| Author | Message | ||
     Kibbegirl Citizen Username: Kibbegirl Post Number: 347 Registered: 5-2003 |
There was a group of six pre-teens or teenagers in the library tonight who were so LOUD, so disruptive and so wild that it was insane. They ran up and down the stairs, threw backpacks at each other, ran in and out of the building and yelled at each other. My kids were stunned and scared, especially when they were barelling in and out of the libary room like llamas! They then gave the poor librarian, many she knew by name, such a hard time. She asked them to leave the building several times, but they gave weak excuses like 'I have to use your phone to call my Mom' and 'I'm not allowed to leave the building until my mother picks me up'. Finally, the wild bunch left, but not without causing a bit more noise and trouble! If you know that your son/daughter went to the library tonight, ask them if they were part of this melee or if they know the culprits. | ||
| Just The Aunt Supporter Username: Auntof13 Post Number: 3787 Registered: 1-2004  |
They are worse in Maplewood. I can't believe how out of controll the kids are. When I was that age we never would have dared act like these kids. Back then the library could toss you out on your ear. Your parents would be called, and you'd get punished by them when you got home. Not anymore. | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 8 Registered: 12-2005 |
when i was that age i was in the park playing ball after school. It sure is different growing up in South Orange and Maplewod these days. | ||
| Greeneyes Citizen Username: Greeneyes Post Number: 716 Registered: 8-2001 |
That's sad. I know a few years ago there was a security guard at the library. Isn't she/he on duty anymore? | ||
| Ace789nj Citizen Username: Ace789nj Post Number: 228 Registered: 2-2005  |
Posting it here does absolutely nothing, you should've called the police. | ||
| Lizziecat Citizen Username: Lizziecat Post Number: 1046 Registered: 5-2003 |
Another reason I'm no longer a librarian. | ||
| Mayor McCheese Supporter Username: Mayor_mccheese Post Number: 816 Registered: 7-2004  |
Call police about people speaking too loudly at the library? I would hope that they they could find more important thingts to do. I worked at the Maplewood library for a few years. Nothing was worse than when those kids were let out of school. I think that their parents used the library as a babysitter. | ||
| Pizzaz Supporter Username: Pizzaz Post Number: 3093 Registered: 11-2001  |
The parents and school guidance should be contacted. The behavior is inapproriate. BTW: I had the priviledge of working in both the South Orange Public and SHU libraries. But, how time flys....  | ||
| cmontyburns Citizen Username: Cmontyburns Post Number: 1717 Registered: 12-2003  |
"When I was that age we never would have dared act like these kids." I can only assume you're amish. When i was that age, lots of people acted that way. Including, I'm sure, me on occasion. | ||
| buzzsaw Citizen Username: Buzzsaw Post Number: 3699 Registered: 5-2001  |
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| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 10 Registered: 12-2005 |
why would anyone want to call the police for children acting loudly in the library. As adults, can't we handle something like this and not have to bother the police???? | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 11 Registered: 12-2005 |
when i was that age I was in the park after school. That's what I said. I didn't have time to go to the library. Their were more important things to do. | ||
| Richard Citizen Username: Rikky Post Number: 66 Registered: 7-2005 |
kids today are spoiled brats, plain and simple. parents are too busy making it big and don't spend the time to properly raise their children with the correct morals and values. these kids run wild and have no discipline cause mommy and daddy aren't around so they lavish them with gifts and freedom to make up for the guilt. i know you can't paint all kids with the same brush but too many i see these days are as spoiled as the parents raising them. all this prosperity has a down side. | ||
| Mayor McCheese Supporter Username: Mayor_mccheese Post Number: 817 Registered: 7-2004 |
Times have changed, Our kids are getting worse They won't obey their parents, They just want to fart and curse. Should we blame the government, or blame society, or should we blame the images on tv No! Blame Canada! Blame Canada | ||
| Sitoyan Citizen Username: Sitoyan Post Number: 135 Registered: 7-2004 |
