| Author | Message | ||
     dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1407 Registered: 5-2001 |
Cue "Dueling Banjos."  | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1607 Registered: 8-2004  |
Do we have to do this all over again? We addressed this statement six months ago . From the same AP hit piece: - Bush declared four days after the storm, "I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees" that gushed deadly flood waters into New Orleans. He later clarified, saying officials believed, wrongly, after the storm passed that the levees had survived. But the transcripts and video show there was plenty of talk about that possibility even before the storm - and Bush was worried too Seems the article says that Bush was warned about levees being topped , not breached. That of course would be a Clintonesque defense , so I won't use it. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1409 Registered: 5-2001 |
Guy, I think you took Clintonesque defensiveness to another level. Nicely done. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1647 Registered: 7-2004  |
Hey, what d'ya know, a transcript of a conference call that the White House told congress DID NOT EXIST suddenly appears. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11626997/site/newsweek/ What a bunch of liars. | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1608 Registered: 8-2004 |
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| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1410 Registered: 5-2001 |
Guy's got it right this time. Bush has the same respect for the truth as his predecessor. | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12704 Registered: 1-2003  |
Hang on, Robert Livingston. He was very engaged: he cared. He cared enough to say stuff! | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1609 Registered: 8-2004 |
dave, Bush is Ward Cleaver compared to Clinton. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1649 Registered: 7-2004 |
It's true, Tom. If Bush is guilty of one thing, it's caring TOO much. It's his Achilles heal.  | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12705 Registered: 1-2003 |
Is not! Phththth. I'm telling Mom. | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5114 Registered: 10-1999  |
If we're doing "Leave it to Beaver" analogies, the first President Bush is Ward Cleaver, Clinton's Eddie Haskell, and GW Bush is definitely Lumpy. | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1610 Registered: 8-2004 |
With a name like Bush , one of them has to be Beaver. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1412 Registered: 5-2001 |
You made the comparison, Guy, not me. I merely agreed with it. (One could argue that when Clinton lied, he knew he was lying, whereas when Bush lies he really doesn't know it because he is so utterly out of touch with what is going on around him.) | ||
| tulip Citizen Username: Braveheart Post Number: 3290 Registered: 3-2004 |
Southerner says: Nothing like seeing Dems squirm, and you guys are squirming big time as we shove things down your throat. dave 23 says: One could argue that when Clinton lied, he knew he was lying, whereas when Bush lies he really doesn't know it because he is so utterly out of touch with what is going on around him.) I have actually been giving a lot of thought to these two explanations/rationalizations for right-wing behavior, and Bush's behavior. I have hoped beyond hope that dave23's position is the truth, and Bush is just too, shall we say, "limited" to understand what's going on around him, and too out of touch to ask. Unfortunately, sometimes he seems to be in the mode that southerner finally admits to being (the entirely immoral and unpatriotic) view of many right wingers. At least, Rove, Rumsfeld and maybe even Cheney do this. They really want to terrorize, intimidate and frustrate Democrats, and their strategies are aimed at that. It's so counterproductive, unpresidential, and antagonistic to true leadership to spend all your time trying to think of what would annoy the opposition, rather than actually trying to do something positive. Right Wing: No, Bush could not haul concrete down to LA or Mississippi, but he could have insisted that FEMA and officials go down there as the flooding happened. Why were they all in one room as the flood came? The ULTIMATE question is: Why did it take several days to fly or drive food, water and ice to the SuperDome and other locations? This was enormously frightening to watch people shouting, "HELP< HELP" and watching children and old people....AMERICANS...dying of thirst and hunger. Really. In the 21st century. Unbelievable. | ||
| Southerner Citizen Username: Southerner Post Number: 762 Registered: 2-2004 |
tulip, You finally get it. With no re-election to worry about the fun is messing with you libs. You guys give such a great reaction that it becomes addictive. I hope Bush keeps it up because I love to hear your shock and astonishment. | ||
