| Author | Message | ||
     LW Citizen Username: Lrw Post Number: 76 Registered: 10-2005 |
SLK-Maybe I need to start hanging out with you because the only people I see wearing coats when it's 70 degrees are homeless people. Maybe that's why no one is answering your question, because we don't see it. Black people may however, wear coats when it's 60 or 65 degrees; while white people may wear sandals and shorts on the same day. Who knows? | ||
| mem Citizen Username: Mem Post Number: 6003 Registered: 5-2001  |
LW, If a white guy and a black guy were caught with crack wouldn't they both receive the same sentences? Little kids and high schoolers must be protected from drug scum more than college students, who tend to be over 18 and adults, hence the stricter laws. If marijuana laws were stricter you would figure out some way to relate this back to the black problem as well. This is getting ridiculous. | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 6 Registered: 4-2006 |
LW... Who ever you are, you go! That is exactly what I wanted to say! I even thought about Lincoln who freed the slaves and his comments about Negros. Here's some inside black culture info- doo rags have been around since I can remember. they were not really worn outside, but they are worn to make waves in the hair pattern. No different from a white woman wearing those big rollers to the grocery store. See how when you give a different image, your minds view becomes three dimensional? I have to challenge myself to do that all the time. For those of us watching Oprah right now she is talking about exactly what I said earlier every group has issues, the same issues. Today she is speaking about young girls wanting to be Paris Hilton, the Olsen twins, and are extreme dieting, using drugs and " dumming themselves down". Are we to blame the girls for their poor self image and how they conduct themselves (ex: girls gone wild), or should we understand the effects that Western culture and capitalism have had on young womens' self image? I see said the blind man notorious -One day I would like to explain that there is a distinct difference between hip hop and rap. I hate rap music and I am a spoken word artist. I love the hip hop culture and music produced by it. Follow me? Rap is- 50cent hip hop is= the roots, common, mos def, talib kwali, Erykah Badu.. Get it the difference? hip hopis every empowering and conscious. Think circa 80's Public Enemy and KRS-1, Poor Rightwous teachers etc. look up this music and tell me what you think rastro: A recent study was done on that same topic and sadly the answer is yes. First and foremost we are dealing with efficacy. Does the white man have more resources? Who does he know? Can he pay for representation? Beyond legislative... The study said a white man having done time is more likely to get a job than a black man who has not. Now that's deep ! Lydia- definately PL me. We are starting SOMAC again and I will be happy to have all of you at our next meeting April 22nd. We have to get beyond talk and it action! But need fresh, bright minds! So come on girl! | ||
| mem Citizen Username: Mem Post Number: 6004 Registered: 5-2001 |
I'm 1/2 Irish. Many times, Irish people are labeled as drunks. Should I be all outraged about the ever increasing strictness of drunk driving laws as possibly targeting my heritage? Sheesh. | ||
| The Notorious S.L.K. Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1189 Registered: 10-2005 |
LW- I got your point with your first post, but we can play this game forever. If you recall, I have no problem with Farrakhan speaking even though I think he is a goof. The important thing to remember about free speech is that it is a two way street. Many people tend to forget this. If you don't like/agree with what one says, retort! So you think the real reason that drug laws are stiffer around high schools/public buildings is only to keep the black man down? Sorry, there is much more to it and you know it. But please do not excuse the actions of these rappers just because you don't think blacks don't get their fair shake. This is the exact type of mentality that is hurting Black America. -SLK | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 565 Registered: 7-2005  |
S.L.K. It's not an attitude..it's a truth. And if hip-hop is the downfall of black youth, why do I listen to hip-hop religiously and yet I'm not rag-wearin' gang-bangin' drive-by shootin' baggin-saggin' pants wearin' game-spitter? And why are many middle-class white youths obssesed with Hip-hop and yet they aren't sucked into the mentality either? S.L.K. additionally..I do my part. What I do and/or don't do has no bearing in this discourse and neither weakens nor strengthens either of our arguments. | ||
| bklyntonj Citizen Username: Bklyntonj Post Number: 646 Registered: 7-2003 |
Ok mem, just for you. Cocaine has always been known as the "rich man's" drug. So it developed quite a status symbol. Soon it was discovered, if cocaine is cooked up with baking soda and other stuff (I won't get into it) to make it a rock-solid form, it becomes more potent and creates a higher return on investment (ROI) on the street. Since this became the drug of choice on the streets and made many people of color a boat load of money, something had to be done to stop this. Hence, laws were created to make the crime more severe for having crack (cooked to a rock-solid form cocaine)than powder cocaine. None of the ingredients used to make crack are illegal but having crack on your possesion is more illegal than having cocaine? | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 566 Registered: 7-2005 |