If any adult, or even the librarian, would dare trying to discipline these kids, she would face the rage of the kids' parents: "How dare you speak like that to my kid? How dare you tell my kid what to do and what not to do? Who do you think you are?" And she would probably be sued for child abuse. That's the society we live in.  I say BLAME THE S.O. TRUSTEES. It's their fault. | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 12 Registered: 12-2005 |
just ask them to leave. Solution solved. | ||
| Ace789nj Citizen Username: Ace789nj Post Number: 230 Registered: 2-2005 |
Right, and what do you do when they don't leave? Just because they're kids doesn't mean they can't cause a disturbance like any adult could. If they keep at it, if they don't listen to the librarian, if there's six kids telling you go to hell what is the next course of action? | ||
| Just The Aunt Supporter Username: Auntof13 Post Number: 3789 Registered: 1-2004 |
Cmonty- 'Amish?,' Not a chance! LOL I would hope yo didn't act like these kids! I spent many days at the South Orange Library when I was a child and NOTHING like what goes on now went on then. These kids are beyond out of control. I've been at the libraries after school and have witnessed the problems the staff of both libraries have to deal with first hand. When I was a kid I was taught to be respectful of adults. If an adult asked me to settle down, or to please lower my voice and I gave them a hard time, our patents would hear about it. I remember it being a privilege to graduate from the Children's Room to the 'Adult' part of the library. We were taught to use 'library' voices. If you want to run around and through things and cuss, go to the park. The libraries can't even toss people out anymore out of fear of being sued. Maybe you haven't been to any of the libraries for the first two hours after school gets out. Sometimes I feel I'm in a zoo. I try to avoid the libraries then. Yet, go to Millburn or Livingston and though there are plenty of teenagers in both of these libraries, the situation is the total opposite! These kids are way more behaved and respectful. | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 13 Registered: 12-2005 |
Ace- get the schools involved. Have the principle of the school get incolved and speak with their parents. This is not a police matter. All that was said was these kids are loud and running up and down the stairs. If I was a police officer I would hate to keep going to the library to discipline some local teens. I would rather look for real criminals. | ||
| SOSully Citizen Username: Sullymw Post Number: 1128 Registered: 5-2001  |
both Maplewood and South Orange libraries are used as unofficial after-school care for some students. I hate it. These children have no supervision and it falls on the poor librarians to keep order and it's an impossible task. The children are not there for educational reasons. They are only there until their parents can pick them up. In theory that is not a bad thing, but it can be so loud and disruptive at times that I opt not to take my own children there at those times. Isn't that a shame? I certainly understand that childcare is expensive and not everyone can afford it, but should it be the library's responsibility to babysit? If they were quiet and respectful I don't think anyone would have a problem with it. There should be some recourse when children repeatedly misbehave within the library. If you've never witnessed what goes on in the libraries after school, go see for yourself before commenting. | ||
| Just The Aunt Supporter Username: Auntof13 Post Number: 3790 Registered: 1-2004 |
Chatter It's not as simple as you think. Things are way more out of control then some of the posters here realize. Visit the library one day after school and see it for yorself. In Maplewood, where I think the problem with unruly teenagers is worse because the middle school is right across from the library, the school did get involved. It cut down on some, but not most of the problems. As someone pointed out, it seems as if some parents use the library as their form of childcare... | ||
| CageyD Citizen Username: Cageyd Post Number: 576 Registered: 6-2003 |
There is aftercare for the Middle Schools with the After School PRogram and the News Record reported recently that they had many spots available in the MS programs. I do think the police should be called. Saying "oh, it's no big deal" is the wrong way to go. These are quality of life issues. When they are ignored many things begin to deteriorate. As a society, we must maintain a level of civility. Post rules prominently in the libraries, and if rules are not followed you will be asked to leave, if you do not, the police will be called. Or, more draconian, change the libraries hours/policies - from 2:30 - 4:30 no one under the age of 18 is permitted unless accompanied by an adult. | ||
