| Author | Message | ||
     Costanza Supporter Username: Vandalay Post Number: 1772 Registered: 8-2004  |
" Would you guys please give my dad a break"  | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4432 Registered: 12-2004  |
"MATB, first of all, Mrs. Z, being a MRS, was female." Right, we all got that. Again, not getting what you're getting at. And my point is that if MRS. Z was, in fact, "the best, kindest, most wonderful teacher" you ever had she would certainly have known better than to belittle a young child who obviously had problems of his own and could have used her help. So clearly, she wasn't all that interested in taking care of that particular child, was she. Different people take care of their children in different ways. Perhaps I choose to let my child cross the street on his own because I believe he is fully capable and I want him to learn to become independent and be proud of himself. Good point Elizabeth. | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1947 Registered: 10-2005  |
combustion- Thank you for providing a fine example of a holier than thou attitude. Now I don't love my kids? This is news to me. Crap, if that is the case, I should of stuck to my orginal plan and parked as far away as possible, left the keys in the ignition and the motor running, still kept the windows open but blasting the heat and took my sweet ••• time in the cleaners, bitchin about every little stain that didn't come out. Hell, while I am at it I am going to resign from my job tomorrow and smoke crack 24/7 right in front of them. One of my famous lyrics ever(fro an old hardcore band called Dag Nasty) go something like this: "you wouldn't have to walk on water if just swam like the rest of us...." -slk Gregor-I truly appreciate the air support but Dr. & Hoops are correct in statting they never criticized my parenting. But RL, is a special (and predictable) case all together, but I am sure he heard that alot during his lifetime. Elizabeth-whoever deleted, I was digging it....  | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 2396 Registered: 8-2003  |
I don't criticize anybody's parenting choices. I can't tell you how many times I've had people berate me for letting my toddlers operate power tools. I figure if a kid can't use a circular saw by age 3, there's something wrong. they usually only make one or two mistakes before they get the hang of it. my kids Lefty and Three-Finger will tell you the same thing. | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1948 Registered: 10-2005 |
Gregor- I do appreciate it when you get RLs underwear in a wedgie though...priceless!  -SLK | ||
| Gregor Samsa Citizen Username: Oldsctls67  Post Number: 601 Registered: 11-2002  |
Dr and hoops...I stand corrected...I jumped in in the middle of this to stick up for my home-boy, and did not carefully read all 3 pages of posts...my bad. RL, where my mind is is not the issue. I was merely stating a fact... | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 2399 Registered: 8-2003 |
gee, you were sticking up for your home-boy. that makes me feel better that you were making up •••• about me... | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1949 Registered: 10-2005 |
Dr.- Oh chill dude, he apologized and retracted his statement, what more are you looking for? -SLK | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 2405 Registered: 8-2003 |
gee, I guess I'm just not as gracious as him  | ||
| Rosiegirl Citizen Username: Rosiegirl Post Number: 45 Registered: 5-2006  |
I am sorry, but I CAN NOT just sit here quietly anymore. I am learning that those who disagree with me the most are those who don't have children. Why is it when a parent does something irresponsible and gets critiqued for it, this is their response? Get over yourself, SLK. That's a pretty self-righteous statement if I have ever heard one!! Just because someone doesn't agree with your parenting technique and they don't have a child means that they don't know how to take care of a child????? PUH-LEASE!!!! Clearly, having children doesn't give you any more knowledge in that area either. If your children were of a different age (perhaps 4-5 years older), I would be behind you 100%(but what do I know, I don't have kids!!!) But leaving a 2 1/2 y/o and a 4m/o by themselves, for even 5 minutes....you don't need to be a parent to figure out how many different things COULD have happened(baby choking, older one choking, older one leaving the car). I am a believer that there is no one right way to raise a child. Depending on the parent(s) and child(ren) involved, different things work for different people. But that is no excuse for tossing better judgement out the window. That being said, I certainly don't think that any of this makes you guitly of being a bad father. I think the person who called the police did the right thing and I think the police handled the situation the right way. I also think you are a very luck man to have such an understanding wife. If my husband ever did anything like that, I'd kick his ••• into next week. But hey....that's just me...a childless woman. What do I know? | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1962 Registered: 10-2005 |
