| Author | Message | ||
     Factvsfiction Citizen Username: Factvsfiction Post Number: 72 Registered: 4-2006 |
I don't know about you, but it annoys me when I read articles in the Times real estate section or elsewhere quoting the profundities of former Ny'ers, and fairly fresh NJ residents, about how it is living in New Jersey. Still sensing the need to seem cool and still cutting edge hip our new fellow residents generally prattle on about our crappy restaurants, the horror that things are not actually open 24/7 (!), the generalized sterility of the 'burbs, and oh yes, the need to always return to the mother country for their fix of culture and sophistication. I would like to say to them: Yes, I guess the quality of life in the City was just "all that" when you had to sit next to that ripe-smelling homeless looking guy on the subway, or came back to your building from a party at 1:00 a.m. and found someone peeing on the side of it, or when you used to take your kid to the park and enjoyed the admiring glances of the local perv. Next I would say: We're a welcoming lot here in NJ, so that's why we don't laugh at you when you try and mow your lawn, or at how you drive your car or attempt to park it. Give us and yourself a chance, New Jersey is your home too. And do us all a favor. Shut up and sit down. Your thoughts please. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9308 Registered: 4-1997  |
When they get homesick I offer to park outside their house and honk all night. | ||
| Jersey Boy Citizen Username: Jersey_boy Post Number: 596 Registered: 1-2006  |
Ditto. J.B. | ||
| Mayor McCheese Supporter Username: Mayor_mccheese Post Number: 1239 Registered: 7-2004  |
Or you could pave over their lawns and fill are new area with trash, hobos and urine. That would make any transplant out of the city feel right at home. | ||
| tulip Citizen Username: Braveheart Post Number: 3473 Registered: 3-2004  |
Frankly, the suburbs are too urban. Give me the country life! When I moved to the country from NYC, I tried to lure my NYC friends to come and visit. They dumped me. I'm still happy as a clam to have the scent of the lilacs I planted wafting in through my living room window, and watching my garden spring to life every spring. I'd be a hermit if I had to, just to be able to do a grocery shopping and not get clobbered by my fellow (wo)man. | ||
| Darryl Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 7100 Registered: 10-2001  |
Years ago NYC was a pretty cool place to live. Over the last few years it's become sissyville. You introduce me to someone who's just moved from NYC over the last few years and right off the bat I put them through the sissy test. 9 out 10 times, they fail and sadly I'm forced to brand them as a NYS..(New York Sissy) This is especially true if in the case of a man he shaves his head..This makes him a NYBS..(New York Bald Sissy) | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 3600 Registered: 12-2004  |
If it was so great in NYC, then why did they move here in the first place? | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1440 Registered: 2-2005 |
I moved to NJ for very specific reasons, not the least of which was getting some distance between myself and Manhattan. At the same time - yeah, there are rare times when a 24 hour deli would be nice... but I sure as hell wouldn't want one in the village! It's been two years and I am still having chinese food withdrawal issues... so I'll probably be nicer about it than most of you. Then again, its important to separate the true New Yorkers (i.e. those from Manhattan) from the ones that just TALK a good game: Like it or not, people from Manhattan have a very specific view of the world - one that takes decades to change - and it can be described as follows: 1. Manhattan - center of the universe. This is where everyone wants to live (but many people never admit that, even to themselves). It's OK to criticize Manhattan... just remember that Manhattan residents are never going to take you seriously. It's kind of like the United States in the United Nations... sure, we pretend to listen and we pretend to care what you think - but we're just trying to avoid an argument, you people simply do not register with us. 2. Brooklyn and Queens - Close but not close enough. People from Brooklyn and Queens might say they live in "NYC", but we all know the terrible truth. You get a few points for trying, but you're looked upon with the sad pity that all wannabe hipsters receive. The term 'poser' (or is it 'poseur') comes to mind. The phrase "I'm moving to Brooklyn" can be equated to "I've grown tired of living and want to kill myself... but have chosen a slow and painful method". You can blame it on the kids, you can blame it on the rents, but we know the truth - you're a quitter. There's something wrong with you, and we hope to God that it's not contagious. 