| Author | Message | ||
     sbenois Citizen Username: Sbenois Post Number: 12940 Registered: 10-2001  |
Your expectations were unrealistic. | ||
| tjohn Citizen Username: Tjohn Post Number: 2855 Registered: 12-2001  |
Mammabear wrote: " It was a non-issue until this year. And the abrupt removal of the items was handled very poorly. It was offenseive and malicious. The Board memebrs in charge of both sales were informed that Christmas items "made people feel sick." So is that it Mammabear? Not the decision itself, but the way it was made? It seems to me that the most contentious arguments in this town since I have been here have stemmed by bad management and presentation of the issues. It would seem that had the property tax reval and the school music policy modification been handled differently, there would have been much less fuss. In the case of the property tax, I think the T.C. was genuinely blind-sided. | ||
| anon Citizen Username: Anon Post Number: 1573 Registered: 6-2002 |
This is one for the books! (No pun intended) The Orthodox critics of the Reform Movement would have a field day. They would say that a Reform Synagogue has gotten so far away from Judaism that a Christian can refer to it as "my neighborhood temple" and can complain that it won't allow the display and sale of Christmas items! | ||
| Joan Supporter Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 4676 Registered: 5-2001 |
Mammabear: It says a lot for the welcoming and accepting nature of the TSTI pre-school that you and the other non-Jewish (and non-observant Jewish) families who participate in the pre-school program feel such a part of the pre-school that you have come to think of TSTI as your neighborhood temple. It sounds as if a lot of people have been doing a lot of things right up to now. It is a shame that what you describe as the poor handling of a single incident should change all that for you and possibly other families as well. Have you considered requesting a meeting of the pre-school board with Rabbi Cohen, Rabbi Miller and/or representatives of the TSTI board to discuss the pre-school board's feelings on this matter and come to an understanding of how the non-Jewish families at the pre-school can continue to feel welcome in the pre-school setting? | ||
| susan1014 Supporter Username: Susan1014 Post Number: 327 Registered: 3-2002 |
Oh, by the way, what ARE you trying to say about Oheb Shalom (or about Sherai Tefilo, by the way), by making the comment "This is not Oheb, it's Sharey-Tefilo"?? Are you trying to imply that Sharey-Tefilo is not committed to its Jewish identity? Or that Oheb is not open to the community? Or what? I still think that you are completely missing the difference between multicultural and non-denominational. If no one ever explained it to you, they may need to communicate better. If the preschool board has come to feel that it is not a subsidiary of the synagogue, responsible to its leadership, that also sounds like a problem. Still, your level of anger startles me. At the end of the day, it is a synagogue preschool. No matter what the enrollment numbers look like, Judaism and the needs of Jews are going to be protected. If that makes you so angry, perhaps you should be elsewhere (or less involved!). My kudos to Joan for her gentle advice. In the end, this perceived offense should not have to do damage to relationships at a synagogue preschool that has been very open to non-Jewish community members. | ||
| Taylor M Citizen Username: Anotherusername Post Number: 245 Registered: 8-2004 |
mammabear This thread died 3 Jan. You brought it back. | ||
| Debby Citizen Username: Debby Post Number: 1497 Registered: 5-2001 |
Mamabear - the Temple is not having an identity crisis. Are you? Are you suddenly realizing that you thought you could get past the whole 'Jewish thing', but it really doesn't sit right with you? | ||
| Lizziecat Citizen Username: Lizziecat Post Number: 471 Registered: 5-2003 |
What I don't understand is why mammabear sent her kid to a temple preschool in the first place. I and my family are Jewish atheists, and I never would have dreamed of sending my children to a temple preschool because I knew that there would be elements of their experience there that I would not agree with. I was careful to send both of my sons to secular preschools, affiliated with no religion, and thus avoided the sort of conflict that mammabear is experiencing. There are lots of good preschools that are not affiliated with temples, and I am baffled as to why she knowingly left herself open to a situation such as this. | ||
| Just The Aunt Supporter Username: Auntof13 Post Number: 410 Registered: 1-2004  |
On another thread I got the impression Mammabear was looking into other schools. | ||
| nan Citizen Username: Nan Post Number: 1702 Registered: 2-2001 |
That's right. She made a deliberate public declaration with that post. Mammabear wants the whole community to know that her little "Preschool Power bloc" will get the service they deserve or else. | ||
| greenetree Supporter Username: Greenetree Post Number: 3642 Registered: 5-2001  |
