| Author | Message | ||
     steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1071 Registered: 2-2002 |
-Re: Corzine: I thought that the article in the News Record was pretty clear on the matter but to expand just a bit for the benefit of any mildly interested voters: -Since he, (Corzine) had originally affirmed his support directly to K&K, (at the train station, thus the "cartoon" above) his office declared (after a subsequent change in stated endorsement policy), that it would not be necessary to trash or cease using printed material already made with mention of endorsement since the campaign had already had them made with a good faith understanding. It is unfortunate that after the governor personally said that he would support K&K that then his official prefered stated policy became to not endorse any candidates anywhere in a primary and thus not to use his name in that regard for any NEWLY printed material or material that could be changed such as the website and the ad in the NR. In other words: First he said "cool". Then he said "Hmmm sorry guys but I'm gonna play it cool, but since I already told you cool, it's cool to keep using the stuff you already have". (I'm paraphrasing). The end. -Codey's office however did not have the same change in policy, thus his stated endorsement remains, as does the endorsement of a great number of Maplewood citizens all over town. It seems a trifling matter to me since I would personally not vote for a candidate based solely on whether they had the endorsement of state "biggies" though it is certainly nice to have. If voters are truly interested in getting to know more about the candidates I would suggest that they click on the web links posted in the top post of this thread, read the mailers and handouts and yes indeed, -talk to them. -This is a small town, you can actually talk to them if your wish. PS: Where is Art? -He is usually involved with anything to do with parking. And on that matter I feel personally compelled to say: Holy crap. A guy devotes tons of hours every week to this town for no pay and the only thing a challenger comes up with in a printed mailer to try and gain traction against him is where he parks? Vote for who you wish but vote. | ||
| Aquaman Supporter Username: Aquaman Post Number: 919 Registered: 8-2001  |
Steel, First, you start a thread called “Shop and Compare” as if you’re some kind of neutral consumer advocate. Turns out, you’re on the campaign committee for your personal friend and hero, Ken Pettis. It’s fine to support your friend, and to work on his campaign, but it’s a little phony to pretend you actually “shopped” or “compared” the candidates. You didn’t. Your ruse is thus deceptive. Also deceptive is the implication that Jon Corzine endorsed Pettis and Leventhal for Maplewood Township Committee in 2006. He didn't. The website you provided has a carefully implied endorsement, without actually saying there’s an endorsement. It has a big heading labeled ENDORSEMENTS in huge text with an endorsement from Dick Codey. Next to the ENDORSEMENT is a tiny “newsworthy” with a picture of Jon Corzine. Nowhere does it say Corzine endorses Pettis, but the placement right next to the word endorsement reeks of dishonesty, in my opinion. A simple "we goofed" would suffice. Instead you turn on the spin. Astonishingly, your candidates are quoted today in the News Record as calling their nancy and Lester (the best!) "disingenuous" and lacking "integrity". Really? How so? Is the Pettis campaign being run on a strategy of deception? Your explanation to Strawberry about your Darfur misspelling is your funny joke, right? You see, your cartoon is once again meant to imply that Corzine gave his endorsement to Pettis & Kathy (he didn’t), but when Straw poked fun of your cartoon, you went with schtick. Since you know that there is no District 18, and no “Bill Dafur”, you were making an “inside joke”. Funny to those that know better, but false information to everybody else. False objectivity. False endorsements. False information. Way to go Steel, you’re a real asset to the Pettis team. Thankey, Dr. Arthur "Maggee" Curry DDS | ||
| Larry Seltzer Citizen Username: Elvis Post Number: 10 Registered: 4-2006  |
I had already figured that Nancy and Lester had nothing compelling to say in their own favor but this mailing is really cheap and embarassing. They ought to be ashamed of themselves. | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7883 Registered: 5-2001  |
The mailing is indeed an embarrassment. Without knowing anything else about the candidates, I think that they may have just shot down their own campaign. I'll look at all the available info, but I admit that I now am starting off biased against N & L. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave  Post Number: 9678 Registered: 4-1997  |
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| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 7312 Registered: 10-2001  |
