| Author | Message | ||
     newone Citizen Username: Newone Post Number: 217 Registered: 8-2001 |
First of all, never believe anything you see in the movies (especially Chuck Norris ones  ) Those ain't real life. Speaking for myself, I never feel afraid when I'm out and about but as I said earlier (and on other threads), if CCW ever came to pass in Jersey, I'd do it. | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1584 Registered: 1-2003  |
There is a difference between paranoid and prepared. I'm a CPR instructor. In my desk I keep a CPR mask and gloves. I also have a first aid kit. On 9/11 I used it. Is that fear? Do you have a fire extinguisher? Is that because of your fear of fire? Or do you just say Fire, Shmire, whatever. As I said in my post, I've been mugged twice. Hey, maybe that means my odds are up and I'm safe forever now. Maybe not. My wife's friend was a victim of road rage just 2 weeks ago. Some loonie purposely rammed her car after she accidently cut him off, flipping her minivan. I saw some nut almost beat the crap out of an old man at home depot over a parking space. By the way, it was almost because I stepped in and defended the old man. I believe you said you are a cop (hence your ID)... so do you choose not to carry a gun? | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 888 Registered: 7-2004 |
How would carrying a gun have helped your wife's friend who's car was flipped? Should the old man have pulled out weapon? Would that have helped the situation, or made it worse? | ||
| Valentine Michael Smith Citizen Username: Umbert Post Number: 76 Registered: 3-2004  |
I agree with Livingston. Was the old man supposed to shoot the guy? And besides, what if home depot parking lot guy had a gun? The old man might have almost been shot, along with who ever intervened. People are fracking crazy. Too crazy to let them have guns. I have been on the receiving end of road rage and I can't tell you how glad I am those people didn't have guns. What is really to lose by banning guns and what is to gain? It seems like the benefits of ridding (or even just attempting to) our society of guns far out weighs the cons. | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1585 Registered: 1-2003 |
If the old man had a weapon, maybe he wouldn't have needed me. But if the old guy did have a weapon and knew how to use it, it would have made the situation far better. He could have defended himself instead of being lucky that someone there would defend him. Having a gun wouldn't have helped my wifes friend. Though, she was running away from this nut at relatively high speed. Mainly out of fear, maybe if she'd have been armed somehow, she wouldn't have ran, wouldn't have been going so fast, and wouldn't have flipped. Who knows? Crazies are everywhere. Living around here sure proves that. But what I am saying is that things happen, and you should be prepared. If you pulled in to a parking space at HD and start to walk in, and some loonie starts screaming at you, and threatening you, and even if you apologize and offer to move your car, as the old guy did, and this possibly drunken or high nutcase still comes at you, what would you do? run? Turn the other cheek? Or might you be wishing for pepper spray or a police baton (and the training to use either)? By the way, running is usually the best choice, but the old guy was in no shape to outrun anyone. | ||
| Valentine Michael Smith Citizen Username: Umbert Post Number: 77 Registered: 3-2004 |
Well if i had no other choice I'd do my damndest top kick his •••. And worse case scenario, I get my ••• kicked. I would rather get my ••• kicked then kill someone. I had three words bleeped out! Whoops. But I would actually run away. | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1586 Registered: 1-2003 |
VMS... This is all because I said I have trained and have NON-Lethal weapons. I don't want to kill anyone, however, if I had to to defend myself or my loveed ones, I would. What if you get your butt kicked so bad that you have permanent damage, like brain damage, or blindness? Would you still rather get your butt kicked? Not me. If I have no choice, I will fight, and fight hard, and use everything I can to win. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 889 Registered: 7-2004 |
If the old man was too weak to run away, how would he have the strength to beat an obvious lunatic down with a police baton? As bad as it may be, I can't imagine a scenerio where old guys are shooting people in parking lots over parking spaces and women are rolling down their window and firing at overly-aggressive drivers on the highway. Then again, the republicans are back in power... | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 1515 Registered: 12-2001 |
I'm no cop. I stepped in and defended cops once when you said they exaggerate the danger they face to get overpaid or something. If I were a cop I would carry a gun - I think it's required. Good point about the fire extinguisher, but I would bet that the stats for fires being put out successfully are better than those of successful self-defense with a gun. What kills more white middle class men - street violence, or high cholesterol? In fact, how many middle class men get killed by unknown parties every year (regardless of race)? I was at a party once, and this 23 year old guy who worked for Jesse Helms is making small talk with me, and he starts saying the best kind of attack dog to have is a great dane, because after it attacks the burgler, and he sues you, you bring him to court and he's this big cute Marmaduke, and they won't find against you. I was like, what? He had it all worked out. The burgler is inevitable, the successful attack is inevitable, and the lawsuit is inevitable in his universe. I felt sorry for him and the burden of fear he lives with. I think he thought I was some kind of wimp - ironically becasue I wasn't worried about crap like that. He was complaining about not being able to carry a gun, too. I can't imagine carrying a gun around for like 20 years and never getting to use it. I was robbed a gunpoint once. No biggy. You hand over your wallet. As a matter of fact, I opened it and gave them the cash. I guess I could have shot them in the head as they walked away had I been armed. | ||
| campbell29 Citizen Username: Campbell29 Post Number: 134 Registered: 4-2002 |
Is the best solution for people who steal our parking space, or cause a car accident to shoot them? How about if someone is in the express line with more than 10 items - am I justified in whipping out my weapon and threatening them? Can I open fire if they refuse to move to the slower line? I don't have a problem with people keeping their own guns in their own houses for whatever their own reasons are, but I don't think carting them around with us to solve the hassles of daily living is a solution too many of us are comfortable with. | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 1516 Registered: 12-2001 |
