| Author | Message | ||
     nwyave Citizen Username: Mesh Post Number: 111 Registered: 1-2003 |
I have this in the "Budget Cuts" thread, but I think it is important enough to have in a separate thread unto itself. I feel that way, because I am getting the strong feeling that another item that represents potential discretionary spending, will not be eliminated and frankly I am mind baffled by it and want to publicize it as soon as possible to get others opinions. We are in a financial crisis, but yet... I've seen some literature lately about the Tony Smith sculpture. I am far from an expert in that field and it may be a beautiful thing to have in our village. However, I do not think that with the current financial crisis, the town should be spending one penny in this area. If we can get grant money (that would not be used for any other purpose, and thus the only reason we are getting it is to fund this project), then assuming the astetics work, that would be fine. If we are in a financial crisis, then even things that people might really want, such as this, needs to be examined. As this is discretionary, in my opinion it would have to wait until we can perhaps one day afford it - certainly not now. Furthermore, if the desire is to hook this up with SOPAC somehow, I would counter that with SOPAC still a real maybe, I sure hope the BOT, with all due respect, realizes this is not the time time for this. We have to learn to say no, and live within our means. For those of you who have already commented on this, I would appreciate, if you would comment on it again on this thread so that there is an adequate representation here of public opinion and it does not get minimized because some have already posted on the "budget cuts" thread. I urge folks to comment. Don't complain later on about higher taxes if you do not give your imput now on things that can affect our taxes - especially something like this that if not spent would at least not affect Village services. Thanks. | ||
| doublea Citizen Username: Doublea Post Number: 301 Registered: 3-2003 |
I certainly agree that we are not in financial condition at this point in time to spend $50,000 on the sculpture. At a recent BOT meeting, several of the trustees spoke of the need to prioritize expentitures. As much as many in town would like to have a Tony Smith sculpture (or a replica as I understand it), I'm sure there are many other areas where $50,000 would be better spent. Earlier this year I wrote a post on this board that said while we all would like only the best for South Orange, the BOT and the Village President have never shown any indication that they are willing to prioritize expentitures. That was said even before the term "crisis" was used. I personally felt we have continually been in a state of financial crisis. Now that it has been labeled as such, let's see the BOT and Village President start prioritizing. nywave: Thank you for your efforts in trying to rein in municipal spending. Perhaps a letter to the NR might receive additional attention. With apologies to Dave, there are some people who don't read MOL. Of course, there are a lot of people who probably don't read either MOL or the NR. | ||
| mayhewdrive Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 407 Registered: 5-2001 |
NW & Doublea, Ditto. I agree. I wish I could the recall the actual cost of this because I am thinking that the amount was actully quite a bit higher than $50k. The idea that this one sculpture will somehow make South Orange a tourist destination like the Louvre or the Met is just silly. | ||
| peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 259 Registered: 8-2002 |
I don't know that I've seen anything on this. Is this the statue/sculpture with the large orange on it that is proposed for the village? (the miniature is in front of South Orange Middle School?). Either way -- unless its a total gift to the village, I'd put it off indefinately! Pete | ||
| NCJanow Citizen Username: Librarylady Post Number: 988 Registered: 5-2001 |
Pete, That was a donation from the Middle School HSA, I believe. Boy, how I wish the purchase of THAT had been a listed as a Village expense and rejected. Whew! NCJ aka LibraryLady On a coffee break..or something like it. | ||
| bets Citizen Username: Bets Post Number: 386 Registered: 6-2001  |
Tony Smith was born and raised in South Orange and is a sculptor of major renown. We lived next door to the Smiths when I was born and my father very much enjoyed his friendship with Tony. My father has sketches Tony did for a design for my dad's employer's corporate offices. My dad remembers meeting Jackson Pollock at Tony's house and has hilarious stories of Pollock and Tony making road trips out to Pollocks house. Tony's daughters Kiki and Annie are also artists of fame. We saw a show at the Palm Springs Institute of Art devoted to the three artists and their mediums. To just discount having a Tony Smith sculpture is limiting at best -- he was proud of his South Orange roots and I believe having such a sculpture could, indeed, make South Orange a destination. | ||
| nwyave Citizen Username: Mesh Post Number: 112 Registered: 1-2003 |
I'm proud of my roots too. I was able to buy a nice house in SO and pay pretty hefty taxes as a result of being a very prudent and conservative financial person. I think that similar logic needs to be applied to the town as a whole. Are you willing to pay for it in higher taxes and not complain about it then? There are a lot of things that we might want and think would be nice - when do we say no until we can afford it? Lets be real, do you really think that is what is going to make people come to SO now and if so, have such a major impact on the downtown to spur development. We have to be realistic here otherwise, then we should expect high tax increases to support such expectations. I am by no means discounting his work, I am saying though we are a town of 18,000 people with minimal commercial activity and thus nearly all the tax burden has to be carried by property owners. Like it or not that is the reality. If we got a grant for the whole cost, so be it - otherwise, we will all be paying for it through tax increases. We may go on and on about that there are other places to cut, but to a very large extent, there aren't. Most of the costs of the town are fixed and are providing vital services. So we have a choice - pay ever increasing taxes or say no to those things that are discretionary, such as this, until we can so afford it. If I sound perturbed - I am. We simply can't have our cake and eat it. If you don't mind the higher taxes that expenses such as this cause, so be it - but please when the next muni increase comes out and this is part of the cause, don't complain. | ||