So, these mailers were printed and mailed before K& K had a written endorsement? I mean, why don't they just tell us Bill Clinton endorses them. They can take a picture in front of a life size card board figure.. As I said, there seems to be an ease among them when it comes to lying. Not saying the opponents are any better. All I've heard about those two is one's a drunk. (not gonna say which one) All this said, Jamie Ross and Bart Albini are making more sense everyday. | ||
| pcs81632 Citizen Username: Pcs81632 Post Number: 36 Registered: 6-2002 |
I guess the real question is: Did he do it? If he did, then it should be taken into account when you go into the voting booth. I don't like the fact that the US Congress exempts itself from the laws it imposes on the rest of us. And I certainly wouldn't like it if the same thing is happening on the local level. | ||
| steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1072 Registered: 2-2002 |
Dear Aquaman Bite me. Try signing your real name and somebody might care what you think or write. Dear Strawberry Ditto Sincerely, Wayne Sullivan | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 7885 Registered: 5-2001 |
If only where Ken Pettis parked his car were our biggest problem in Maplewood. Actually, at first I was annoyed that he would take advantage. Then, I started thinking about what someone else posted re: how many times does he (or other TC members) go straight to evening meetings from work. And none of them get paid for it. Heck, if it doesn't bother the TC employees and they have enough parking, I really don't care. I know that I've taken advantage of work perks for personal things before. In the meantime, what are K & K & N & L going to do about taxes, Springfield Ave development, speeding, crime and our schools? | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9681 Registered: 4-1997 |
That's pretty funny. | ||
| Aquaman Supporter Username: Aquaman Post Number: 921 Registered: 8-2001 |
Pcs-etc. "Did he do it? If he did, then it should be taken into account when you go into the voting booth. I don't like the fact that the US Congress exempts itself from the laws it imposes on the rest of us." Boom! We know Pettis lied about Corzine, if it was an honest mistake than he would have said so, instead he vilified his opponents. Poor sport and a shifty candidate. The mailer from Nancy and Lester was grumpy, but at least it was truthful. | ||
| Aquaman Supporter Username: Aquaman Post Number: 922 Registered: 8-2001 |
Dear Steel, Um, bite me back, like, nibble away dude. When you're done, answer the questions - 'kay? Endorsements? Not so much. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9683 Registered: 4-1997 |
Enough of the biting already. Here's the piece   | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 7314 Registered: 10-2001 |
Steel, Thanks to your mailer your candidates face a big problem come election day. You need all the votes you can get. Not sure asking registered voters to bite you is how you go about getting those votes. | ||
| steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1073 Registered: 2-2002 |
The worst part of the above mailer is that in reality Pettis has a paid-for parking permit in his window. -Something this sad BS mailer failed to note. -Naturally the photographer failed to make that visible in the shot. Is this truly what the challenger's campaign has come to? Carry on. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 7316 Registered: 10-2001 |
the parking sticker is expired.. This just in. FDR has endorsed Ken and Kathy. | ||
| pcs81632 Citizen Username: Pcs81632 Post Number: 37 Registered: 6-2002 |
Well, then, I'm confused. If he's got a paid-for parking permit, what's he doing in the parking lot at the Municipal Building? Were there no spaces left in the train station? If a non-TC commuter can't find a space in the commuter lot, where do they park? If the parking lot at the Municipal Building was open (in whole, or in part) to other commuters who were unable to park at the station, then I would say the mailer is incorrect. But it sounds like the parking lot at the Municipal Building is not open to the general public. And that sounds to me like a perq that's not available to the average commuter. Am I missing something? | ||
| pcs81632 Citizen Username: Pcs81632 Post Number: 38 Registered: 6-2002 |
And, I guess, the other issue that the mailer raises is, is he the only member of the TC never to hold office hours for the public? I thought all of the TC members hold office hours, either in Town Hall or other places. Let's face it - some members of the TC never go away. (I'll be happy after the primary when they all stop blocking the entrance to Kings or the Post Office each weekend morning.) Can the meeting hours thing be verified? | ||
| steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1074 Registered: 2-2002 |