CIA CRACK/COCAINE INVOLVEMENT. Say what you will...but GuerillaFunk is the Label that brough back Public Enemy. I'll buy that. http://www.guerrillafunk.com/video/cia.html "I'm not a hunter but i am told, that, uh, in places like in the arctic, where indiginous people sometimes might, might, hunt a wolf, they'll take a double edged blade, and they'll put blood on the blade, and they'll melt the ice and stick the handle in the ice, so that only the blade is protruding, and that a wolf will smell the blood and wants to eat, and it will come and lick the blade trying to eat, and what happens is when the wolf licks the blade, of course, he cuts his tongue, and he bleeds, and he thinks he's really having a good thing, and he drinks and he licks and he licks, and of course he is drinking his own blood and he kills himself, thats what the Imperialists did with us with crack cocaine, you have these young brothers out there who think they are getting something they gonna make a living with, they is getting something they can buy a car, like the white people have cars, why can't i have a car? they getting something they can get a piece of gold, white people have gold, why can't i have gold? they getting something to get a house, white people have a house, why can't i have a house? and they actually think that theres something thats bringing resources to them, but they're killing themsleves just like the wolf was licking the blade, and they're slowly dying without knowing it. thats whats happening to the community, you with me on that? thats exactly, precisely what happens to the community, and instead of blaming the hunter who put the damn handle and blade in the ice for the wolf, that what happens is the wolf gets the blame, gets the blame for trying to live, thats what happens in our community, you don't blame the person, the victim, you blame the oppressor, Imperialism, white power is the enemy, was the enemy when it first came to Africa, and snatched up the first African brothers here against our will, isss the enemy today, and thats the thing that we have to understand." | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 7 Registered: 4-2006 |
Notorious S.L.K- why does it bother you that they wear coats in the summer? W big woop! My husband is from Monmouth county- very few black people in his town. in the winter he like my boss who is Dutch wear shorts and often his hiking sandals. I tease him an say thats from growing up with only white friends.(Joke people) I see plently of non-black males wearing inappropriate clothing in the winter. What sinister plan can they have? or do they just have a high tolerance to cold weather Do you see my point.... that question is a bit ridiculous. why did we all used to put cuts in our jeans(our 80$ jeans)! because we were goofy little kids, are black males not allowed to be quirky and goofy and have no fashion sense, or are they criminals,or gangs wearing big coats to hide weapons? NOt that you said that ,but I just sensed it. Hope I am wrong peace & love efull I wear socks to bed every night, no matter if it is 100 degrees outside? Am I strange? Perhaps Yes,if you know me | ||
| mem Citizen Username: Mem Post Number: 6005 Registered: 5-2001 |
Bklyn, Then the laws for crack should be more strict. Keep them off the streets and in jail. Or should they be out on the streets making it even harder for all the poor people of color who are actually trying to make it? | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 8 Registered: 4-2006 |
Glock- little Dred Prez- every day! Keeps me focused. "It bigger than hip hop" "I'd rather be gunned down, than dummed down" | ||
| The Notorious S.L.K. Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1190 Registered: 10-2005 |
Glock- Points taken. But I am not so much concerned about suburban kids as I am about the urban dwellers (the one's my wife works with)that know nothing but this mentality. And I never said hip hop is the downfall of black youth..it is part of a bigger problem. What do you think it is? -SLK | ||
| bklyntonj Citizen Username: Bklyntonj Post Number: 647 Registered: 7-2003 |
I agree with you mem but I also feel that some were upset because they weren't getting as big a piece of that ROI as they expected... Oh yeah, so I guess nobody but Buzzsaw, efull and Notorious SLK are up for the face-to-face sit down huh? | ||
| mem Citizen Username: Mem Post Number: 6006 Registered: 5-2001 |
"they is getting something they can buy a car, like the white people have cars, why can't i have a car? they getting something they can get a piece of gold, white people have gold, why can't i have gold? they getting something to get a house, white people have a house, why can't i have a house?" This similar to how my nephew thinks and speaks. He is 1.5 years old. He doesn't do crack when he can't have everything handed to him, but he does lay down and throw a mean tantrum!  Unfortunately the poor child of color won't have the opportunities my nephew may have, and something has to be done about that. | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 567 Registered: 7-2005 |
The larger problem is that black people were brought here to be slaves and hard workers for white people...and post slavery this country no longer wanted them because, in the eyes of this country, there was no longer any justification for their existence here. That fact still remains...it's just been hidden by the progress of social courtesy over time. But no one wants to hear that. So let's keep arguin'. Let's keep on guessin'. (i'm up for the sitdown..but after May 10th when I'm done fillin' my dome with knowledge) | ||