| Washashore Citizen Username: Washashore Post Number: 75 Registered: 4-2003 |
Some suggestions, other than raising taxes, for how we might begin to set aside money to purchase an original Tony Smith sculpture (I am sympathetic to Bets' viewpoint): 1. Sell the SUV the Village bought for the Business Administrator/CFO/Treasurer (Montclair's BA gets no town-sponsored vehicle). Say, $20,000 2. Terminate the Village-paid cell phone contract for the BA (Montclair's BA does not have one). Say, $500 3. Put the kabash on the Village's plan to create a Special Improvement District (SID). A SID would require the imposition of ADDITIONAL taxes on the businesses in S.O. and the hiring of ADDITIIONAL staff, all with no guarantee that there would be any improvement to the downtown. Say, $140,000.(Remember, Chris Hartwyk was the Village's Redevelopment Attorney for several years - on the dole, as they say, and what did we, the taxpayers who paid his salary, get? A dust bowl after 3 years of vacancy on the Beifus site, contamination on the closed Shop Rite site - after the Village bought it WITHOUT first having done due diligence and an environmental audit to determine its condition. Perhaps we should garnish Chris' and Ed Matthews' salaries to pay back the Village for advising condemnation and subsequent purchase of this contaminated property, and for the lost tax revenue for the years the site has been vacant and idle). Say, $2,000/month from each = $48,000/year for 20 years (!?!) Given the implementation of these suggestions, in the first year, we'd raise over $200,000 toward the purchase of an original Tony Smith sculpture. The Village would benefit far more from owning this sculpture than it did from how the recouped money for the sculpture was originally spent. | ||
| Lizziecat Citizen Username: Lizziecat Post Number: 53 Registered: 5-2003 |
Oh, like one sculpture by an artist who used to live in SOuth Orange is going to make this town a "destination." Puh-lease! If the artist's friends and family feel so strongly about having a sculpture in South Orange, let them either raise the money to but it for the town or donate it outright. We have other priorities here. Our downtown rehabilitation seems stalled, our taxes are through the roof, our pool needs repair as do our streets, and I could go on and on. Washashore has some interesting ideas for cutting expenses, but that money, too, if we ever see it, should go to maintaining the village infrastructure. | ||
| dgm Citizen Username: Dgm Post Number: 144 Registered: 5-2001 |
I thought the Tony Smith sculpture is to be largely privately funded since I attended a big expensive fund raiser last year and the goal was several hundred thousand dollars. Is the Village is contributing? | ||
| nwyave Citizen Username: Mesh Post Number: 114 Registered: 1-2003 |
There is expected that at the end of the day there would have to be some sort of town contribution. | ||
| peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 260 Registered: 8-2002 |
if the purchase of the sculpture is privately funded, then it might be a question of land/space for it - which is a relatively no-cost contribution if its an existing park, etc. the bigger question is -- how big a "distraction" is something like this to the village and BOT. let's get back to the budget issues at hand... Pete (it kills me that we debate almost endlessly about parking on MOL -- but the budget thread gets little attention!) | ||
| notehead Citizen Username: Notehead Post Number: 742 Registered: 5-2001  |
I agree. I'd love to have the sculpture in our town, but only if the money to acquire it is raised privately. | ||
| Marc Citizen Username: Bautisma Post Number: 3 Registered: 9-2003 |
where are they planning on putting the sculpture? | ||
| Washashore Citizen Username: Washashore Post Number: 77 Registered: 4-2003 |
peteglider: You say "let's get back to the budget issues at hand..." My suggestions for cuts in Village expenses in my post above could work toward tax reductions, street cleaning, and/or a Tony Smith sculpture. The issue is to get responsible BOT members who can pass responsible budgets, and hire competent and responsible people. The way this group of BOT (minus some notable exceptions like Patrick) have allowed bonding and the incurring of over 35M in annual debt while our annual budget is 25 million, salary and staff increases and perks (like the BA's village-paid SUV) smack of the height of irresponsibility. I've suggested some avenues where reasonable budget savings might be obtained. Perhaps others in this thread can add to the list to suggest to the BOT, since the BOT themselves seem unable to lead in this area. | ||
| Dave Ross Supporter Username: Dave Post Number: 5302 Registered: 5-2001  |
What's the service charge on the debt? | ||
| peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 262 Registered: 8-2002 |
wash -- my point being -- a thread about a sculpture or parking gets more attention than a thread about the budget! we should look at *every* idea generated for being cost effective -- Pete | ||
| vermontgolfer Citizen Username: Vermontgolfer Post Number: 93 Registered: 12-2002 |
There are some very interesting thoughts put forward about cutting budget expenses and including this purchase would also be a prudent decison. Mr. Smith may have created magnificant sculptures, but frankly let's save the $50.0 and find as many other additional areas to cut expenses and at the very least maintain our taxes, not increase them. I don't see where putting this sculpture in town will make it a destination. | ||
| nwyave Citizen Username: Mesh Post Number: 116 Registered: 1-2003 |
By the way, the elimination of this would have the effect of reducing our tax increase by about .35% (to be clear for argument sake if it was a 10.35% increase, it would go to 10%). My understanding (not 100% sure, but I think I am in the ballpark), is that each $140,000 results in a 1% increase on our taxes. Hence $50,000/$140,000 = .35%. Without having to comment at this point there stand on the Smith sculpture, does any of the BOT who participate in this forum know if my above logic is correct - i.e. - $140k results in 1% effect on taxes. Thanks, Erwin |