| tulip Citizen Username: Braveheart Post Number: 3293 Registered: 3-2004 |
That's called sadism. | ||
| Southerner Citizen Username: Southerner Post Number: 765 Registered: 2-2004 |
No, it's called politics. | ||
| cjc Citizen Username: Cjc Post Number: 5279 Registered: 8-2003 |
Topped. Breached. They are different, but either possibility was addressed when the Feds said people had to get out of New Orleans. They were looking at a Cat 5 approaching NO, and had no idea what strength it would be by the time it hit. The conclusion all around seemed to be that big trouble was in the offing, and they told everyone to get out. They didn't say "Well, we don't think the levees will breach, so stay where you are" did they? This isn't to say the Federal response was adequate at all. It seems to me that we're going over the fact that the federal response sucked one more time (how many are we up to?), with a slight bit of light cast upon the state and local people being just as ineffective at addressing what was about to take place. All of which does nothing for the people of New Orleans. | ||
| Madden 11 Citizen Username: Madden_11 Post Number: 836 Registered: 12-2003 |
With no re-election to worry about the fun is messing with you libs. Yeah, it looked like the people stranded on rooftops and in the Superdome were having a great time getting "messed with." Every time I read one of Southerner's posts, I ask myself the same question: does he not know that politics is about more than just rooting for your own side, or does he just not care? The majority of liberals and Democrats on this board would be appalled if a Democratic president botched things so badly, but for those on the right, it's all good as long as it's their guy. No, it's called politics. No, it's called a callous disregard for any and all human life the second it leaves the womb. | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12716 Registered: 1-2003 |
does he not know that politics is about more than just rooting for your own side, or does he just not care? It doesn't matter which it is to me. Sadism is taking pleasure in others' pain. | ||
| Scrotis Lo Knows Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 937 Registered: 10-2005 |
Madden 11- RL- tulip- If you are so "outraged," quit your bitching and revolt already! What are you a bunch of pansies? All bark and no bite.... -SLK | ||
| Madden 11 Citizen Username: Madden_11 Post Number: 837 Registered: 12-2003 |
If you are so "outraged," quit your bitching and revolt already! So you think the appropriate reaction to a disagreement with the direction of our country is to reject democracy. That's the Clinton impeachment in a nutshell. | ||
| cjc Citizen Username: Cjc Post Number: 5283 Registered: 8-2003 |
The Clinton impeachment was a rejection of democracy??? | ||
| Madden 11 Citizen Username: Madden_11 Post Number: 838 Registered: 12-2003 |
The Clinton impeachment was a rejection of democracy??? Absolutely. The vast majority of the American people were against it. | ||
| Grrrrrrrrrrr Citizen Username: Oldsctls67 Post Number: 323 Registered: 11-2002  |
Oh boy...where to begin... | ||
| The SLK Effect Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 943 Registered: 10-2005 |
Madden 11- Here is a crash course in civics 101. We do not live in a DIRECT democracy. We live in a Republic/REPRESENTATIVE DEMOCRACY. You voted your congressmen to office to do the voting for you... got that? You figure out the rest.... -SLK | ||
| ae35unit Citizen Username: Ae35unit Post Number: 8 Registered: 2-2006 |
Guy, I'm not sure why you put a picture of The Rose Law Firm on the thread. Is it the bbbbbbbbbut Clinton did it too, thing? Southerner, I don't know why you take joy in attempting to hurt people, is that just a Republican thing? And Scrote, you still owe me. Here's my answer to the Rose picture, Guy, something equally relevant, Southerner, you'll like this:  | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1616 Registered: 8-2004 |
Unit, RL wrote the following. Hey, what d'ya know, a transcript of a conference call that the White House told congress DID NOT EXIST suddenly appears What a bunch of liars. Perfect Rose Law Firm segue way | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1655 Registered: 7-2004 |
Guy: But you do admit Bush is a liar, right? | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1617 Registered: 8-2004 |
Robert, still haven't seen any evidence that Bush lied. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1656 Registered: 7-2004 |
How did I know you were going to say that? | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5826 Registered: 12-2001  |