I really think that Maplewood voters deserve better than the nature of this discussion as it has presently turned but I'll venture just a bit more. Dear Aquaman, If your questions and statements above had been posed with a bit more earnest curiosity I may have responded with a more polite initial response but I'll be a sport and try again. Firstly, re: "false objectivity": You're kidding right? With the strong endorsement that I wrote at the top of this thread, why are you troubling to label me with false objectivity because I titled the thread "shop and compare" which is precisely what I intended readers to do in regards to checking out the web sites? Second, re: "false endorsements". There is no "lie" and claims to the contrary serve no truth. Thankfully I am sure that voters will understand the details if they trouble to read the NR article and are not otherwise insistent on a different version of what actually occurred as clearly explained there. Third, re: "false information". (about the 18th district). Hello, -it's a joke. Did anybody really believe me when I said that Corzine was in town for "Bill Dafur"? To all, have a pleasant evening and good night. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6409 Registered: 12-2001  |
pcs..the argument posed above your post re Ken parking in that lot. Many of the TC members do attend meetings immediately after work. It make skirt the law, but these are unpaid civil (unlike some of these posts...sheesh) servants and some of those TC meetings go until after midnight. As Greentree pointed out (I think it was her)...if this is the biggest problem Maplewood faces then we are blessed. Screw endorsements. That is beating a dead horse. They help no one. If the News Wrecked endorsed someone I wouldn't even know it I would be so busy fixing the spelling with a red pencil. MAPLEWOOD NEEDS NON-PARTISAN TOWN COUNCIL ELECTIONS AND FAST | ||
| Nohero Supporter Username: Nohero Post Number: 5463 Registered: 10-1999  |
"MAPLEWOOD NEEDS NON-PARTISAN TOWN COUNCIL ELECTIONS AND FAST" Our neighbor to the north (the one with the first name of "South") has non-partisan elections. I would not trade with them. | ||
| fmertz Citizen Username: Fmertz Post Number: 112 Registered: 5-2001 |
DeLuca and Huemer will stop at nothing to regain control of the town council. For the life of me, I can't figure out why. What will they get? More anti-war resolutions?? The TC members should work together and respect each other's point of view and their constituents instead of mud-slinging, wasting money and pulling candidates out their hats. I like the balance on the TC right now. It keeps everyone in check. I would expect this behavior from dour DeLuca, who is ruthless and will say anything to get elected, but not from Huemer. It's disgusting. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 7318 Registered: 10-2001 |
I agree with you Fmertz. However, you gotta admit Corzine's "endorsement" will be the gift that keeps on giving. Kind of like "I voted for the war before I voted against it." Kathy isn't helping the situation by claiming the endorsement was real. Instead, she needs to make it clear her camp misunderstood Corzine's. | ||
| Aquaman Supporter Username: Aquaman Post Number: 923 Registered: 8-2001 |
As the on-line campaign manager for Lester and Nancy (What's the Harm?) I must say I'm distressed that my b&m counterpart went this nasty. While it's true that Pettis is taking advantage of his office, the negative ad was over the top. Aquaman isn't sure which is douchier: Holding public office and raising parking costs while illegally parking, or pointing out that public officials who raise parking costs park illegally. Says on the flyer it came from 28 Hickory Drive. Anyone know who lives at 28 Hickory? >>>> Aquaman, this is Hickorygate part deux!  | ||
| Bob K Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 11700 Registered: 5-2001 |
A former mayor I believe. Since he didn't put his name on the campaign "literature" I wouldn't mention it either. Luckily, this person is retired from active campaigning. Otherwise there would be real fireworks on Hickory every evening as the two mayors lobbed mortar rounds at each other.  | ||
| fmertz Citizen Username: Fmertz Post Number: 113 Registered: 5-2001 |
I wouldn't call having the campaign headquarters in your house "retiring" from active campaigning. This is just sour grapes. Swagger no more. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6414 Registered: 12-2001 |
Man it took me about 1 minute to find out who lives at 28 hickory drive. Next time, unless you want to be THAT TRANSPARENT, rent a PO BOX. | ||
| Wendy Supporter Username: Wendy Post Number: 2535 Registered: 5-2001 |
Duncan, I believe election law requires a real street address for the treasurer of a campaign. One's campaign manager doesn't have to be listed anywhere on literature but the treasurer's address does. (And, fwiw, I also disagree with the flier, just as I have with past negative campaigning on all sides and all parties.) As S or someone above said, discuss why you think particular votes or philosophies were incorrect. This ad was ridiculous. I am still supporting Nancy (haven't made up my mind on the second vote), btw. Wendy Lauter | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6420 Registered: 12-2001 |
I am pretty sure I have seen PO Boxes listed as addresses for candidates. I will double check. | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6421 Registered: 12-2001 |