Roisegirl- I hear you but in my opinion, leaving a 6 and 4 year old in a car potentially has a much better chance of something going wrong than my children's age. A two year old leaving the car? I would love to see that... My whole gripe was I just don't understand why the cops needed to be called. And sorry, raising children does give you the one up on those who don't I use to think the same as you before I had children. Notice I didn't say child, but CHILDREN. After the first 6 months raising one child is pretty easy. Throwing two children into the mix both under two years of age is a whole new universe (as everyone warned me). Have some children and look me up in a couple o fyears. -SLK | ||
| fabulouswalls Citizen Username: Fabulouswalls Post Number: 251 Registered: 10-2005  |
I think I'm in love. Apologies to Mrs. FW | ||
| Rosiegirl Citizen Username: Rosiegirl Post Number: 46 Registered: 5-2006 |
SLK, I have often cared for both my niece and nephew(at the same time & if you don't think a two year old can leave a car seat, you haven't met my nephew!). I make it seem like I've never been around a child before. I never said that being a parent is easy. I never said that running errands with two children under the age of three is easy. I never claimed that life is free of all kinds of complications. I am not that much of a fool. I understand that circumstances arise, making what used to be such a simple task very complicated. Yes, you were probably embarrassed and inconvenienced by your "run-in" with the law. I still don't think what you did was right. And for WIW, I doubt my opinion will change once my maternal status changes. I'll be more than happy to confirm in the next four or five years. | ||
| Rosiegirl Citizen Username: Rosiegirl Post Number: 47 Registered: 5-2006 |
SLK, I have often cared for both my niece and nephew(at the same time & if you don't think a two year old can leave a car seat, you haven't met my nephew!). You make it seem like I've never been around a child before. I never said that being a parent is easy. I never said that running errands with two children under the age of three is easy. I never claimed that life is free of all kinds of complications. I am not that much of a fool. I understand that circumstances arise, making what used to be such a simple task very complicated. Yes, you were probably embarrassed and inconvenienced by your "run-in" with the law. I still don't think what you did was right. And for WIW, I doubt my opinion will change once my maternal status changes. I'll be more than happy to confirm in the next four or five years. | ||
| Brett Citizen Username: Bmalibashksa Post Number: 2657 Registered: 7-2003 |
Seams pretty stupid to keep telling SLK that leaving the kids in the car was stupid, wrong, uncaring, unforgivable, idiotic, etc. His point is, why were the police called. Well I sounds to me like that is what should be done. Brett sees children in car Brett thinks: What the….. Brett looks around o_0 Brett sees no adult Brett looks at watch Brett wonders “I wonder if they have been in there along time” Brett looks around o_0 Bret wonders “Are these free babies? Can I just have one?” Brett looks around o_0 Brett looks at watch Brett thinks “I can’t wait for adult all day” Brett Ponders “If I go into Gleason’s the Adult may be offended and yell, or strike me” Brett thinks “I’ll call 911, they’ll help me” “Hello, yes, there are two children in this car all alone. Ok, thanks” Brett Smiles “Well the cops didn’t think it was unreasonable to call” I’ve searched high and low to find out what the law is regarding leaving children in a car alone. Frankly there isn’t one in NJ. And there is a lot of controversy about that. It’s against the law to leave a dog in a car, but not kids. Now if the cops told you that is was, they were wrong, or there is a local Maplewood law. I did find two references to Legislation that is in the process of becoming State law. Now if a child gets hurt, you can get hit with all kinds of Endangering a child laws. But SLK didn’t break the law. | ||
| crabby Citizen Username: Crabbyappleton Post Number: 773 Registered: 1-2004 |
If the caller was really concerned, why would he call the cops? It takes time to respond. If I had been that person, I would have looked in to see if said children looked okay. Then I would go into Gleasons and say "hey, there are some kids unattended in a car, someone need some help?" If no one responded, then it would be safe to say that someone left kids unattended FOR REAL! SLK didn't really leave these kids unattended. HE COULD SEE THEM FROM INSIDE AND IT WASN"T HOT OUT! And presumably they were strapped in. And he said the doors were locked! People, ya gotta relax. | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 2413 Registered: 8-2003 |
maybe the guy did look in at the kids and it was a concerned person who called the cops because a creepy looking guy was hanging around the car.  | ||