3. Staten Island - I can't even discuss it. Staten Island should be considered a part of New Jersey (read on). People from Staten Island should be glad we don't sink the ferry and blow the bridges. If you were born there then it's not your fault - if you moved there on purpose, you deserve all the NYC garbage we can float over there on barges. 4. The Bronx - where the hell is the Bronx, anyway? And should anyone care? I think there might be a baseball stadium there, but it's north of 72nd street and therefore irrelevent. 5. Long Island - land of annoying teenagers who flock to the city on a regular basis. Can be indentified by various traits: pack behavior, over-loud talking, ridiculous sense of humor. Both men and women act as if they're in their first year of college, even the ones in their 40s and 50s. Younger Long Islanders can be good casual sex partners, but try not to engage them in conversation. Also, never admit to your Manhattan friends that you slept with someone from Long Island - there's a significant social stigma. The best thing you can say about Long Island is "at least it's not Jersey". 6. New Jersey - Much like Long Island, but at least Long Island is in New York State. Also, the Hamptons have a certain appeal... which, of course, is why New Jersey is #6 while Long Island is ranked #5. Many of the same attributes apply to New Jersey residents as to Long Island residents. For some reason, many NJ men unwittingly assume the personna of Tony Soprano as soon as they hit Penn Station - no one knows why. Look for knockoff designer clothing and lots of jewelery. Under no circumstances should you ask a suspected NJ resident where they live - they might actually tell you, and the explanation of how to get to their creepy little backwater town can take up to 10 minutes of your life. People who move from Brooklyn to NJ automatically upgrade themselves from former Brooklynites to former Manhattanites - because no one in NJ will know the difference anyway. 7. The rest of the country - let's face it... if it takes more than 90 minutes to get to Manhattan, you may as well be living in a rural Chinese village. We feel sorry for you, in a vague kind of way. Sometimes we may see these places in National Geographic magazine when we're at the dentist's office. Ask a true Manhattan resident if UNICEF should send money to Africa, Guatemala and Nebraska and they'll probably say, "of course - we need to help those poor unfortuntate third-world areas". PS - I actually like New Jersey, but let's not lose our minds... in other words, I don't think anyone from New Jersey should bring up the topic of driving ability. I've driven in approximately 15 states and five foreign countries, and New Jersey stands alone - it is the WORST driving experience I've ever had. I don't know what causes it... but driving in NJ is like walking through a locked ward in a psychiatric hospital - the best you can hope for is not to get TOO dirty or depressed. | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1202 Registered: 10-2004  |
What Case said - except for the part about Brooklyn. I love NJ err NY err NJ... Whatever - NJ gets its reputation from being the little brother. Practically the whole state works in New York so there is a symbiotic relationship. Native New Jerseyans can have an inferiority complex from the New York bias shown in all the media. Hey, I love you guys but you need to know that if you never lived in New York, you just will never get it. | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7457 Registered: 5-2001  |
 I've posted this in the past: Studies show that it takes the average NYer 14 years to admit that they live in Jersey, once they make the move. In my case, I was deeply in love. Oh, and she had the rent controlled apartment. | ||
| crabby Citizen Username: Crabbyappleton Post Number: 568 Registered: 1-2004 |
Just remind those NYers of our new state motto... See For Yourself, Pal | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7461 Registered: 5-2001 |
How much did we pay for that one? | ||
| CM Townsend Citizen Username: Cm_townsend Post Number: 145 Registered: 2-2005 |
