| Author | Message | ||
     doublea Citizen Username: Doublea Post Number: 291 Registered: 3-2003 |
Dan: I agree with you that SHU should not be made the scapegoat for all our problems, and thought to myself that maybe the trustees were breathing a sigh of relief that attention had been deflected from the real issues. Thanks for pointing this out. Nevertheless, more and more municipalities are asking the college and universities in their towns to make in lieu of payments, and this should certainly be pursued with SHU. And this is the same SHU that we were told was going to partner with us on SOPAC because it had "deep pockets." | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 400 Registered: 3-2003 |
"Its not like SHU was just granted an abatement. Seton Hall has in been in existance since 1856. Its tax exempt stautus is known to all of us and whether you agree with it or not, that fact has to be condsided when making a budget." Exactly. (Although I can't help enjoying enormously the suggestion above that SO redraw its boundaries to put Seton Hall in Newark.) | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 401 Registered: 3-2003 |
Is it possible the 2003 tax rate was set in the hope that an improvement in the national economy (or the local investment climate) would bail us out in 2004 or 2005? | ||
| doublea Citizen Username: Doublea Post Number: 292 Registered: 3-2003 |
We'll be pleading for more PILOTs.  | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 402 Registered: 3-2003 |
An excerpt from a letter I received from John Gross's office concerning the 2003/2004 budget: "As I am sure you will recall, 2003 was always projected in our five-year forecasts as a "difficult" budget year. In fact...municipal taxes were estimated to increase by 10.91% or approximately $1.5 million. In addition to this expected increase, 2003 presented itself with an additional increase of approximately $550,000 in insurance expenditures, a reduction in revenue of approximately $280,000 from interest earned and $200,000 from construction fees, for a total of approximately $1,030,000 in unanticipated appropriations and revenue shortfall..." I can understand the hit from insurance expenditures--this has happened all over, post 9-11--and I can see how investments could have yielded less than anticipated interest lately. (I hope this is a lesson to anyone who would fully privatise social security.) But why in heaven's name were construction fees not foreseen? Somewhere back in the PILOT thread, I think, someone brought up our debt service. Can anyone speak to whether and how much this affects our postiton now? Also, in the minutes of the 1/25/03 BOT Special Meeting, it's reported that a discussion occurred around whether SO would increase funding to the Community Coalition on Race, which has received $35,000 from South Orange for each of the last three years. The CCR had requested a raise to $45,000. Discssion of the issue was postponed until the Trustees could get a look at Maplewood's CCR funding. Anyone know how this issue was resolved? Finally, I see from the same minutes that the Board voted "yes" to 2003 expenditures of $25,000 in Village Hall Interior Renovations and $2,500 in Carpeting. Under "Court Administration," $3,500 in carpeting expenses was allocated from funds previously appropriated, along with $4,000 in wallpaper and paint. Now, I'm all for improvements to Town Hall and the Court, but not necessarily in the run-up year to a budget crisis. Nevertheless, "The Board asserted that the Court must be "fixed up" because it is aesthetically unpleasing. Trustee Theroux asserted that the Court and the Police Department must be made more "consumer friendly" and this project should become a priority." What's going on here? I realize the Special Meeting took place eight and a half months ago, but it did follow a Finance Committee meeting two weeeks earlier. Were there no indications of impending financial trouble at that time? Were our trustees kept in the dark about the budget situation, or was someone asleep, or what? | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 403 Registered: 3-2003 |
"We'll be pleading for more PILOTs." I thought exactly the same thing. | ||
| peteglider Citizen Username: Peteglider Post Number: 226 Registered: 8-2002 |
And isn't Mr Beifus smart to be holding SO hostage with his "tundra" site! It won't be the developer pleading for an agreement, it will be the village grovelling for a settlement to get the revenue flowing! Think about it -- by keeping the property in its current miserable state he's bringing enormous politcal pressure on the BOT -- and then if he times it right -- when SO is most revenue vulnerable/needy -- he'll be in a strong position to hold out for what he wants. lose lose situation for SO -- regardless of what the BOT does. Pete | ||
| Eric DeVaris Citizen Username: Eric_devaris Post Number: 33 Registered: 2-2003 |
As much as I appreciate Washashore's urge to "create a booty" in the coffers of the Coalition to Preserve South Orange, Inc. (CPSO), I wish to declare here that Washashore's post of 9/12/03 9:34pm.on this thread is his/her own initiative, without the approval of CPSO. The Board of Trustees of CPSO does not know the identity of the person behind the username "Washashore". The Board of Trustees of CPSO had no prior knowledge of the aforesaid post and does not endorse any of its contents. Funds in the coffers of the CPSO are not destined to support any political campaign. The mission of CPSO states clearly that we are to educate the public on important issues of the Village by disseminating factual information. We intent to adhere to our mission. Eric DeVaris, CPSO president | ||