| SOSully Citizen Username: Sullymw Post Number: 1130 Registered: 5-2001 |
I thought of the draconian rules too, but that just penalizes the respectful kids who are there working on assignments, etc | ||
| Kibbegirl Citizen Username: Kibbegirl Post Number: 349 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is it possible for both So. Orange & Maplewood middle school principals to send home notices to parents encouraging their children to use proper use of the library and to once again reinforce that the library IS NOT a BABYSITTER? I understand that many parents are at work at this time of day and may be unaware of the nonsense that takes place. "When I was that age" I tried to be a good student and when I did do my dirt, it was quiet and harmless :-) I would've never acted like these kids acted last night. I wish I recognized some of them because their parents would've received emails and/or phone calls from me ratting them out. | ||
| peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 1752 Registered: 8-2002 |
I was in the SO library a while back, and a homeless person was using the men's room to "bathe". Especially considering that these restrooms are across from the children's room -- not good. I understand the police did get involved to stop that from happening. Pete | ||
| Lizziecat Citizen Username: Lizziecat Post Number: 1047 Registered: 5-2003 |
Unruly kids in the library has been a problem since I became a librarian in the seventies. I worked in a lot of libraries, and it was a problem in EVERY SINGLE ONE. And some of them were "nice" libraries in this area. The homeless using the libraries as places to hang out is also a problem, because the libraries are public buildings where no one can legally be excluded. Witness the case of the Morristown Library vs. Richard Kreimer, a homeless man whom the library tried to bar because of his threatening behavior and his extreme odor. Kreimer sued and won a huge settlement, and the homeless are still a huge problem in the Morristown Library. It is a disgrace that librarians are called upon to deal with situations like this. Librarians shouldn't have to discipline unruly, rude children, and they shouldn't have to deal with bizarre, dangerous and emotionally disturbed people. After twenty-five years of that, I got sick of it and quit. | ||
| Rastro Citizen Username: Rastro Post Number: 2292 Registered: 5-2004  |
Kids! I don't know what's wrong with these kids today! Kids! Who can understand anything they say? Kids! They are so ridiculous and immature! I don't see why anybody wants 'em! Just you wait and see Kids! Kids! They are just impossible to control! (Soon you'll be old enough to be) Kids! With their awful clothes and their rock an' roll! (Another teenage delinquent) Why can't they be like you were, Perfect in every way? What's the matter with kids to-- Kids! What the devil's wrong with these kids today? Kids! Who could guess the they would turn out that way! Why can't they be like we were, Perfect in every way? What's the matter with kids? What's the matter with kids? What's the matter with kids today? | ||
| Phenixrising Citizen Username: Phenixrising Post Number: 1391 Registered: 9-2004 |
Calling the police is NOT the answer. Kibbegirl says, Is it possible for both So. Orange & Maplewood middle school principals to send home notices to parents encouraging their children to use proper use of the library and to once again reinforce that the library IS NOT a BABYSITTER? I think that this is a good idea! Since this happened at SO library a call to Mr. Kirk Smith may be in order. Even though this is not school property, it doesn't hurt to ask for his assistance. He probably knows the lil perps! Also, a notice sent by the HSA newsletter could help.  | ||
| Ace789nj Citizen Username: Ace789nj Post Number: 231 Registered: 2-2005 |
Fine as a preventative measure, but calling for a principal after school hours for an incident nowhere near the school won't get you too far. IMO the principal should be concerned with controling the kids when they're in school. When they're out and about if their parents haven't done enough to keep them respectful then someone should say something. If you're in the library and they're going crazy I would hope the employees could handle it, if that doesn't work SAY SOMETHING to them and when that fails either be passive and deal with their antics (like some posters here would likely do  ) or call the police. | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 14 Registered: 12-2005 |
Ace789nj- if you were a cop, would you want to go to the library every afternoon or on several occasions and deal with these children. Or would you rather go look for some bad guys. Please, notify the school and let them send home letters to the parents that if your kids don't behave the school may take measures. I'm sure the school would get involved if asked. | ||