The irony of course is that most people who live in Manhattan are not from Manhattan; therefore, they are not authentic New Yorkers regardless of their posturing as such. The “true” New Yorkers are the ones who grew up in Brooklyn, the Bronx, Queens, Long Island, and Staten Island (and the few who actually were born and raised in Manhattan). | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1443 Registered: 2-2005 |
I disagree. Manhattan does not require you to be born there; Manhattan requires you to LIVE there. The adoption process is rapid - you're quickly assimilated into the Manhattan community. Long Island and Staten Island have very little to do with the real NYC - it's unfortunate that "NYC" is translated as "Manhattan" or "the city"... there's only one Manhattan. The real 'posturing', as it were, comes from people in Queens, Brooklyn or (God help us) Staten Island claiming to live "in the city". | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1203 Registered: 10-2004 |
Case is right again. When I lived in Brooklyn we always said we are going to the city. When I lived in Manhattan, I was already there. | ||
| ess Citizen Username: Ess Post Number: 1850 Registered: 11-2001  |
The funny thing is that people leave Manhattan and choose Maplewood -- because of its proximity and ease of getting to Manhattan! Ha ha ha! | ||
| CM Townsend Citizen Username: Cm_townsend Post Number: 146 Registered: 2-2005 |
Case, Where were you born and raised? I would bet that it wasn't in any of the five boroughs of New York City! | ||
| Ms. Cooper Citizen Username: Ms_cooper Post Number: 71 Registered: 4-2005 |
I grew up in NJ, and lived in Manhattan for ten years after college and couldn't WAIT to get back to the Garden State. Don't get me wrong, I love NY (city only) and would be miserable if I ever lived more that 30 mins. away from it, but I think that NYC is completely overrated these days. First of all, to address the food issue; there is nothing worse than a food snob. Food is food. I have had some of the worst meals of my life in famous/trendy NY restaurants. People used to ask me where to get the best Italian food in NYC and I would tell them; "New Jersey". For the entire time I lived in NYC, I pined away for a real slice of pizza--not the bland, pizza shaped object fashioned by the good-natured Arabs who owned and operated "Slice of Roma Authentic Pizzeria". On the other side of that coin was the totally yuppified and glorified $20/pie Brick Oven pizza which was always charred to an inedible crisp--but how can one argue when Zagat's claims that "Only God can make better pizza"?--he was probably from Jersey. NYC Chinese food all tastes the same--all greasy and fried-like with a squishy consistency. At least with NJ Chinese food you can taste the ingredients and my body doesn't try to reject it immediately after the fortune cookie. I will take any item from that glorious case of baked goods over at Sonny Amsters to $9.00/slice flourless chocolate cake (aren't we sick of this by now?) We have the best bread in our area of NJ. Some bakeries in Newark and Hoboken supply their bread to some of the finest restaurants in NYC. We have it all the time. I read somewhere that the bread from Balthazar is actually baked in Morristown. I always thought it funny that the general perception of people from NYC are funny--"they have that New York sense of humor". I found the opposite to be true. Humorless, self-absorbed, uptight beings without a moment of self-effacing clarity would swirl around me daily as I stood on line to pay $1.75 for a roll of toilet paper. New York used to be this amazing place of creativity, a haven for misfits, where one could go to express themselves freely and brazenly. Now, it is one giant strip-mall. You can't walk five feet without hitting a Starbucks or a DunkinDonuts. Where once porn was peddled, cell-phone shops have been installed. It depresses me to look around and see every chick from 18 to 45 dressed like one of the Olsen twins replete with open-toe strappy sandals--in October. | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1444 Registered: 2-2005 |
CM - wrong again. Born in Brooklyn, moved to Long Island in my teenage years. Lived in Midtown Manhattan for many years. | ||
| eliz Supporter Username: Eliz Post Number: 1423 Registered: 5-2001 |
Case: | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1445 Registered: 2-2005 |
Silly me, I should have accepted his bet, right? | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 3603 Registered: 12-2004 |