| mem Citizen Username: Mem Post Number: 6007 Registered: 5-2001 |
Of course I am up for a face to face sit down. Will there be wine? | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 9 Registered: 4-2006 |
exactly-mem bklyntonj-lets plan a day to meet at the library- maplewood or SO and everyone here can come if they choose. Hows this friday afternoon? | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 568 Registered: 7-2005 |
actually this friday is good for me www.guerillafunk.com | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 10 Registered: 4-2006 |
Wine! now we are talking ! do you see how well we do, when we communicate? If there's wine good conversation, some critical thinking, solutions I'm getting all hot & bothered already .....ooh boy | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7201 Registered: 5-2001  |
I swore that I'd stay out of this, but I can't help tossing in a couple observations. 1. The idea that "white racism (if there is such a thing)" and "black racism" are on equal footing. Once comes from a history of being oppressed and trying to better oneself, the other from a history of being the oppressor and trying to keep it all for oneself. 2. As someone in her mid-forties, I am barely old enough to remember the civil rights movement. But, I do. There is no way anyone younger than me can "get it". When "we" decided that leaving the civil rights and liberation movements out of the history lessons as the 80s and 90s went on, we did a great disservice to our youth and ourselves. The opportunity for learning from our mistakes got washed away; white people in their 30s have no understanding of how some of their actions offend. Black and white youth toss around perjoratives like the words have no meaning or history of violence or disrespect. Kids who want to learn about history are left to find it for themselves and sort thru differences between the teachings of Malcom and Farrakhan. When we stop living in fear of frank and open discussions of the history of this country, maybe the next generation will be more aware and a little smarter and we can stop having this discussion because it really won't matter. I've said this before on this board: Many people under 40 just don't get it. Young women today don't know what the older ones had to go thru so that they could be executives. Young gay people who are out freely (especially on the coasts) don't understand why their elders are still afraid to be out on the job. Young black men write lyrics calling women and each other all sorts of denegrating names; they don't understand a fire hose or know about the Panther breakfast programs. I am certainly not saying that this is true of all young people. And by no means am I saying that we've won all the battles against bigotry and unequal standards. But a lot of people lost jobs, lives and families to get us this far. Before everyone goes jumping all over Glock, think about the fact that he has made it his business to learn history and think about how it all fits in with today's world. | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 11180 Registered: 5-2001 |
There was a discussion here a couple of years about teenage drug use. There is a fair amount of evidence that drug use is more prevalent among white kids in the 'burbs than black kids in the inner city. Maybe someone can dig up the thread. A lot is perception and drug choice. Crack is, or was, an inner city street drug. Cocaine as Bklyntonj points out is the upper middle classes drug of choice. Perception people, perception people. I really don't give a shite if blacks feel the cold more than whites or not. Is this important? Didn't think so. Black guys I went to high school back in the 1950s wore du rags after having their hair straigtened which was called a "conk" job. This was, I am told, quite painful as it involved lye, but everybody wanted to look like the Commodores. Again, not a biggie. | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 11 Registered: 4-2006 |
Greentree, BOB K are you guys up for the discussion. Friday maybe Maplewood library if we can get a room? | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 12 Registered: 4-2006 |
Greentree, BOB K are you guys up for the discussion. Friday maybe Maplewood library if we can get a room? | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 570 Registered: 7-2005 |
Private message them. | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7202 Registered: 5-2001 |
Unfortunately, I can't make it on Friday. I am quite intrigued by Glock. Although, I am torn as to whether I actually have the mental energy for this discussion right now. A good friend is shaking her head as she reads this; I will receive a PL telling me that I used to have a conscience  No, just my stamina. TS, on the other hand.... What time? Perhaps she'll be around. | ||
| Wendy Supporter Username: Wendy Post Number: 2314 Registered: 5-2001 |