OK - I don't have kids so I am prepared to get slammed for this question, but.... You have a school where (according to the initial posts) a child is happy, the parents are pleased with the teachers and the curriculum and all appear to be doing well. But, the criterion for keeping the child there is whether or not an item of particular interest to some of the parents is sold at a fundraiser? Maybe it's a good thing I don't have kids, because I sure don't understand the decision-making process. | ||
| tjohn Citizen Username: Tjohn Post Number: 2861 Registered: 12-2001 |
Greenetree, Are you assuming that the decision-making process is rational? If so, that may be your problem. Assume it is irrational and it all becomes much more clear. | ||
| Joan Supporter Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 4680 Registered: 5-2001 |
Mammabear and her clic were over ruled on a matter of preschool policy. Forget for a moment how insignificant this bit of policy may seem to some of us in light of the far greater impact of day-to-day decisions that go into running a preschool and meeting the needs of the children who attend. Note that Mommabear has stated in more than one post on this thread that she has nothing but praise for these policies and the manner in which they are carried out. Her entire tirade is beginning to sound more and more like a temper tantrum. Mammabear should either work her way through her negative reaction to this decision or make good on her claim of searching for a preschool where she will feel more in control. | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4234 Registered: 10-2001 |
complete b.s Joan. Mamabear is 100% correct. The school accepts her money under the guise it's a school that accepts all children. Then, they pull the rug out from under her and all the Christian children. School sounds like it's run by a bunch of weenies. | ||
| Soda Supporter Username: Soda Post Number: 2307 Registered: 5-2001  |
Please Ignore The Previous Troll Post. -s. | ||
| Joan Supporter Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 4683 Registered: 5-2001 |
Strawberry: You wrote: "The school accepts [Mommabear's] money under the guise it's a school that accepts all children. Then, they pull the rug out from under her and all the Christian children." How does removing some wrapping paper and three books from the merchandise offered for sale at a fund raiser being held at at a synagogue equal "pulling the rug out from under her and all the Christian children?" I'm having a bit of trouble understanding what you are trying to say here. | ||
| anon Citizen Username: Anon Post Number: 1575 Registered: 6-2002 |
Joan: You should have taken Soda's advice. | ||
| Bobkat Supporter Username: Bobk Post Number: 7170 Registered: 5-2001 |
It appears that the pre-school sold "Christmas" items in prior years, but changed policy this year. Did the music ban in the schools effect this decision? | ||
| Strawberry Supporter Username: Strawberry Post Number: 4236 Registered: 10-2001 |
Joan, It amazes me just how foolish some people can be. The School and the Temple have no problem accepting the money from those of a faith other than Judiasm. The school also has no issue asking non-Jews to donate money and time to the facility. They even go as far as to make it clear the celebration of Christmas is one to honor as part of the fund raising effort. However, at the last second (twice) the school/Temple decides to remove all items related to Christmas, a clear slap in the face to the 30% or non-Jewish population there. As a Jew I am outraged at such behaivor. Frankly I'm more outraged by those who defend such attitudes as well. Anyone who defends the school's actions is just not that bright. And Soda, shut up already. You're the biggest troll on this site. | ||
| Joan Supporter Username: Joancrystal Post Number: 4688 Registered: 5-2001 |
Anon and Soda: Thanks for the warning but I would much rather have clearly expressed thoughts than innuendo on this board. Strawberry: Thanks for making your position clearer. I think you are missing a few points here. No one, not even Mommabear, has gone so far as to say that the celebration of Christmas is one to honor as part of the fund raising effort. If I read Mommabear's many posts here correctly, the point is rather that the non-Jewish parents on the board did not consider the books about Santa Claus or the wrapping paper to be all that Christmas-related. What we have here is an inter-cultural misunderstanding. Where do you see that the temple has decided twice and at the last moment to remove items related to Christmas [from the merchandise offered for sale at the fund raiser]? Mommabear only speaks of a single instance (this year) when such action was taken. It the temple had objected previously, why on earth would the preschool board have approved including such materials a second time? I respect your outrage and if you have facts not yet presented in this case, I would welcome your citing them here along with your source but please don't jump to conclusions based on only a partial understanding of the situation. |