| John Caffrey Citizen Username: Jerseyjack Post Number: 36 Registered: 11-2005 |
Put it into perspective. S.O. and Mapl. don't have an abunddance of bad guys to chase. Sometimes just an appearance at the library would put a stop to some of the disruption. Furthermore, some of the behavior described could result in injury or damage to library property. Let the cops get involved. JC | ||
| millie amoresano Citizen Username: Millieamoresano Post Number: 261 Registered: 11-2003 |
Why doesn't the library put some type of sign up saying "children under the age of___ must be with an adult"? | ||
| chatterbox Citizen Username: Chatterbox Post Number: 15 Registered: 12-2005 |
why not post a security officer during after school hours? He could sit and read while babysitting. | ||
| Just The Aunt Supporter Username: Auntof13 Post Number: 3822 Registered: 1-2004 |
One of the problems with these disruptive teenagers is when you ask them to 'please settle down' they turn on you. They mouth off, make threatening moves, they get down right scary. From what I understand, the schools have been informed, but there isn't much that can be done. I say ban the kids who act up from the library. What ever happened to 'respect?' And why is it when I go to Livingston Library, the 59 something teenagers there are not causing problems? Same with Millburn? | ||
| Phenixrising Citizen Username: Phenixrising Post Number: 1395 Registered: 9-2004 |
From what I understand, the schools have been informed, but there isn't much that can be done. JTA, Knowing Mr. Smith, he commands respect in & off campus. I will mention this incident when I see him today. Folks tend to use the library as a babysitter, however, that doesn't mean acting-out and disturbing others. As chatterbox said, this can be mentioned in the newsletter. And banning may be a "good" thing for these outbursts. And when they're banned, the parents are going ask why. Unless a kid is acting out in a threatening manner and could cause possible harm to someone, leave the police out of this. You can work with SOMS. The Vice Principal's wife was elected to the township board, complain to her about these disturbances and she can relay this to her hubby | ||
| Rastro Citizen Username: Rastro Post Number: 2297 Registered: 5-2004 |
Curious... why is the school being brought into this? The school is not a babysitting service any more than the library is. Call the parents. Tell them their kids are being disruptive and they must be picked up. Doesn't the school administration have enough to worry aboutwithout having to police kids off-site and after hours? | ||
| Phenixrising Citizen Username: Phenixrising Post Number: 1398 Registered: 9-2004 |
Rastro, Not necessarily police kids off-site, however,SOMS could be a liason between the 2. During school announcements over the PA the issue can be brought to the students attention. Also in the HSA newsletter that is sent home to the parents. Diciplinary actions should come from the library, not the school. (Perhaps banning the kid for bad behavior.) As indicated above, some of these parents use the library as a babysitter. The library IS in close proximity to the school. If they can't enter the library, then the parents should not complain because their child is behaving badly. | ||
| Rastro Citizen Username: Rastro Post Number: 2299 Registered: 5-2004 |
Phenix, While I do think it would be fine to have the announcements and inlude it in the newletter, I firmly disagree that "Disciplinary actions should come from the library..." Disciplinary action should come from the PARENTS. If the parents are too busy with other things to "police" their own kids, it should not be the librarians' responsibliity to do so. Though I do think we're saying the same thing, I don't want to in any way put hte onus on the librarians to do the parents' job. | ||
| Phenixrising Citizen Username: Phenixrising Post Number: 1399 Registered: 9-2004 |
Your right Rastro… "Disciplinary action" should come from the parents. What I meant to say was the library had the right to bar the kid from entering because of behavior problems (disciplinary action). I should have worded this correctly. Thanks! | ||
| LibraryLady(ncjanow) Supporter Username: Librarylady Post Number: 2974 Registered: 5-2001  |
As an employee of the South Orange, I want to thank everyone for their suggestions and concerns. Our director, Melissa Kopecky welcomes conversations and comments from everyone. Please contact her at the Library (973-762-0230)or email her at MKopecky@sopl.org if you'd like to discuss this (or any other) situation. Nancy Janow |
