before outsourcing so we all thought it was funny.
Despite spending mucho $$$$ on coworkers items, I've never asked anyone to buy anything from my kid's school fundraisers. I always just buy something my self and send the form back to class.
The ONE except occurred when my son was at the Y and they were having a Tupperware fundraiser. I happen to mention it at work in a conversation about how much I hate school fundraisers. A few of the woman I work for, immediately said, "You can sell TUPPERWARE!!!! Where's the order form???" They forced me to bring it in to work (kept reminding me) and bought a ton and even sold to other coworkers! I had to shlep a huge bag of Tupperware in on the train.
I was so annoyed. |
Lydia
Supporter
Username: Lydial
Post Number: 980
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 8:03 am: |
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I like girl Scout cookies (esp. the peanut butter ones) so I buy them.
I don't need wrapping paper and chocolate thingys in tins so I don't buy them.
If you can't say "no" to a school fundraiser I don't think it's the seller that's out of line, it's your own inability to establish boundries.
If the seller is your superior at work, that's a bit sticky, but in most cases I doubt passing on the cookie dough/wrapping paper/seeds is sending anyone onto the unemployment line.
The girls should sell the cookies themselves, it's the parents who get too into the competition aspect of the fundraiser and forget that it's really about empowering the girls individually and as a group - totally agree w/ you Tulip. |
SO Refugee
Citizen
Username: So_refugee
Post Number: 44
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 9:30 am: |
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I took the form to work and kept it on my desk, so whoever wanted to buy could and those who didn't never even mentioned it. My problem was that when I brought the cookies into the office, I had literally 15-20 people ask me why I didn't let them know I was selling.
I wish I could use one of the drug dealer codes like my left pants leg is up, so I'm in business... |
Cathy
Supporter
Username: Clkelley
Post Number: 792
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 9:34 am: |
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Lydia, you are right about the boundaries of course. But many of our employees are Indian, and although I don't know much about Indian culture (although I am always trying) I have observed that they, to a person, buy every single da-n thing on offer at work. This includes the lowest-paid students we have working for us, and I know they can't afford to pay these prices.
I think that the higher-ups need to be sensitive to this mentality. When they don't, I think they are taking advantage of the employees. The bosses might not fire people for not buying and therefore think it's OK, but they may not know how hard it is for some employees to say no.
I also agree with you that kids should be empowered to do it themselves - whether it be for Scouts, the football team, gymnastics, whatever. |
tulip
Citizen
Username: Braveheart
Post Number: 2100
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 10:59 am: |
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Thanks, Lydia. |
Joan
Supporter
Username: Joancrystal
Post Number: 5137
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 11:18 am: |
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I agree with "Great Aunt Julia". One of the major aims of having the girls selling the cookies is to help them build a feeling of self-sufficiency in raising money for their own programs. If the cookie sale is handled properly, the girls also learn about self-confidence, planning, organizing, keeping records, effective communication skills and a variety of other lessons which carry over well to so many other aspects of their life.
The girls should sell the cookies, not their parents, aunts, uncles, grandparents or family friends. Having adults sell the cookies for the girls is a lot like having adults do the girl's homework.
Now, if you were to ask about the appropriateness of bringing the girl scout to the parent's work place to sell the cookies.... |
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