| Washashore Citizen Username: Washashore Post Number: 67 Registered: 4-2003 |
Eric DeVaris: Thank you for highlighting the mission of CPSO as one of educating, and not of electing. The error was clearly mine, and I apologize to both CPSO and to anyone who may have been misled by my "booty" call, and identification of CPSO as the repository. For those of you who are upset about the state of affairs in S.O. - from bonding and high taxes and Midas site aquisitions and tennis court bubbles and no Supermarket, and Beifus tundra and...and...and...I promise that I will help work to create a political PAC where donations CAN be made to help elect a new slate of BOT in the 2005 election. When the PAC is up and running and open for business, you all will be the first to know. | ||
| patjoyce Citizen Username: Patjoyce Post Number: 29 Registered: 7-2001 |
The debate loses validity when it appears to be completely politically motivated. I do not know who wasashore is , but I want to make it clear that when I ran for BOT the CPSO did not contribute one cent to my campaign. Contribute money to CPSO because it is a great organization, but not if you want to start a political war chest. Political rhetoric at this site chills my willingness to engage in dialogue or offer facts in response to requests for information. Most importantly, it permits those who wish not to engage in dialogue to marginalize the discussion. To respond to some questions, I do believe that CCR received $35,00.00 but I will check on that figure. I believe this financial crisis presents an opportunity to scrutinize the budget and eliminate the fat. As to how did we get here. The BOT was told by the CFO that we had a surplus of 4 million dollars in July of 2002. The actual surplus for 2002 was 3,014.560. The dollar amount of this year's shortfall is 1.1 million. If you do the math the difference between the actual surplus and what we were led to believe was the surplus would pretty much cover this shortfall. The finance committee was not informed of this change in economic forecast. In fact, the first the BOT was told of this was Friday 9-5-03. Patrick | ||
| patjoyce Citizen Username: Patjoyce Post Number: 30 Registered: 7-2001 |
The debate loses validity when it appears to be completely politically motivated. I do not know who wasashore is , but I want to make it clear that when I ran for BOT the CPSO did not contribute one cent to my campaign. Contribute money to CPSO because it is a great organization, but not if you want to start a political war chest. Political rhetoric at this site chills my willingness to engage in dialogue or offer facts in response to requests for information. Most importantly, it permits those who wish not to engage in dialogue to marginalize the discussion. To respond to some questions, I do believe that CCR received $35,00.00 but I will check on that figure. I believe this financial crisis presents an opportunity to scrutinize the budget and eliminate the fat. As to how did we get here. The BOT was told by the CFO that we had a surplus of 4 million dollars in July of 2002. The actual surplus for 2002 was 3,014.560. The dollar amount of this year's shortfall is 1.1 million. If you do the math the difference between the actual surplus and what we were led to believe was the surplus would pretty much cover this shortfall. The finance committee was not informed of this change in economic forecast. In fact, the first the BOT was told of this was Friday 9-5-03. Patrick | ||
| noracoombs Citizen Username: Noracoombs Post Number: 23 Registered: 8-2002 |
PATRICK JOYCE SAYS: "As to how did we get here. The BOT was told by the CFO that we had a surplus of 4 million dollars in July of 2002. The actual surplus for 2002 was 3,014.560. The dollar amount of this year's shortfall is 1.1 million. If you do the math the difference between the actual surplus and what we were led to believe was the surplus would pretty much cover this shortfall. The finance committee was not informed of this change in economic forecast. In fact, the first the BOT was told of this was Friday 9-5-03. " IF this is true, I have one question for the BOT: Why was the Village CFO still the CFO as of 9-6-03? | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 608 Registered: 4-2002 |
Dan: SHU has been in town a long time. However, up until about 10 - 12 years ago they were mostly a commuter school. They have dramtatically increased the number of dorm rooms on campus without any long term planning as to the affect it would have on the village or within their own campus. Recently they started putting three students in a room instead of two. They allow all students to have a car, but they do not have nearly enough parking spaces forcing students to look elsewhere and usually on local residential streets. The enormous increase in the student population has led to a large increase in the number of calls to the Police and Fire departments. Commuter schools do not and did not bring forth the same problems as a residential school. It all adds up to the fact that SHU needs to recognize their responsibility. One can say the BOT is deflecting blame, but that is just not true. There is no question the debt should be lower. There is no question we need to eliminate any waste and services that we cannot afford. We are a small village with limited resources. SHU can be a resource for the village and they can increase their contribution to the village to better reflect their imapact on local services. J Crohn: The Secacus transfer is open on weekends not and is expecting to be fully operational when the path service to downtown Manhattan is completely restored (December 03 is the expected timing). I am not sure it will really have an impact on local commuters except for having another stop (many trains will skip Newark now). The transfer will have a much greater impact for towns on the bergen and main lines who will now have a way of taking the midtown direct. | ||