Ah yes, Ms. Cooper. Rational perspective at last. I never really understood the appeal of living in NYC. It's ridiculously expensive for everything. You pay through the nose and get to live in some tiny, dark box in some very marginal neighborhood. And like Ms. Cooper said, it's $1.75 for a roll of toilet paper, and every other thing you buy costs twice a much as anywhere else. It's loud ALL THE TIME, and dirty and smelly and too cold in the winter and too hot in the summer, and just generally has an insanely frantic pace that would probably cause me to lose my mind were I not able to get away from it. But I guess all that indicates it that I really am not a "city" person. Although, I lived in Philly while going to college, and enjoyed it because it was much smaller and saner and more easily managable on a daily basis. I lived in Jersey City for 11 years and enjoyed it for many of the same reasons I enjoyed Philly, and also, specifically because of it's close proximity and easy access to all that NYC has to offer. But I had a much nicer apartment than I could ever have afforded in NYC, more open space and a bit more quiet, and it generally didn't smell as bad as NYC! The only way I would EVER consider living in NYC is if I had tons of money and could afford a great roomy aparement overlooking Central Park, had a vacation home to go to on the weekends and a car that could get me there and a guaranteed place to park it. And, unless I win the lottery, that ain't happening. | ||
| dave23 Citizen Username: Dave23 Post Number: 1693 Registered: 5-2001 |
I love Maplewood and Manhattan. | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 2833 Registered: 12-2001  |
I feel like if someone spent 5 or 10 post-college, childless years living in Manhattan, I don't need to hear them sniff about NJ. If you moved toward the suburbs like a salmon upstream when it came time to spawn, then you are suburban. The true, born in Manhattanites I know who moved out NEVER start with the all-night-deli-chinese-food-blah-blah-blah stuff. That's strictly for the post-college Manhattan-livers. NJ is 6 percent Asian or something. I think you can find Chinese food if you look around. | ||
| CM Townsend Citizen Username: Cm_townsend Post Number: 147 Registered: 2-2005 |
Case, Well, as you were presumably defining a person’s identity as predicated on one’s current domicile in order to justify your definition of an authentic New Yorker as opposed to those inauthentic New Yorkers born and raised in the other four boroughs, it was a safe bet that you probably were not from Manhattan since you stated that mere “assimilation” through residency is the requirement for “adoption” in the “Manhattan community.” Therefore, to be a real “New Yorker,” you only have to live in Manhattan, which is the true NYC. So, I guess from your logic, since you are no longer living in Manhattan, you are no longer a New Yorker. You are then a New Jerseyan! Welcome friend! | ||
| I'm Only Sleeping Citizen Username: Imonlysleeping Post Number: 162 Registered: 8-2005 |
Why are people who never lived in NYC so defensive about it? New York is an incredible place. Everyone should live there at least once. And yes, there are things about it that you can't find anywhere else, including Maplewood. On the other hand, there are many things about Maplewood that make life better than in NYC, especially if you're starting a family. I wouldn't have moved to Maplewood if it wasn't where I wanted to be, and I love living here. But I wouldn't trade the experience of having lived in New York for anything, and there are--and always will be--things that I miss about it. Why does that bother some people so much? What would inspire somebody to start a thread like this? It just seems weird. | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1446 Registered: 2-2005 |
Excellent use of SAT words there, CM. Its OK that you were wrong - it happens to a lot of people (so I hear). | ||
| amandacat Citizen Username: Amandacat Post Number: 1114 Registered: 8-2001  |
Thanks, Themp! I am a TRUE New Yorker (born in Manhattan at Lenox Hill Hospital, lived in Queens until I was six, then in Manhattan through high school and in Brooklyn post-college) who LOVES it here in Maplewood -- pizza and chinese food included! Poseurs . . . | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1447 Registered: 2-2005 |