Final note: I have enough trouble managing my Ipod and wallet, much less a gun. Oops, left it in my other coat... | ||
| Tom Reingold Supporter Username: Noglider Post Number: 5572 Registered: 1-2003  |
Michael, if this is America and we all have the right to choose, let there be choice. You can have your gun, and we can walk around gunless and no one should call us crazy, either. | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1587 Registered: 1-2003 |
A baton probably wouldn't have helped him. He could have sprayed pepper spray, used a stun gun (but not in NJ), shot the guy (if he had a CCW), etc. But I guess he should be at the thugs mercy because someone might misuse weapons. I'm not looking to debate gun laws. They are what they are. Really, what would you do? Would you have defended the old guy? I only did so BECUASE I am trained. Or would you just have let him get the crap beaten out of him, and then hoped the police came so you could be a good witness as the old guy is carted off to the hospital? But I guess I should know based on your posts, defending the innocent or the weak is NEVER your job. You would just go right up to the service desk at HD and complain that their security wasn't good enough. This isn't some hypothetical. This happened to me, recently, and closeby. I did what needed to be done. Luckily the nutcase took off, but if it came down to it, I would have fought, and fought hard. What would you do? | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1588 Registered: 1-2003 |
Does ANYBODY READ???? I don't have a gun, am not advocating gun ownership, and really don't care either way. I said upfront that I have LEGAL, NON-LETHAL weapons, and self defense training. I wondered if others did anything close. Sheesh. | ||
| Robert Livingston Citizen Username: Rob_livingston Post Number: 890 Registered: 7-2004 |
Janay: You're my hero!! | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1589 Registered: 1-2003 |
I know | ||
| newone Citizen Username: Newone Post Number: 218 Registered: 8-2001 |
Some reading: Unseen stories by Robert A. Waters April 24, 2002 On September 11, after two jets crashed into the Twin Towers in New York, the major television networks were faced with a crucial decision. Should they show the frightful scenes of victims jumping to their deaths from upwards of eighty stories? NBC, CNN, ABC, and CBS chose not to. Whether or not you agree with the networks, there is little doubt that their refusal to show all the news affected our attitudes about the attacks. Had those scenes been shown, American resolve to crush the terrorists might have dug even deeper. The major networks affect opinion by what they don't show as much as by what does appear on our television screens. Nothing illustrates this more clearly than the unseen side of the gun issue. For instance, when was the last time the networks interviewed someone who used a gun in self-defense? Since these cases are almost never shown in the national media, millions of viewers assume that they never happen. School shootings, stories of employees going postal and gunning down co-workers, and even gang-related shootings are regular fare on television news. But because stories of armed self-defense are unseen, the implication is that guns are only used for harmful or criminal purposes. Here are a few examples of stories you never saw. On March 14, in a case that seemed a natural for national news, a football star was gunned down while trying to hold up a liquor store. Derrick Breedlove, a talented tight end, had recently signed a scholarship to play for Hampton University in Virginia. Scouts were already touting him for an NFL career. But when he entered the liquor store wearing a ski-mask and brandishing a sawed-off shotgun, Breedlove was shot and killed by a clerk. On April 2, Virginia "Sue" Devoe was attacked in her Clintonville, Ohio home. Her former boyfriend, James Ryan McVey, kicked in the front door, dragged her through the house by her hair, and repeatedly kicked her. Then he attempted to kidnap her. That's when Devoe's 91-year-old neighbor came to her aid. Shirley Becraft drew his handgun and shot the intruder. McVey's death ended years of violent assaults on Devoe. A local investigator praised Becraft, saying, "It's hard to know where she would be now if he hadn't [shot McVey]." On March 18, in Orange City, Florida, Robert Shockey waited inside Blockbuster Video for his son, who worked there, to close the store. The store had been the scene of a violent armed robbery a month before. Shockey, who has a permit to carry a concealed weapon, saw two ski-masked robbers burst through the doors. One carried a hunting rifle and threatened an employee. Shockey pulled his handgun and shot the gun-wielding assailant. When the second robber reached for the rifle that his accomplice had dropped, Shockey shot him. Police not only ruled the shooting self-defense, they stated that they planned to give Shockey a "good citizenship award." And so it goes. On March 5, Bethan Scutchfield, a 71-year-old invalid from Colville, Washington fatally wounded a stranger who broke into her house and knocked her to the floor. On March 6, an 83-year-old San Antonio woman shot a teenager as he tried to break into her home. On March 3, in Pembroke Pines, Florida, two robbers pointed semiautomatic weapons at businessman Corey Dacres but the victim pulled his own gun and shot both of them. Dacres, who has a permit to carry a concealed weapon, was not injured. Cases of armed self-defense occur thousands of times each year. What is the price we pay for the black-out of such stories by the networks? Like a shadow war, viewers who aren't shown both sides of the issue remain uninformed. and this: http://www.klfy.com/Global/story.asp?S=2961624 | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 1517 Registered: 12-2001 |
Hey, um Curt Sliwa? Mellow out. You often drop references to your martial arts. I can't help but bate you a little when you do. Good for you for standing up for the old man. I don't think you should jump to unwarranted conclusions about others based on web postings. | ||
| Michael Janay Citizen Username: Childprotect Post Number: 1590 Registered: 1-2003 |
Oh, come on, RL and I have a thing going ;) | ||
| themp Supporter Username: Themp Post Number: 1518 Registered: 12-2001 |
Actually - Here's what I meant to post: I would have called the UN. |