Point of clarification.. A. QUALIFICATIONS OF A CAMPAIGN TREASURER Any competent person 18 years of age or older may serve as a campaign treasurer or deputy treasurer. To serve as a treasurer, the person should maintain a resident address within the State of New Jersey. No where in the Compliance Manual for Political Committees does it say that the committee itself must use the Treasure's address. Just that they have state residence. So a PO Box could be used, based on my quick scan of the document.} | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9697 Registered: 4-1997 |
NJ ELEC commission (emphasis added) | ||
| steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1075 Registered: 2-2002 |
I started this thread with an endorsement of Ken and I'll try to bookend it with my "Steely" analysis of the other three candidates as election day draws near. I have to confess that at the outset of this campaign I had a couple doubts. As much as I personally like Kathy, (and this may come as a shock to her), I was not entirely sure that she would necessarily be the best choice to continue on the TC. I was wrong to have doubts. She is. Through my involvement in this campaign I have now first-hand witnessed her dogged determination, complete dedication, strategic abilities, organization and attention to details sometimes to my own distraction, (ok, ok I initially spelled "liaison" wrong in the handouts). I have discovered that her only weakness, if it can be called that, is as we all know, she is perhaps not the greatest of public speakers. So what. Not everyone possesses that gift, (in fact few do), and in the balance of our present form of government it is certainly not foremost in importance. More important is her abiding concern for Maplewood and her willingness and ability to tackle complex issues and work with (many) others toward a positive outcome. That is foremost. She also has an almost crazy sense of fairness which I think prevents her from creating any injustice. I would urge anyone who is unsure to give her their vote. Now although I am somewhat loathe to do so, I feel compelled to mention why I have become dubious of Nancy in the role as much as I immediately liked her during our meetings while campaigning in the village and at the debate. I have no reason to change that personal impression of her but this is business, (so to speak) and I also do not for a second question her good will in her intentions for Maplewood. There are some minor points of campaign statements to quibble with, (have there been any really major ones backed up with alternative ideas?), but as I've mulled it over I keep remembering something she said at the Hilton debate that has nagged me. She informed us that she was one of the initial people years ago to get things started in South Orange involving all the changes that they have going on in the downtown S.O. Avenue area with their various projects. Bravo. but then she said, -and this is what I find troubling, -that she left that process after she didn't like the way things were going. I can understand that sort of frustration, -anyone can, but how does that bode well for our own redevelopment on Springfield Ave? In other words she walked away and now they have a bunch of holes in the ground over there and taxpayers absolutely howling. I'll leave Maplewood voters to decide if that is a positive implication in terms of her learning curve or a negative one for her potential contribution to the process here but it is something I question darkly and in the end would shy away from voting for her on that basis alone. I could be wrong but I don't think so. As to Lester. Seems like a good potential victim to serve on the TC in the future but I sense that it is a bit early for him. That is just my personal impression. Perhaps because I have little impression of him at all is part of my hesitancy to offer greater praise because I have certainly been paying great attention. As for the present, -I really didn't hear a great deal of disagreement from him on issues of importance for Maplewood. There were a few complaints or concerns but not really much of anything as to what to do differently though he certainly had the best line at the debate. -When asked by our intrepid NR reporter who he would support as Mayor if elected, part of his response included, (with a wry smile), "I only met Mr Huemer a few months ago and although I find he's somewhat attractive, frankly he's really not all that special", -Good one. Deflating and funny at the same time. As I've said before, it is admirable that anyone wants to try to take on the TC work for no money, damn little appreciation and a lot of grief but in the end voters have to make choices towards their own collective interests from amongst the willing victims. Vote for whoever but vote. Carry on. | ||
| Larry Seltzer Citizen Username: Elvis Post Number: 12 Registered: 4-2006 |