I'll be happy to join you but perhaps after you read the below you might think differently. LW, I learned about Jefferson's negatives in school (in addition to his positives) but that was not until high school, you know the school level we're talking about showing a more balanced approach to certain people. I would not expect to have learned it in elementary school, whether it was Jefferson School or some other elementary school that goes up to 5th or 6th grade. I'm frankly still astonished that hardly anyone is willing to call Farrakhan on his antisemitic messages. There were plenty of wonderful leaders for both blacks and others who did not need to stereotype or cast a certain subgroup in the position as oppressor. Whether his negatives should have been said during the assembly is open to debate (I of course think they should have), but I have the feeling that many of you posters don't feel the negatives resonate too much. I find that sad and disturbing and divisive frankly. efull, I can't walk a mile in your shoes although I consider myself an empathetic person. I liked what you said in your first post. Wonder what you Farrakhan apologists think about Bill Cosby's statements to the African-American community along with what has been quoted already regarding Morgan Freeman? Most days after work or weekends work for me. Can't do a middle of the day. Would prefer alcohol while we talk but I can do it straight too. Wendy Lauter I'm listed | ||
| Cynicalgirl Citizen Username: Cynicalgirl Post Number: 2610 Registered: 9-2003  |
I'm kinda with greenetree's post, above. At the age of nearly 52, and having lived through some serious recent history, it does feel like teachers aren't teaching much recent history, and younger folks just don't know what happened before about 1985. The whole how we got where we are today. Much happened with various civil rights (including women) just since 1972. Things that would blow your hair back single women could not do in 1972. We were property, virtually. Same for minorities. Not saying there's not a lot of ground yet to cover, but good to know where some things have been. And, how the declining U.S. manufacturing economy totally screwed a lot of underclass people of all colors. I'm no Marxist, and still less a Socialist. But I swearda God, they (that is, the real "man") would rather we fought amongst ourselves down here in the middle class and below than take a closer look at where the jobs and futures have gone for a whole lot of people. I absolutely believe it is stupid and wasteful and inefficient to fight amongst ourselves, and scapegoat each other. And we shouldn't let anybody lead us by the nose into such specious movements. | ||
| efull Citizen Username: Efull Post Number: 13 Registered: 4-2006 |
Wendy... I still want you to come to our yet decided upon and confirmed meeting of the minds. Obviously you are a thinker and you are entitled to your own thoughts, whether I agree or not is the beauty of discussion and being human. By definition Farrakhan is antisemitic, (see I said it and I used to attend the Mosque in Newark) where's the question in that? Does that erase his place in history is the bigger question. I believe it does not define him(again think 3 dimensional) there's more to his message than that. | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1084 Registered: 10-2004  |
greenetree - hear hear... Jefferson was a great man, a rich slave owner and the father of the constitution which makes our country great. He obviously was flawed but not by the standards of his day. LW can defame Jefferson all he wants but without Jefferson there may not have been a United States. Farrakhan on the other hand has no business being in the same paragraph. The man is a fraud. The nation of Islam is not benevolent and its roots are in black separatism. No one answered the questions about who murdered Malcom X. I will not be attending any discussion at the library, this forum is good enough for me as I prefer my anonymity. Most of you who were not born before 1960 do not know what the civil rights movement was about. Glocks favorite speech not withstanding. The nation was in tumult, Newark had riots which it still has not recovered from, the country was involved in a horrible war in Vietnam, the draft was in force and no one was exempt. There is racism in the world and it is pervasive and it makes it much harder on AA people to get ahead. But the good news is that it is better now then it was in 1970. Better then 1980. Better then 1990. You get it. Its not good. There are deep ingrained racist and evil people in the world but they are not winning. As long as we can discuss our differences and as long as we can respect each others positions, then we can in Rodney Kings words "just get along". In 1970 it was a very rare thing to see interracial dating. Now its not only common place but interracial children are everywhere. To me that is a wonderful thing. We have much more in common then we have differences. Drugs are an evil and crack was one of the worst scurges to ever visit the inner city. Crack is far worse then powder cocaine because it is so addictive. A generation was lost to crack in my opinion. | ||
| Glock 17 Citizen Username: Glock17 Post Number: 573 Registered: 7-2005 |
I'm bi-racial. Hoorah. And personally I think Halle Berry is the only justification needed for interracial relationships.  | ||
| Scully Citizen Username: Scully Post Number: 310 Registered: 8-2005 |
Hoops: 'the draft was in force and no one was exempt' Uh, half the population was exempt... Nice list but you forgot the woman's movement! | ||
| Cynicalgirl Citizen Username: Cynicalgirl Post Number: 2613 Registered: 9-2003 |
Glock 17, "Bullworth" would agree with you. | ||
| bklyntonj Citizen Username: Bklyntonj Post Number: 648 Registered: 7-2003 |
Wow, some of you posters are the most informative, interesting people on MOL. Your input would be huge in making a difference in race relations in our towns and abroad. Some of the things mentioned on this thread aren't known by the majority of people. We've touched on politics, religion, music, drugs, education, etc. This is powerful! Hoops, I'm disappointed that you wouldn't want to attend. You'd be a great asset to the discussion. Just imagine, if we're able to have this discussion what great strides could be made? The coalition on race, achievement gap and education system would all benefit by the precedent we could set. Just think, all those powerful statements and knowledge coming together; brainstorming. Now that's progress! Great job with taking control of the situation efull. Where ever, I'm there. | ||