I think I have an answer for I'm Only Sleeping - people are touchy about Manhattan because of it's reputation as "THE" place to live. Granted that it's not for everyone... but even on this thread, all I see is comparisons to Manhattan. The Chinese food, the Italian food, the quality of life, etc. I wonder if it's true that people compare everything to Manhattan because deep down they know Manhattan is at the top of the pyramid? Along this same line, people are "defensive about NYC" because they know that 'city people' probably view them as inarticulate animals, snuffling around in their own waste - as I alluded to in my posting, the typical Manhattanite probably thinks that anyone south of Maryland is a dyed-in-the-wool hillbilly, eating squirrel and dating his sister. I'm not condoning this view, but there's no point in denying it: Manhattan is very special. Denis Leary did a phenomenal piece on this... I won't butcher it by trying to repeat it here, but as a quick paraphrase "We wear Manhattan as a badge of honor - that's why nothing impresses us, because we live in New York". If you have the chance to hear the CD, do so - you'll laugh. Keep in mind that I moved out to NJ voluntarily! I like the place a lot. I'm not here to raise a family (sadly, my property taxes do not reflect this) but I'm very happy with Maplewood. One of the reasons, of course, is that I can spend 5 minutes walking to the train and 30 minutes later I'm in Midtown - the center of the known universe - when the need arises. | ||
| CM Townsend Citizen Username: Cm_townsend Post Number: 148 Registered: 2-2005 |
Case, http://www.m-w.com/ Once again, welcome to New Jersey! | ||
| phyllis Citizen Username: Phyllis Post Number: 509 Registered: 6-2001 |
Too funny! "Manhattan does not require you to be born there; Manhattan requires you to LIVE there. The adoption process is rapid - you're quickly assimilated into the Manhattan community." I don't Case, I respectfully disagree. From my experience, you become quickly assimilated into a community of people who are not from NYC, but have transplanted from elsewhere. Maybe that's being too picky. But my born and bred NYC friends have never had angst about defining themselves as city folk, they just are. Some grew to hate the city and moved elsewhere, some can't imagine raising kids anywhere else. Having been raised in the NJ 'burbs near the city, I've been spending lots of time in NYC since childhood. It's not the same as living there, but some kid from the midwest living in NYC for a total of 3 years is going to try to convince me that they are too sophisticated to be able to survive in the suburbs? Another point my mother loves to make.... New Jersey has always been made up of people moving from New York or Hudson County. This is nothing new. My old block growing up was exactly the same 40 years ago. People still missed certain things about city life and were thrilled by some of the benefits of the suburbs. I moved to Maplewood so that I could be among people with an urban sensibility. But I do tire of defending the state just as I tire defending NYC to people who think its horrible. | ||
| LilLB Citizen Username: Lillb Post Number: 1621 Registered: 10-2002  |
I loved living in Manhattan, I loved living in Montclair, and I love living in Maplewood. They all have their pros and cons. When you first move from one place to another, it's natural to compare the two and you miss where you came from a bit - part of it is realistic, some is your memory making things better than they were because you miss it. I also grew up in the "burbs near the city", but in NY State, and I still remember being at a friend's house who had cousins visiting from the midwest -- we were watching TV and a commercial for a Broadway show came on and they got SO excited - they were excited just to see a COMMERCIAL for a Broadway show - they just don't see those ads where they're from and they thought Broadway was just magical (which I'm sure some would argue it is). PS - I don't think the chinese food is better in NYC - not a chance  | ||
| Mr. Big Poppa Citizen Username: Big_poppa Post Number: 597 Registered: 7-2004  |
Manhattan may be the best place in the world to live as a young, childless, single person. However, it is difficult to raise a family there which is why many of us moved to NJ. I hate the typical suburbia (I spent most of my life living in it), which is why we picked Maplewood (the "Un-Jersey" per one t-shirt I saw). It is a quaint, pedestrian-friendly, and open-minded community (except for the people on Soapbox-All Politics). Like any part of the world, NJ and NYC have their good and bad things. Usually, when someone moves to a new place, they go through a bit of homesickness and can struggle through the changes. That is normal and shouldn't be seen simply as "bashing" their new city/state. I'm sure many people who have lived in and loved NJ would have many complaints if they moved to NYC. It just takes some getting used to. I'll give you an example. When we first moved here 2 years ago, I almost got into multiple accidents because I never had to make a right to make a left (jug handles). I thought that was the stupidest thing in the world! NJ Sucks! Arrggh! But, after I got used to it, I realized that it is actually very practical (keeps the traffic moving) and safe. NJ....genius! I think we need to keep in mind that when people go through changes in their lives, they can often act negatively to them at first. Be patient, folks, and help with the transition. | ||
