| Author | Message | ||
     themp Citizen Username: Themp Post Number: 1336 Registered: 12-2001 |
I thought Kerry was going to win, too, Sbenois, but I supported him before I thought that, and even after. You called Bush an idiot and other things. Bet you're biting your tongue. Infested is not a very "objective" word. | ||
| Mark Fuhrman Citizen Username: Mfpark Post Number: 1042 Registered: 9-2001  |
How does Sharpton differ from Zell Miller? From Tom DeLay? Equally radical and divisive figures. The problem is one of message delivery for the Dems. They need focus and coherence, where they now have confusion. | ||
| sbenois Citizen Username: Sbenois Post Number: 12853 Registered: 10-2001  |
I had no problem with Zell Miller. Nor did I have a problem with Rudy or McCain. Sorry. | ||
| anon Citizen Username: Anon Post Number: 1555 Registered: 6-2002 |
I agree with Mark and disagree with Sbenois. Tell me one "left-wing" position taken by Kerry. The Republicans won by appealing strongly to their base, painting the Dem candidate as a "flip-flopper" with no core principles and their own candidate as "steadfast" in his principles. So how does the Democratic Party react? By "rethinking" its positions. In other words, troubling its base and "flip-flopping" on its positions. What's wrong with this picture? | ||
| Paul Surovell Supporter Username: Paulsurovell Post Number: 204 Registered: 2-2003 |
A few comments on some points made on this thread: (1) The lawsuit was filed by rank-and-file Democrats, but has not been joined by the Democratic Party itself. There have been reports that the Kerry campaign has joined the lawsuit's request that all voting machinery, equipment and software be frozen and impounded. This refusal by the Party to stand up and fight against mass violations of voting rights -- especially among African Americans -- not to mention the rights of the Party itself, is exactly what turns people away from the Democratic Party. The circumstances in Ohio were possibly as bad as they were in the Ukraine, where the discrepancy in the exit polls was the primary reason for calling for a re-vote. Read the text of the Ohio lawsuit which provides county-by-county absuses and disenfranchisement of African American votes as well. (2) Most of the reasons given for why Kerry "lost" -- including those voiced by Sbenois -- are based on results of the exit polls. If the exit polls can be believed to reach an understanding of WHY people voted, why shouldn't they believed for an understanding of WHICH CANDIDATE PEOPLE VOTED FOR -- the exit polls show a Kerry victory in Ohio AND a total vote victory nationally as well. (3) No major media has reported Freeman's analysis of the exit polls and the exit poll consortium (made up ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, Fox and AP) has refused John Conyers's request for their raw data. This is not evidence that Freeman's analysis should be ignored, but is a good reason to question the integrity of the media. We all know from the WMD experience that the major media is capable of censoring stories that challenge the establishment's view. (4) It remains to be seen whether Rep. John Conyers (and likely additional members of the Black Caucus) will be joined by a Senator in challenging the Ohio results on January 6th when a joint session of Congress is convened to certify the Electoral College results. Will we have another repeat performance by the Democratic Senators of the 2000 certification process -- featured in the opening scene of Farenheit 911 -- in which no Senator would join the half-dozen members of the Black Caucus in challenging the results in Florida on the basis of mass disenfranchisement of African American voters? If Senator Kerry and the others sit in silence, the image and reputation of the Democratic Party as an empty vessel, unable to fight for truth and democracy, will reach a new low. Paul Surovell | ||
| sbenois Citizen Username: Sbenois Post Number: 12858 Registered: 10-2001 |
Perception is reality. | ||
| edible juicy red pulpy fruit Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4198 Registered: 10-2001 |
Paul, You've fallen into a trap. Americans as a whole have become fed up with a system of lawyers who sue over everything and anything from a bruised knee to a non-contested election. Edwards was clearly miscast as a candidate simply because America has no intention of awarding personal injury lawyers anymore than we already do. To think for one second that the American people would accept an Ohio Judge's decision to re-direct the results of the 2004 election is laughable. The American people have spoken and as a result the Republican party enjoys an overwelming majority. If as a Democrat you're looking to blame someone, blame the radical left wing of your party. Moderate swing voters saw Dean, listened to Kerry, and in the end voted REPUBLICAN. Your focus and energy needs to be 06. The mid-term elections can be the beginning of a swing back to the center for the Dems. Something the Donkey party needs to do quickly. | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 934 Registered: 8-2003  |
Not exactly. Not if they can sue over being denied the right to hear Christmas carols.  | ||
| Ukealalio Citizen Username: Ukealalio Post Number: 1603 Registered: 6-2003 |
Yea edible, please send your message to the selfish, publicity seekers who have hired a religous right law firm to sue our towns. Now THATS a waste!!!. | ||
| anon Citizen Username: Anon Post Number: 1560 Registered: 6-2002 |
170 years ago, DeTocqueville wrote in "Democracy in America" that every controversey in America eventually ends up in a Courtroom. It's nothing new. | ||
| Paul Surovell Supporter Username: Paulsurovell Post Number: 205 Registered: 2-2003 |
Edible, Americans will support a Democratic Party that fights for principles and core values and stands up against lies, injustice and corruption. John Conyers will provide a role model for these qualities on Thursday the 6th, when he challenges the election results in Ohio. By the way, what positions held within the Democratic Party do you consider to be "left wing?" Please enlighten me so I can respond more directly to your post. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4202 Registered: 10-2001 |
"By the way, what positions held within the Democratic Party do you consider to be "left wing?" The Dems have no message, just left wing messengers. This is why they continue to lose. Conyers is a moron. | ||
| Paul Surovell Supporter Username: Paulsurovell Post Number: 206 Registered: 2-2003 |
Strawberry, I'll try one more time. Can you please give some examples of what you mean by "left wing" when you use the term "left-wing messengers?" Thank you. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4203 Registered: 10-2001 |
radical liberals want the U.N. making decisions for the U.S. Radical liberals believe big businesses are corrupt and should be punished with higher taxes to support social programs to support the unemployed. This in order to assure that an individual who never works, never has to look for a job. Radical liberals oppose the most effective way to curb serious crime, the death penalty. Radical liberals support the disgraceful partial birth abortion. Radical liberals believe in socialized medicine. Radical liberals hate America. Always have. Radical liberals are in short, socialists. Jesse Jackson, Michael Moore, Al Gore, Rev. Sharpton and Howard Dean are all radical libs. These are all current policies and policy makers of today's Democratic party. | ||
| Dr. Winston O'Boogie Citizen Username: Casey Post Number: 936 Registered: 8-2003 |
banal | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4204 Registered: 10-2001 |
one more thing and the most important point of them all. A radical lib has no solutions, just complaints. This was Kerry's biggest mistake. He did an awful lot of whining, but when asked what his plan would be, he never offered one.. Not once. Radical liberal attitude cost him the election. | ||
| Local_1_crew Citizen Username: Local_1_crew Post Number: 316 Registered: 3-2004 |
if i thought for one second that you believed one word of what you say instead of just trying to garner attention, i would feel very sad for you. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4207 Registered: 10-2001 |
boring | ||
| cjc Citizen Username: Cjc Post Number: 2953 Registered: 8-2003 |
Universal (see: "free") daycare and pre-school is left wing. Single payer healthcare is left-wing. The Department of Peace is left wing. | ||
| overtaxdalready Citizen Username: Overtaxdalready Post Number: 313 Registered: 6-2001 |
When did Kerry become the President of Ohio? |