| bklyntonj Citizen Username: Bklyntonj Post Number: 649 Registered: 7-2003 |
Oh and Hoops, there's still speculation on exactly who assasinated El Hajj Malik Shabazz. Some say it was members of Mosque #25 (Newark, NJ), some say the CIA, others the FBI. We can argue this but who knows. Glock, here's one of the most powerful statements I ever heard. This was quoted by Malcolm X. "The Nation of Islam, the greatest thing that ever happened to black people and n i g g e r s messed it up." | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1085 Registered: 10-2004 |
I'm honored. The discussion will be productive without me tho. Scully -  - your right. thanks for setting me straight. | ||
| The Notorious S.L.K. Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1191 Registered: 10-2005 |
Howdy folks, With a two year old pregnant wife (due end of April) my time is limited but am really interested for a sitdown... Let me know the 5 W's and I'll do my best to attend. Hoops go, I want to meet you... -SLK | ||
| Phenixrising Citizen Username: Phenixrising Post Number: 1531 Registered: 9-2004  |
As someone in her mid-forties, I am barely old enough to remember the civil rights movement. But, I do. There is no way anyone younger than me can "get it". DITTO! Great post greentree! Even though I was young, I do remember seeing AA's sprayed with water hoses on tv while quitely protesting. Gov. George Wallace freely showing his racism to the world. Hearing about the lynchings and shootings of innocent AA's. One of the worst thing I witness first hand was my neighborhood burning down around me after MLK was killed. I remember the hardware storekeeper who was friendly with our family crying because his business of several years was lost from the riots. In the 70's, I witness forced busing in Boston, and my siblings being chased out of White neighborhoods. My father's car being stoned while going to work. (He eventually had to take a detoured route to work.) While the busing issue tore Boston apart, one of the worst incidents happened at Federal Plaza in Boston. While some whites were protesting the busing issue they took it amongst themselves to BEAT an AA man with the American flag. Same Federal Plaza which housed both Senators Kennedy and Brookes at the time. Opposition groups from South Boston actually chased Teddy Kennedy into the building while he gave a speech defending busing and smashed out a huge window. I was there as a kid working partime and seeing grown folks behaving very badly. Like greentree said above, unless you witness and experience the civil rights movement (btw Jews marched right along with AA's in the 60's), you just don't get it. I've also seen on this board certain situations where folks just say, "what's the big deal?" I see it right in this particular thread by the comments of some. For the babies of the 70's & 80's, feel lucky you didn't have to live through the ugliness of the 60's and early 70's. I saw ugliness rears its head again yesterday on tv during the immigration protest. An American man burning the flag of Mexico. What kind of message is that sending to our youths? What kind of message is that saying to the world? SHAME. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6179 Registered: 12-2001  |
Can we please never forget that crap like this happened in my lifetime, in my hometown...Which, I think, is Greentree's thesis.  | ||
| J. Crohn Supporter Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 2518 Registered: 3-2003 |
"With a two year old pregnant wife..." Now that's something you don't see every day. | ||
| LW Citizen Username: Lrw Post Number: 77 Registered: 10-2005 |
Mem, there is currently a commission, headed by a retired Middlesex County Superior Court Judge, which seeks to rectify the current "school zone" laws throughout the state, because they are discriminatory in practice and enforcement. I would recommend that you try to find further information on it, or I can try to send it to you, if you'd like. The commission has found that because of these discriminatory drug laws, an overwhelmingly disproportionate amount of Blacks and Latinos are incarcerated for non-violent offenses, compared to their white counterparts. And the judge is not Black or Latino, because, if we're honest with ourselves, that did come to someone's mind. He is just a highly regarded, respectable man of the law who has witnessed first-hand the unfairness and bias of these particular laws. And he is able to realize the effect that these laws have, not just on the Black and Latino communities, but on our greater society as a whole. Perhaps we could all learn something about that. According to Malcolm X's (El Hajj Malik Shabazz) closest family and friends, along with actual facts, his gunmen were from the Newark mosque, but law enforcement (whether Harlem PD, CIA, or FBI) definitely played a role in the assassination of Malcolm X. And with or without Thomas Jefferson, there would've been a United States! Again his relevance speaks to the focus of the vilification, by some, of Minister Farrakhan; compared to the purgery of Jefferson's misdeeds. BTW, I'm a "she". I only point that out because some people refer to me as a male. |