| Hoops Citizen Username: Hoops Post Number: 1206 Registered: 10-2004 |
Ollies on 86th street. If you havent eaten their huge assortment of dumplings you havent had dumplings. My favorite Chinese restaurant of all time. | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 2835 Registered: 12-2001 |
I had you in mind. | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1450 Registered: 2-2005 |
I'm not sure about the kid from the midwest; if they 'do' Manhattan properly, they probably will have MAJOR issues with leaving and going to the suburbs. Then again, when it's time to go... it's time to go. The point is that once you've lived in Manhattan you can really appreciate the place... and it never leaves you (even though YOU may leave IT). Oh, and CM - the oddest thing happened. I was playing with the online dictionary link you sent (I don't usually require one, unless it's for a spelling issue)... but I entered a few words just to see how complete the definitions were, and when I typed in "pretentious" I got a link back to your original post!  Incidentally, if you continue to go around offering sucker bets, you may want to try www.gamblersanonymous.com - not everyone will be as nice as I am, not taking you up on bets you're sure to lose. | ||
| Oldstone Citizen Username: The3ofus Post Number: 1 Registered: 4-2006 |
before i moved to maplewood almost 2 years ago i lived in manhattan's chelsea neighborhood for 20+ years. when one is in their 20's & 30's, trying to be fabulous/edgy/with-it/hip, there is no better place to live. i was in the middle of it all AND i did it all. once i hit my 40's i came to the conclusion (a few years later than i wish i had) that the city is best suited for the young. the city that sucked the life out of me and my bank account is no more than a place to work now. maplewood has provided a much more gentle way of life. a life where i don't have to care what i look like to run to the dry cleaner, etc. a life where i can hear myself breath at night instead of traffic, partyers, sirens and alarms (although the bloodcurdling screams of mating feral cats around here scare the bejeezuz out of me) as someone who would have laughed had i been told that i would end up in jersey, i have to say that i have adjusted to this life much, much better than i thought. i gave up all the intensity of having the best, being the best, etc. for a very nice life out here. if there was no maplewood, i would probably still be in the city worried about becoming one of the sad, elderly people you see around. | ||
| Oldstone Citizen Username: The3ofus Post Number: 2 Registered: 4-2006 |
and tulip, i got dumped by all my manhattan friends, too. who cares? | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 2836 Registered: 12-2001 |
I used to sit on the fire escape and sing "moon River" when we lived in Manhattan, and get sandwiches at the automat in Times Square on my way to see the Talking Heads and Coltrane play at CBGBs. I loved the sound of the iceman's cart in the street, the sushi, the internet boom, the 3rd avenue elevated train that they used in the first King Kong movie, the draft riots, the peach orchards downtown, the Dutchmen smoking clay pipes, the ship's chandlers' merry cries, the baskets of oyster, the smoke of inummerable coal fires from tenement chimneys, Jimmy Stewart watching our apartment through binoculars with his leg in a cast, Tom Verlaine and Richard Hell eating luch with Andy Warhol and Donald Trump at Elaine's... These are my NY memories...alas, gone forevermore. Remember when Riverboat opened? Gee, that was swell. | ||
| Case Citizen Username: Case Post Number: 1451 Registered: 2-2005 |
That's odd, our 'city' friends love coming out to Maplewood... and we still see them when we are in Manhattan (which is often). It seems really strange to me that good friendships can be broken by a 30 minute move... hell, it takes longer to get from downtown to uptown on the subway than it does to get to Maplewood... although you have to admit the scheduling of NJ Transit isn't as flexible as that of the subway. I guess all I can say is, "that sucks". Speaking of which, can you believe CB's is closed? |