| Brett Citizen Username: Bmalibashksa Post Number: 2661 Registered: 7-2003 |
"If the caller was really concerned, why would he call the cops? It takes time to respond." Less time then it takes to pick up dry cleaning | ||
| Joan Supporter Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 8223 Registered: 5-2001 |
SLK: Point of clarification: Were you able to see the kids in the car the whole time you were in Gleason's or just the car itself? [Note Bajou's earlier post.] Your answer to this question might affect some posters' opinions. | ||
| Aquaman Supporter Username: Aquaman Post Number: 997 Registered: 8-2001  |
S.L.K.2.0, You did absolutely nothing wrong. Your children were far safer in their car seats in a parked car in a lot watched by their parent than they were on the way to Gleason's. There is more chance of them getting harmed in some way by removing them. Door slams on finger, trip and fall out the car door to the asphalt, winged by another vehicle, carelss parker opens door into them, etc. You also saved your children from inhaling the dioxychlorocycline fumes. No pokes in the eye from wayward hangers. No stepping on those straight pins. Child endangerment is a serious offense. But your children were absolutely not in harm's way. I would have probably noticed a stranger peering into my car windows and whippng out a cell phone, and I would have stepped outside to assure the good samaritan that things were OK. Think about gassing up with kids in the car. Say you're at one of those Self Service stations. You get out of the car to pump your gas. (OK) You enter the office to pay for the gas and buy a Twix Bar. These wacky people think there's a difference between being 25 feet from your car in a gas station and being 25 feet from your car in a dry cleaner. Sheesh. Keep on beeing your lovable self, SLK. | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4444 Registered: 12-2004 |
And the debate rages on..... Rosiegirl, FYI, not one of my children was able to unbuckle their car seats until well after the age of three. My youngest just turned three and has absolutely NO CLUE, nor would he be physically able, as it is difficult for me to buckle and unbuckle the seat he sits in. I've had EXTENSIVE experience with 2-year-olds over the last few years and I can assure you that it is HIGHLY unlikely that MOST 2-year-olds would be capable of unbuckling their seat, opening the door and climbing out of the car. I think it's safe to say your nephew is most likely the rare exception to the rule! I'm still not getting what folks think these kids are choking on and where they're getting it. Further, kids are just as likely to get themselves in any manner of trouble just about anywhere they go, particularly when they are on foot and able to seek out said trouble. Being buckled securely in ANY seat, be it in the car or anywhere else, seriously cuts down on the probability that they will get in trouble. In most cases, when I was looking to have my little ones secured someplace where they wouldn't get in to trouble, they were generally either strapped in to some seat, somewhere, or placed in their crib. | ||
| phyllis Citizen Username: Phyllis Post Number: 584 Registered: 6-2001 |
Right or wrong, I think everyone needs to realize that the cops might be called if you leave your kids in the car while doing errands. Let's assume that everyone on this thread loves their kids. We all have different assessments of where to draw the line as to what is risky for our kids and what is not. For a number of different reasons, certain behaviors change from becoming culturally/publically acceptable to unacceptable or vice versa. As a culture, America seems safety-obssesed. This is mostly good, but certainly goes too far in some cases. My sense in talking to people is that leaving kids in a car is moving from sometimes acceptable to never acceptable in the public parenting conversation. It seems from above that it is in fact, NOT illegal here, but if there is a move to make it so in other states I wouldn't be surprised if it comes here. Legal or not, I think the norm here is that you don't leave your kids in the car and people should be aware of that when deciding whether or not to do it. I have seen cops called to parking lots on a couple of occasions in the area. The question on this thread seems to be whether common courtesy dictates that you try to first talk to the person before calling the cops. Not sure what I would have done in this instance - probably not have called the cops if it really was only 5 minutes and in the Gleasons lot (as opposed to a mall). But I have a fear of nutty wacky people, and feel that when one's parenting is being judged by a stranger, nuttiness is expected. So unless I was feeling particularly fiesty, I don't think I would have opted to confront someone in this instance when the kid were probably okay. | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1964 Registered: 10-2005 |