Why is anyone afraid to say that Jerry Ryan is the Adams/Lewis-Powder campaign treasurer? It's public record (and yes, it's Jerry who lives at 28 Hickory). Celia King is the Chair of the campaign. Same records. Look some more at the same records and you'll see that David Huemer has donated $5000 and Vic $2000. Those are the only donations over $300 (and therefore the only ones they have to detail). | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9701 Registered: 4-1997 |
Steel, That was incredibly ignorant comment, so I'm glad you made it so I may correct it for our readers. Those holes in the ground post-date Nancy's departure (also note that Main Street does not have direct control over these things the way the Trustees do). We in South Orange know precisely where the blame lies for ineptitude and it wasn't and isn't with Main Street or Nancy. But thanks for playing. | ||
| kathleen Citizen Username: Symbolic Post Number: 517 Registered: 3-2005 |
steel, If you want to quibble with some "minor points of campaign statements", why not quibble with some major ones? Kathy and Ken did not "acheive" tax reductions during their tenure, as their campaign literature tries to put over. Municipal taxes went up almost 20 pecent on my bill. They did not stick to their promises about taxes either, which were to cap tax increases at the CPI, and they've been just about double that. I also don't think it was an "acheivement" of Ken's tenure that he established the location of the police station on Springfield Avenue, as his campaign mailers say. He OPPOSED the location of the police station on Springfield Avenue, I think correctly. Finally, and I think most importantly, this is a DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY, not a TC election. Both Kathy and Ken know that people they are promoting on their websites to be District Leaders are in reality Republicans who support Republican candidates. I cannot be more blunt than this: If you want to do something for children in Maplewood, if you want to talk about who has integrity, do us the favor of not trying to scam the public and corrupt the election process right at its core. It is a complete misrepresentation to voters and an abuse of their trust to parade candidates under the Democratic Party banner when you know they are not Democrats and then claim that's not your responsibility even though you use your campaign website and personnel to campaign for the election of these Republicans in a DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY. It is wrong. Deeply wrong. You forfeit the trust of voters and rightly so. And it is a terrible civic example to set for children. And I mean that. We Democrats can't honestly tell kids their government in Washington is leveling with them, or their candidates in New Jersey are leveling with them. Is it too much to ask that people who run for public office here and endorse others not try to masquerade Republicans as Democrats in an election where the voters have so little chance of finding out the truth? It's indefensible. If they can't persuade their own party pooh-bahs to drop this tactic, how effective are they at anything else? | ||
| Duncan Supporter Username: Duncanrogers Post Number: 6435 Registered: 12-2001 |
Thanks Dave, for the correction. I looked up the "treasurer" as opposed to the "paid for by". I stand humbly corrected.  | ||
| steel Citizen Username: Steel Post Number: 1078 Registered: 2-2002 |
Dave, -Please read again my quote that you quoted. There is no "correction" necessary. I said that she walked away and now you have holes, -Is that not true? The fact that the holes in South Orange "post-date" Nancy's departure does not detract from my point of concern. She said that she left the process "when [she] saw that [she] didn't like the way things were going". If we chose to believe that she could have done better if she had been solely in charge then given that, we must also chose to believe that she either lacked the power to persuade to prevent such problems or simply chose to bail out of shear frustration, -that she could perhaps see the writing on the wall of what was coming and no longer chose to be a part of it rather than fight as best as was possible. Either way it is an abandonment which is particularly tragic if she really could have done better then those she left to muddy things, (literally). I as a voter in Maplewood facing the prospect of development on Springfield Avenue do not wish to chose someone who may chose to simply leave if things get particularly challenging beyond anticipation. | ||
| kathleen Citizen Username: Symbolic Post Number: 525 Registered: 3-2005 |
Or maybe she has the integrity not to go on participating or giving cover to a process and political agenda she can see is wrongheaded or just plain wrong. Maybe she's not afraid to stand alone. | ||
| Dave Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 9703 Registered: 4-1997 |
If you don't think Nancy fought first, you're wrong. Again. Did you even realize Nancy started the Springfield Avenue Partnership? | ||
| kathleen Citizen Username: Symbolic Post Number: 527 Registered: 3-2005 |
She does talk about that in the debate. |