Breached V. Topped is much the same as what the definition of 'is' is. Political Doublespeak. It made me sick when Clinton said it, and it makes me sick when Bush says it. Only thing that is worse is the inaction on the part of GWB,LA and NOLA gov'ts cost lives. | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1618 Registered: 8-2004 |
Duncan, I don't put too much weight into single off the cuff comments especially when they are clarified. Bush clarified his levee statement. Blanco's statements to the WH on Aug 29 explains some reason for the confusion. "We keep getting reports in some places that maybe water is coming over the levees," Blanco said. "I think we have not breached the levee. We have not breached the levee at this point in time. That could change, but in some places we have floodwaters coming in New Orleans East and the line at St. Bernard Parish where we have waters that are 8- to 10-feet deep, and we have people swimming in there, that's got a considerable amount of water." Their hesitation may have cost lives, but they sure saved alot also. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 1657 Registered: 7-2004 |
Nothing Blanco said should excuse from the "no one anticipated the breach of the levees" comment. Just because they weren't breached at the time doesn't excuse Bush from this lie. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5827 Registered: 12-2001 |
RL....easy there cowboy. I am willing to entertain the notion that Bush believed what he said when he said it given the language used by both Blanco and the dude from the hurricane center. But, still in all, Brownie (to his disgruntled credit) seems to have said numerous times on tape that K was bigger and more dangerous and as a result needed closer attention. Now hearing phrases like "he was fully engaged" doesn't mollify the very real fact that the US Federal govt (leaving aside whatever screw ups occured at the state and local levels) completely dropped the ball with respect to saving the lives of the poorest of our contrymen and woman. There is not a big piece of me that allows sympathy for that. Bush had a chance (WITH WARNING NO LESS) to prove that all the hype of keeping America safe wasn't just hype and he failed. Miserably. By any standard. The quote that keeps sticking in my craw is Brown's when he said "if the levee's had been blown up by Terrorists we would have had everything we needed" (paraphrased). That strikes me as the most naked truth in the whole thing. | ||
| ae35unit Citizen Username: Ae35unit Post Number: 9 Registered: 2-2006 |
Guy, thanks for the explanation, I missed that connection. Possibly because it's utterly bogus. From Salon: Despite the impression left lingering by the nation's leading newspapers, a close scrutiny of the record fails to show that Hillary Clinton is guilty of any Whitewater crimes. In spite of the strenuous efforts of the independent counsel's lengthy, multimillion-dollar investigation, there still has not been any evidence presented to show that the first lady broke the law, or even did anything unethical. Take the infamous missing billing records of Hillary Clinton's work for Madison Guaranty. When the records finally turned up in the White House in 1996, after having been subpoenaed two years earlier, charges of "obstruction of justice" filled the airwaves and the halls of the Republican Congress. New York Times columnist William Safire called the first lady a "congenital liar." Drowned out in the hubbub was the fact that the records actually substantiated in great detail what Hillary Clinton had repeatedly testified to, publicly and under oath. ...and remember it's your multimillion dollars | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 12728 Registered: 1-2003 |
He lied, or he didn't pay attention. One or the other. Take your pick. | ||
| Guy Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1619 Registered: 8-2004 |
Brown said he was fully engaged. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 5828 Registered: 12-2001 |
Yes he did. And according to Brown, he was fully engaged at that 8/29 meeting. It is his contention that all the time leading up to and even immediately after the event things were messy. I am really interested to know why you are compelled to defend the indefensible when confronted with it in so many forms. I speak only of Katrina and the federal response at the moment. Bush •••••• up...big time. Given an opportunity to demonstrate great leadership in the face of an enourmous national catastrophe, he failed. By almost any measure. Why is that hard to face? Even if you love him for all the rest of the things he has (or hasn't) done. It is a wonder to me. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1419 Registered: 5-2001 |
He did say that, Guy. He also said, "I think the mistake the president did make is that he was overconfident in FEMA, despite my entreaties [about] what was happening to FEMA." If we are to believe Brownie, he warned the president that FEMA was not in good shape but was ignored. |