Crabby, you won the grand prize with this statement: "If I had been that person, I would have looked in to see if said children looked okay. Then I would go into Gleasons and say "hey, there are some kids unattended in a car, someone need some help?" Hoooray!!!!!  And that is all I am saying (in my original post). Instead of calling the cops, the caller should of thought that I have a valid reason for doing such a thing. I NEEDED HELP! Maybe they should of offered me some....and that is why i am annoyed. I would do it for them since I can totally relate to raising two youngsters.... Now lets reverse the situation, what if I did bring both kids into the shop (one by the hand, the other in an infant car-seat)? That means that in order to get them and all my [lots and lots] dry cleaning back to the car I would most likely have to leave my kids UNATTENDED in the store in order to get the clothes back to the car. Either way MY kids would be unattended to (a far lesser amount of time but still), so either way I am screwed. Yes, there are people/staff in the store who could keep a momentary eye on them but personally I am more skeeved out leaving around strangers then leaving them in an idle, locked car. -SLK Oh to answer the question ( I could see the back of my older child's head and the outline of my youngest (his car seat faces backwards). But I was paying more attention to any unwanted individuals around the entire car.... | ||
| Innisowen Citizen Username: Innisowen Post Number: 2356 Registered: 3-2004 |
SLK: You're absolutely right. | ||
| doulamomma Citizen Username: Doulamomma Post Number: 1796 Registered: 3-2002 |
Good points Phyllis... MATB wrote: "I'm still not getting what folks think these kids are choking on and where they're getting it."...I agree - if the choking hazards are there when a car is stopped, they are also there while driving. Most of us look over the car to make sure to remove choking hazards on a regular basis. Parents know that we just can't always be there, so we teach our older kids rules, we clear the area to make it as kid-proof as possible etc. cars, home, grandma's house, preschool - hazards are everywhere...part of living in the world. We all just take the precautions we can based on individual kids (not all kids are attracted to the same things). I know I drive extra to go to a pharmacy that's drive-thru, same for ATM...any time I don't have to haul 3 kids out of a car & risk life & limb getting them accross a parking lot & street is a bonus; especially since not all folks remeber to practice safety and yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. Here's a suggestion: how about a signal to good samaratans (since we have established that it is not currenty illegal, per se) - hazard lights ...to indicate that someone is quickly dropping off a DVD inside or racing in to get cash at the ATM a few feet away & the kid is sleeping, that they forgot a cell phone in the house? If we are all planning to call the cops every time we see something we disapprove of (and that's what I think was going on here, more than actual fear for the children), then we all better get unlimited cell phone plans and hire some more police officers, 'cause I sure see lots of things I wouldn't do/don't think are safe. There are obviously times when we do witness something truly, iminently dangerous and of course we should get help if we can. SLK took precautions he thought were reasonable...doesn't have to be the same precautions I or anyone else would take. hell - my almost 9yo is making himself lunch while I type this & my 2yo is sleeping - I might go out and pull a few weeds before he wakes up. My home is as danger-free as I can make it in relation to my kids & pets...I love them. But I still have knives in my kitchen, have electrical outlets etc... everything is a calculated risk. | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1965 Registered: 10-2005 |
Inny- I must agree with others, you are being awfully nice to me lately and you don't attack my grammar/spelling errors anymore...it is even starting to creep me about a little bit... What gives? | ||
| crabby Citizen Username: Crabbyappleton Post Number: 774 Registered: 1-2004 |
It's called "Be kind to your enemies...it will drive them crazy!" | ||
| Innisowen Citizen Username: Innisowen Post Number: 2357 Registered: 3-2004 |
SLK: When you're right, others ought to admit it, myself included. It was an unfortunate situation (you said that you felt that you were at fault so that's fine by me). I said in an earlier post on that that other people around you should have handled it differently by showing either patience, voicing concern to you, or offering to help. As I mentioned, it must have been an unpleasant situation for your children to go through as well. If your child had fallen and broken a leg, everybody would have been around you and your child with all sorts of offers of sympathy and helpfulness. Perhaps they should have done so in the situation you wrote about. Don't worry. I'll rag you when I believe you deserve it, but not in this case. | ||