| mayhewdrive Citizen Username: Mayhewdrive Post Number: 389 Registered: 5-2001 |
"They have dramtatically increased the number of [dorm] rooms on campus without any long term planning as to the affect it would have on the village" Sounds just like South Orange. | ||
| mrosner Citizen Username: Mrosner Post Number: 609 Registered: 4-2002 |
The number of residents is virtually the same in the 2000 census when compared to the 1990 census. Since 1995 the village has increased the size of the police force and in large part because of the increase in the number of calls to SHU. Adding 200 apartments for the whole village is a lot less than doubling the number of on-campus students in ten years. Even if you add up the number of people for the three apartment buildings (gaslight, beifus, shop-rite)and the quarry, it would add up to less than the number of new students. The village has added parking spaces too. The village has done traffic study's and had a full report done by the Atlantic group in 1994 before any construction started. That report is a long-term plan done by professionals. You might disagree with it, but it did represent a plan and SHU did not do any planning. Plus, new residents pay their own way via property taxes (or a PILOT). SHU increases their profits on the backs of residents. So, not really the same at all. | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 404 Registered: 3-2003 |
Thank you, Mr. Joyce. Is it correct that a public meeting will be held this Monday night at 8:00 at Village Hall? | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 405 Registered: 3-2003 |
"The transfer will have a much greater impact for towns on the bergen and main lines who will now have a way of taking the midtown direct." That's the information I was asking for, thanks. It isn't the impact on local commuters I'm curious about, but the positive impact on communities that might become more attractive than ours as a result of their improved access to Midtown Direct service. In other words, if our taxes become prohibitive and if other towns' are less so, and if at the same time commuters will soon be able to get to NY more easily from less tax-burdened suburbs, then SO may see a down trend in housing values. | ||
| J. Crohn Citizen Username: Jcrohn Post Number: 406 Registered: 3-2003 |
Mark, interesting comments about SHU. Would it be feasible (or legal) for the Village to institute a permit fee of some sort for student parking on SO streets? I.e., something along the lines of, all SHU students would have to register their vehicles with the town and be required to buy SO parking permits. (Or something--this might be impossible to enforce.) The number of students living on campus and in town generally must be a burden of some sort on city services, but at the same time, do students not also contribute economically to the health of the town? That is, don't they shop here, work here? As for police and fire dept. services, could we levy a specific charge for such services against the university? | ||
| Eric DeVaris Citizen Username: Eric_devaris Post Number: 34 Registered: 2-2003 |
Mr. Rosner, Let's set the record straight. The Village had indeed done a traffic study and a long-term plan by professionals in 1994. I know, I was part of their preparation at the time. Long-term plans, however, are not meant to rigidly stick to their projections; as the socio-economic, political and physical climates change, these plans need to be revisited, also by professionals, at least every two or three years. Long-term plans are meant to be a weather vane pointing to a direction, not a straight road set in concrete. To my knowledge outside professionals have not revisited the Atlantic Group’s plan in the last nine years. Yet South Orange’s demographics and socio-economic environment over that period have changed considerably. The Atlantic Group’s plan has been, over the years, conveniently adjusted, interpreted, or ignored by the governing body to suit short-term solutions. To wit: recreational facilities, land acquisitions (Midas, Shoprite), the Quarry, open space, the budget, the number of residential units downtown, etc. I hope this information helps. Eric DeVaris | ||
| NCJanow Citizen Username: Librarylady Post Number: 934 Registered: 5-2001 |
Dave, is it really appropriate to call our elected officials crooks as in Washashore's quote,"our failure to root out the crooks in May, I am not aware that any of the trustees or members of the village administration has been convicted of any crime or even charged. Isn't that slander, or defamination of character or just plain lying? Bums, nogoodniks, people one disagrees with, that's all legimate name calling, calling them crooks requires some evidence, don'tcha think? NCJ aka LibraryLady |