| combustion Citizen Username: Spontaneous Post Number: 489 Registered: 4-2006  |
I'd like to point out just how nicely SLK and MATB's have responded to other people's opinion's on child rearing, and use that as my answer as to why the person did not feel comfortable confronting the parent. In case I have to spell it out, most parents become •••••••• when told they're doing something that could endanger their kids. Sure, after the cops were called SLK pretends that he'd have reacted nicely to being confronted, but reading all these posts, I suspect reality would have been just a little different. Probably something along the lines of "mind your own fcuking business." | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4456 Registered: 12-2004 |
It must be really handy to be clairvoyant. | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4457 Registered: 12-2004 |
And very clever how you wrapped that personal attack in a broad sweeping generalization, so as to keep from being banned! Nevertheless, I did not miss the fact that you just called me and SLK ••••••••. | ||
| combustion Citizen Username: Spontaneous Post Number: 491 Registered: 4-2006 |
Thanks for helping me to prove my point. Your assistance is always welcome. | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4458 Registered: 12-2004 |
And all I ever did was ask you if we were supposed to become recluses in an attempt to avoid any and all possible risks, regardless of how small. But, really, you're right. It's me and SLK who are being ••••••••! | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4459 Registered: 12-2004 |
What point, exactly, was it that I was helping you prove? Guess I must have missed it. | ||
| combustion Citizen Username: Spontaneous Post Number: 492 Registered: 4-2006 |
Well, how come on a message board, if someone says it shouldn't be done, the posters are attacked, yet SLK claims that had someone said the same exact thing in real life, he would have just said "oops, you're right." I find that a little hard to believe. The point was that you CANNOT approach parents with advice EVER without being attacked. That point. | ||
| combustion Citizen Username: Spontaneous Post Number: 493 Registered: 4-2006 |
SLK wrote "I would of took a chiding from another customer if that's what it took... " From reading this thread, I highly doubt it. | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4460 Registered: 12-2004 |
Still not really getting you, but I don't see where SLK or I attacked anyone, we were merely trying to explain our position and the reasoning behind the choices we make. Who was attacked? I guess I missed it. If anything, there were plenty of people who "attacked" us (one of whom was especially vile) as being lousy parents who don't care about our children--all that based on knowing little or nothing about us. | ||
| MeAndTheBoys Citizen Username: Meandtheboys Post Number: 4461 Registered: 12-2004 |
Well I don't know about SLK, but I generally don't say I would do something if I know I wouldn't. Over the years there have been plenty of strangers who have felt compelled to tell me what I was doing wrong--however minor--as a parent. Early on, it really upset me, but then I came to realize it wasn't worth my energy to get into it with them. So now my standard response to unsolicited advice from strangers is "thanks, but they're fine" or something like that, a polite smile, and I move on. It's really not worth my time or energy to get into it with someone who knows nothing about me. I'm fairly secure in the knowledge that, for the most part, I'm a good parent and my kids are turning out O.K. | ||
| S.L.K. 2.0 Citizen Username: Scrotisloknows Post Number: 1966 Registered: 10-2005 |
MATBs- Here Here on your last post. Combustion- It all matters how I am approached on the subject. If someone got into my face all self-righteously then yeah, I would cop a "MYOFB" attitude, who wouldn't? But as Crabby stated, if someone came in said "hey man, you must have your hands full (the only reason I can think of for you leaving the kids in the car), do you need some help?" I would have been very gracious and accepted. By someone choosing to call the cops they decided to go the self-righteous route in such a passive aggressive way. Why shouldn't I be annoyed? But according to you, I don't love my children because I did the dastardly deed of leaving them in the car. It sounds to me you would call the cops too. How about this grand idea, since you are so concerned about the welfare of my children, everytime I need to go to Gleasons I will give you a call and pick you up so you can help me watch my kids while I take care of business. How about it? Thought so.... -SLK | ||
| Alleygater Citizen Username: Alleygater Post Number: 2551 Registered: 10-2004 |
SLK: I've been reading this post since the beginning and until now, I held back from asking. But now suddenly, I feel like I gotta know what was so important about this specific batch of dry cleaning. No really. |
